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    T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

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    franco
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  franco on Tue May 16, 2017 12:25 pm

    And the timing for these deliveries following the May parade in which the latest version of the T72B3 was paraded. It is all but guaranteed that those tanks are in this delivery. On the other hand, believe OnillieO has a point in that there may not be much of a difference (to warrant a M designation) and all the others will receive the further upgrades.
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    SeigSoloyvov
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Tue May 16, 2017 4:22 pm

    0nillie0 wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:
    franco wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    franco wrote:Another 20-24 T-72B3M arrive at an unidentified Division in the 1st Army;

    http://in24.org/world/27215

    Article says B3 not B3M.

    You may be right. Another article on them described them as the modernized T-72B3. Which I may be incorrectly assuming to mean the B3M version.

    with modules of dynamic protection "Relic" hinged lattice screens as well as new modules dynamic protection in a soft case.

    This gives me indication it is B3M.

    I think that in a years time, the distinction between B3 and B3M could pretty much be moot.
    The desired elements from the B3M upgrade can be handpicked for application on any B3 tank. Some tanks will only feature the new side skirts, while others will be upgraded with only the SLAT armor.
    Other tanks will have the full kit installed, including the new side modules, which can simply replace the storage boxes on the default B3. This all will depend on specific regional and operational requirements, and availability of parts.

    It would have made more sense to me, to simply integrate these upgrades as part of the B3 upgrade kit, rather than use "B3M" terminology, as this was previously already used for the upgraded version with the independent commanders panoramic sight. It made more sense here as there was significant modification of the turret, crew stations and operating doctrine trough the addition of the second sight. In fact, this is the only part that has been missing in every picture that i have seen, yet keeps getting mentioned.

    The new "B3M" seems to feature mostly bolt on or bolt off parts and modules, which could be be applied to any B3 tank (including the installing of the improved ERA elements inside the modules to replace Kontakt 5) without serious downtime or adjustments in internal components such as FCS.

    I would imagine that most of the B3's in the West are planned to be upgraded with Relikt anyway.

    Now if they start adding panoramic sights, then i can understand the distinction between B3 and B3M more. But so far, i have not seen a single picture of it combined with the other upgrades displayed on the parade B3M's.

    T-72B3M have panoramic sights...you can see it on the top hatch the lens is just covered to protect it no doubt since unless the sights are active you cover them this is a standard rule.
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    0nillie0
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  0nillie0 on Tue May 16, 2017 6:27 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:

    T-72B3M have panoramic sights...you can see it on the top hatch the lens is just covered to protect it no doubt since unless the sights are active you cover them this is a standard rule.

    I think you missed the part where i distinguished between the T-72B3M which entered service in 2014-2015, and the recently showcased T-72B3M which was seen in the victory parade and other recent photo's.

    The 2014-2015 "T-72B3M" :

    This has the panoramic sight installed, but obviously lacks the upgrades of the newer model.

    The 2017 "T-72B3M" :


    This is the version that is entering service now. It has been seen both at the victory parade, as well as in transport to enter service. Not all tanks apear to have been equipped with the full kit, as we have seen tanks in transport which only have the new sideskirts and slat armor installed, but lack the new ERA modules on the side of the turret and front of the hull.

    This version clearly also lacks a panoramic sight, yet it also reffered to by various people here, as well as official sources as "T-72B3M".
    Note that NONE of the new batch of vehicles that i personally have seen so far have been equipped with a panoramic sight. Perhaps i missed it.
    Sites like Sputnik have said that it is suppose to also feature the sight of the 2015 version, but like i said, it seems to be missing from the kit currently being fielded.

    It could off course be a retrofit that will be implemented later on, as it requires additional modification of the actual turret and additional equipment inside the commander station, where as the 2017 kit is mostly bolt on, with many elements that possibly could be installed even in field conditions.
    Hence the confusion, and what we have been talking about all this time.
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Tue May 16, 2017 7:12 pm

    0nillie0 wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:

    T-72B3M have panoramic sights...you can see it on the top hatch the lens is just covered to protect it no doubt since unless the sights are active you cover them this is a standard rule.

    I think you missed the part where i distinguished between the T-72B3M which entered service in 2014-2015, and the recently showcased T-72B3M which was seen in the victory parade and other recent photo's.

    The 2014-2015 "T-72B3M" :

    This has the panoramic sight installed, but obviously lacks the upgrades of the newer model.

    The 2017 "T-72B3M" :


    This is the version that is entering service now. It has been seen both at the victory parade, as well as in transport to enter service. Not all tanks apear to have been equipped with the full kit, as we have seen tanks in transport which only have the new sideskirts and slat armor installed, but lack the new ERA modules on the side of the turret and front of the hull.

    This version clearly also lacks a panoramic sight, yet it also reffered to by various people here, as well as official sources as "T-72B3M".
    Note that NONE of the new batch of vehicles that i personally have seen so far have been equipped with a panoramic sight. Perhaps i missed it.
    Sites like Sputnik have said that it is suppose to also feature the sight of the 2015 version, but like i said, it seems to be missing from the kit currently being fielded.

    It could off course be a retrofit that will be implemented later on, as it requires additional modification of the actual turret and additional equipment inside the commander station, where as the 2017 kit is mostly bolt on, with many elements that possibly could be installed even in field conditions.
    Hence the confusion, and what we have been talking about all this time.

    You can see the mount, T-72BSM's are equipped with sights.

    That said the parade tanks where brand new meaning they just came off the line they still have to attach things like the sights.

    Russia has a nice habit of parading unfinished tanks, Armata, T-14 etc.

    you are over analyzing this by extremes.
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  AlfaT8 on Tue May 16, 2017 7:53 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:
    0nillie0 wrote:
    SeigSoloyvov wrote:

    T-72B3M have panoramic sights...you can see it on the top hatch the lens is just covered to protect it no doubt since unless the sights are active you cover them this is a standard rule.

    I think you missed the part where i distinguished between the T-72B3M which entered service in 2014-2015, and the recently showcased T-72B3M which was seen in the victory parade and other recent photo's.

    The 2014-2015 "T-72B3M" :

    This has the panoramic sight installed, but obviously lacks the upgrades of the newer model.

    The 2017 "T-72B3M" :


    This is the version that is entering service now. It has been seen both at the victory parade, as well as in transport to enter service. Not all tanks apear to have been equipped with the full kit, as we have seen tanks in transport which only have the new sideskirts and slat armor installed, but lack the new ERA modules on the side of the turret and front of the hull.

    This version clearly also lacks a panoramic sight, yet it also reffered to by various people here, as well as official sources as "T-72B3M".
    Note that NONE of the new batch of vehicles that i personally have seen so far have been equipped with a panoramic sight. Perhaps i missed it.
    Sites like Sputnik have said that it is suppose to also feature the sight of the 2015 version, but like i said, it seems to be missing from the kit currently being fielded.

    It could off course be a retrofit that will be implemented later on, as it requires additional modification of the actual turret and additional equipment inside the commander station, where as the 2017 kit is mostly bolt on, with many elements that possibly could be installed even in field conditions.
    Hence the confusion, and what we have been talking about all this time.

    You can see the mount, T-72BSM's are equipped with sights.

    That said the parade tanks where brand new meaning they just came off the line they still have to attach things like the sights.

    Russia has a nice habit of parading unfinished tanks, Armata, T-14 etc.

    you are over analyzing this by extremes.

    No, the announcer at the V-day parade was quite clear that those were T-72B3s not the B3M/B4s, i checked the footage myself and they did not have the Independent commander sight.

    Unfinished and going through finalization are 2 different things.
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  0nillie0 on Wed May 17, 2017 10:56 am

    "Two dozen modernized tanks T-72B3 entered the arsenal of motorized infantry 1st Panzer Army"



    https://twitter.com/mod_russia/status/864438035215040512/photo/1

    Note that the Russian MOD refers to these tanks as just "T-72B3".

    Also : take a look at the picture below taken from the Armata Thread :
    http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/bmpd/38024980/4182855/4182855_original.jpg

    Where the mount for the panoramic sight is supposed to be, there is nothing but an ERA tile. So IMHO at least this batch of new tanks will not have panoramic sight.
    And i believe this trend will continue untill we see "T-72B4" enter service in the future, which will use more components of Armata, with T-72B3M as a low rate production intermediate platform, perhaps reserved for battlefield command role or specific units.
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Cheetah on Thu May 18, 2017 5:59 am

    Bumped into this while doing the rounds.

    Syria and Israel to participate in International Army Games for first time

    Syria, South Africa, Israel, Uzbekistan, Fiji, Uganda and Laos will for the first time participate in the International Army Games, the organizing committee said while holding a conference with the foreign military attaches from 32 countries on Wednesday.

    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/946347

    http://tass.com/defense/946347

    Could we see a Merkava MK4 in tank biathlon?
    If so, it would be interesting to see how it goes against the T-72B3
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  George1 on Mon May 22, 2017 2:23 pm

    Belorussian modernization of the T-72 tank



    On May 8-22, 2017, the 8th international exhibition of arms and military equipment MILEX-2017, Belarusian companies Beltechexport, OJSC 140 repair plant (Borisov) and OJSC Peleng (Minsk), held in Minsk (Belorussia) from May 20 to May 22, 2017, Presented a modernized tank T-72BME, which is the result of a "deep modernization" of the T-72 tanks.

    In the press release of the exhibition it is reported that the main essence of the T-72BME tank modernization is the installation of a new sighting complex with a thermal imaging sight, reinforcement of armor protection by an effective combination of monolithic and combined armored protection with additional installation of dynamic protection and anti-cumulative screens, increased mobility by installing more A powerful engine, as well as autonomy in the conduct of ambushes and defensive actions by using a built-in autonomous power source.

    The main distinguishing elements of the T-72BME tank are:
    Installation of the integrated control system "ESSA-72U", including a multi-channel thermal imaging sight, ballistic computer, television indicators and a backup sight of the tank commander, which ensures effective destruction of enemy targets at maximum range in all weather conditions day and night;

    Installation of a set of sensors (a wind sensor, a gun position sensor, an atmospheric pressure sensor, roll and pitch sensors, a gun position sensor), which significantly reduced the aiming time on the target to improve the accuracy of firing from the spot and in motion;

    Ensuring the possibility of conducting fire by all types of 125-mm rounds, including modern tank guided missiles;

    Installation of the "Contact-1" type of dynamic protection [and also protective screen grids];

    Installation of the 902B "Cloud" system with eight launchers;

    Installation of the V-84MS engine with 840 hp;

    Installation of a digital VHF radio station of the last generation BARRETT-2082 +;

    Installation of a modern infrared or thermal imager of the driver;

    Installation of an autonomous diesel power source to ensure operation of the main tank systems in the defense and save the life of the main engine.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2621919.html


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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Book. on Mon May 22, 2017 7:46 pm

    T-72, T-90 Helmet-Mounted Display (HMD).

    See thru armor. Full 3D view.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Book. on Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:54 am

    Sosna-U: Fire Control system in a T-72B3

    These photos are rather interesting because they show the “insides” of T-72B3, the upgraded version used by the Russian Army. Large numbers have been acquired in recent years and they were used in the Ukraine conflict. The main improvement is the Sosna-U FCS (Fire control system), which has a thermal sight. The first image shows another T-72 as seen by the thermal camera. The second image shows a screen for the driver.

    The third image shows the parameters included in the FCS. In previous versions many of these were not included. Now they are calculated automatically. The first 5 are:

    - Temperature of propellant.
    - Temperature of air
    - Atmospheric pressure.
    - Wind speed.
    - Lateral inclination.

    Here: http://alejandro-8en.blogspot.com/2017/06/sosna-u-fire-control-system-in-t-72b3.html






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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

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