The North Korea-US Confrontation

GarryB wrote:Wondering if it is hard to jam GPS?

Chinese embassy Serbia...

The US government spend an enormous amount on extensive and accurate maps of everywhere, but they used old maps to bomb downtown Serbia?

I mean that it's harder to jam military GPS than civilian one,,military has some advantages like anti-jamming ,anti spoofing and apowerful signal than civilian GPS,

BTW,the source of the jamming can quickly be determined on the field.


look

http://www.novatel.com/about-us/news-releases/news-releases-2011/first-ever-single-enclosure-gps-anti-jam-antenna-for-military-land-vehicles-announced-at-cansec/

The Chinese Embassy in Serbia was bombed because they got pieces of the F-117 that was shot down and had them in their embassy.

Bye bye Embassy......boom.

And if it is right near the target you are trying to destroy what exactly are you going to do about it? Drop two GPS guided bombs?

you can use other ways to target this location of jamming ,

US made it in gulf war and destroyes some of GPS jammers that iraq imported from russia,

the point is jamming atomahawk will not prevent it from hitting it's target ,it can use other arriving techniques to hit the target like TERCOM and DASMAC..

I have aquestion here:

It's known that military GPS has aseparate frequencies that differ frome civilian one ,
,

Is there aone jammer that can jam the both civilian and military gps in the same time ?

in the news above ,N.K want to jam amilitary gps but the reporter said that mobile phones "in S.Korea" that use civilian gps also were affected or jamed ,

according to my knowlege here, i think using one device that has four signal generators, it can vary it's frequency from one generator to another to jam four frequencies ( CIVILIAN GPS, MILITARY GPS, CIVILIAN GLONASS, AND MILITARY GLONASS ).

GarryB wrote:And if it is right near the target you are trying to destroy what exactly are you going to do about it? Drop two GPS guided bombs?

Of course not. We'd switch to Mk.82s and saturation bomb the whole area!



Or, use the newer laser-guided JDAMs. We've blasted moving targets with those. Granted, it was on a range and I'm not sure they've been employed operationally yet since they frankly haven't really been required, but it gives you a useful fallback if you encounter jamming. Plus, some of the improvements to JDAM incorporated over the years have specifically focused on increasing jamming resistance, like IGAS. AGTFT results showed less than a 7 meter CEP in a high-jamming environment using some of the anti-jamming tech stuck in the back end. One of the fixes was to modify the receiver antenna. They apparently couldn't stop it from acquiring the DoD GPS signal for guidance.

The F-117 was near the end of March, while the embassy bombing was in May... even if they did send parts to the Chinese I very much doubt they were sitting in the Chinese embassy in Serbia a month after they were given access to them.

That implies that they gave China access immediately following the shootdown. Serbia had the parts. They could've given access to Russians in-country pretty much immediately (you can still learn a hell of a lot from inspecting RAM), and given access to the Chinese a bit later.

Unless it is a big bomb or a very soft target a 30m miss is a complete miss.

30 meters is the "worst case" figure. Plus, there has never been a single confirmed event of jamming causing a JDAM to miss its target.

Of course the American solution is add laser guidance to JDAMs... spend more money... the Russian solution would be to go back to laser guided bombs...

It makes sense. JDAMs aren't all that expensive in the grand military scheme of things, and while a laser-guided bomb might seem like a viable alternative, their use is restricted by environmental considerations such as cloud cover, smog, etc. Having a laser head on a JDAM lets you use the capability when you need it, and fall back on the INS/GPS guidance if it isn't viable. If an Su-27SM takes off and heads to a target 60 minutes away with a load of LGBs, and finds the target covered in clouds that moved in, he's SOL. If an F-16CG takes off and heads out in the same situation, the laser-guided JDAM is still useable.

I would suspect the Russians would be more interested in the electronics on board like the IRST system and its enclosure to allow it to work while remaining stealthy, plus of course the engine intake shielding material.

The engine shielding is far less complicated than you might think it is. The metal grill acts as a flat panel, with the openings too small for current FCS radars to get a beam through and find a return off of the compressor face.

JDAMs have been used in lots of situations where it is not possible to confirm the precise location of impact points

What area have they been used in that is immune to overhead reconnaissance or satellite coverage for BDA?

As far as I know both Glonass and Navstar have lots of frequencies some of them civilian and most military. If you can jam one then it shouldn't be that hard to jam them all, but the distance you can jam them to is the hard part...

Just send your powerful noise in the same frequency that your enemy use

I mean if the point of JDAM is cheap, then why make them more expensive with laser if laser is so flaky?

The ability to hit moving targets is one big plus. And sometimes you just need the extra bit of accuracy an LGB can provide. Besides, not all of them are going to be laser JDAMs. I want to say we bought either 400 or 4,000 of the kits, I can't remember which.

60 minutes away the Su-27SM could take off with most of its internal fuel tanks empty, and even carrying a few AAMs will have room for plenty of satellite and laser and TV guided bombs to cover all options. BTW if they can't predict the weather in 60 minutes time then they shouldn't be in a position to drop bombs on people because they are clearly incompetent.
... and further more... 60 minutes flight time means they should be using Iskander anyway...

Stop nitpicking, you! It was just an example to illustrate a point-LGBs aren't going to be useable 24/7/365.

Impressive (but I found the RVV-BD far more amusing!). I wonder if this was thought up with the FULCRUM, FLANKER, and PAK-FA in mind? Can it take targeting inputs from the IRST, or do they want to use an actual thermal imaging sensor in an external pod?

RVV-BD is an export R-37, yes. It's likely not the baseline R-37 but a newer variant, as the R-37 is old news at this point. Yes, the R-37M was often quoted as having a booster stage to get the range from 250-300 km to 400 km, but it also never appeared anywhere so it may have been a paper project which succumbed to a lack of funding post-1991. The domestic RVV-BD (R-37M1? R-37-2?) appears to be a perfectly suitable R-33/R-33S replacement for the MiG-31BM, finally giving the operational FOXHOUND something possessing range and lacking archaic SARH seeker technology.

Fitting it on upgraded legacy platforms makes sense, it makes the upgrade packages more attractive to export customers. In the RusAF I'd assume it will arm the MiG-31BM at the least (the missile displayed at MAKS pretty much proves this point), with the PAK-FA likely and the Su-35 possible. However, given the work that's been done with the AAM-L and the FLANKER airframe, particularly recently with regards to a potential Indian AF sale, I wonder if they haven't done anything with the RVV-BD/FLANKER combination yet.

Why stick something like this on the MiG-29 though? At combat weight the FULCRUM is a true Hornet equivalent: great weapons systems, excellent ACM performance (if you pop off the heavy stuff to turn and burn), but very lacking in legs. Sticking heavy AAMs like this on the FULCRUM greatly expands its reach, but yanks away one of its true assets: the ablity to go into a HOBS engagement out-turning the competition. FLANKER, I can understand. You can hang a heavy load on it and at combat weight it doesn't care much and will still dominate the WVR fight. The most overlooked airshow routine of all time was the Su-30MK at Paris or Farnborough in the early/mid 90s: Western "experts" shouted that the FLANKER wasn't going to be nearly as impressive with a full warload. Russia's response? Load out the Su-30MK, fly routine, laugh.

I've always heard of both the R-37M and the AAM-L, I don't think there was any confusion there regarding who has the booster stage. The R-37M/AAM-L were likely intended to be the armament for the MiG 7.01, you weren't fitting a booster-equipped R-37M underneath a FOXHOUND-M.

Airborne ABMs are relatively pointless. Until the US comes up with a sensible arms reduction concept, I.E. one that includes the PRC AND Russia, relying on airborne systems is a great way to get yourself glassed. It's a good concept for a theater role against a limited threat like Iran or Syria, but not against a serious threat like Russia or the PRC where there are considerably more weapons to deal with.

North Korea threatens US with Juche military strategy, unprecedented methods of warfare

According to Pyongyang, in a confrontation with the US North Korea may use precision and diversified nuclear striking means, ground, naval, underwater, air and cyber warfare means

PYONGYANG, February 4. /TASS/. North Korea could use the most firm countermeasures in response to hostile actions of US President Barack Obama administration, the country’s National Defense Commission said in a statement published on Wednesday.

Pyongyang is ready to "counter the United States in any war, including a nuclear one," the statement by the commission, North Korea’s supreme leadership body, reads.

The people and the army of North Korea "have neither need nor willingness to sit at the negotiating table with the US that seeks to trample the republic’s ideology and bring down its social system," it says.

Washington should be aware, the commission said, that in a confrontation with the US, North Korea may use precision and diversified nuclear striking means, ground, naval, underwater, air and cyber warfare means.

The National Defense Commission, led by North Korea’s leader Kim Jong-un, stresses that the people’s army will use a Juche strategy and tactics and also the unprecedented methods of military actions.

The statement comes as President Obama has announced plans to introduce more sanctions on North Korea and also amid persistent calls of the US political and military leadership to step up the blockade of the country.

The commission also notes the dangerous character of the upcoming military drills between the US and South Korea known as Key Resolve" and "Foal Eagle" which usually begin in March.

Last month, North Korea announced it was ready to introduce a moratorium on nuclear tests should the US and South Korea shelve their plan for joint military exercises. However, the US government rejected the offer.

http://sputniknews.com/us/20150530/1022733556.html

The United States unleashed a version of the Stuxnet computer virus five years ago in an unsuccessful attack on North Korea's nuclear weapons program, people familiar with the covert campaign said.

The operation began at the same time as a successful US-Israeli joint effort in which the Stuxnet virus was deployed to destroy a thousand or more Iranian centrifuges that were enriching uranium, Reuters reported.
On Thursday, Reuters reported that Iran and North Korea were engaged in behind-the-scenes attempts to work on a nuclear weapons program. However, an official source from the Iranian Embassy in France dismissed the claim, according to Iranian News Agency IRNA.
© Sputnik/ Valeriy Melnikov
Report About Iran, N Korea Nuclear Cooperation False

For the attack against North Korea's nuclear program, Stuxnet's developers produced a related virus that would be activated when it encountered Korean-language settings on an infected machine, one US intelligence source told Reuters.

US agents, however, were unable to access the core machines that ran Pyongyang's nuclear weapons program, said another source, a former high-ranking intelligence official who was briefed on the program.

As one of the most insular countries in the world, North Korea's utter secrecy, as well as the extreme isolation of its communications systems, foiled the National Security Agency-led campaign, the official told Reuters.

North Korea's communications networks are similarly isolated. One needs police permission just to own a computer, and the open Internet is unknown except to a tiny elite. Furthermore, the country has one main conduit for Internet connections to the outside world, through China, Reuters reported.
North Korean military hackers are capable of attacks on power plants and banks, and could severely destroy infrastructure, as well as kill people, a prominent North Korean defector and rights activist said Friday.
N Korea Military Hackers Could Launch Deadly Attacks – Prominent Dissident

Iran, on the other hand, engages in widespread Internet use and had interactions with companies from around the globe.

Experts who spoke with Reuters said there are similarities between North Korea and Iran's nuclear programs, and the two countries continue to collaborate on military technology. Because of that overlap, the NSA would not have had to modify Stuxnet much to make it capable of destroying centrifuges in North Korea.

Despite the subtle differences between the programs, the NSA attack was thwarted by the inability to infiltrate North Korea's program in the first place.

David Albright, founder of the Institute for Science and International Security and an authority on North Korea's nuclear program, told Reuters that US hackers probably tried to get to North Korea by compromising technology suppliers from Iran, Pakistan or China.

As for the successful attack on Iran, a leading theory is that Stuxnet was placed by a sophisticated espionage program developed by a team close to the virus' authors, known as the Equation Group.

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/us/20150530/1022733556.html#ixzz3bZZcwVR7

A US Army general says North Korea has some of the world's best hackers

http://www.techinsider.io/north-korea-worlds-best-hackers-2016-5

North Korea's conventional military of aging Soviet jets and tanks can't compete against the high-tech military of the US, but its capabilities in cyber warfare keep on getting better, according to a top US Army general.

"This is an area of growth," Gen. Vincent Brooks told Senate leaders last month. "While I would not characterize them as the best in the world, they are among the best in the world and the best organized."

Brooks was speaking before the Senate Armed Services Committee for a hearing regarding his nomination to take over all forces in South Korea. The 57-year-old general took over that post late last month.

"They seem to be more and more willing to do this [hacking]," Brooks said. "They have in fact, electronically attacked US companies."

North Korea is often dismissed as a backwards totalitarian regime with little technology — sometimes illustrated by a lack of electricity as seen from space — but it has invested heavily in cyber, which in some ways, allows a nation-state with few resources to inflict real-world damage.

"Given North Korea's bleak economic outlook, [offensive cyber operations] may be seen as a cost effective way to develop asymmetric, deniable military options," reads a 2013 DoD report. In other words, while North Korea may not be able to hurt a Goliath like the US or South Korea with guns or missiles, it sees hacking as a cheaper way of getting to that result.

According to a 2014 CNBC report, the Hermit Kingdom has pursued cyber warfare since the 1980's, and has targeted banks, universities, and other organizations, mainly in South Korea. But perhaps its biggest hack yet came with the breach of Sony Pictures, which saw the leak of unreleased films and embarrassing emails of studio executives in 2014.

Attributing a cyber attack to a nation-state can be difficult, given that hackers often hide behind proxy servers and mask their tracks, but intelligence officials at the time told the Washington Post they had "99% certainty" that North Korea was behind the Sony hack.

As the book "Hacked World Order" detailed, evidence of the Hermit Kingdom being behind the attack was further bolstered by the Snowden leaks, which revealed the NSA had placed "covert implants" in routers and firewalls around the world, which would give the intelligence agency great insight into where an attack came from. And later comments from FBI Director James Comey were clear:

"We could see that the IP addresses they used ... were IPs that were exclusively used by the North Koreans. It was a mistake by them. It was a very clear indication of who was doing this. They would shut it off very quickly once they realized the mistake, but not before we saw them and knew where it was coming from."

North Korea has approximately 6,000 trained hackers in its military ranks, a defector from the country told the BBC. The defector taught computer science at a Pyongyang University and said many of his former students went on to the hacking unit known as Bureau 121.

Little is known about the North Korea's cyberwarfare agency, though it does seem to employ considerable computer expertise. With its Sony Pictures breach, the hackers used a common method to gain access called spear-phishing and were able to steal credentials for a systems administrator, enabling them to burrow inside the systems for at least two months to map out their plan of attack.

"They were incredibly careful, and patient," one person briefed on the investigation told The New York Times.

That an Army general would warn of North Korea's growing progress in cyberspace comes as the Pentagon ramps up its own efforts in what it calls the "cyber domain" after the release of a new cyber strategy in April 2015. In it, the military proposed 133 teams for its "cyber mission force" by 2018, 27 of which were directed to support combat missions by "generating integrated cyberspace effects in support of ... operations." (Effects is a common military term used for artillery and aircraft targeting, and soldiers proclaim "good effect on target" to communicate a direct hit).

A Pentagon spokesperson told Tech Insider the numbers breakdown for the cyber mission force would be more than 4,300 personnel. But only about 1,600 of those would be on a "combat mission team" that would likely be considered to be taking an offensive hacking role.

Still, the US military recently used hackers against ISIS as others fought on the ground in February, quite possibly for the first time ever.

"These are strikes that are conducted in the war zone using cyber essentially as a weapon of war," Defense Secretary Ash Carter told NPR. "Just like we drop bombs, we're dropping cyber bombs."

For Brooks, he sees North Korean hackers as a threat to be taken seriously, telling Senate leaders he was "not optimistic about the direction that North Korea is going."

But when pressed on whether the US could respond with a "counterattack that can do harm on them," Brooks pushed to answer that only in a classified briefing, but, he said, "that is an option that is available."

General information on the recent escalation of rhetoric and actions concerning North Korea:

North Korea Said To Be Preparing Nuclear Device Detonation; Test Site Is "Primed And Ready" - ZeroHedge

China rejects North Korean coal - Fox News

‘We are sending an armada’: Trump ready to eliminate N. Korean ‘menace’ with or without China - RT

Get comfy lads, I have a feeling things might get a tad warmer in the general vicinity of Korea sooner or later. Also, usual rumors of troop build-ups on borders etc. particularly regarding China.

OminousSpudd wrote:General information on the recent escalation of rhetoric and actions concerning North Korea:

North Korea Said To Be Preparing Nuclear Device Detonation; Test Site Is "Primed And Ready" - ZeroHedge

China rejects North Korean coal - Fox News

‘We are sending an armada’: Trump ready to eliminate N. Korean ‘menace’ with or without China - RT

Get comfy lads, I have a feeling things might get a tad warmer in the general vicinity of Korea sooner or later. Also, usual rumors of troop build-ups on borders etc. particularly regarding China.

Hopefully nothing stupid happens. If a war breakouts, big IF because it's unlikely, but if the U.S does a limited strike with spillover effects it will once again show that the Russians and the Chinesse are completely inept, weak and unable to prevent the U.S from stirring shit up at their borders without relatively major consequences as the U.S resides a whole continent apart. When will they get a clue?

Like a young boy growing up.....lessons, lessons, lessons....

Hopefully nothing gets out of hand.

Some sort of flight suspension going into effect with China-Pyongyang flights. China state media claims it's to do with ticket prices.

http://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy-defence/article/2087773/flagship-carrier-air-china-suspend-flights-pyongyang

New Korean War may break out ‘at any moment’ – Chinese FM

ATLASCUB wrote:
Hopefully nothing stupid happens. If a war breakouts, big IF because it's unlikely, but if the U.S does a limited strike with spillover effects it will once again show that the Russians and the Chinesse are completely inept, weak and unable to prevent the U.S from stirring shit up at their borders without relatively major consequences as the U.S resides a whole continent apart. When will they get a clue?

Like a young boy growing up.....lessons, lessons, lessons....

Hopefully nothing gets out of hand.

In all honesty I am most concerned about the very real threat of nuclear retaliation to SK cities. To think that US ABM is in any state to prevent a nuclear strike is completely naive.

As for Russia, they couldn't care less. This is not their problem, and although it will be blatant aggression and completely illegal, there is nothing they can do to prevent it.
N. Korea will be safer under Chinese partition anyway.

Hey maybe a nuke will hit a US battlegroup, then everyone's happy.