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    Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal

    AlfaT8
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    Post  AlfaT8 on Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:19 pm

    This is going to bite Russia in the Ass eventually, count on it.
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sun Jul 14, 2019 1:00 am

    AlfaT8 wrote:This is going to bite Russia in the Ass eventually, count on it.

    Weren't they saying the same thing about the intervention in Syria? What will they gain by betraying Russia? They've already have been alienated by the EU and the US (cant get any worse than a regime change military coup), their relations with GCC is at it's worst in years (Saudi-Qatari split, and Khashoggi). I don't think you really thought this out thoroughly. If they betray Russia, they'll also lose the Eurasian (Turkic) Central Asian countries, Iran, and probably China as well (likely India as too). The U.S. probably would pull strings to keep Turkish relations with South Korea, Japan, Brazil to a minimum.That's not even the worst of it, if they decide to betray Russia, nothing will stop a complete civil war from breaking out in Turkey between the Islamist's, the Secularists, and the Kurds (who make up 1/3rd of the population).
    kvs
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    Post  kvs on Sun Jul 14, 2019 1:55 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:This is going to bite Russia in the Ass eventually, count on it.

    Weren't they saying the same thing about the intervention in Syria? What will they gain by betraying Russia? They've already have been alienated by the EU and the US (cant get any worse than a regime change military coup), their relations with GCC is at it's worst in years (Saudi-Qatari split, and Khashoggi). I don't think you really thought this out thoroughly. If they betray Russia, they'll also lose the Eurasian (Turkic) Central Asian countries, Iran, and probably China as well (likely India as too). The U.S. probably would  pull strings to keep Turkish relations with South Korea, Japan, Brazil to a minimum.That's not even the worst of it, if they decide to betray Russia, nothing will stop a complete civil war from breaking out in Turkey between the Islamist's, the Secularists, and the Kurds (who make up 1/3rd of the population).

    Russia and Turkey likely have some deal over Syria. Naturally, we do not know about this.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:32 am

    This is going to bite Russia in the Ass eventually, count on it.

    Their treatment of the Ukraine right up until the coup also bit them in the ass, but it was also in their interests at the time to promote good relations and help a neighbour.

    Honestly if Turkey says fuck you Russia we are going to give away all your secrets to America and Europe for the S-400, then Russia has quite a few options... including tripling the cost of the gas they buy from them to fund upgrades of the S-400 to minimise the cost of the compromised technology.

    But there is a good chance that Turkey might realise that giving away the secrets of a system they intend to use themselves is not the best idea, and that Russia can be a much better ally than the US has ever been to Turkey... hell the EU wont even allow Turkey to become part of europe... happy to let it join HATO and spill their blood to save the europeans but not quite enough friendship there for you to actually join the club.

    Russia and Turkey don't need to be blood brothers joined at the hip like Siamese twins... but there needs to be cooperation and a level of trust there... they have a lot in common and they can help each other out quite a lot as long as neither side does anything stupid, because that is what the US is hoping for because it already did something stupid by trying a coup in Turkey.

    Compromising S-400 technology just means S-400M needs to be developed and it probably is with improvements in radar soon to change the way they make their radars no doubt... they talk about the difference it would make to radar sets but imagine what change it would make for Active radar homing missile seeker heads being smaller and lighter and much much more powerful...
    Airman
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    Post  Airman on Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:33 pm

    Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 Image

    Does anyone have any idea about this? I think the truck is MAZ-7410.
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:40 pm

    Airman wrote:Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 Image

    Does anyone have any idea about this? I think the truck is MAZ-7410.

    It's an auxillary vehicle, probably missile loader with extended protrusion underneath the canvas/tarp being a hydraulic crane.
    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Jul 15, 2019 3:08 am


    About OPSEC concerns: S-400 has already been exported to China so you can bet that USA already has info on it

    And since Russia is about to deliver it to India you can bet that they fully expect it to become public domain knowledge and have it covered

    So it's very unlikely that USA could learn anything from Turkish S-400 that they don't know already



    Airman
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    Post  Airman on Mon Jul 15, 2019 5:36 am

    Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 D_c7RjrX4AUdNr-

    Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 D_c7SqvXYAAdCau

    Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 D_c7ThQXsAEjW1g
    George1
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    Post  George1 on Mon Jul 15, 2019 1:56 pm

    Eighth plane carrying S-400 components arrives in Turkey

    https://tass.com/defense/1068530
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Jul 15, 2019 2:28 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    About OPSEC concerns: S-400 has already been exported to China so you can bet that USA already has info on it


    What makes you think the PRC gave their secrets to the US? I'm willing to bet the version of S-400's delivered to China is different to the ones delivered to Turkey, or the ones that could be delivered to the GCC, let alone the ones operated by VKS.
    Airman
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    Post  Airman on Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:20 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    Airman wrote:Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 Image

    Does anyone have any idea about this? I think the truck is MAZ-7410.

    It's an auxillary vehicle, probably missile loader with extended protrusion underneath the canvas/tarp being a hydraulic crane.

    I think I found it. 40V6M/40V6MD Semimobile Mast with 96L6E Acquisition Radar.

    Russia-Turkey S-400 missile deal - Page 4 5d2c389d18c7731accb625b2

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