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    TOR-M2 Air Defence system

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    Isos
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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  Isos on Sat Jun 11, 2016 8:32 pm

    sepheronx wrote:I always had a soft spot for Tor over the Pantsir.  Glad to hear they are making them more automated as that is what I figured they would do to both Tor and Pantsir eventually in order to increase number of them without having to increase number of people to operate them.

    Interestingly enough, they didn't mention in your post the 9M338 missile.  This is the latest and would probably replace all others in the future.  hopefully.

    Having bot of them makes jamming a lot harder. Deadly combot for any flying object.

    Fully robotized isn't a little bit dangerous for civilian planes ? And you need a really good trained radar operator to pick up the planes in hard ECM environment, I don't think tehnology can do this better than human.

    sepheronx
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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  sepheronx on Sat Jun 11, 2016 9:05 pm

    A couple of things to take into consideration:
    - Yes, Automation will be a problem in events such as EW environment. But what gives these unmanned systems benefit over others is if they are stationary. Why I mention this is because they will not be connected wireless, so not letting off signals to be intercepted or system being intercepted and controlled wireless, but all controlled via fiber optic lines so it would require having to actually cut into the connection physically in order to gain control. If they are thinking of making them unmanned in the sense where the systems operate freely on their own, then that is a problem for sure.
    - Regarding radar, not really. In any event, I imagine that such systems will be connected to a central unit (as said, via fiber lines), and the central system will have access to data from advanced radar systems so it will be able to detect and track targets far more efficiently and accurately. The radar systems onboard these Tor systems are only so good due to its size and power draw.

    I imagine it will be a module system where they operate somewhat by their own, but all connected to a control unit. Technically, Unmanned drones are controlled via a central console by two people anyway, so not exactly fully unmanned. I imagine this is the same method. So in reality, control units of a Tor, which may require two individuals to control it, can be now left unmanned and all controlled by a couple of guys in a trailer somewhere else, that can monitor and control lets say 5 or more of these systems at same time.

    Viktor
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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  Viktor on Sun Jul 03, 2016 3:03 pm

    Nice thumbsup

    Now the moment we have been waiting for - TOR with 16 missiles and new type of missiles Very Happy - two regimental sets will be delivered by the end of this year

    Russian troops in 2016 will receive 2 sets of air defense systems, "Tor-M2"

    MOSCOW, July 2 -. RIA Novosti Two sets of modified anti-aircraft missile system "Tor-M2" with twice increased ammunition arrive in the Russian army in 2016, said on Saturday, the chief of Defense Forces Land Forces, Lieutenant-General Alexander Leonov.

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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  franco on Sun Jul 03, 2016 3:21 pm

    Viktor wrote:Nice  thumbsup

    Now the moment we have been waiting for - TOR with 16 missiles and new type of missiles Very Happy - two regimental sets will be delivered by the end of this year

    Russian troops in 2016 will receive 2 sets of air defense systems, "Tor-M2"

    MOSCOW, July 2 -. RIA Novosti Two sets of modified anti-aircraft missile system "Tor-M2" with twice increased ammunition arrive in the Russian army in 2016, said on Saturday, the chief of Defense Forces Land Forces, Lieutenant-General Alexander Leonov.

    I took that to mean twice the range not twice the weapons load. We will have to see.

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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  Viktor on Sun Jul 03, 2016 3:24 pm

    franco wrote:I took that to mean twice the range not twice the weapons load. We will have to see.

    No. New missile will expand the engagement envelope but we have been discussing here because this is not first such info - double the munition Laughing Laughing

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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  medo on Sun Jul 03, 2016 5:06 pm

    franco wrote:
    Viktor wrote:Nice  thumbsup

    Now the moment we have been waiting for - TOR with 16 missiles and new type of missiles Very Happy - two regimental sets will be delivered by the end of this year

    Russian troops in 2016 will receive 2 sets of air defense systems, "Tor-M2"

    MOSCOW, July 2 -. RIA Novosti Two sets of modified anti-aircraft missile system "Tor-M2" with twice increased ammunition arrive in the Russian army in 2016, said on Saturday, the chief of Defense Forces Land Forces, Lieutenant-General Alexander Leonov.

    I took that to mean twice the range not twice the weapons load. We will have to see.

    With the new Tor-M2 missiles, they will double the number of missiles from 8 to 16. But they also have increased range from 12 km to 15 km.

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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  Viktor on Wed Jul 06, 2016 1:54 pm

    New TOR-M2U delivered to Russian ground air defense

    The latest missile systems, "Tor M2U" came to the troops

    SAM "trafficking in M2" has 12 surface-to-air missile , capable of hitting targets flying at speeds up to 700 meters per second at a distance of 12 kilometers and at an altitude of six thousand meters.

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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  George1 on Sun Jul 10, 2016 9:56 pm

    New Tor-M2U air defense missile systems arrive in tank unit in Siberia

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/886630

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2006953.html


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    GarryB
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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  GarryB on Tue Jul 12, 2016 1:11 am

    Will Tor get a fire & forget missile any time soon?

    I hope not.

    Fire and forget capability makes each missile rather more expensive and a tiny seeker in the missile would be easier to defeat than the rather powerful and sophisticated electronics mounted on the TOR vehicle.


    The main advantage of fire and forget missiles is that in a saturation attack fire and forget missiles can be launched rapidly, whereas the current command guided missiles need guidance channels to control them limiting them to about 4 simultaneous targets at one time. The high speed of the missiles and the increase in missile numbers means that should be plenty though more sophisticated tracking radar should allow an increase in that performance factor a phased array with three to four faces covering 360 degrees would be the best solution.

    Very simply put the current radar system is amazing for a vehicle mounted air defence system, but having a tracking radar in the front means targets coming in from all directions at once requires a minimum of four vehicles for 360 degree coverage.

    Four face phased array radars for search and tracking functions means continuous 360 degree coverage and likely a large increase in the number of targets tracked and missiles guided to targets. An EO channel would add options in heavy jamming situations too.

    The advantage of the TOR and Pantsir systems was the fact that the missiles are simple and cheap so the system is cheap and easy to use against even drone targets.

    A few IIR or MMW radar guided missiles would make sense within a battery I suppose... the HERMES missile will be getting such sensors and will be used together with Pantsir batteries too.

    The automation of the TOR system is likely to allow fitting of the automated turret system onto the new platforms with unmanned turrets... I wonder if they will take the opportunity to make dramatic changes to the design... ie imagine an ARMATA vehicle with a tiny forward mounted turret and front mounted engine with the small turret consisting of a 3 or four faced array radar system with an EO ball on top for IIR detection and the rear deck consisting of an array of vertically stacked missiles in a large pallet. If they can fit 16 of the new missiles in the old turret they should be able to fit double that in the rear deck area of an armata tank with the engine at the front... 32 missiles ready to fire and being at the rear it could be module based and able to be removed in one piece and replaced with a fully loaded module for fast reloads.

    The three or four faced radar array would not need to rotate and could be fixed. the EO ball on top could be a mini turret with multiple optical ports looking in several directions at once including up and include the optics for the commander and perhaps a self defence MG and grenade launcher.


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    Austin
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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  Austin on Sat Jul 16, 2016 8:42 pm

    Tor Variant

    http://arsenal-otechestva.ru/article/479-last-defence

    jhelb
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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  jhelb on Tue Jul 19, 2016 10:54 am

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    Benya
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    Arctic variant of Tor-M2

    Post  Benya on Mon Aug 08, 2016 11:32 pm

    Confirmed! Arctic variant of Tor-M2 is under development (platform and designation also confirmed)

    Kupol to develop Arctic variant of Tor-M2 SAM system

    Russia`s JSC Izhevsk Electromechanical Plant Kupol (a subsidiary of the Almaz-Antey Concern) is developing the Arctic variant of the Tor-M2 (NATO reporting name: SA-15 Gauntlet) mobile surface-to-air missile (SAM) system, according to the No.31603940773 notification published on the state acquisitions website.


    The Tor-M2 SAM system

    The modification of the Tor-M2 SAM system for the troops deployed to the Arctic region is designated as Tor-M2DT (Russia`s MoD designation: 9K331DT). According to the notification, the system will be based on the DT-30PM tracked double-section tractor developed by the Vityaz Machine-Building Plant (Ishimbay, Bashkiria). The Tor-M2DT mobile launching unit (DT-30PM-T1, MoD designation: 9A331MDT) is supposed to include the 9A331MT launcher and a life support module. The DT-30PM-T1 vehicle will be complemented by the DT-30PM-T2 mobile maintenance workshop.

    According to the notification, the Kupol enterprise is to produce one DT-30PM-T1 mobile launching unit and one DT-30PM-T2 mobile maintenance workshop by October 30, 2016. The type tests of the new vehicles are scheduled for the 1st quarter of 2017. The company is to spend about RUB122 million (USD2 million) to conduct the aforementioned works.


    The DT-30 is a Russian-made all-terrain tracked carrier vehicle.

    Official article:
    Arrow http://www.armyrecognition.com/august_2016_global_defense_security_news_industry/kupol_to_develop_arctic_variant_of_tor-m2_sam_system_50808163.html

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    Re: TOR-M2 Air Defence system

    Post  airstrike on Fri Sep 30, 2016 4:01 pm

    Tor-M2U air defense system ready to enter service with the Russian Army

    http://echelon-defense.com/2016/09/30/tor-m2u-air-defense-system-ready-to-enter-service-with-the-russian-army/

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