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    T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

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    Vladimir79
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    T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Vladimir79 on Tue Jul 20, 2010 2:00 am

    Russian tank-builders are ready to mass- produce the modernized T- 72

    Moscow . July 16. Interfax -AVN - Upgraded at the request of the War Department T-72 tank is ready for serial production , but orders him from the Russian army yet, told Interfax -AVN representative of the Ural Transport Engineering Design Bureau , Vladimir Nevolin .

    " Upgraded tank was full cycle of state tests and is ready for production and supply . The order for the upgraded T-72 depends on the Ministry of Defense . While on the Russian army orders for these tanks do not " , - said V. Nevolin .

    At the same time he stressed that "modernization of the T -72 was performed according to the requirements and upon request of the Russian army.

    To date, all research on modernized T -72 carried out, and the tank is ready for serial upgrade, said V. Nevolin . " The development of the modernization of the T -72 made in full, all the documentation submitted to the Nizhny Tagil , " - he said.

    Upgraded T-72 is equipped with advanced cannon , fire control system , improved protection . The tank was used armor of the second generation , which provides protection against chemical shells and guided missiles , said V. Nevolin .

    He stressed that the use of the upgraded T-72 armor significantly increases the level of protection against armor- piercing tank shells.

    Speaking of the conducted earlier Uralvagonzavod works on repair and modernization of T -72 , V. Nevolin said that " basically it was overhauled with a minimum upgrade . " The gun remained unchanged , some crafted automatic loader mounted engines of 1000 horsepower. Chassis T -72 is also undergoing changes and is unified with the T -90 " , - explained the agency.

    Asked about the status of the tank support combat vehicle ( BMPT) on the chassis of the T-72 , V. Nevolin said that development work on this topic were completed about five years ago, " adopted BMPT not accepted, the installation Party has not been released .

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Tue Aug 10, 2010 4:24 am

    Well their plans to have up to 6,000 tanks in service and to have 1,500 T-90s in service suggests that this T-72 upgrade will be applied to a lot of tanks.
    Does anyone know what the cost of this upgrade to T-72s will be and how it compares with the cost of a current T-90?

    I guess based on their logic that any future conflict will not involve thousands of Russian tanks in a charge so the particular situation can determine which they use.
    Many small conflicts it should be able to be dealt with using upgraded T-72s and against tougher opposition the T-90s could be used I suppose.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Tue Aug 10, 2010 4:41 am

    Regarding the mention of the BMPT I have never really understood the decisions made with the armament of that vehicle.
    Two 2A42 cannon seem a strange choice... the only reason you would have two such weapons is to increase rate of fire. Surely using a twin barrel 2A38M from the Tunguska should give all the rate of fire needed for use against aircraft or ground targets, especially if it was modified to allow fixed number bursts and single shots.
    The idea of using ATGMs I understand as such weapons are much cheaper than gun launched missiles fired from tanks, but I think a high angle 100mm rifled gun as used in the BMP-3 etc would also be of value for its high elevation and HE power.
    The whole purpose of the BMPT is a heavily armoured heavily armed vehicle that can go where tanks go yet doesn't have the elevation problems most tanks have with their main guns so targets high in nearby buildings can be engaged with more than machineguns.
    A BMP-3 is too thinly armoured for that role.
    I think the BMPT lacks a direct and indirect fire heavy gun like the 100mm gun of the BMP-3, which could have been fitted as an external mount with armour plate protection with a 30mm 2A38M mounted next to it.

    Equally the front corner gun positions for PKT machineguns or 30mm grenade launchers seem a bit restricted. They apparantly use fibre optic aiming but their mounts are fairly restricted in their firing arcs. Proper mini turrets would make more sense, or external mounted guns used would be a better idea.
    The fitting of the 30mm grenade launcher at the rear of the upgraded BMP-2 turret on the roof with much of the space either side used for a large amount of ammo would be a good solution too.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 11, 2010 10:53 am

    Isnt it a colossal waste of money to do major upgrade of the T-72's considering its a 70's design tank and does not offer the crew protection level of modern tank and an upgrade might be a case of Pig with lipstick.

    It is better to procure T-90's in good numbers and work on Future MBT based on T-95 or an advanced variant.

    It is better to sell the vastT-72's to few South American Country , Africa ,Libya as attractive rates and put that money in procuring T-90's and FMBT

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Vladimir79 on Wed Aug 11, 2010 11:26 am

    Austin wrote:Isnt it a colossal waste of money to do major upgrade of the T-72's considering its a 70's design tank and does not offer the crew protection level of modern tank and an upgrade might be a case of Pig with lipstick.

    Yes it is. There is no point spending money on something you have no intention of using, nor do we have the manpower to utilise them. The conscript system has done away with paper armies where these storage tanks would be. My fear is we will spend too much money in this and not get all the T-90s we are promised.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Thu Aug 12, 2010 4:13 am

    The problem with the T-95 seems to be weight, the Russian Army doesn't want heavier tanks, it wants lighter ones that can be more easily transported from place to place as needed.

    The issue with the T-72 upgrade is financial.
    I am going to make up figures here to explain what I mean, now just because the figures are made up doesn't effect the logic behind what I am saying. The final cost of the tanks will make or break this logic.

    The logic goes that the T-90 is the best tank for Russia, but it is expensive.
    Building a brand new T-90 will cost 6 million dollars. We (Russian Army) already have lots and lots of T-72s in service and storage so if we go through them and pick out the best ones that are the least worn that need the least upgrade we can upgrade them for 2 million dollars. With similar armour to the T-90 (Late model T-72s actually are T-90s)(already fitted), and similar Relict ERA(cheap), and with new engines transmissions and gearboxes (maybe two hundred thousand dollars worth) and of course the real expensive electronics like thermal sights, battle management computers and fire control systems (three quarters of the upgrade cost at about 1.5 million dollars), then for 90% of the capability of a T-90 as well as parts commonality (which reduces production costs and maintainence costs and training costs and logistics costs with one type of gun/engine/electronics etc etc) you can have 3 upgraded T-72s for the price of a T-90.
    For the proposed tank park of 1,500 T-90s and the remaining numbers of extra tanks to reach 6,000 being T-72s (ie 4,500 ) you are looking at (6 million x 1,500) plus (2 million x 4,500) = ( 9 billion dollars) + ( 9 billion dollars) = 18 billion dollars for 6,000 tanks. If you want to go for all T-90s then the cost will be (9 billion dollars) + (27 billion dollars) = 36 billion dollars.

    I think the difference in prices makes it all worth it... especially when you consider that all you are getting for the extra 18 billion dollars is the destruction of an extra 4,500 late model T-72s and the production of even later model tanks of the same type in the form of the T-90.

    Basically the T-72 was the simple mass production tank for numbers. The upgraded T-72 and the current T-90 are really just what was a simple mass production tank but with all the expensive electronics and new armour etc etc that the expensive tanks had (T-64 and T-80).

    On the plus side it means all the 100mm rifled high velocity tank guns and the 115mm smooth bore tank guns (and their equivalent towed models and ammo stores) can be dropped from the inventory and just 125mm ammo and guns can be concentrated upon.

    Obviously if the T-72 upgrade had to be applied to a T-54 and ended up costing 7 million per vehicle then the idea wouldn't work and the logic would suggest that buying all new T-90s would make the most sense.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  IronsightSniper on Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:12 am

    Yeah, modernizing old equipment isn't an entirely bad idea, but the Russians really have got to come up with a new tank design, Black Eagle and T-95 sounded nice until they were either not real or canceled.

    Protection wise, T-72's are actually quite protected. Here's a nice picture of a well protected T-72:

    If I weren't any smarter, I'd say that the Russians woke up one day and decided to throw Kontakt-5 everywhere unshaven Kontakt-5 would be effective against most munitions that would be throw at it, and really, the only thing that would be able to kill a T-72 in an area covered with Kontakt-5 would be the newest of the new APFSDS penetrators such as the M829A3 or the one the German/French are using Razz Bombs would also work.

    But to be quite honest, the only T-72 variant I'm looking forward to are the T-90 and the T-72BM "Rogatka". The T-72BM has lots of features!

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Austin on Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:14 am

    What features do T-72BM have , is this the same as Bulark variant of T-90 ?

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  IronsightSniper on Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:28 am

    Aside from electronics upgrades, the T-72BM has Relikt ERA which provides twice the protection of Kontakt-5 ERA. If you buy the numbers tha their manufactures puts out, Kontakt-5 gives a vehicle about 600 mm RHAe against CE rounds and 250 mm RHAe against KE rounds. Simple math puts Relikt's protection levels at 1200 mm RHAe against CE rounds and 500 mm RHAe against KE rounds. Although RHAe isn't a sure thing and just because something has more RHAe won't mean it won't be beaten by something that has less RHAe, you can expect that Relikt > M829A3.

    Aside from that, T-72BM will also have Nakidka camouflage, which would reduce the chances it would be seen by an enemy's thermal viewers by several percent, reduce a tank's heat signature by several percents, and reduce a tank's radar signature by 6 fold if I remember correctly. So Nakidka would basically make it harder for the night viewer of an Abrams or the Radar of an Apache to spot it.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Austin on Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:32 am

    Thanks , Do you know what is the status of T-90 upgrade and How many do they plan to procure ?

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  IronsightSniper on Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:58 am

    Nah, sorry, but I doubt the T-90 would be procured in high numbers by the Russian army.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Viktor on Mon Oct 04, 2010 6:36 pm

    Still under 100 pieces for Russian army. Considering no one else is producing any tanks I dont think there is need for rush.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 05, 2010 5:24 am

    There is only one tank making company left in Russia and before 2010 the picture was pretty clear.

    They were making an upgrade package that started out as an upgrade for the T-72s, T-80s and early model T-90s in service that was going all in one shot upgrade them by making all the guns and sights and engines and transmissions and everything to the same standard. It was also to redesign the frontal armour to remove gaps and weak points. It also added new communications and thermal sights and battle management systems that allowed better command and control of the vehicles without verbal communication.
    This upgrade was to be applied to export T-90s called T-90M or T-90AK and a similar but better version was going to be applied to existing Russian tanks and new build T-90s. All older tanks not getting the upgrade are to be disposed of... ie sold or given away to allies etc etc.
    Now remember this is part of the plan before 2010. The production of the new standard upgrade which had a new turret bustle autoloader in addition to the underfloor auto loader so there were no loose rounds in the crew compartment and also with the added advantage that longer rod penetrators could be loaded from the rear turret bustle. The added electronics also enlarged the turret rearward.
    The New production T-90s were to form the back bone of the tank fleet while the T-95 was to trickle into service in small numbers and form a heavy tank option where its advantanges made it useful.

    The fly in the ointment is that the priority of the Army is aviation and not heavy armour and the large reduction in force numbers and the new region structure of the army means that transportability is now seen is vital with the ability to move troops to where they are needed seen as more important than super heavy protection for the crew. This means the 55 ton T-95 is no longer what they want, they want something lighter and more mobile.
    The problem with tank transporter trucks is that those big powerful trucks are often as expensive as the tanks they carry so lighter tanks... perhaps even wheeled tanks might be in the cards for the Russian Army.

    I have heard talk from the Armed forces about cancelling this and that... but at the end of the day I can't see the one tank making factory dropping everything for the upgrade or the T-95 and starting from scratch. The tank factory manager has said that the upgrade/new production standard for the T-90 etc will be ready by the end of 2010. I would expect orders to not increase till that standard is decided one way or the other, but once the final upgrade is agreed upon production of T-90 will increase to meet the needs of the Russian Army which will be about 1,500 T-90s new and upgraded, and at least 4,500 further vehicles upgraded with the rest scrapped or sold to friendly countries. For example they could gift all their T-55 and T-62 tanks to some ally.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 05, 2010 6:30 am

    Would also add that there are a few T-72 and older series tank users in the world that might want and upgrade path that doesn't cost too much.
    This T-72 upgrade can be applied to instock Russian tanks and then sold to those countries that the Soviet Union used to give tanks away to for free... (ie cheaper than giving T-90s and will lead to spares sales etc.)

    Ie the Russian Army has a lot of old tanks it doesn't know what to do with them and getting rid of them will save them a lot of money and free up a lot of space in facilities that do nothing but store old tanks.

    In addition it means finally getting rid of older main tank rounds from the inventory and storage so that they can concentrate on one calibre for tanks (125mm).

    This will be good for logisitics and training and free up space for other uses or for sale.

    I don't know but I suspect a large number of the stored tanks is only part of the problem and they probably have old vehicles of all types stored that will also likely need to be dealt with too.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  BTRfan on Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:00 pm

    Vladimir79 wrote:
    Austin wrote:Isnt it a colossal waste of money to do major upgrade of the T-72's considering its a 70's design tank and does not offer the crew protection level of modern tank and an upgrade might be a case of Pig with lipstick.

    Yes it is. There is no point spending money on something you have no intention of using, nor do we have the manpower to utilise them. The conscript system has done away with paper armies where these storage tanks would be. My fear is we will spend too much money in this and not get all the T-90s we are promised.


    Couldn't they maintain a cadre force of volunteers or part-time soldiers (who receive some pay) who will attend a several week/month long basic soldiers course and basic tanker's course and then train with the tanks one weekend per month and do maintenance work on them one weekend per month or every other month as needed?

    We have cadre forces here in the USA, known as State Defense Forces, or sometimes State Military Reserve, State Defense Guard, etc. I am in the process of seeking a commission as an officer in my State's Military Reserve. The unit answers to the Governor, it is not the National Guard, it cannot be deployed overseas, but it can be mobilized in emergency situations, such as natural disasters, major civil unrest, foreign invasion, etc. Basically the State Military Reserve in my state is a division/corp structure with the strength of perhaps a few regiments. The idea being that several thousand personnel maintain equipment, train with the equipment, train in platoon/company level exercises, maintain standards of physical fitness, and keep current on weapons qualification, and if there is an invasion they will train the thousands of people who will be used to fill the division/corps to full strength.

    Basically the idea is that the official state militias (those run by the state government and answering to the governor) are going to be augmented by the bubba type militias (those full of hillbillies running around the woods training on their own) as well as retired veterans, police, conscripts, and volunteers/other irregulars. I'd say that one trained soldier can probably instruct/train 10-30 volunteers/conscripts over a period of 8-12 weeks, meaning that a cadre force of approximately 2,000 individuals has the potential to serve as the foundation for a corps of 60,000 soldiers who would be ready within three months.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  BTRfan on Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:08 pm

    Austin wrote:Isnt it a colossal waste of money to do major upgrade of the T-72's considering its a 70's design tank and does not offer the crew protection level of modern tank and an upgrade might be a case of Pig with lipstick.

    It is better to procure T-90's in good numbers and work on Future MBT based on T-95 or an advanced variant.

    It is better to sell the vastT-72's to few South American Country , Africa ,Libya as attractive rates and put that money in procuring T-90's and FMBT


    I'd say the hell with Libya or any given South American country, Russia should do something that not only brings in some funds but also accomplishes a foreign policy objective.

    The tanks should be sold, at a discount, to Serbia, so Serbia can wind up with 1,500 to 2,500 new tanks that it can spend a few years upgrading, which will assure Russia obtains a lot of funds and arms their friend Serbia with reasonable quality tanks.

    If I were the Serb leader I'd want to have at least 1,000 main battle tanks ready to go, with crews for said tanks, so that when NATO winds up occupied in some major fight, be it against China or be it in the form of civil wars due to Muslims in their own lands, a Serb blitzkrieg can be launched to reclaim Kosovo, destroy/flatten Albania (or else they'll bounce back and attack their neighbors again), unite with Montenegro, reclaim Bosnia, and perhaps unite with Macedonia as well.

    Serbia is a small country and I believe they have some money issues, so they should probably take a cadre and irregular/paramilitary approach when it comes to boosting their manpower. They don't need a standing army of 150,000 to 500,000 to achieve their goals, all they need to do is have equipment on hand, trained crews for the special equipment (tanks, artillery, etc) and then have a number (perhaps 50,000 to 150,000) of men who are trained for war and ready/willing to fight when called, along with a few thousand paramilitaries who will finance themselves through plunder. When the war breaks out the crews are mobilized, the tanks are pulled out of storage, then the paramilitaries mobilize and go do their thing. The government doesn't have to pay to finance the irregulars in Kosovo as they'll finance themselves with what they loot from Albanian swine. The government only has to pay in regards to whatever air support, tank support, and artillery support is provided, unless some of the cadre forces are permanently assigned to the paramilitary forces and they to finance themselves via plunder and obtain their own spare parts.

    There are almost 10,000 T-72s presently in the Russian Federation, correct? It shouldn't be too hard for at least 1,000 to 2,000 to wind up being sold to Serbia under terms Serbia could reasonably afford.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 13, 2010 1:53 am

    I think Serbia would appreciate the sentiment of getting 1,000 modern tanks from Russia, but the financial burden of operating and maintaining more tanks is not something Serbia really needs right now.
    I think after the 74 day NATO air campaign they lost something like 13 vehicles so it is not like they are an Arab country that has just been handed their a$$e$ by the Israelis and needs to re-equip.

    I think even the Serbs themselves have accepted that using force to take Kosovo is not really an option and that there are probably a few within NATO that were frustrated with the air war and wanted to send in the ground troops.

    I have a lot of respect for the Serbs but I think if NATO sent in ground forces they would win though they would find fighting in Serbia makes Iraq and Afghanistan seem like a walk in the park because of the terrain and forests. NATO would get a bloody nose, but Serbia will be bludgeoned to near death and that is in no ones interests. (except the Albanian Kosovo residents).

    I also don't think that handing out old tanks should be all charity... it should be coordinated with Rosoboronexport as either a reward for an order, or to encourage orders or growth in trade with countries. It can also be used as payment for renting facilities.

    For instance, Vietnam might want some tanks but not need T-90s so 1,000 upgraded T-55s might meet their needs... with add on armour suites and a relatively modern fire control system fitted. They could be gifted to Vietnam for the use of the Cam Rhan Bay Naval base in batches. And then perhaps some light armoured vehicles might be gifted... if Vietnam wants them. The Russians still have a lot of single seat fighters like Mig-21s and Mig-23s in storage AFAIK. It really comes down to what the potential customer wants.

    The point is that gifting these things saves Russia in storage costs, it benefits the customers as they get either very cheap stuff or free stuff to encourage them to order other stuff or as a reward for other purchases.
    If Vietnam wanted 1,000 T-55s they will need spare parts and ammo and other add ons etc so there are lots of ways for Russia to make money.

    I am not sure what tanks Vietnam have in service... they might have T-72s in which case they might want more T-72s which might eventually lead to an order for further upgraded T-90s later on.

    Russia might be able to sell all the tooling and equipment at the factories that sell 100mm rifled ammo used in the T-55 and T-54 series tanks to Vietnam so they can make their own ammo and also sell any ammo stocks that are not time expired to them too.

    Even adapting the tanks for remote control operation and using them for target practise in developing anti tank weapons.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  BTRfan on Wed Oct 13, 2010 2:33 am

    GarryB wrote:I think Serbia would appreciate the sentiment of getting 1,000 modern tanks from Russia, but the financial burden of operating and maintaining more tanks is not something Serbia really needs right now.
    I think after the 74 day NATO air campaign they lost something like 13 vehicles so it is not like they are an Arab country that has just been handed their a$$e$ by the Israelis and needs to re-equip.

    I think even the Serbs themselves have accepted that using force to take Kosovo is not really an option and that there are probably a few within NATO that were frustrated with the air war and wanted to send in the ground troops.

    I have a lot of respect for the Serbs but I think if NATO sent in ground forces they would win though they would find fighting in Serbia makes Iraq and Afghanistan seem like a walk in the park because of the terrain and forests. NATO would get a bloody nose, but Serbia will be bludgeoned to near death and that is in no ones interests. (except the Albanian Kosovo residents).

    I also don't think that handing out old tanks should be all charity... it should be coordinated with Rosoboronexport as either a reward for an order, or to encourage orders or growth in trade with countries. It can also be used as payment for renting facilities.

    For instance, Vietnam might want some tanks but not need T-90s so 1,000 upgraded T-55s might meet their needs... with add on armour suites and a relatively modern fire control system fitted. They could be gifted to Vietnam for the use of the Cam Rhan Bay Naval base in batches. And then perhaps some light armoured vehicles might be gifted... if Vietnam wants them. The Russians still have a lot of single seat fighters like Mig-21s and Mig-23s in storage AFAIK. It really comes down to what the potential customer wants.

    The point is that gifting these things saves Russia in storage costs, it benefits the customers as they get either very cheap stuff or free stuff to encourage them to order other stuff or as a reward for other purchases.
    If Vietnam wanted 1,000 T-55s they will need spare parts and ammo and other add ons etc so there are lots of ways for Russia to make money.

    I am not sure what tanks Vietnam have in service... they might have T-72s in which case they might want more T-72s which might eventually lead to an order for further upgraded T-90s later on.

    Russia might be able to sell all the tooling and equipment at the factories that sell 100mm rifled ammo used in the T-55 and T-54 series tanks to Vietnam so they can make their own ammo and also sell any ammo stocks that are not time expired to them too.

    Even adapting the tanks for remote control operation and using them for target practise in developing anti tank weapons.


    I want to say the Vietnamese are using mostly Type 59s that they obtained from China.


    As for Serbia regaining Kosovo, it will be possible if/when NATO is too occupied elsewhere, such as with a massive war against China, or when the main NATO members begin to collapse due to internal pressures. I don't expect that France, Germany, or Britain will last more than 10-15 more years at the rate they're going.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 13, 2010 3:58 am

    Looking at this page:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_People%27s_Army

    If you scroll down to the equipment section there is a wide range of Soviet equipment still in use by Vietnam.
    I would suspect some of it might be better replaced, but you'd have to discuss it with them to be sure.

    Just off the wiki page I see some BTR-50s are listed. They might still be operational (being tracked their mobility on soft ground would be very useful) or they might just be scrap by now.
    They might want more from old Soviet stocks, or it might be better to provide BMPs instead.
    Equally they have T-62s and T-54s and T-55s and a wide range of Chinese tanks. So they might find more T-62s would be a good way to replace older models or they might want more older model tanks because they are easier to maintain and operate.

    It all comes down to what they like and what they want.

    They might be sick of the old crap and want all new stuff, or they might just want more ammo for the old stuff and parts to keep it running better.

    Rather than the old superpower habit of dumping old stuff on "lesser allies", it would show respect to talk to them and find out what they would like. They might find a handout offensive and demand to pay market rates... don't know till you talk.

    Good thing about talking about it is that you find other common areas of trade.

    The thing is that Vietnam and other countries in the area have little disputes with China and other countries about the ownership of islands so Russia could exploit those differences and sneak in and do some trade.

    Regarding Kosovo... Serbia needs to keep its eyes open, its mouth largely closed, and not volunteer for anything. It will only be a matter of time before NATO countries dealing with Kosovo realise these new allies are not that appealing.

    Of course I think the line of logic should now be that if Albanians in Kosovo can declare independence and create their own country then surely Serbs in the new independent country of Kosovo and indeed the artificial country of Bosnia can also claim independence and create their own new countries respectively.
    And claims it was a unique case don't wash... every case is unique.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 13, 2010 4:21 am

    Actually I just looked at the wiki link I posted and it mentions a tank upgrade program with the Israelis called T-55M3.

    This website
    http://www.quandoinhandan.org.vn/QDN...9/Default.aspx

    In Vietnamese translated to English by Google Translate:

    Improvement and modernization of tanks and armored-
    People's Army - Saturday, 05/12/2009, 17:51 (GMT 7)

    Today, with the strong development of science and technology, technical equipment and weapons in general, up-armored vehicles (T-TG) in particular countries of the world is constantly researching, manufacturing create new and more modern equipment quickly into the military. Besides research, development, improvement trend, modernized to enhance technical capability, tactics of the vehicle type T-TG is also promoting the country. This is the appropriate choice in many countries the military has done, both to meet the operational requirements of modern warfare, both in line with economic conditions, the defense industry of each country.
    Department of Technical Officer Corps (General Engineering) inspected the tank improvements. Image: LE HOA

    The years, the improvement and modernization of the car T-TG is on the payroll is the most troops in the world and made regional focus. Programs and projects to improve and modernize the car T-TG concentration enhanced maneuverability, enhanced fire power, improved fire control systems, communications systems and improve self-protection. Through these programs, improvement projects, many types of car T-TG-generation first and second, capital obsolete technical features, tactics has makeover to become the weapon system powerful, high combat effectiveness.

    To suit the type of modern war, meet the requirements of national defense, the improvement and modernization of T-TG car is essential. The Russian military has successfully improved many types of battle tanks with high power T-55 tanks into a T-55AM, PT-76 tanks into PT-76B/57mmAP ... U.S. Army M1A1 tanks to improve M1A2, M1A3 ... German Army M1 improved armored vehicles into armored Bradley M2 Bradley ... Based on equipment needs and potential capabilities, tend to improve and modernize the car T-TG in the future of the military is enhanced tactics and techniques for some types of cars T-TG as T54, T55, PT-76, BMP-1, M113, BTR-60BP, BRDM-2 ... become the standard vehicle car T-TG-generation main battle Tuesday, flexibility , high mobility and improve combat effectiveness.

    Improvement towards increased mobility vehicles T-TG, scientists and military technical research has focused on the new engine has great capacity to improve its own capacity and maximum traction of the car . Such selection engine instead 5MC B46-engine B-55 on T-55 tanks, while capacity increased from 580 horsepower to 690 horsepower; B6-engined, 240 horsepower capacity of the tanks PT-76 with engine UTD-23 or AMZ-328 has a greater capacity. Research engine go-Eden replace gasoline engines in armored cars and armored tire chains. For the M113 vehicle, instead of gasoline engines with the go-Eden, or rather two petrol engines GAZ-49B on the BTR-60BP in a car engine go-Eden ... Research AMZ-236A transmission mount new resources (such as mechanical power transmission system planets, hydro mechanical automatic gearbox for the car T300PI M113) with a drive system and hydraulic control system operation improvements, to improve the characteristics and dynamics of smooth movement of vehicles. Enhance the vehicle's wading pool and T-TG on any terrain.

    Improvements to enhance the fire power to fight the car T-TG is one of the priorities. Tanks were studied to improve fitting and use of artillery rounds advanced to destroy different objectives; mounted anti-tank missile system can destroy body and plates of all types of tanks modern. Specifically, T-54B, T-55 improved antitank missiles mounted Bastion (9K116) led by the laser, was launched through the 100mm guns. Grenade launchers mounted on armored caterpillar mounted 30mm grenade launcher on the AGC-17 M113 armored vehicles, mounted 57mm automatic cannon AY220M up PT-76 tanks to fire at targets on both land and air ... BTR armored car tires and BRDM-2-60BP improvements and installation of large range anti-tank missiles 152mm (Kornet-E), 30mm automatic grenade launcher or AG-30 23mm cannon barrel type 2 GS-23. Sync with the weapon system is the fire control system is also improved strongly, more car control system installed a new fire, like LANSADOT, EFCS-3, VOLNA with ballistic computer and telemetry is de-combined. Improved system stability, the viewfinder system, the glass thermal imaging night vision or amplify dim light generation to improve the flexibility and precision firepower to aim the target day, night and not to enemy detection.

    The car T-TG also study Smoke gun mount fitted camouflage and explosive reactive armor to enhance self-protection, anti-detection and destroyed by means of reconnaissance and firepower of the enemy . Weapons systems on the vehicle of communication and T-TG step synchronization, research and installation of advanced types of communication station, modern, using high-speed integrated circuits, a wide frequency range, sensitivity high-frequency automatic adjustment, a long-distance communications and to ensure vehicle stability when contacted T-TG activity in any terrain.

    The level and scale of improvements and modernization of the car T-TG militaries of different countries around the world. In our country, the improvement and modernization of the car T-TG to study the option consistent with the level of science and technology and defense industry in the country. Next time, our troops continue to implement programs and projects to improve and modernize T-TG in the direction of application of modern technology, product standards and level of car generation T-TG third, ensuring consistent with my typing, while mastering all aspects of technology transfer, to meet the technical requirements for ensuring long-term use.

    Colonel, Master Tran Xuan Hai



    It seems there is plenty of scope for cooperation and trade.

    GarryB
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 19, 2010 12:33 am

    There is a new contract with Venezuela for T-72s so perhaps this is the first order for the new modernisation of the vehicle?

    There is also talk that the S-300 batteries that Iran ordered could be sold to Venezuela too.

    Vladimir79
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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Vladimir79 on Sat Oct 23, 2010 5:40 pm

    GarryB wrote:There is a new contract with Venezuela for T-72s so perhaps this is the first order for the new modernisation of the vehicle?

    There is also talk that the S-300 batteries that Iran ordered could be sold to Venezuela too.

    The modernisation has not been finalised, count on a version of T-72M1.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  GarryB on Sun Oct 24, 2010 5:54 am

    I would think that Hugo would want the best, and I would hope the makers are pushing their latest model.

    Really comes down to whether Hugo wants some tanks from ex-Soviet stocks (ie cheapos) or new builds.

    I would expect if he wants new builds he would go for the best T-72 model.

    Of course if money was no object then one would expect he would be wanting T-90s so money clearly is an issue, or perhaps they feel they don't need that level of tank because it might cause neighbours to rearm with new western tanks which will cause an arms race.

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    Described as newest T-72B mod.

    Post  GarryB on Wed Dec 15, 2010 1:43 am

    http://andrei-bt.livejournal.com/68348.html

    Described as newest T-72B mod.

    New optic-electronic countermeasure system, new ERA, FCS and so on.

    BTW I was thumbing through a book about WWII and I was reading about the performance of the Panther and I noticed that at about 45-48 tons the Panther is a similar weight to a T-90.

    Made me think how far tank design has come with a comparison of frontal armour and engine power and the power of the main gun etc etc.

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    Re: T-72 ΜΒΤ: Μodernisation and Variants

    Post  Austin on Sat Sep 03, 2011 12:01 pm

    As per the news I gathered from MP.net the T-72A and B are being upgraded to T-72BA standard , More details here

    http://www.otvaga2004.narod.ru/xlopotov_8/tank_t72ba_01.htm

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