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    Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:41 pm


    Can anyone type a quick list of RuN nuclear attack subs and number of them per class (just class and number, not individual ships) that are in service now and those that are undergoing overhaul?

    We have Sierras, Akulas, Oscars and Yasens but how many of each exactly right now?

    I am getting lost in those spreadsheets in Russian....
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    franco

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  franco on Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:46 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Can anyone type a quick list of RuN nuclear attack subs and number of them per class (just class and number, not individual ships) that are in service now and those that are undergoing overhaul?

    We have Sierras, Akulas, Oscars and Yasens but how many of each exactly right now?

    I am getting lost in those spreadsheets in Russian....

    Top figure is total, check individual fleets to see those submarines operational.

    http://russianships.info/eng/today/
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:51 pm

    Minus first two Pacific fleet submarines - Podolsk and Sv. Georgiy Pobedonosets, as they were decomissioned last month.
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    franco

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  franco on Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:28 pm

    verkhoturye51 wrote:Minus first two Pacific fleet submarines - Podolsk and Sv. Georgiy Pobedonosets, as they were decomissioned last month.

    Don't believe they have been decommissioned yet, but the tender to dismantle them after they are, was put out.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:28 pm

    franco wrote:
    Top figure is total, check individual fleets to see those submarines operational.
    http://russianships.info/eng/today/
    verkhoturye51 wrote:Minus first two Pacific fleet submarines - Podolsk and Sv. Georgiy Pobedonosets, as they were decomissioned last month.


    Okay so according to this website I am coming up with following numbers of nuclear submarines in use, correct me if I'm wrong:


    SSBN: 10 total (3 Borei-class + 7 Delta-class) 2 Deltas are in overhaul, I am not counting last Typhoon-class since it's just there for testing

    SSGN: 9 total (8 Oscar-class + 1 Yasen-class) 2 Oscars are in overhaul but are not slated for decommission unlike Akulas

    SSN: 13 total (4 Sierra-class + 2 Victor-class + 7 Akula-class) I have no idea what exactly here is slated for repair and what for decommission so I'll just count ones in use now



    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13


    Is this right?
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  KiloGolf on Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:35 pm

    [quote="PapaDragon"]
    franco wrote:So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13


    Is this right?

    Pretty much.
    And looking at the SSN numbers begs the question, is it enough?

    Don't think so, for the size of patrol areas of Russia.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:50 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:.......
    Pretty much.
    And looking at the SSN numbers begs the question, is it enough?

    Don't think so, for the size of patrol areas of Russia.


    Yeah it's bit anemic but that gap can be plugged by spamming non-nuclear subs like Kilos (and later ones). Work the littoral area with those and send SSNs further out.

    I still wonder if they plan on pursuing SSN version of Husky or will they just skip it go with all SSGN fleet like USA did (Los Angeles and Virginia) That seems to be target approach given Yasen design.

    But as long as SSBN and SSGN numbers are stable then it's all pretty much okay. If gap shows up there there is no way to plug it with Kilos so they better keep eyes on the ball. Fortunately they seem to be doing it.
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    franco

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  franco on Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:13 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    franco wrote:
    Top figure is total, check individual fleets to see those submarines operational.
    http://russianships.info/eng/today/
    verkhoturye51 wrote:Minus first two Pacific fleet submarines - Podolsk and Sv. Georgiy Pobedonosets, as they were decomissioned last month.


    Okay so according to this website I am coming up with following numbers of nuclear submarines in use, correct me if I'm wrong:


    SSBN: 10 total (3 Borei-class + 7 Delta-class) 2 Deltas are in overhaul,  I am not counting last Typhoon-class since it's just there for testing

    SSGN: 9 total (8 Oscar-class + 1 Yasen-class) 2 Oscars are in overhaul but are not slated for decommission unlike Akulas

    SSN: 13 total (4 Sierra-class + 2 Victor-class + 7 Akula-class) I have no idea what exactly here is slated for repair and what for decommission so I'll just count ones in use now



    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13


    Is this right?

    I think that the 2 SSBN's that the tender for their demolition was announced last month are still active. The tender process was started while awaiting the arrivals of their replacements.
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:23 pm

    SSBN: there are 8 Deltas in comission, 7 Delta IV and 1 Delta III, all finished overhaul. Dmitry is part of the fleet and is able to fire Bulavas

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul) OK

    SSN: 4 Sierra (3 active, 1 in modernization)+ 3 Victor (active) + 11 Akula (6 active, 5 in modernization) = 18.


    Right now total numbers are 14 + 9 + 18 + Kilos and Ladas = 63 + reserve fleet > US submarine fleet
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:01 am

    verkhoturye51 wrote:

    Cost saving is the idea behind Husky, but I still hope they'll make a SSBN version quieter and more resistant against torpedo hits, a SSN faster and deeper diving and so on.

    indeed making "up-armored" SSBN/SSN version could make fairly resistant against smaller torpedoes ... something like T-34 against 37mm guns.





    verkhoturye51 wrote:Nice!

    Weird thing in the bow doesn't really resemble VLS. Current trends in Russian submarine building favour big sonars in the bow and torpedos/missiles in the middle of the boat anyway.

    So all in all it's just 8 VLSs in the middle of a hull or half of Yasen's capacity, which is consistent with official releases, signaling size much under Yasen's.

    And that pump jet propulsor looks stealthy, too. Can't wait too see her get wet in 2-3 years!


    agree bad ass looks - especially "bondisch" sail's windows. Whether it's smaller than Yasen? unlikely - loom as size of sail's doors or VLS for Calibrs - Calibr is ~8 m long.
    Torpedo tubes are visible (in higher res) in front upper part of


    Is should have also some hidden modules to store robots or perspective weaponry.


    Last edited by GunshipDemocracy on Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:19 am; edited 1 time in total
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:16 am

    5- hull Typhoon was able to survive a torpedo hit.
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    TheArmenian

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  TheArmenian on Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:43 am

    verkhoturye51 wrote:SSBN: there are 8 Deltas in comission, 7 Delta IV and 1 Delta III, all finished overhaul. Dmitry is part of the fleet and is able to fire Bulavas

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul) OK

    SSN: 4 Sierra (3 active, 1 in modernization)+ 3 Victor (active) + 11 Akula (6 active, 5 in modernization) = 18.


    Right now total numbers are 14 + 9 + 18 + Kilos and Ladas = 63 + reserve fleet > US submarine fleet

    Some corrections and additions for subs in service:

    SSBN:
    1 Typhoon class - Dimitry Donskoi
    3 Borei class - Dolgoruky, Nevsky and Monomakh
    6 Delta IV class - Verkhoturye, Ekaterinburgh, Tula, Bryansk (in modernization), Karelia and Novomoskovsk
    3 Delta II class - Podolsk, Georgy Pobedanosetz, Ryazan (2 of them will be retired soon)

    SSGN
    1 Yasen class- Severodvinsk
    8 Oscar class - Voronezh, Smolensk, Tver, Orel, Tomsk, Irkutsk, Chelyabinsk and Omsk (the last 3 are in modernization)

    SSN
    2 Sierra I class - Kostroma and Karp (in modernization)
    2 Sierra II class - Zubatka and Okun
    11 Akula class - Kashalot, Bratsk, Magadan, Kuzbass, Samara, Panthera, Volk, Leopard, Tigr, Vepr and Gepard (7nof them are in modernization)
    3 Victor III class - Obninsk, Danil Moskovsky and Tambov

    SSK
    20 Kilos class (approximate)

    Special Submarines
    1 Podmoskovye (ex- Delta IV class)
    1 Orenburg (ex- Delta III class)
    1 Sarov
    ? Losharik
    ? etc.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:07 am

    franco wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:............

    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13


    Is this right?

    I think that the 2 SSBN's that the tender for their demolition was announced last month are still active. The tender process was started while awaiting the arrivals of their replacements.

    I know, I already deducted those two


    Last edited by PapaDragon on Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:02 pm; edited 2 times in total

    walle83

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  walle83 on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:11 am

    I think we can forgett about the last Akula submarine. It just used for missile tests and for show off. Yes it can fire the Bulava missile but i think only one or two of its missile tubes was modified for that use. And all SS-N-20 missiles have been scrapped by now.
    Also the submarine had its overhaul in 2002 so it will soon need major repairs and overhaul again. Doubtfull Russia will pay for that once again when they can spend that money on new Borei subs insted.
    Just like Kirovs cruisers this Soviet killer is just a wounderfull sight, but in reality it belongs in the past and not in the modern Russian navy. Scrap it and spend the money on something better.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:05 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:.....
    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13
    .....


    And just in time, infographics on Russian submarine fleet:

    Huge picture, 7776x4848:
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Isos on Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:18 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:.....
    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13
    .....


    And just in time, infographics on Russian submarine fleet:

    Huge picture, 7776x4848:

    Yasen will start coming in really big numbers. They have modernized soviet era nuclear attack subs. Future diesel subs will have AIP so much more usefull than diesel subs they have now. And Oscar will get their new uksk vls.

    The russian navy will be much more powerfull than the soviet probably in 6 years because all their ships will be able to lunch kalibr oniks and tzirkon.

    walle83

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  walle83 on Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:09 am

    Isos wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:.....
    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13
    .....


    And just in time, infographics on Russian submarine fleet:

    Huge picture, 7776x4848:

    Yasen will start coming in really big numbers. They have modernized soviet era nuclear attack subs. Future diesel subs will have AIP so much more usefull than diesel subs they have now. And Oscar will get their new uksk vls.

    The russian navy will be much more powerfull than the soviet probably in 6 years because all their ships will be able to lunch kalibr oniks and tzirkon.

    Will Yasen-class start to come in "really big numbers"? Care to explain how this will happen?
    Yes Russia do overhaul and upgrade some of its older nuclear subs. But its going really slow, and most probably wont return to service before 2020-2025.
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  Isos on Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:22 am

    walle83 wrote:
    Isos wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:.....
    So in use at the moment:

    SSBN: 8 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSGN: 7 (+2 in overhaul)

    SSN: 13
    .....


    And just in time, infographics on Russian submarine fleet:

    Huge picture, 7776x4848:

    Yasen will start coming in really big numbers. They have modernized soviet era nuclear attack subs. Future diesel subs will have AIP so much more usefull than diesel subs they have now. And Oscar will get their new uksk vls.

    The russian navy will be much more powerfull than the soviet probably in 6 years because all their ships will be able to lunch kalibr oniks and tzirkon.

    Will Yasen-class start to come in "really big numbers"? Care to explain how this will happen?
    Yes Russia do overhaul and upgrade some of its older nuclear subs. But its going really slow, and most probably wont return to service before 2020-2025.

    They are building 6 of them if I'm not wrong. So they will be put into service one after the other really quickly. Now they don't have them but they will get those being build and that will change drasticly the level of technology of sub forces. While the old one are being upgraded also right now so they will come back with the yasen. So the number of subs will increase if they keep the old ones and get new ones.

    6 is a big number for sub forces. Specially if it is about Yasen class. But what's important here is that they will put into service all of them in the same period which should be 2020-2025.

    2025 will be the year where old rusty russian navy will no exist anymore. They will have plenty of new ships and far less old ships. Like new kilo, new yasen, new borei, and husky will be start in the shipyards.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  GarryB on Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:57 am

    I think we can forgett about the last Akula submarine. It just used for missile tests and for show off. Yes it can fire the Bulava missile but i think only one or two of its missile tubes was modified for that use. And all SS-N-20 missiles have been scrapped by now.

    The last Akula sub used for testing should not be forgotten... it would be ideal for testing a range of weapon and system types that would not require taking an operational sub off the line to do the same work.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue May 29, 2018 7:10 pm


    Podmoskovye spy sub, fresh photos with dorsal payload cradle:







    More photos: https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/107655/
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    George1

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  George1 on Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:25 am

    Construction schedule of Borei-A, Yasen and Husky



    https://navy-korabel.livejournal.com/193283.html
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:54 pm

    George1 wrote:Construction schedule of Borei-A, Yasen and Husky

    https://ic.pics.livejournal.com/navy_korabel/63221775/62442/62442_900.jpg

    https://navy-korabel.livejournal.com/193283.html


    So 7-8 year build speed on average. Slower than USA but faster than France and UK.

    Boreis are definitely winners here, decent pace, lots of hulls and fortunately SSBN fleet is well stocked so no need to rush things.

    But that 5 year gap (at best) between last Yasen and first Husky is really concerning. Is Russian SSN fleet numerous and capable enough to absorb delivery gap that big? Seriously asking.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:00 pm


    Gepard almost ready


    hoom

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  hoom on Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:37 pm

    At first I was like Suspect whats with that mast (?!), then I was all 'oh its just a rudder' Neutral
    but then I was Shocked


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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Nuclear Submarine Force: Discussion

    Post  PapaDragon on Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:04 am

    hoom wrote:At first I was like Suspect whats with that mast (?!), then I was all 'oh its just a rudder' Neutral
    but then I was Shocked
    .....

    Ahhh the good old Typhoon screwing around with people's sense of scale as usual.... Smile

    Also, I just noticed how massive Akulas are, usually they look like chunkier Kilo subs when on the surface. But here you can see how ginormus they are.

    This always happens to me when I look at subs, I always forget that 2/3 of them are underwater.

    You can imagine how I freaked out when I saw Oscar class in dry dock. Unlike Typhoons that look huge even when not submerged, Oscars look average sized at best on the surface but the whole thing is insane when seen in full.

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