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    Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

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    Austin
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    Russian Nuclear Submarine Force:2

    Post  Austin on Tue Apr 08, 2014 5:33 am

    Viktor wrote:Nice  thumbsup 

    Russian Navy by 2020 will add to more than 10 modernized attack submarines

    So life increased by half would be 12-15 years after modernisation

    The exact number is 12 Submarine will be modernised

    6 Akula , 4 Oscar 2 , 2 Sierra-2  and 8 new Yasen class.

    So if all goes according to plans and funding provided , Russia will have 20 SSN/SSGN by 2020

    I just hope after what has happened in Ukraine they dont reduce defence funding for SAP 2020 and SAP 2015-2025 even if they have to eat grass.

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Austin on Wed Jun 18, 2014 10:53 am

    Wooooo Interview withCEO CB "Malachite" Vladimir Dorofeev on Severdvinisk/Yasen Sub   thumbsup 


    http://www.rg.ru/2014/06/17/yasen-site.html
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Flyingdutchman on Mon Sep 29, 2014 3:19 pm

    http://in.rbth.com/economics/2013/08/09/yasen-class_nuclear_attack_submarines_to_give_russia_major_edge_28201.html

    http://in.rbth.com/economics/2014/09/29/new_cruise_missiles_for_russian_navy_38645.html
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:38 am

    what about the fact that 2/3 of russian attack subs only have ASW missiles, no AShMs?
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Mike E on Fri Oct 03, 2014 10:11 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:what about the fact that 2/3 of russian attack subs only have ASW missiles, no AShMs?
    What is the 1/3? Akula's can fire em', the Sierra as well... - Don't forget that all subs with a 533 mm torpedo tube can fire the RK-55, or the Klub (GarryB?).

    The 65 has a range of 100 km, by the way...
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:47 am

    Mike E wrote:
    KomissarBojanchev wrote:what about the fact that 2/3 of russian attack subs only have ASW missiles, no AShMs?
    What is the 1/3? Akula's can fire em', the Sierra as well... - Don't forget that all subs with a 533 mm torpedo tube can fire the RK-55, or the Klub (GarryB?).

    The 65 has a range of 100 km, by the way...

    I thought the schukas and karps could fire only torpedos and ASW missiles. Well, I guess wikipedia fooled me this time.
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Mike E on Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:56 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    KomissarBojanchev wrote:what about the fact that 2/3 of russian attack subs only have ASW missiles, no AShMs?
    What is the 1/3? Akula's can fire em', the Sierra as well... - Don't forget that all subs with a 533 mm torpedo tube can fire the RK-55, or the Klub (GarryB?).

    The 65 has a range of 100 km, by the way...

    I thought the schukas and karps could fire only torpedos and ASW missiles. Well, I guess wikipedia fooled me this time.
    Anything with a 533 mm tube, or so I've heard... Any one else want to add on?
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 04, 2014 5:24 am

    what about the fact that 2/3 of russian attack subs only have ASW missiles, no AShMs?

    Subs and Ships of the Soviet Navy tended to have very specialised weapons.

    the main exception was the SS-N-14 which has a torpedo on a missile with a warhead and IR seeker.

    It was designed to fly to the target area under rocket propulsion at subsonic speed and then drop the torpedo into the water near where the enemy sub was expected.

    In the later models however there was a switch where the torpedo is not dropped and the whole weapon searches for and locks on to a ship using an IR sensor. There is a 300kg warhead on the rocket, plus the weight of the torpedo and its fuel make an excellent anti ship weapon... subsonic, but passive homing and very powerful payload.

    Most other weapons were single purpose... anti Ship or anti sub and none were land attack AND conventionally armed.

    New Russian Subs and ships and upgraded subs and ships have the UKSK system... or universal cruise missile launch system... which can carry land attack cruise missiles, subsonic and supersonic anti ship missiles and anti sub ballistic rocket delivery systems that deliver a torpedo out to about 40-50km.

    I thought the schukas and karps could fire only torpedos and ASW missiles. Well, I guess wikipedia fooled me this time.

    Both can launch SS-N-21 Granat, which is the old nuclear armed Kalibr, which suggests Kalibr can also be carried and fired. It also says it can carry SS-N-15 and SS-N-16... which are 533mm and 650mm calibre ballistic rockets delivering a torpedo or depth charge for ASW use.


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    what about the fact that 2/3 of russian attack subs only have ASW missiles, no AShMs?

    Post  Mike E on Sat Oct 04, 2014 2:26 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    I thought the schukas and karps could fire only torpedos and ASW missiles. Well, I guess wikipedia fooled me this time.

    Both can launch SS-N-21 Granat, which is the old nuclear armed Kalibr, which suggests Kalibr can also be carried and fired. It also says it can carry SS-N-15 and SS-N-16... which are 533mm and 650mm calibre ballistic rockets delivering a torpedo or depth charge for ASW use.
    That is what I was thinking... If it can fire the Granat, it should be able to fire the very similar Kalibr. - Which would add a ton of flexibility to the subs.
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  George1 on Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:49 am

    Amazing Photos Of Russia Dismantling An Outdated Nuclear Submarine

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    Borei-class SSΒΝ vs Virginia-class and Ohio-class SSBNs

    Post  par far on Thu Oct 23, 2014 11:19 pm

    How does the Borei class stack up against the American Virginia class and Ohio class submarines?

    Are Russian Submarines better than the American ones or is it the other way around?

    Also where does the Yasen class submarine rank?

    Can some please tell me all the submarines that Russia operates right and what submarines will Russia operate in the future?

    Will Russia export any submarines soon?
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Mike E on Fri Oct 24, 2014 12:10 am

    par far wrote:How does the Borei class stack up against the American Virginia class and Ohio class submarines?

    Are Russian Submarines better than the American ones or is it the other way around?

    Also where does the Yasen class submarine rank?

    Can some please tell me all the submarines that Russia operates right and what submarines will Russia operate in the future?

    Will Russia export any submarines soon?
    The Virginia is a completely different kind of submarine, it should be excluded... As should the Yasen, this thread will get too cluttered with two different kinds of submarines. 

    No one can really say, though the Borei is a much newer and (currently) more advanced than the Ohio. There is a reason that the US is trying to replace the Ohio-class with a stop-gap ASAP. Borei should be much quieter, but at the same time is holds a smaller number of missiles (albeit more advanced missiles). 

    Virginia's are a much more recent development than the Ohio, so the age-gap between that and the Yasen is lesser than the one between the Ohio and Borei. The Virginia is a nice design, and a very potent one, but the Yasen should still be quieter (which is one of the most important aspects of a sub). Another thing to keep in mind is their armaments... Both countries use rather old and dated torpedoes, but Russia's heavy torp has a longer range than its uS counterpart. That being said, both subs' torp armament isn't very great and is pretty similar in general. The one advantage of the Yasen and Russian subs in general, is that they can fire the ridiculously fast Shkval super-captivating torpedo, which doesn't have a US counterpart. As for missiles, I believe that the Virginia is stuck to land-attack Tomahawks while the Yasen can carry multiple Kalibr's (land attack, anti-ship, ASW etc) including the ASW models (which out-range all US and Russian torpedoes). 

    As of right now, they are using the...

    SSBN's; Borei (2 active though one more is ready), Delta IV (six active), Delta III (3 active, will be outed soon) and one p.941 Typhoon.

    SSN's; Akula (9 in service, though this needs to be checked), Oscar (5 active AFAIK), Sierra (3 active, once again, this needs checking), and the Victor (4 active). 

    SSK's; Kilo (16?), Kilo 636 (1, but second model is almost ready), and the one Lada (more on the way).

    I'm sorry if some of these figures are wrong, it is a royal-pain-in-the-%$@ to find these numbers, at least it is for myself... 

    Anyway, in the near-future (decade from now)...

    You can expect the left-over Delta III and p.941 Typhoon model(s) to be decommissioned and scrapped at a later date. In their place, their will be the coming Borei's (eight ordered so far).

    The Victors will probably be thrown-out (so to speak), with the Sierra's still in service along with most of the Akula's, the phased-out subs will be replaced by the Yasen's (seven ordered, though hopefully some more can be added).

    The older Kilo's will be getting the boot, with the 636's and Lada's replacing them (Lada orders are not significant as of right now, though they will grow). - Maybe some 636's (I hope)...

    Amur will be exported.

    They are exporting the Kilo and 636 Kilo right now, and the Amur orders should be coming in soon, there is also the one Akula SSN under rent (something like that) in India right now.

    Russia is already beginning work on the Borei-replacement (long ways away), the Yasen-replacement is unknown... Finally, the Lada and maybe an upgrade of it will occur in large numbers. The US is only working on a cheaper (and much less effective) Virginia-class variant (for land-attack, hence the downgrades) and the stop-gap Ohio replacement (which should be fine).
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  TR1 on Fri Oct 24, 2014 1:31 am

    There are in reality only several 971s (Akula) active. The state of the fleet is terrible. Several are nominally active but not really ready to go to sea. 3-4 active at best today I would estimate.

    As for 945s (Sierra), only the Nizhn Nogorod is active. Though the Pskov is on factory trials after being repaired, so it should be back in service soon.

    Only 1 RTMK is in service, though two others might rejoin the fleet if Nerpa can get their shit together. The last (Petrazavodsk) has been essentially a donor vessel for some time.

    5 BDRMs are in service, Yekaterinburg is not back in fleet service yet.
    Dmitry Donskoy is only a test vessel, not a true combat ship anymore.

    As for actual characteristics and comparisons, beside "hard" info (missile types, number, age, etc) don't expect to find anything serious online.
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Mike E on Fri Oct 24, 2014 4:35 pm

    TR1 wrote:As for actual characteristics and comparisons, beside "hard" info (missile types, number, age, etc) don't expect to find anything serious online.
    Agreed, you (par far) shouldn't expect to get much in terms of good opinions on a matter such as this one. Many important factors of all the mentioned-submarines are secretive, and if they aren't, it is still a PITA to find info on them. This site; http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/ has the best (easy to find) info on Russian subs, along with a bunch of different navy-related news and articles etc. On US subs, you won't be able to find the details on just about anything on their subs, as the US Navy is extremely secretive about the details and is often conservative with their capabilities (to keep the "enemy" from gaining an advantage). That being said, some of their systems are public and can be found anywhere on the internet.
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Mike E on Sat Oct 25, 2014 4:53 pm

    One thing to keep in mind is that neither Navy (none to be precise) can consistently detect their opponents submarines. A good example of this (in this case it is between China and the US) is when a Chinese Type 039 got within five nautical miles of the USS Kitty Hawk carrier group without being detected. Only after it surfaced (just cause, it wasn't because of the need for air) was it detected, and that was by a jet flying overheard and had nothing to do with technology... Pretty crazy to think about, and the Type 039 is China's first indigenous SSK. I don't even want to know how close a 636 or Lada could get to a carrier group....  Same could happen with a US sub, except for that they do not have any diesels in service. Anyway, 5 nautical miles in within range of a torpedo like the Shkval, so that shows the threat that SSK's represent.... Obviously, the big difference between Russian and American submarines, isn't the subs themselves, but their tactics and for what purpose they'd be used. An American SSN or two (if not more) will be guarding a carrier group, which restricts what they can do. On the other hand, Russian SSN's aren't restricted in that way, but are instead lesser in number. So it is a trade off. The US's rather offensive stragety is what causes this problem (for them), as Russia will be defensive naturally and hence doesn't have all these carriers etc. 

    As for the next-gen Virginia (a current model was just commissioned actually)... It will basically be like an underwater missile carrier, which is an interesting 180 for the US Navy. The design itself will be slightly larger (mostly in length) in order to accommodate a large number of Tomahawk's (as of right now). It will also be less complex and less advanced as well, in an attempt to bring down the cost and raise the rate of production. - Both of which are needed because of budget problems and aging LA class subs respectively. IMHO, it will basically be a cruiser under the sea, but it will also be replacing older SSN's which doesn't make much sense to be honest. It would be like Russia replacing the Kilo with a shrunken down diesel Borei... They have completely different roles... Thankfully (for the US Navy), they should have a decent number of Virginia's (current model) by then. - This newer model wouldn't stand a chance against actual SSN's, and it would also have "cheaper" (worse) sensors as well AFAIK. 

    The next-gen Ohio replacement is much more predictable... It should have a design influenced by the Ohio, but will be more advanced in just about every way. Interestingly enough, they will only be ordering twelve, and with the Ohio's gone by then, America's SSBN fleet will shrink down dramatically. This is partly thanks to the subs high price, which will be close to three times what the Borei costs if I remember right. Anyway, it should carry sixteen ballistic missiles (same as Borei, down from 24) and will fire the Trident-2 (a life-extension variant). Some have said it will only be able to hold twelve missiles, but I doubt that is anything more than creative thinking.... Besides that, it should use lessons learned from the Ohio and Virginia etc.

    The US Navy has no plans to order a SSK AFAIK, because it doesn't fit their strategy and cannot actually be offensive. 

    To be honest, I don't think that Russia has much to worry about... The US will be reling on smaller numbers (compared to today) of subs, some of which don't really have a role (Virginia-"upgrade"). At the same time, Russia won't be posing a much larger threat to the US Navy because of smaller numbers despite their advanced-nature. So, in all reality, nobody can say this sub is better than this one etc until they actually engage.

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  par far on Sun Oct 26, 2014 10:40 am

    Mike E wrote:
    TR1 wrote:As for actual characteristics and comparisons, beside "hard" info (missile types, number, age, etc) don't expect to find anything serious online.
    Agreed, you (par far) shouldn't expect to get much in terms of good opinions on a matter such as this one. Many important factors of all the mentioned-submarines are secretive, and if they aren't, it is still a PITA to find info on them. This site; http://militaryrussia.ru/blog/ has the best (easy to find) info on Russian subs, along with a bunch of different navy-related news and articles etc. On US subs, you won't be able to find the details on just about anything on their subs, as the US Navy is extremely secretive about the details and is often conservative with their capabilities (to keep the "enemy" from gaining an advantage). That being said, some of their systems are public and can be found anywhere on the internet.


    Mike you were right, I could not find any good on this topic, they are probably top secret.

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  par far on Sun Oct 26, 2014 11:08 am

    Mike E wrote:One thing to keep in mind is that neither Navy (none to be precise) can consistently detect their opponents submarines. A good example of this (in this case it is between China and the US) is when a Chinese Type 039 got within five nautical miles of the USS Kitty Hawk carrier group without being detected. Only after it surfaced (just cause, it wasn't because of the need for air) was it detected, and that was by a jet flying overheard and had nothing to do with technology... Pretty crazy to think about, and the Type 039 is China's first indigenous SSK. I don't even want to know how close a 636 or Lada could get to a carrier group....  Same could happen with a US sub, except for that they do not have any diesels in service. Anyway, 5 nautical miles in within range of a torpedo like the Shkval, so that shows the threat that SSK's represent.... Obviously, the big difference between Russian and American submarines, isn't the subs themselves, but their tactics and for what purpose they'd be used. An American SSN or two (if not more) will be guarding a carrier group, which restricts what they can do. On the other hand, Russian SSN's aren't restricted in that way, but are instead lesser in number. So it is a trade off. The US's rather offensive stragety is what causes this problem (for them), as Russia will be defensive naturally and hence doesn't have all these carriers etc. 

    As for the next-gen Virginia (a current model was just commissioned actually)... It will basically be like an underwater missile carrier, which is an interesting 180 for the US Navy. The design itself will be slightly larger (mostly in length) in order to accommodate a large number of Tomahawk's (as of right now). It will also be less complex and less advanced as well, in an attempt to bring down the cost and raise the rate of production. - Both of which are needed because of budget problems and aging LA class subs respectively. IMHO, it will basically be a cruiser under the sea, but it will also be replacing older SSN's which doesn't make much sense to be honest. It would be like Russia replacing the Kilo with a shrunken down diesel Borei... They have completely different roles... Thankfully (for the US Navy), they should have a decent number of Virginia's (current model) by then. - This newer model wouldn't stand a chance against actual SSN's, and it would also have "cheaper" (worse) sensors as well AFAIK. 

    The next-gen Ohio replacement is much more predictable... It should have a design influenced by the Ohio, but will be more advanced in just about every way. Interestingly enough, they will only be ordering twelve, and with the Ohio's gone by then, America's SSBN fleet will shrink down dramatically. This is partly thanks to the subs high price, which will be close to three times what the Borei costs if I remember right. Anyway, it should carry sixteen ballistic missiles (same as Borei, down from 24) and will fire the Trident-2 (a life-extension variant). Some have said it will only be able to hold twelve missiles, but I doubt that is anything more than creative thinking.... Besides that, it should use lessons learned from the Ohio and Virginia etc.

    The US Navy has no plans to order a SSK AFAIK, because it doesn't fit their strategy and cannot actually be offensive. 

    To be honest, I don't think that Russia has much to worry about... The US will be reling on smaller numbers (compared to today) of subs, some of which don't really have a role (Virginia-"upgrade"). At the same time, Russia won't be posing a much larger threat to the US Navy because of smaller numbers despite their advanced-nature. So, in all reality, nobody can say this sub is better than this one etc until they actually engage.


    Thank you for all the good information Mike E, if the Chinese Type 039 can come this close, than the newer subs must killer.
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Mike E on Thu Oct 30, 2014 4:04 pm

    You're welcome...  Very Happy

    Anyway, I made a big mistake when I said the downgraded Virginia's are going to replace the older LA's. Turns out only five of them will be made, and they will replace the Ohio SSGN's. The newer Virginia's (one of which was recently commissioned) won't be improvements, but instead will be simpler and easier to produce cheaper but not worse). So, the RU Navy still doesn't have to worry, but I thought I'd correct myself nonetheless.
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Viktor on Mon Dec 08, 2014 5:11 pm

    Nice thumbsup

    2014NS "Obninsk" fulfilled shooting cruise missile
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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  George1 on Mon Dec 08, 2014 8:38 pm

    Viktor wrote:Nice  thumbsup

    2014NS "Obninsk" fulfilled shooting cruise missile

    it is a Viktor III class submarine. Do we know what type of cruise missile was fired?

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  chicken on Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:39 am

    George1 wrote:
    Viktor wrote:Nice  thumbsup

    2014NS "Obninsk" fulfilled shooting cruise missile

    it is a Viktor III class submarine. Do we know what type of cruise missile was fired?

    Some guys say it might be a land attack Kalibr.

    At first they thought it was the new Improved Kilo that was recently turned over that will conduct the test but it's still 3 days of testing so maybe they'll try firing from different ships?




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    2014NS "Obninsk" fulfilled shooting cruise missile

    Post  Austin on Tue Dec 09, 2014 11:32 am

    Good Details in the link


    Several "Boreas" and "Ash" for improving the project lay in the "Sevmash" in 2015

    http://itar-tass.com/armiya-i-opk/1632949
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    russian nuclear subs

    Post  George1 on Fri Dec 26, 2014 9:39 am

    Russia to lay down 3 Yasen-class, 2 Borei-class submarine in 2015

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Vann7 on Sun Jan 18, 2015 8:19 pm

    par far wrote:How does the Borei class stack up against the American Virginia class and Ohio class submarines?

    Are Russian Submarines better than the American ones or is it the other way around?

    Also where does the Yasen class submarine rank?

    Can some please tell me all the submarines that Russia operates right and what submarines will Russia operate in the future?

    Will Russia export any submarines soon?

    amazingly no one told you this..

    But ..

    you are mixing attack conventional submarines that carry cruise missiles.. vs ballistic submarines that carry nuclear weapons mostly and its sole purpose is destroy countries..  while attack submarines is main purpose is attack warships  and or other submarines or land targets with conventional weapons.


    when it comes to the future.. it will be..
    in attack submarines...
    Yasen class + kilo class vs Virginia+Seawolf class..

    in ballistic submarines with nuclear weapons..
    Borei class vs Ohio class..

    The Borei and Yasen and brand new submarines... while the american Ohio are 40 years old.. and the seawolf 15 years and virginia 10 years old.

    So the timing they have in service should give you an idea of how they stack each other in terms of technology
    of the ships.

    When it comes to weapons.. in attack submarines..weapons..
    it will be Russia using state of the art modern Kalibr and Onix missiles..and close range torpedos ,
    vs americans using Tomahawks and harpoon missiles of the 70s..

    in terms of technology Russia wins hands down..  the advantage of USA is in numbers. really and nothing else.

    in ballistic navy submarines nuclear war weapons ..
    it will be Russia using Bulava state of the art missiles vs  Americans using tridents that is technology of the 70s..
    and some upgraded ohios using trident II technology of the 90s..

    So ironically contrary to what the western people believe..Russian navy have more cutting edge technology...
    in their Submarines.. than US navy..   US navy advantage is not technology but numbers..and that have 10 aircraft carriers vs 1 of Russia .. but Russia counter their lower numbers with better technology and superior weapons..

    Kalibers/onyx anti-ship missiles range = up to 700km supersonic cruise missiles
    Harpoon anti ship missiles range = 130km subsonic cruise missiles..

    That said.. how it stack in a naval fight US vs Russia? if is conventional. and open seas. US navy will have to keep their surface warships away of Russia combat range ie.. 800km ++  and use their naval airforce flying low or Virginia submarines to try to sneak close enough to Russian navy to start a fight.

    Russia will be using their diesel electric submarines and yasen to hunt those virginia too.. so it will not be easy..

    If is close to Russian land.. is several times more harder if not impossible to have an effective fight , because Russia continent becomes effectively a giant aircraft carrier that do not sink.  And S-400s defenses will keep away any airforce.. patrol boats and helicopters with radars will be sent to scan for  submarines.

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  par far on Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:26 am

    Vann7 wrote:
    par far wrote:How does the Borei class stack up against the American Virginia class and Ohio class submarines?

    Are Russian Submarines better than the American ones or is it the other way around?

    Also where does the Yasen class submarine rank?

    Can some please tell me all the submarines that Russia operates right and what submarines will Russia operate in the future?

    Will Russia export any submarines soon?

    amazingly no one told you this..

    But ..

    you are mixing attack conventional submarines that carry cruise missiles.. vs ballistic submarines that carry nuclear weapons mostly and its sole purpose is destroy countries..  while attack submarines is main purpose is attack warships  and or other submarines or land targets with conventional weapons.


    when it comes to the future.. it will be..
    in attack submarines...
    Yasen class + kilo class vs Virginia+Seawolf class..

    in ballistic submarines with nuclear weapons..
    Borei class vs Ohio class..

    The Borei and Yasen and brand new submarines... while the american Ohio are 40 years old.. and the seawolf 15 years and virginia 10 years old.

    So the timing they have in service should give you an idea of how they stack each other in terms of technology
    of the ships.

    When it comes to weapons.. in attack submarines..weapons..
    it will be Russia using state of the art modern Kalibr and Onix missiles..and close range torpedos ,
    vs americans using Tomahawks and harpoon missiles of the 70s..

    in terms of technology Russia wins hands down..  the advantage of USA is in numbers. really and nothing else.

    in ballistic navy submarines nuclear war weapons ..
    it will be Russia using Bulava state of the art missiles vs  Americans using tridents that is technology of the 70s..
    and some upgraded ohios using trident II technology of the 90s..

    So ironically contrary to what the western people believe..Russian navy have more cutting edge technology...
    in their Submarines.. than US navy..   US navy advantage is not technology but numbers..and that have 10 aircraft carriers vs 1 of Russia .. but Russia counter their lower numbers with better technology and superior weapons..

    Kalibers/onyx anti-ship missiles range = up to 700km supersonic cruise missiles
    Harpoon anti ship missiles range = 130km subsonic cruise missiles..

    That said.. how it stack in a naval fight US vs Russia? if is conventional. and open seas. US navy will have to keep their surface warships away of Russia combat range ie.. 800km ++  and use their naval airforce flying low or Virginia submarines to try to sneak close enough to Russian navy to start a fight.

    Russia will be using their diesel electric submarines and yasen to hunt those virginia too.. so it will not be easy..

    If is close to Russian land.. is several times more harder if not impossible to have an effective fight , because Russia continent becomes effectively a giant aircraft carrier that do not sink.  And S-400s defenses will keep away any airforce.. patrol boats and helicopters with radars will be sent to scan for  submarines.


    Thank for the clear up Vann, can you tell me what is the difference between project 636.3 and project 636.6.

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

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      Current date/time is Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:06 pm