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    EU, USA and Russia critisize India for Satellite shotdown...

    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:44 pm

    In a rare moment of unity, EU, USA and Russia critisized the indian test from last week. India shot down a satellite and indian PM Modi praised this idiocy as prove "that india has become a space power".

    The test created a debris cloud which could have triggered a Kessler Sydrome.

    NASA boss Bridenstine said, that the debris raised the risk for ISS to be hit by 44%.

    24 debris particles overlap the ISS orbit. This is horrible and unacceptable.

    ESA CEO Wörner said: "No credible space power would willingly create more space trash".

    The sharpest comment came from russian ROSKOSMOS leader Rogosin, who said: "If you shot down a satellite, to prove that you are a space power...only proves that you are not."



    For Info, a destroyed satellite creates a debris cloud, travelling around earth with 28.000 km/h. If this debris cloud hits another object..this object too will smash and create more debris which
    leads to more objects to smash each other. A cataclysmic event that triggers a cascade of collissions and in end, makes space not usuable for humanity anylonger.


    The last time someone made this was China in 2007. The debris cloud still has to be supervised.

    But now to my opinion...we talk about india here. No doubt its military has experts and sane thinking people...

    When such a mad idea comes up, is there nobody who punchs on the table and says: No!

    This test was so patheticly dumb that no words can express it.

    Our usual differences in our worldviews aside...i wonder what you say.
    Vladimir79
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    Post  Vladimir79 on Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:20 pm

    It is an irresponsible action, I said it when China did it so I cannot excuse India of the same. The ability to shoot down an LEO object in a fixed orbit with days and weeks of preparation is no great feat. It is being able to shoot them down on the fly that is of strategic use.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Wed Apr 03, 2019 9:13 am

    It was not a positive step, but with the US creating space military forces... it is a necessary test to ensure things you are told work do work...

    Of the enormous number of items in earth orbit the vast majority are Soviet and American... ranging from grain of sand size objects to objects the size of a school bus.

    Talk of some out of control cascade where one item smashes into another and creates dozens or hundreds of smaller pieces which then hit other things is amusing... impacts don't change trajectories that much, and so only other objects on the same trajectory are ever at risk.
    Hole
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    Post  Hole on Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:03 am

    Indian test created around 50 small parts which are in a low orbit and will burn up in the atmosphere in a few weeks, according to russian specialists (Sputnik reported).
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed Apr 03, 2019 4:35 pm

    GarryB wrote:It was not a positive step, but with the US creating space military forces... it is a necessary test to ensure things you are told work do work...

    Of the enormous number of items in earth orbit the vast majority are Soviet and American... ranging from grain of sand size objects to objects the size of a school bus.

    Talk of some out of control cascade where one item smashes into another and creates dozens or hundreds of smaller pieces which then hit other things is amusing... impacts don't change trajectories that much, and so only other objects on the same trajectory are ever at risk.

    No it is not amusing. Infact dozens of satellites share same or similar orbit.

    Its simple math, do a few more such tests and you dont need a space force, since space is unacessible.
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed Apr 03, 2019 4:37 pm

    Hole wrote:Indian test created around 50 small parts which are in a low orbit and will burn up in the atmosphere in a few weeks, according to russian specialists (Sputnik reported).

    A bursting satellite creates 50 small parts? What happened with rest? Felt into a black hole?

    ESA detected over 34.000 particles. 24 of those cross ISS orbit. We talk about a debris cloud, which btw already spans 350 km.
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Apr 03, 2019 5:12 pm

    US and Russia are so proud of their lasers, they can always use them to destroy the small parts.

    Most sensitive satellites can move so they don't really care. They are only frustrated that india improves its technology.
    kvs
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    Post  kvs on Wed Apr 03, 2019 5:57 pm

    Isos wrote:US and Russia are so proud of their lasers, they can always use them to destroy the small parts.

    Most sensitive satellites can move so they don't really care. They are only frustrated that india improves its technology.

    What the hell are you smoking. Russia never exhibited any pride in its lasers. Stop making up "facts". And
    existing ground based laser systems would not be able to vapourize any space debris since they are:

    1) sufficiently decollimated

    2) attenuated by the atmosphere

    3) can't focus on the target beyond the horizon

    When space based lasers are deployed let us know.

    Your smug dismissal of the problem of space debris shows you are a clown. You talk about sensitive satellites moving
    with arbitrary speed and arbitrary distances as if you know this for a fact. Satellites can't even move orbits during
    solar coronal mass ejection events when the Van Allen belt low radiation gaps move enough that satellites can get their
    electronics fried and rely on shielding. Satellites only have fuel for minor orbit corrections to keep themselves in
    the same orbit due to gas and dust drag. None of these maneuvering systems is rapid like you envision them to be.
    So no bullet evasion is going to happen.

    These satellite shootdowns are a joke designed to stroke people with an inferiority complex.
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:15 pm

    These satellite shootdowns are a joke designed to stroke people with an inferiority complex.

    I'm pretty sur if I go on the mig-31 thread where we talk about the russian anti-sat missile you will be saying totally different things.

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t1812p575-mig-31bm-interceptor-news#236962

    I also said about this russian missiles that such weapons can destroy your own satellites by creating small parts cruise at mach 20 making them like APFSDS rounds and many poeple said it was bs, the missile is very good because its russian.

    Now that India tested its own you're crying.

    Russia never exhibited any pride in its lasers

    Yes they did. In this forum too people always talk about mighty Peresvet powered by nuclear reactor while they don't even know what is made for.

    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:32 pm

    The simple fact is, that shooting down a satellite is a clear sign, that your country isa poor underdeveloped shithole country.

    1. Shooting down a satellite is easy. The trajectory and speed is known. Evry country with a functional rocket and computers with the powrlevel of s chool calculator can do this.

    2. If India really wanted impress someone, they should have send a rocket up, to catch a debris and bring it down.

    So congratz India. You went back to something USA, France, Canada, Japan, Russia, China, UK and Italy could do since the 60th.

    Sofar first surveys show that at least 6500 fragments larger than a pencil eraser were created.

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:27 am

    No it is not amusing. Infact dozens of satellites share same or similar orbit.

    You can have a hundred thousand objects in the same orbit path... as long as they are going in the same direction the chance of a collision is zero because the only way they can collide is if one is moving faster than the other ones... but if something is moving faster than the other ones it will automatically move into a higher orbit and the problem is solved.

    The ISS is moved several times a year to avoid collisions... it is not a new problem... it also expends fuel to maintain altitude because sometimes material leaving the atmosphere can slow down objects at those orbital heights and slow them down a little... for trash that means they drop down into a lower orbit and when it happens again they get even slower and eventually they fall back to earth and burn up. It is in much higher orbits where the real problems exist but as you move to higher orbits the orbital ring becomes enormous and room for objects expands enormously.

    Its simple math, do a few more such tests and you dont need a space force, since space is unacessible.

    You'd think that would make America and other space faring countries do something... but they don't want to do anything that limits their access to space... America will even buy rocket engines from the devil than to lose access to space...

    These satellite shootdowns are a joke designed to stroke people with an inferiority complex.

    It has obviously pissed off America, and a certain Frenchman here so that makes it good value...

    The simple fact is, that shooting down a satellite is a clear sign, that your country isa poor underdeveloped shithole country.

    Can't be or the EU would have done it already... but then they can't shoot down satellites which makes them an underdeveloped shithole country that can't even piss off the Americans...

    1. Shooting down a satellite is easy. The trajectory and speed is known. Evry country with a functional rocket and computers with the powrlevel of s chool calculator can do this.

    If it is easy then you do it. NASA sent men to the moon with shitty analog computers collectively with less processing power than your phone, doesn't make it easy.

    2. If India really wanted impress someone, they should have send a rocket up, to catch a debris and bring it down.

    You are assuming they didn't want to test a capability and just wanted to impress the world... Fuck the debris... they don't have that many satellites in orbit... the chances of it hitting Indian satellites is very very low.

    So congratz India. You went back to something USA, France, Canada, Japan, Russia, China, UK and Italy could do since the 60th.

    Americas militarisation of space means an anti satellite capability is going to becomes a must... only a matter of time before the Russians test their S-500 on satellites, though they might also test technology to clean up the debris at the same time... but when they do you can bet your ass the EU will feel the need to test an anti satellite weapon too.

    Sofar first surveys show that at least 6500 fragments larger than a pencil eraser were created.

    Good. If the pinnacle of human achievement is the west in general and the US in particular we should not be allowed to leave the planet...
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:21 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    No it is not amusing. Infact dozens of satellites share same or similar orbit.

    You can have a hundred thousand objects in the same orbit path... as long as they are going in the same direction the chance of a collision is zero because the only way they can collide is if one is moving faster than the other ones... but if something is moving faster than the other ones it will automatically move into a higher orbit and the problem is solved.

    The ISS is moved several times a year to avoid collisions... it is not a new problem... it also expends fuel to maintain altitude because sometimes material leaving the atmosphere can slow down objects at those orbital heights and slow them down a little... for trash that means they drop down into a lower orbit and when it happens again they get even slower and eventually they fall back to earth and burn up. It is in much higher orbits where the real problems exist but as you move to higher orbits the orbital ring becomes enormous and room for objects expands enormously.

    Its simple math, do a few more such tests and you dont need a space force, since space is unacessible.

    You'd think that would make America and other space faring countries do something... but they don't want to do anything that limits their access to space... America will even buy rocket engines from the devil than to lose access to space...

    These satellite shootdowns are a joke designed to stroke people with an inferiority complex.

    It has obviously pissed off America, and a certain Frenchman here so that makes it good value...

    The simple fact is, that shooting down a satellite is a clear sign, that your country isa poor underdeveloped shithole country.

    Can't be or the EU would have done it already... but then they can't shoot down satellites which makes them an underdeveloped shithole country that can't even piss off the Americans...

    1. Shooting down a satellite is easy. The trajectory and speed is known. Evry country with a functional rocket and computers with the powrlevel of s chool calculator can do this.

    If it is easy then you do it. NASA sent men to the moon with shitty analog computers collectively with less processing power than your phone, doesn't make it easy.

    2. If India really wanted impress someone, they should have send a rocket up, to catch a debris and bring it down.

    You are assuming they didn't want to test a capability and just wanted to impress the world... Fuck the debris... they don't have that many satellites in orbit... the chances of it hitting Indian satellites is very very low.

    So congratz India. You went back to something USA, France, Canada, Japan, Russia, China, UK and Italy could do since the 60th.

    Americas militarisation of space means an anti satellite capability is going to becomes a must... only a matter of time before the Russians test their S-500 on satellites, though they might also test technology to clean up the debris at the same time... but when they do you can bet your ass the EU will feel the need to test an anti satellite weapon too.

    Sofar first surveys show that at least 6500 fragments larger than a pencil eraser were created.

    Good. If the pinnacle of human achievement is the west in general and the US in particular we should not be allowed to leave the planet...

    Gary i really tell you one time. Your problem is acting smart yet you have no knowledge.

    France sends up rocket modules and let them dock with a space station. That is high art. Shooting down a satellite is like running over a women. Docking a module on the ISS is renaissance dance.

    Now to the rest of your rubbish. A destroyed Satellite creates a debris cloud. It spreads apart and endangers more and more orbits. Some objects a speed up by impact, others sink down.

    As for us, we currently test a method to remove space debris.

    But hey, we are high culture...not the unwashed indian peasants.

    https://www.esa.int/gsp/ACT/projects/active_debris_removal.html

    Also i´m not angry, its just that the primitive level of india annoys me.

    You know...its like Cortez felt when seeing the Aztecs. They celebrate some savage and primitive shit.

    We dont need to test a anti satellite weapon. We have that capability since 1962.
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:03 pm

    As for us, we currently test a method to remove space debris.

    But hey, we are high culture...not the unwashed indian peasants.

    https://www.esa.int/gsp/ACT/projects/active_debris_removal.html

    Also i´m not angry, its just that the primitive level of india annoys me.

    You know...its like Cortez felt when seeing the Aztecs. They celebrate some savage and primitive shit.

    We dont need to test a anti satellite weapon. We have that capability since 1962

    You are such an asshole.

    First, most of the debris in the space come from western countries and soviet union.

    Just like they didn't care about global warming when they developed their industries but cares now about that when China and many other poor countries are geting industrialized, they care about space debris only because china, india, japan ... are successfull in their space programs.

    They try to make some international rules to speed down others developement who won't need Soyuz or Arian rockets for their own satellites.

    Second, when Cortez went to kill Aztecs celebrating savage and primitive shit, Spanish used to kill people who didn't beleive in Christ. Not better than Aztecs killing for them own Gods.
    Vladimir79
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    Post  Vladimir79 on Thu Apr 04, 2019 10:26 pm

    Aristide wrote:
    Hole wrote:Indian test created around 50 small parts which are in a low orbit and will burn up in the atmosphere in a few weeks, according to russian specialists (Sputnik reported).

    A bursting satellite creates 50 small parts? What happened with rest? Felt into a black hole?

    ESA detected over 34.000 particles. 24 of those cross ISS orbit. We talk about a debris cloud, which btw already spans 350 km.

    That is definitely an exaggeration. The orbit was low enough that whatever is there will fall in less than a month. It was far less reckless than China that still has their debris field from 2007 in orbit.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Fri Apr 05, 2019 3:38 am

    Many countries are already working on solutions... a bit more debris up there will increase the funding and priority for such programmes.

    If space exploration was properly planned and organised rather than the half arsed every man for himself crap we have now they would have been dealing with space junk all this time... not ignoring the problem... knowing it wont go away by itself, leaving it for the next generation to deal with.

    Your constant bragging over your cultural superiority is amusing too... if you were so wonderful should we be telling you instead of you having to tell us?

    People complain about potential damage to the ISS... every time they do a damn space walk they lose a dozen tools and nuts and bolts because they are not all tethered... any one of those would be very efficient at destroying a satellite in a crossing orbit... so all this BS about India making space unsafe is just bullshit.

    It is the same as when the Russians put in to service their first long range murder bot... an Armed HALE UAV that can attack targets from high altitude without warning... then such things will need international rules and regulations and a real tighening of what is legal and what is not... forgetting the last few years of unchallenged murder by the US and UK and Israel... you'd think those evil Russians thought it all up themselves.

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