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    Russian Economy General News: #10

    kvs
    kvs

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    Post  kvs on Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:46 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:It's the oil tax that allows Russia to have a high budget
    What this guy wants is to make his friends rich.  Russian oil is already competitive being between Brent and WTI oil.

    He is basing his view on make belief ideas of potential development vs real development now. Heck, all of the Russian oil companies are making profits hands over fist.

    Fuck that.  Guy should be investigated for potential corruption

    I agree this clown has whored himself to the oil industry and is now acting like their lobbyist.

    Russia is now experiencing the down side of capitalism. The bottomless pit of corporate greed. No amount of profit is
    ever enough. Just look at Wall Street: stock prices are based on the level of profit of a company and not on its viability or
    utility. All the yammering about "free markets" is utter BS. The definition of a free market is the limit of a large number of
    competitors making nearly zero profit. Profit maximization is the definition of oligopoly and monopoly. The oil industry
    around the world is a pure oligopoly. Thus, oil companies manipulate this market through collusion and the sort of lobbying
    and corruption you see in this article.

    Novak should be removed from office merely for the conflict of interest he exhibits with this obvious pro-industry lobbying. He
    is not in his office to server the interests of the oil industry but the interests of the population. That means imposing real
    taxes and not subsidies or trivial taxes. As long as the current taxes do not drive Russian oil companies into bankruptcy, they
    should not be reduced. Even being the "highest in the world" they are not nearly onerous. If these companies are not happy doing
    business in Russia with Russian oil and gas, then they should bugger off to somewhere else.



    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:58 pm

    kvs wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:It's the oil tax that allows Russia to have a high budget
    What this guy wants is to make his friends rich.  Russian oil is already competitive being between Brent and WTI oil.

    He is basing his view on make belief ideas of potential development vs real development now.  Heck, all of the Russian oil companies are making profits hands over fist.

    Fuck that.  Guy should be investigated for potential corruption

    I agree this clown has whored himself to the oil industry and is now acting like their lobbyist.  

    Russia is now experiencing the down side of capitalism.  The bottomless pit of corporate greed.  No amount of profit is
    ever enough.  Just look at Wall Street: stock prices are based on the level of profit of a company and not on its viability or
    utility.  All the yammering about "free markets" is utter BS.  The definition of a free market is the limit of a large number of
    competitors making nearly zero profit.  Profit maximization is the definition of oligopoly and monopoly.  The oil industry
    around the world is a pure oligopoly.  Thus, oil companies manipulate this market through collusion and the sort of lobbying
    and corruption you see in this article.

    Novak should be removed from office merely for the conflict of interest he exhibits with this obvious pro-industry lobbying.  He
    is not in his office to server the interests of the oil industry but the interests of the population.  That means imposing real
    taxes and not subsidies or trivial taxes.  As long as the current taxes do not drive Russian oil companies into bankruptcy, they
    should not be reduced.  Even being the "highest in the world" they are not nearly onerous.  If these companies are not happy doing
    business in Russia with Russian oil and gas, then they should bugger off to somewhere else.




    Yeap. Russian government and people as a whole obtain a lot from the taxation of oil. So he is against the Russian state on behalf of his corporate buddies? Real conflict of interest.
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    Post  calripson on Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:38 pm

    Scratch the surface of any of the economic elite in Russia and you find the same thing. They pay lip service to Putin only out of fear and self-interest. Given the chance, they would return to the tax system of the 1990's complete with transfer pricing schemes and offshore accounts. They couldn't care less about the interests of 145 million Russian "peasants". All they care about is their wallet, their homes in London, their Israeli or US second citizenship, their kids' acceptance to Oxford or Harvard, and their bank accounts in Switzerland.
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:13 pm

    calripson wrote:Scratch the surface of any of the economic elite in Russia and you find the same thing. They pay lip service to Putin only out of fear and self-interest. Given the chance, they would return to the tax system of the 1990's complete with transfer pricing schemes and offshore accounts. They couldn't care less about the interests of 145 million Russian "peasants". All they care about is their wallet, their homes in London, their Israeli or US second citizenship, their kids' acceptance to Oxford or Harvard, and their bank accounts in Switzerland.

    That is true.  And it was Medvedev who pushed for not only the anti corruption program that is going on now and has seen major politicians and elites face jail time.  Now new laws need to be placed to prevent these oligarchs to do their previous acts after Putin goes. I know Medvedev was hated for a few things (His Iphone ordeal) but ultimately, the hate is mostly aimed at him due to actually making real progress against oligarch's and of course the media is owned by them.
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    Post  Viktor on Wed Oct 09, 2019 11:41 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    Given any Russian pipeline this or that or of the future or LNG just as same US will always try to prevent cooperation of Russia with EU. Always, and can do that with only what it has.

    Of course America will keep doing this because there is no penalty for them... they were never able to get transit fees, but there is a chance to delay or complicate an economic opponent which is exactly what they are doing.

    What I am saying however is that to now put the pipeline through Danish waters so they get a financial benefit from gas being pumped to europe is to reward them for their cooperation... but they didn't cooperate.

    Yes and I bet Russia sees things as they are and knows that everything changes and nothing is permanent. US shortsighted once proud EU nation leaders into submission by means of children stories about freedom which met its dead end at LGTB/pedo rights than hopes and promises and hype and present day Danish leaders have anti-Russian stance still those lackeys will not last forever and while I bet Danish anti-Russian leadership will pronounce such Russian move as a free pass it would also made a statement to the US that those same lackeys can not be trusted because they can not be relied upon even a small thing small pressure to endure as they succumb to money once more like mercenaries to whoever pays more. Whole British narrative about the strong Danish stance against evil Russian pipeline suddenly makes no sense because on what grounds one can build truth that Danes want more sanctions on Russia based on values that holds no connection to money alone and than suddenly Danes want Russian money that holds no connection with values alone. Such in that case fairy tales is destined to crumble paving the was as in other EU member states to more sovereign parties that than as a weapon hold an argument against the mentioned lackeys and with whom you can build cooperation based on solid grounds not fairy tales.



    GarryB wrote:I would appreciate your suggestion if there was no alternative, so they get a reward for finally caving, but there is an alternative and it wont delay the programme much more than it already has and wont cost that much more for an initial outlay... money that will be saved every year for the working life of the project because transit fees wont need to be paid.

    And I could say the same  Very Happy
    For example US/Brits put a lackey (and you can always and anywhere found one) in charge of some country. Than such person without being provoked acts aggressively towards Russia and when Russia roars British narrative uses it as a argument against Danish nation. So basically you have a principle in British narrative (that shapes peoples minds) where it based on self given importance in mind of people (defenders of freedoms, offenders of evil (communism) defenders of always something and it does not matter what it is as long as it is different from the targeted nation values) passes judgement of provoked one on lackey on many causing in return mass approval of such action. Basically what you do while hiding the truth is applying response that is offensive to one (lackey) on many(whole nation).That is why I think it is more important to destroy the narrative meaning lies disguised as truth build up and you can do that by targeting whole logic along the line by means you have at your disposal. This is why I think it holds more worth to run thru barricades placed than bypass them. You can always bypass still imagine how would US think If they saw Russia backing up on every barricade placed. I think their next move would be to place them where ever they could and their number would grow exponentially while with every barricade placed crushed they expose themselves to uncertainty as than they know not on where to place their bets with ridicule hanging over them at all times so only other option left is to rise stakes and with every riskier action there are less willing to follow.


    GarryB wrote:You could argue that the pipeline was routed through Danish waters on purpose so they could earn transit fees as a reward for their cooperation... but they did not cooperate. They stalled. And you could argue that the US made them using unfair tactics, well bypassing danish waters means they can pretend they were anti pipeline and pro US all the time... that might earn them something from the US... but I doubt it will be anything like the money they would be getting in transit fees in the first year of operation let alone the operational lifetime of the pipeline.

    And you could say the same for Bulgaria which fell apart under McCain pressure still Russia did not forget nor abandon it and now situation is that Bulgaria is happy to let Turskish Stream pass through its territory thus Russia gets to have resurrected South Stream even though moments before libeliars celebrated its death. I agree with you that US uses unfair tactics and with unfairness on unfairness and with fairness on fairness principle holds ground still I see no point on condemning puppet nations on unfairness but only its source and as we saw how Russia handled situation in Syria we saw whole different approach as unfair treatment of the puppet nation states who hold not destiny in its hands and could flip flop just as same hold potential for lasting animosities and lasting friendship given absence of reasons for opponents propaganda so to speak.


    GarryB wrote:
    Therefore I think crushing opposing states will to endure opposing Russian pipeline and even with the whole US weight behind them will send major massage to any other state left out in the open. It will state "I can not be stopped".

    Putting it through danish waters and paying them transit fees is saying you can try to screw us over and we will forgive you and be your best buddy anyway...

    They made an agreement and then they chose not to follow through with that agreement by stalling, but when it was clear the pipeline would go ahead anyway they are now trying to get them to change back and give them money for nothing... which is what this is... Denmark wont be responsible for maintaining the pipes.... they didn't pay to have them layed... they are just getting money because they happen to be on the sea floor near their territory.

    And it will also make a statement true "we tried and we failed"  Very Happy
    just as same Ukranian lackey now in desperation scream "EU has turned its back on us" after Macron Putin meting which holds even more importance because Macron is a libeliar and if not in grave danger as he sees it he would have never said it. You see, fall after fall after fall eventually makes one wonder Smile  


    GarryB wrote:A bit like Ukraine demanding best friends rates for gas while maintaining their aggressive anti Russian stance in everything... sorry mate, the real world doesn't work that way buddy.

    Well its not as like as Denmark is opposing it and that opposition is getting crushed and Ukraine is demanding it and that demand is getting crushed as ultimately is not about all the options Russia has at its disposal and than using the one with the biggest impact or most bad ass (thats the US way and the reason it is now where it is). Its about that at any given moment you can pursue only one option and the sequence of options determines the way you want to handle your goal. That is Russia great unknown and the reason for the saying "Russia is a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma" as Churchill could not understood it either Smile Its not about making things happen its about making it right.


    GarryB wrote:
    By the way EU can close Opal pipeline and can just as same opt to open it later on. South Stream i.e. Turkish Stream can be build to deliver gas right on the opposing side of the Opal pipeline and Germany/Russia gas cooperation can opt to build another "Opal" just as same as their cooperation has already proven unshakable by any outside pressure throughout time and so any present situation put forward by globalist i.e. Opal restrictions will not stop but will be crushed.

    The EU can block all gas pipes it likes, but Russia is not going to keep building new ones... at some stage they will say if you don't want cheap gas then buy expensive gas in liquid form for all we care.

    Europe paying more for energy will slow down a few economies... and for what?

    You can lead a horse to water...

    I agree or you cant lead a donkey to the water  Very Happy
    What would be the proper name of such economics Very Happy

    GarryB wrote:
    Of even greater importance is completions of such great project because as will state to Baltic nations "you are unimportant" so all your blabbing and "influence" has led to nothing and instead you have lost your transport ports and many other so while as we start a new great project are you willing to start blabbing again?

    Not listening to the dogs barking... and not really caring either...

    Without their ports now and so and so further on with each bark passed sound will be quieter until it stops.



    GarryB wrote:
    It will put Poland into new perspective just as has throwing huge amounts on money on Patriot systems instead on its own economy or MIC for the sake of security and preservation of superiority feeling over Russia once crumbled with the destruction of Saudy Amraco meaning "you can not hide in front of destruction".

    Their order for 32 F-35s is more amusing... they will bust their budget just keeping them operational... and when they think they can fly out on to the Black Sea undetected and they keep getting intercepted in international airspace by groups of Russian aircraft they might start to realise it was not money well spent.

    lol yes and when that happens and hope is only thing left it starts to get amusing Smile



    GarryB wrote:
    That is why Denmark fees dont matter as eventually good cooperation with Russia can lead to further cooperation in economy once they see (as thinking is obviously absent) that it can be mutually beneficial even with US called boogeyman.

    I agree in principle... the Turks actively went out of their way to shoot down a Russian plane in Syria, but I think cooperation is more useful than confrontation... shooting down a Turkish aircraft would not have solved anything and likely would have resulted in Turkey not buying S-400 systems...

    Denmark, however is of no enormous value to Russia, and if they do put the pipe where they were going to and give them the transit fees exactly what lesson will they learn?

    Do as the US demands because the Russians will understand and not punish us for bad behaviour?

    Try and screw Russia first because they will still be more than reasonable later when you make better choices...

    Lackeys wont learn anything as they will always do what they are told which is why they are lackeys and not independent but people will see opposite of narrative and from there new thinking might evolve so giving lolly pop as an example of respect and cooperation into which small one might evolve sets precedent.




    GarryB wrote:
    From day one Russia had options and opt to take what would latter be seen as a problem still for to ourselves unknown reason decided to take exactly this one and dismissed all other option.

    Russia chose the most direct pipeline route and all the countries involved did not raise any concerns at the time of planning.

    Still Russia knew and decided to take that route. It also exposed truth about ones nation willingness behind the curtain of narrative to cooperate with Russia as well as the ones willing to crush its nations interests into their own. It set the things straight. Its the knowledge you can act upon with precision unlike acting under the veil of narrative meaning based on unknowns. It takes initiative from ones hands and place it into Russian hands.


    GarryB wrote:Plenty of countries not involved like the US and Ukraine and other countries afraid the new pipelines are to replace theirs had a lot to say, but they can be ignored by Russia.

    If they get their way then Russia can still sell liquified gas at a cheaper price than the US can ship it for and still make money... it will just mean that europe will get the same energy for a higher price and will have to wait for the ship to deliver it and pump it into their system before they can use it.

    With pipes they just flip a switch...

    And if those countries want to run their people into a ground than thats their decision and Russia has nothing to do with it. Those pipelines will than remain empty and monopolist will find reasons to further up the price and all the joy to them Smile but as for Russia it makes pipelines left and right and LNG terminals and with plenty of options it will easily replace the gas lost on EU markets with the markets others will abandon for the sake of higher EU prices but as we can see Germany wants Russian pipes, Bulgaria, Serbia, Turkey, Hungary, Austria, Italy even Britain buy it so it is as for now a far fetched story Smile




    GarryB wrote:
    You talk only about fees still pipeline operator (managed by Russia and EU nations as well) will together bear the little burden and most likely charge it to a shippers which will in turn based on it also forms a price thus in a sense pinching the ball back to the final customer or at least nice chunk of it also as fees in relative order depend on the volume of pipeline used it is much profitable to have full volumes than worry about the little fees thus like a monument that shines and demoralizes above ones opponents heads stands the statement "I cannot be stopped" and tells a story how when dealing with Russia you can profit from cooperation and lose everything in confrontation.

    The extra pipe will cost more to lay because it is longer, but once in place the transit fees will just add slightly to the costs to the customer and will be paid for by the customer... like a danish tax on energy for everyone in europe that gets their gas through that pipe.

    Not paying those fees to Denmark saves european consumers money, and makes the product cheaper and more appealing to the customer and the seller... because the seller can keep the money as extra profit, or sell more gas.

    Trying to be buddy buddy friendly with the EU is a total waste of time... they don't like Russia and just want leverage to annoy and spoil.

    Russia should pump gas to Germany and Turkey and wash their hands of anything else. Russia can sell to Germany and Turkey and the EU can buy from them and negotiate their own terms and conditions.

    If that does not suit then pay more for LNG.


    Not all of the EU but only ones that think in such way and we can see the wind changing not because of nothing but despite everything and we can attribute such change to Russian way of handling problems not hiding in front of them.
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    Post  Austin on Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:56 am

    Foreign direct investment in Russian companies up fivefold in 9 months 2019
    It reached $21.8 bln against $4.4 bln in the like period of 2018

    https://tass.com/economy/1082300
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    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 10, 2019 8:23 am

    This whole Danish theater of the absurd raises a serious question. They expect to collect a transit fee for a pipeline going over
    their EEZ and not their territorial waters. This is a de facto upgrade of the EEZ to territory. I seriously doubt the logic
    and actual right for such treatment. It allows for collecting fees from vessels transiting EEZ waters. No such piracy is envisioned
    in the Law of the Sea.

    No, there is a small island off the coast of Germany owned by Denmark and the original pipeline path as agreed upon passes within the territorial waters of that island, so it is not in EEZ waters but inside the actual territorial waters of the island, so with the original path it goes through Danish territory.

    After their delays the pipeline alternative goes around the territorial waters of the island through its EEZ zone, so they wouldn't get any fees, so now they are approving the original pipe path in the hopes to get fees after delaying the pipeline and increasing its cost.

    @Viktor

    I appreciate what you are saying, but I think there is something rotten in the state of denmark... hehehe... it is clear that the leadership in Denmark are anti Russian or can be swayed by the US pressure... Russia can forgive and forget and be the bigger guy here and allow Denmark to earn money on a project they tried to sabotage in the hopes that the Danish might realise they are not the bad guys no matter how their media and politicians are going to paint them... remember western media never make mistakes so the problem will either be Russia or the US, or if they get the money anyway it could be neither and lets just move on.

    The justification for delays and problems was that Russia is bad for europe so unless everyone in denmark point to US pressure that almost cost them the transit fees, I would say they not only learned nothing, but they also got caught rodgering the golden goose.

    An open letter apology signed by all the politicians and media who obstructed the programme and wrote or said nasty things about Russia, and Russia could consider going back to the original pipeline path, but to be honest... even then I wouldn't bother.

    Russia doesn't have to be best friends with Denmark... there are lots of countries that show hostility to Russia that they shouldn't go out of their way to reward.

    Reward bad behaviour and they get confused if they do something that pisses you off and you respond in kind.

    Russia shouldn't use its weight to punish or reward, but Denmark was part of a group of countries that were going to cooperate to build a pipeline to Germany to supply Russia gas reliably because the current route through the Ukraine is old and worn out and unreliable because the owners often steal gas... it is not Russian gas they are stealing, it is gas on its way to europe, but the european customers choose to blame Russia for this theft.

    Russias solution is to remove the problem, which some countries are not happy with either.

    If Russia was delivering liquified gas it would not surprise me if the US demanded that NATO mine the Baltic Sea...

    Denmark has not done some wonderful loyal thing, they have realised their delay tactic wont actually make any real difference except to cut them out of some easy money they were going to get for doing nothing at all, so they are back-pedalling as fast as they can so they can still get some cash out of this because with the new route they get nothing.

    I think they deserve nothing.

    There are other partners in this that have resisted US pressure and sanctions... what sort of message would it give them?

    Perhaps they should have objected and delayed the process to see what sort of extra deal they could get... perhaps a better pay rate...

    No. Screw Denmark.

    Foreign direct investment in Russian companies up fivefold in 9 months 2019
    It reached $21.8 bln against $4.4 bln in the like period of 2018

    Of course it is up.... they have a growing economy that is growing despite the best efforts of the US in particular and the west in general... when most of the west is flat or negative (if you don't include organised crime in the numbers) then there is obviously money to be made in Russia... legal money in legitimate business.

    Investment isn't charity... they expect to make money out of this and they probably will make more money than out of investments in the US or Europe.
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    Post  Vann7 on Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:09 pm

    This is one example that shows up how outdated Is Putin's Vision for development of Russia..
    here is a report

    Wikipedia Revenue Analysis: How a Wiki Could Make $2.3B a Year
    https://monetizepros.com/features/analysis-how-wikipedia-could-make-2-8-billion-in-annual-revenue/


    So what does this have to do with Russia economy?

    That finally the outdated  President will agree to fund an alternative to
    American wikipedia , so that American propaganda of "facts" is not spread into the world anymore
    without challenge.. as a bonus make a lot of money in advertising..

    https://www.rt.com/russia/470648-russia-wikipedia-knowledge-erosion/

    So this is a case of better Super late than never... I wish i could get money for pointing every
    mistake in Putin administration ,countering the west and will be incredibly rich today... this is a step
    in right direction ,but it took how much ? 18 years!!!! Neutral to GasPutin to decide to challenge an American company with a digital business around the internet..

    If i was in charge of Russia economic development. Since Day#1 in office in year 2000 when Putin came,
    i will have pushed with everything for moving Russia economy into a DIRECT competition to every modern
    new generation business that Americans have in california Silicon Valley.. and will moved 99% all the funds that Putin invest in victory parades and 100% of the funds Russia government invest in sports and stadiums into transforming Russia economy into a Semiconductor + Digital Internet + entertainment economy. Japan is not a popular nation in winning sports.. medals.. yet they have far superior influence ,leadership and influence in the world in modern Business far more than Russia.

    An alternative internet , and a brand new world that challenge X86 intel/amd and the visual graphics hardware and software business that makes a TON of money.. world wide in sales.. American business like Microsoft revenue every year is about 125 BILLIONS!!!!  ,between Apple and microsoft  they controls the entire computer world in the general public and majority of world wide business too.. How can any president sleep well at night , knowing US is allowed to dominate so much and totally uncontested is beyond me..  you had to be incredibly incompetent ,incredibly mediocre president to not see the danger in Allowing US Business to control the Internet and the Computer Business in the world..  So this is another reason why Putin needs to go , he holds back Russia development , by decades ,for not challenging US innovative and very popular with society business.. Russia
    alternative to Wikipedia is only possible with just $31 millions of Russian budget.. how crap that is? Putin spend much more than that stupid tank parades..  that Russia use to "Scare" its enemies..  There is nothing more silly
    and more waste of money than to follow the past , just because is a tradition while gaining no real value at all , on doing it..  Putin should just stop showing Russian weapons in victory parades ,it doesn't scare anyone and limit the victory over nazis ,to just a cheap ceremony remembering the victims with public participation without much music or military hardware . Something more in the line of France ,but light. And after that day ,leave the past in the past and Focus in the future instead.. The past only benefit is for not repeating mistakes.. but celebrating the past with so much money by display of so much hardware is not a productive thing for a nation
    like Russia with so limited economy.. This is even more true since none of this victory parades..ever persuade in any way Russian enemies , to be more friendly to Russia.. Instead it only makes people draw comparisons
    with Communist rejected countries too that do the same.

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    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Oct 12, 2019 12:08 am

    Vann's alternative reality keeps pushing forward Very Happy
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    Post  Austin on Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:16 am

    Good Details on both external debt and public debt is now down to zero

    Russia's Net Public Debt Falls to Zero
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    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 12, 2019 8:50 am

    What Vann doesn't realise is that the real world is different.

    If Putin had been hardline out of the starting blocks with the west the Russian economy never would have grown and developed... and while the Russian economy is vastly more independent now than it was in 2000, it was terribly fragile and vulnerable back then so taking on the west would have crushed most Russian companies and made western companies more hostile and less interested in cooperation.

    The facts are that the coup in the Ukraine and Russias reaction to it are claimed by the west to be Russian aggression... the reality is that Russia has been getting stronger for a while now so any little thing would have set the wests sanctions regimes... I mean what has China or Iran done to warrant sanctions?

    Nothing but react to western interference and clumsy attempts at theft.

    The west destroys Libya and tries to destroy Syria and Yemen and Iraq and Afghanistan again and Iran and Russia try to help in some of those places with enormous success, but the west just sees a growing Russia and a growing Iran and a China that wont do as the west tells it to do so they all get sanctions.... no matter what they did they were getting sanctions because they were growing too strong.

    The Russian economy and ability to make what it uses means it is in a very good situation... producing its own food is critical because when the US economy collapses money as we know it might not be worth much... who will accept US dollars... it is just mass produced paper with nothing at all backing it up... you can't even eat it... In the future resources and food production and making your own stuff are going to be criticial and I would say China and Russia are in much better places than most of the west... most so called American stuff is made in Asia and will continue to be made there because it makes it cheaper and affordable.

    His current rant is amusing... a Russian wikipeadia already exists but any income from advertising is pointless because the companies that spend the most are mostly big american companies so any income a Russian wiki might make could be wiped out overnight by some congressman or woman pointing out how much apple or microsoft are spending advertising on a Russian propaganda site and the money would stop immediately... so it is not much of an idea to be honest.

    Of the rest... blah blah Silicon valley... they already have quite a few technology centres... not with the power of silicon valley, nor the monopoly either, but they are there and they are growing to create Russian things that can replace the American things we in the rest of the world are forced to use... most European government departments use microsoft stuff.... full of spyware and shit but no competition and no alternative so they don't even bother with competitions anymore.

    The Russians are making alternatives... they really don't have a choice, but then a lot of other countries don't have a choice now either so that is only going to grow if they do it right.
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    Post  kvs on Sat Oct 12, 2019 4:11 pm

    Austin wrote:Good Details on both external debt and public debt is now down to zero

    Russia's Net Public Debt Falls to Zero

    The usual BS from the Moscow Times 5th column rag. It is the Moscow Times that needs to eat crow for all of the fear mongering
    it engaged in about the reserve fund disappearing due to deficits. Which Austin dutifully reported here for as long as it lasted, the
    hysteria that is.

    Nobody counts sovereign debt and private debt together unless they yap about Russia. This is just utter BS double standards and nonsense.
    The state is not obliged to bail out private borrowers. So comparing the reserve fund to the total external debt of Russia is an absurd
    and pointless exercise. This trick of counting private debt as "Russian debt" and insinuating that it is government debt is designed to
    hide the low actual sovereign debt of Russia to make the OECD debt-driven GDP utopias look better.

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    miketheterrible

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    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Oct 12, 2019 7:04 pm

    kvs wrote:
    Austin wrote:Good Details on both external debt and public debt is now down to zero

    Russia's Net Public Debt Falls to Zero

    The usual BS from the Moscow Times 5th column rag.   It is the Moscow Times that needs to eat crow for all of the fear mongering
    it engaged in about the reserve fund disappearing due to deficits.    Which Austin dutifully reported here for as long as it lasted, the
    hysteria that is.

    Nobody counts sovereign debt and private debt together unless they yap about Russia.   This is just utter BS double standards and nonsense.
    The state is not obliged to bail out private borrowers.   So comparing the reserve fund to the total external debt of Russia is an absurd
    and pointless exercise.    This trick of counting private debt as "Russian debt" and insinuating that it is government debt is designed to
    hide the low actual sovereign debt of Russia to make the OECD debt-driven GDP utopias look better.


    I know, it makes me laugh. Same guy posts same articles about doomsday of economy, then posts same articles it isn't.

    We need consistency, not stupidity and flooding of information.
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    Austin

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    Post  Austin on Sun Oct 13, 2019 2:32 pm

    kvs wrote:
    Austin wrote:Good Details on both external debt and public debt is now down to zero

    Russia's Net Public Debt Falls to Zero

    The usual BS from the Moscow Times 5th column rag. It is the Moscow Times that needs to eat crow for all of the fear mongering
    it engaged in about the reserve fund disappearing due to deficits. Which Austin dutifully reported here for as long as it lasted, the
    hysteria that is.

    Nobody counts sovereign debt and private debt together unless they yap about Russia. This is just utter BS double standards and nonsense.
    The state is not obliged to bail out private borrowers. So comparing the reserve fund to the total external debt of Russia is an absurd
    and pointless exercise. This trick of counting private debt as "Russian debt" and insinuating that it is government debt is designed to
    hide the low actual sovereign debt of Russia to make the OECD debt-driven GDP utopias look better.


    It would depend who these private debt holders are and if they are 100 % private entity or with partial government stake.

    It is not governments job to bail out private players with public money but if these are major job providers and if closing such entity can create mass joblessness or social issues then the government might bail them out or just buy them out with public money.

    In 2008 the USG bailed the Private banks with public money for the fear then it may create social issue when these banks collapses.

    Hole
    Hole

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    Post  Hole on Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:34 pm

    In 2008 the politicians in Washington had the coice of bailing out the people directly or give the money to their oligarch friends. They choose the oligarchs, of course, bescause they get a lot of money from them.
    GarryB
    GarryB

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    Post  GarryB on Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:18 am

    They bailed out the banks but those house owners still lost their houses...

    750 billion dollars was given to the banks... no one went to jail... and we hear nothing about it.... did they have to pay it back at market rates with interest, did the government become part owners of the banks they single handedly saved like any other civilian donor with enough cash to offer it for a bail out? ...or was it a gift... did those bank CEOs enjoy their enormous seven figure bonuses for doing such a wonderful job... then they have such enormous salaries and all the perks like cars and drivers and free travel etc etc should they be getting bonuses at all?

    If the US had an independent media at least these questions might have been asked, but it seems the media is part of the problem and not part of the solution.

    It is funny how truth and justice were the american way... but then it seems they became three separate things... the American way became lies and revenge, and they kinda started ignoring the truth and justice... well now they are reaping the rewards and it is costing them their thousand year reich.

    The real problem is that US TV would rather you were interested in what Kim Kardashian is wearing or saying or tweeting, or just stare at her ass... just look at the pretty lights and do as you are told minion...

    No better elsewhere in the west... look at the UK... lets have a popularity contest to decide if we remain in the EU or not. Not a real discussion of the issues or factors... just pick sides and decide who to vote for based on anything you like... but don't think about any consequences because this is democracy and the majority decide even if the majority are wrong...

    Or they could have EU democracy where they keep holding the vote until the result suits the ruling class and is then accepted as the will of the people. There might need to be a gap of a few years while you re-educate the population so they know what they should be voting for, but with enough money wasted on advertising they will realise groundhog day only ends when you make the correct choice.

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