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    Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:11 am

    hoom wrote:
    not in classical meaning thoi. None of US LHDs have a big punch. BTW french mistral has igla type missiles and 12,7 guns AFAIR.
    Well the air-wing part would provide significant 'increased level of attack and defensive potential' compared to 'normal' amphibious ships but I don't see a problem with giving it a healthy poliment-redut, UKSK & Pantsir-M armament, maybe even sufficient to genuinely claim the TAKR designation.


    that's to me is irony, that after so many claims Soviets made bad decision history tends to return to the same point.  IMHO rationale behind this is simply  less resources take TAKR where airwintg is not the only "punch" but can both attack and defend herself.



    Last couple of interviews carried a similar message to today's MoD news:


    The head of the shipbuilding Main command of the Navy rear Admiral Rear Admiral V. Tryapichnikov.
    According to him, already now, in parallel with the serial construction of ships of the near zone, design offices are developing projects for ships of the far sea, ships for existing projects are being modernized.

    It is planned that in the near future, the basis of the groupings of ships in the ocean zone will consist of multifunctional ships of the new generation, which have increased combat capabilities for the impact and defensive potential.


    Ii lookd like TAKRS might be back indeed

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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:30 am

    kumbor wrote: lol! Ulyanovsk is 11437 project carrier started building in Nikolayev in 1987. The ship has never been launched. Scrapped on slip by 1994. That project is now 35 years old, morally and physically outdated!

    and why MoD requested to "finaization" of original designs? lol1 lol1 lol1


    model of Ulyanovsk for more pics follow the link



    http://bastion-opk.ru/11437-npkb-foto/



    BTW old pic I've found about defense/attack zones of Ulyanovsk (veriosn 1 with Granits) - MiG- here has 700km radius. Su-33 2x longer



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    GarryB

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

    Post  GarryB on Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:52 pm

    Technology and design and materials have moved on since the Ulyanovsk was designed and started building.

    The previously mentioned multi hull design offers some promise in making larger capacity ships that are lighter than more conventional designs.

    New propulsion options could also effect the design as could potential alternative solutions to various problems.

    An Airship based AWACS platform could radically alter the needs of a fixed wing carrier by reducing requirements dramatically in terms of size and length.

    UAVs and UCAVs could also effect the design of the hangar and other decks.

    Even the presence or absence of STOVL aircraft will effect the design considerations...

    Equally the idea of modular design where you might build 12 CVNs, but 2 of them are CVNs and the other 10 are built as cruisers or even arsenal ships...
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:07 am

    What have you done to Garry? The Real Garry would not say such blasphemous things about tech advancements? and such balanced opinion?! no way, never, ever!

    Let Garry go you bastard!   attack  attack  attack



    @GB
    As for airships - not sure about enormous space savings. OK  folded airship can be smaller, but inflated one? My other consideration is Arctic and Kamchatka storms - thye have to be "on line" I  mean strong cable or fly very very high.

    In case of a stratospheric airship it would be rather ore feasible to build a large, unmanned one, which can fly couple of  years and follow fleet grouping. From 20km your radar horizon 600+ km optical one 500+km . No need to use shipa for landing, with 100-150km/h speed n ship is going to be faster anyway.  

    Power supply either solar panels or nuclear reactor (might be too heavy tho)
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    GarryB

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

    Post  GarryB on Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:18 am

    As for airships - not sure about enormous space savings. OK folded airship can be smaller, but inflated one? My other consideration is Arctic and Kamchatka storms - thye have to be "on line" I mean strong cable or fly very very high.

    To be of any use it would need to be relatively big so it will be an airship, not a balloon... no deflating this and putting it in the cupboard.

    I would expect its normal operational altitude would be well above 20km so weather wont be an issue at all.


    Power supply either solar panels or nuclear reactor (might be too heavy tho)

    Solar is not reliable enough, Nuclear would be needed but it wont need enormous amounts of power... with electric motors for station keeping and moving, and fuel cells to convert hydrogen lifting gas into water ballast and back it would be ideal...

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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Future russian aircraft carriers. #3

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:38 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    As for airships - not sure about enormous space savings. OK  folded airship can be smaller, but inflated one? My other consideration is Arctic and Kamchatka storms - thye have to be "on line" I  mean strong cable or fly very very high.

    To be of any use it would need to be relatively big so it will be an airship, not a balloon... no deflating this and putting it in the cupboard.

    I would expect its normal operational altitude would be well above 20km so weather wont be an issue at all.

    then actually it would be ship-borne but hoovering over fleet 24/7 directly from land.




    GB wrote:

    Power supply either solar panels or nuclear reactor (might be too heavy tho)

    Solar is not reliable enough, Nuclear would be needed but it wont need enormous amounts of power... with electric motors for station keeping and moving, and fuel cells to convert hydrogen lifting gas into water ballast and back it would be ideal...



    if missine are nto to take too long yup . BTW Solar panels  - can be all top and on 20,000m there are no clouds anymore ... But AWACS needs nice power supply also at night that;s would be biggest problem in operation.

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