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    Russian Navy: Status and News #5

    GarryB
    GarryB

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    Post  GarryB on Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:41 am

    Well, they don't have a ready to use invasion fleet, which is a good thing because that really would have been a lot of wasted money if they did... the core capabilities are there... they have ballistic nuke subs to prevent the west thinking they can win WWIII.

    They have some corvettes with armament levels comparable to cold war Soviet destroyers, but obviously smaller and lacking endurance to do what bigger ships actually do.

    The designs are modular so the bits are now working... it is just a question of designing and building bigger vessels that will have more modular bits on platforms that can operate globally without land based air support.

    They have effectively created an AEGIS system that works on all their ships, subs, aircraft, and satellites to share information across platforms which is an enormous step forward many navies have yet to take.

    What Russia needs to do now politically is look to the rest of the world and develop trade ties on equal terms and both help the world grow and develop and grow and develop on with them... different to the western model where they ripped off the third world and tried to keep them in their place while exploiting their resources to become rich itself.

    They wont have new really big ships for more than a decade, but the ones they have will be more than enough for what they need them for with fairly minor upgrades and improvements.
    Rodion_Romanovic
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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic on Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:50 pm

    Anyway, it sounds a bit too critical, especially now that they have modern powerplants, sensors and weapon system for a proper destroyer.

    The long trip of the gorshkov frigate showed that they moved in the proper direction.

    22350 are excellent ships, and probably the best frigates in the world, but they lack range and endurance for long trips, unless accompanied by tankers and support/ replenishment ships.


    They just need a ship with double the endurance of the 22350 and with the size of a Udaloy class destroyer, and that is the 22350M. Of course it will take time before they are ready, hoping that they start soon with their production.



    In the meanwhile long range expedition by surface fleet will be done by the remaining Udaloys (some of which are being modernised), by the 2 operational Slava class cruisers ("Moskva" fate is still to be decided) and by the available battlecruiser (Peter the Great/ Nakhimov).

    It is not a large long range fleet, but it is okayish for the next few years, if keeping the same level of long range expeditions as in the last 10 years


    Navy does not have ships capable of providing effective fire support to the coastal flank of the army or landing force, as well as to escort the latter in the operational depth.

    Actually the lack of proper naval gunfire support is a problem shared also by the US Navy and pointed out many times by the US marine corp.

    The Russians have big guns also in the small corvettes (100mm gun in the buyan M), and while they lack blue sea capabilities, they could for sure be used in black sea operations.

    They had 4 (2x2) large (130mm) guns in their sovremenny class destroyers and they still have some of them in operation and in reserve, if needed.

    Assault and attack helicopters in the new amphibious ships will also help, but such ships are not ready yet, and anyway helicopters cannot fully substitute naval artillery.

    Some of the "crazy" Garry's ideas could be quite interesting also, like finding a naval platform for the 152 mm Koalitia artillery gun!
    Gibraltar
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    Post  Gibraltar on Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:05 am

    The shopping list to get a full-scale navy it's not so large.
    Essentially they lack in power projection not in defrnce capabilities.

    For politics reasons they should have 4 battle groups.
    Northern, Pacific, Mediterranean and a last one to support far away operations.
    These battlegroups should be each composed of few advancdd and big units, all nuclear powered.
    1 carrier, 1 battlestar (stupid to dismantle first 2 kirovs, better keep them afloat now and radically refurbish them, even nuclear propulsion, in future) 1 destroyer 1 ssgn and 1 ssn.

    With this "CBG" model they're fully potent all over the world with 20 high-level ships. It's not too much effort considering that they have to build from scratch only the 4 carriers and the 4 destroyers and some ssn and ssgn.

    Can't afford such a dream-team? Again, keep all the Kirovs, even if of them could be saved only the hulls it's so much time and money saved than starting from white sheet. A hull is hull and modern reactor and turbines are not so radically different from Kirovs internal layout. With modern reactors they could even free the space taken buy boilers and overheaters. I'll never understand why to waste the opportunity of getting 4 battlestars instead of 2 in a matter of 10 years.
    Gibraltar
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    Post  Gibraltar on Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:09 am

    To keep minimal blue wwter capabilities, at least 2 nuclear carriers and 4 nuclear destroyers are needed. Kirovs and Yasens will do the rest without the need of support vessels.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Fri Aug 16, 2019 9:49 am

    An important part of planning and management is how much money do you have to spend, and what do you ultimately want to end up with, but also a time scale when you want to get things you need into service.

    There would be no point blowing out the budget right now laying down a CVN or getting the Chinese to whack one out for them in 3-5 years... first of all they don't have the facilities free to properly dock it, the land based infrastructure does not exist for it yet, and you wouldn't have enough large ships to operate with it in the first place.

    Remember in western navies the carrier is the key vessel and all the ships and subs that operate with it are there to support it.

    For the Russians it is the surface and subsurface vessels that are the Navy... the carrier is just there to provide air cover and protection for those ships beyond the reach of Russian land based air power.

    That means they really need to start producing those 7,000 ton Gorshkov destroyers, and those 20K ton cruisers before it even makes sense to build NEW carriers... by the mid 2030s they will need to have a new CVN in the water and likely with cats and Su-57K aircraft and some form of shipboard AWACS platform.

    Their planning and production so far have not wasted their budget and are laying the groundwork getting brand new cruise and anti ship missiles operational right down to Corvette level... new AESAs and a unified battle management system are all in place and a range of brand new gun systems have entered service now too. All the components are there... to scale things up just requires new propulsion... and with 7K and 20K ton vessels nuke propulsion becomes an obvious choice, perhaps electric drive delaying things a little but making it all worth the effort... and just bigger sensors and more UKSK launchers and more SAM tubes and eventually just universal missile launch systems like UKSK-M that can carry anything... what is not to like.

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