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    Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

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    Arctic_Fox

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    Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Arctic_Fox on Wed Apr 12, 2017 6:00 am

    Inside the Russian Nikonov AN94:
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    Benya

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Benya on Sun May 21, 2017 9:33 pm

    New assault rifle and submachine gun for Russian Ratnik future soldier outfit for end of this year.

    By the end of the year the Russian military can choose a submachine gun to equip the new Ratnik outfit. At present automatic rifles of two producers are undergoing tests - Kalashnikov (AK-12 and AK-15) and Kovrov enterprise (A545, A762). It is possible that both rifles will become operational, Lenta-ru online publication said.


    Kalashnikov AK-12 assault rifle

    The Ratnik dubbed as "future soldier outfit" is one of the major modernization projects in the Russian army. The most interesting part is the choice of the rifle to replace currently operational AK-74M. The military want to have the new weapon with two calibers - 5.45 and 7.62mm. It is only logical as after the Soviet army switched in 1974 to 5.45x39mm cartridges some units - reconnaissance, commando, etc. continued to use 7.62x39 firearms.

    Two producers bid to arm the soldier of the future: the Kalashnikov Concern and the Degtyarev plant in Kovrov. The latter submitted a design which was rejected by the military in the past century. It is AEK-971 with trimmed-out automatics. It means the bolt assembly has a special rocker beam equal in weight with connected tooth wheel. During a shot the rocker beam moves in different direction against the bolt assembly and compensates the strike impulse on the back wall of the receiver and thus considerably decreases the upwards movement of the rifle. As a result, the AEK accuracy of fire in bursts is 15-20 percent superior to AK-74.

    The AEK-971 was designed by the Kovrov Mechanical Works for Abakan contest announced by the Defense Ministry in 1978. At that time the military believed the solutions used in the rifle were unfounded and the submachine gun did not even reach the final. However it did not vanish altogether and was upgraded in the 1990s and produced in small batches for the Interior Ministry and other law enforcement agencies. It continued up to 2006 when the Kovrov enterprise stopped weapons production and handed it over to ZiD enterprise. In 2010 it launched small-batch production of AEK-971 and upgraded the rifle. In 2014 the latest modifications were submitted for the Ratnik contest as A545 of 5.45mm caliber and 7.62mm A762.


    Kalashnikov AK-15 assault rifle 7.62x39mm

    The Kalashnikov Concern presented a new version of AK-12 submachine gun. Its history is not that long as of AEK but is also twisty. The design of the rifle began in 2011 specifically for Ratnik. The author of the idea and the head of the project was then Designer General of the concern Vladimir Zlobin. According to arms expert and Editor-in-Chief of Kalashnikov magazine Mikhail Degtyarev, the new rifle created on the basis of AK has practically no interchangeable parts with its prototype.

    In was announced in 2015 that the submachinegun began government acceptance tests. In the autumn of 2016 the Army-2016 show featured an AK-12 rifle which had nothing in common with the submachinegun promoted by Kalashnikov for five years.

    The new AK-12 (and its AK-15 option for 7.62x39mm cartridge) resembled AK-74M rifle in the modernized Obves set with a telescopic buttstock like that of US M16/M4, ergonomic handle, Picatinny rails on barrel extension, grip, gas tube, etc. "I believe current AK-12 to be an option of AK-74M. They are not amended rifles within one design, they are different firearms. And different rifles should not have the same name," Degtyarev said.

    There were claims that the military demanded AK-12 designers to unify the rifle to the maximum with operational AK-74M.


    Kalashnikov AK-15 and AK-12 assault rifles

    The Kalashnikov Concern was reserved in explaining the difference between the initial and final options of the rifle. "The displayed samples were upgraded according to the results of government acceptance tests and differ from previous options by appearance and construction of several important units," it said. In particular, the construction of the barrel extension and the gas unit has been changed. The barrel is overhanging as much as it is possible in AK which has to increase the accuracy of fire. There is also the mentioned telescopic buttstock, a more convenient gun safety lock/fire switch and a possibility to shoot in a fixed burst mode. The main secret of AK-12 is likely the new barrel extension cap with Picattinny rails to mount sights. Kalashnikov representatives say the cap construction makes it possible to mount and safely keep sighting devices on it. Such options of AK-12 and AK-15 rifles were handed over to the military for field tests.

    The main intermediate result of the contest is as follows: the Ratnik project will hardly produce a rifle of the future or a new-generation submachinegun. "There are improvements but very modest on the background of excessive expectations triggered by a media campaign. Local successes include ergonomic improvements of existing firearms. There can be no talk about a breakthrough or even a major modernization of the rifles," Degtyarev said.

    Many experts and the military see no necessity in replacing the AK-74M which suits the army in general. "The experience of all wars shows that the main requirement is reliability," said military expert Viktor Murakhovsky. "AK-74 is a very successful design but it needs modernization. It is necessary to considerably improve combat engagement convenience, including ergonomics, and provide a possibility to mount additional devices," he said. The expert said that in case of a large-scale war it would be necessary to arm an army up to two million men strong and in this case "a transfer to a completely new rifle would be inappropriate".

    Besides, military warehouses have accumulated up to 17 million Kalashnikov rifles which can be modernized through the Obves set if necessary.

    Lenta.ru interlocutors believe the Kalashnikov Concern would win the Ratnik contest as its rifle is the best option from the point of view of production technologies, logistics and real army needs. Besides, Kalashnikov enjoys higher lobbying possibilities than ZiD. The capacities of the Kovrov enterprise do not allow launching massive production of the rifle to rearm the troops. It means even in case AEK-971 wins the contest its production is likely to be entrusted to Kalashnikov, Lenta.ru believes.

    Source: Arrow http://www.armyrecognition.com/weapons_defence_industry_military_technology_uk/new_assault_rifle_submachine_gun_ratnik_russia_12105173.html



    As far as I know, the Soviet Army adopted the 5.45x39mm round for assault rifles due to its higher lethality. While the 7.62x39mm round just penetrates through the human body, the 5.45x39mm one spins inside a couple of times after penetration, causing more damage, has greater muzzle velocity, and is lighter, so more of it can be carried.

    BTW the 7.62x39mm round on the other hand can defeat body armor and targets behind lighter cover (trees/bushes) more easily. This is logical, and this is the main reason why a full transition to the 5.45x39mm (light machine guns are still using the 7.62x39mm round) was never made.

    This raised a couple of questions for me:

    1.) Since we are seeing two assault rifles of both of the aforementioned calibers, how the Russian Army will field them in the future, especially the latter one?

    2.) Which units would use which calibers? It is common in the Russian Army that certain units use different calibers. For example, SpetzNaz soldiers use the AS Val with its 9x39mm caliber, and they are using it for its great stopping power. So will they reintroduce the 7.62x39mm caliber as a standard issue assault rifle caliber, and for what purposes, and in what type of units?
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  GarryB on Mon May 22, 2017 4:49 am

    AFAIK the recon soldiers in each Russian military force have AS and VSS rifles to assist them in their mission.

    Many Spetsnaz forces did use 7.62 x 39mm calibre rifles because they were more effective when using suppressed ammo, but these days they could simply use AS or VSS weapons instead.

    Interesting that the heavy calibre replacement round... 12.7 x 55mm has both subsonic and supersonic projectiles for quiet use and non quiet use.

    I personally like the ADS and would like to see that more widely used.
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    Arctic_Fox

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Arctic_Fox on Tue May 23, 2017 7:50 pm

    A762 latest version:


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    Benya

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Benya on Tue May 23, 2017 10:08 pm

    Arctic_Fox wrote:A762 latest version:



    At first glance, I thought that this is a bastard child of the MP-5 and the AK-12 Very Happy
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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Regular on Thu May 25, 2017 6:44 pm

    ^^^
    Haha, me too Smile

    Tho, visually I prefer 2014 6P67 version than this big boy
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    Arctic_Fox

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Arctic_Fox on Sun May 28, 2017 9:40 am









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    franco

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  franco on Sat Jun 24, 2017 12:35 am

    The units of the Eastern Military District stationed in the Amur Region, the EAO and the Khabarovsk Territory, were rearmed with modern Pecheneg machine guns, Interfax reported citing the VVO press service.

    The manual machine gun "Pecheneg" with a caliber of 7.62 millimeters is designed to engage manpower, transport and fire weapons and low-flying air targets. It is based on the Kalashnikov machine gun. In "Pecheneg" there is a system of forced air cooling of the barrel due to the energy of the powder gases.

    Thanks to the adjustable gas discharge mechanism, the machine gun can be used in any climatic conditions of the Far East.
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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  GarryB on Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:02 am

    The more things change the more they stay the same...

    At the end of WWII the Soviets had the RP46 which had either a belt feed or a round drum magazine in a full power rifle cartridge.

    It was replaced by the belt fed RPD in a short low power round and then by the magazine fed RPK and then the smaller calibre RPK-74.

    Now it seems there are three options to replace the RPK-74... the RPK-16 with a 95 round drum, the new belt fed model or the PKP in a larger calibre.

    Personally I think the best replacement would be a PKP in 6 x 49mm calibre...
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Wed Aug 23, 2017 1:41 am

    Arctic_Fox wrote:A762 latest version:



    Look closely what has changed.

    Now the A's can have folding stocks...again.

    The Tokar/kord 2 is really a nasty beast, with influences from everywhere.

    Negev, Degtaryov, Simonov. Full length rod.
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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Arctic_Fox on Wed Aug 23, 2017 7:10 pm

    Kalashnikov Concern:










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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  PapaDragon on Fri Aug 25, 2017 10:54 am

    .
    Question   Question   Question

    Can anyone identify this gatling gun? I had no idea RU military was into this stuff:


    EDIT: Nevermind, it's GShG-7.62 they ripped off a helicopter




    In action:
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    Arctic_Fox

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Arctic_Fox on Sun Sep 03, 2017 1:47 am

    AM-17 and AMB-17
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    miketheterrible

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    Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Sep 16, 2017 8:26 pm

    http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/09/14/russia-launch-government-tests-17-amb-17-rifles-2018/?utm_referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fzen.yandex.com

    Russia to Launch Government Tests of AM-17 and AMB-17 Rifles in 2018



    Video of the rifle
    https://kalashnikov.media/media/videolibrary/4516418


    In one of its recent news releases, Kalashnikov Concern has announced that the Russian government will start testing the new AM-17 and AMB-17 compact assault rifles in 2018. Several Russian special service agencies including the Federal Protective Service (FSO) and Federal Security Service (FSB) as well as the Russian National Guard have expressed a high interest in these two firearms.

    Once the tests are finished, the Kalashnikov Concern will start mass production of both rifles. The AM-17 will most likely replace the AKS-74U (a.k.a Krinkov). Dimensions wise the AM-17 is comparable to the AKS-74U. It has an advantage of being slightly lighter weight – 2.5 kg compared to 2.7 kg of Krinkov. BCGs of these rifles ride on a top chassis allowing them to have most of the receiver parts made of polymer material thus making them lighter. This layout was pioneered by Yevgeny Dragunov in his MA compact rifle design which ironically was AKS-74U’s competitor in the trials. The suppressed version (AMB-17) will probably be considered for replacing firearms like AS VAL or VSS Vintorez.
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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  George1 on Tue Oct 03, 2017 10:37 am

    Ground Troops Day@ Patriot,1Oct.Recon company of 27th OGvMSBr.Note:SVDM(6V11),VSSM(6P29M) & ASM(6P30M).©️Vitaly Kuzmin

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  George1 on Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:23 pm

    Russian SAW: Tokar-2 5.45x39mm Belt Fed Light Machine Gun Showed Off at National Guard Open House 2017 russia

    The elusive Tokar-2 5.45mm belt-fed machine gun made an appearance at the recent Rosgvardia Open House event late last month. The event demonstrated weapons and equipment being used by the Russian National Guard (Rosgvardia), and was open to the public. Russian media outlet Armytex posted pictures of the event to their page on the social media site VK.com, including photos of the Tokar-2:


    The Tokar-2 firing fully automatically from a standard AK-74 pattern magazine.


    Tokar-2 light machine gun firing fully automatically from a non-disintegrating belt.

    The Tokar-2 is a belt-fed small caliber (5.45mm) light machine gun developed at the request of the Russian Ministry of Internal Affairs (MVD). Originally called “Kord-5.45”, the new machine gun is being procured for the VV Internal Troops, which were the special operations forces of the Ministry until 2016, when they were reorganized under the new National Guard of Russia. It’s not clear how the reorganization has affected the development of the Tokar-2, although – as evidenced by the photos – the program apparently still continues. Although Kalashnikov Concern seems to have produced a weapon for this solicitation, the weapon in the photos is evidently Degtyarev’s design.

    Technically, the Tokar-2 is a very similar weapon to the Western Minimi (in US service called the M249 SAW/LMG). Like the Minimi, it is belt-fed, with an alternate magazine-feed system; however the belt links for the Tokar-2 are non-disintegrating similar to the Russian PKM machine gun. The weapon in the photos at Rosgvardia Open House is equipped with what appears to be a detachable combination moderator/flash hider, as well.

    With the development of the Kalashnikov 96-round drum for the new RPK-16, it is unclear whether the heavier, more complex, and harder to operate Tokar-2 offers any substantial improvement over more conventional magazine-fed weapons. With the USMC and possibly even US Army moving away from belt-fed 5.56mm weapons, it seems plausible that the Russian National Guard may also choose a simpler weapon like the RPK-16 to fill the role, instead of the more-expensive Tokar-2. However, that remains to be seen.

    http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/06/16/russian-saw-tokar-2-5-45x39mm-belt-fed-light-machine-gun-showed-off-national-guard-open-house-2017/

    https://nortwolf-sam.livejournal.com/2057324.html
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:36 pm

    George1 wrote:Russian SAW: Tokar-2 5.45x39mm Belt Fed Light Machine Gun Showed Off at National Guard Open House 2017  russia

    The elusive Tokar-2 5.45mm belt-fed machine gun made an appearance at the recent Rosgvardia Open House event late last month.

    Tokaryev is Tula, Tula's governor is Dyumin. They will buy this gun, thy will buy Smile

    BTW 6x49mm died for good and Russians will return to 7,62x54 ?
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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  flamming_python on Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:42 pm

    GunshipDemocracy wrote:
    George1 wrote:Russian SAW: Tokar-2 5.45x39mm Belt Fed Light Machine Gun Showed Off at National Guard Open House 2017  russia

    The elusive Tokar-2 5.45mm belt-fed machine gun made an appearance at the recent Rosgvardia Open House event late last month.

    Tokaryev is Tula, Tula's governor is Dyumin. They will buy this gun,  thy will buy Smile

    BTW 6x49mm died for good and Russians will return to 7,62x54 ?

    It does make sense for Russia to procure different types of small arms, competing ones as well - for its different service branches.

    They can have Tokars for the National Guard, RPK-16s for the army, maybe something else for the VDV/Marines and the SSO and other Spetsnaz will just pick whatever they want including foreign weapons; if those are the best for the job.

    Then in terms of pistols - the police can favour one type, the military another, the national guard another one and the special forces and FSO just whatever works best.

    They all use common ammo types already in service, and parts for small arms are not exactly an issue. Even if a weapon requires its own special calibre; it's still not an issue if it's just confined to a narrow field.

    So why not pick whatever model fits the requirements of the state organ/srvice branch/organization best - and then these weapons can be trialed and used in parallel, various arms makers get orders, and afterwards notes can be compared as to which ones work better under what conditions in practice

    Older models such as RPK-74s/RPK-74Ms can be given away to Russian allies of limited means such as the DNR/LNR, Abkhazia, S. Ossetia, Transdniestr or Syria.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 07, 2017 11:50 pm

    With the USMC and possibly even US Army moving away from belt-fed 5.56mm weapons, it seems plausible that the Russian National Guard may also choose a simpler weapon like the RPK-16 to fill the role, instead of the more-expensive Tokar-2. However, that remains to be seen.

    WTF does the USMC choice in weapons have to do with Russian weapon procurement?

    The US might have adopted a light machine gun that could feed from belts or magazines... the Soviets did that in 1946 with the RP46 and they didn't keep it.

    It was replaced by the RPD belt fed only weapon and then the RPK family of box feed weapons.

    BTW 6x49mm died for good and Russians will return to 7,62x54 ?

    I hope the reason we have not seen 6x49mm calibre weapons is because they are working on something even better to replace the old cartridge.

    Caseless or plastic cased?

    Eventually I suspect the Army will get a family of weapons with some parts interchangable and related, but that might be some time away...

    Would love to see them standardise on the 9x21mm round and drop the 9x18 and 9x19 rounds they currently use.
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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  George1 on Thu Oct 12, 2017 12:04 am

    AN-94 with Picatinny rail, Dedal-NV collimator type sight, bi-pod and mounted sound suppressor. Image via Moskit at Otvaga2004

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  George1 on Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:48 pm

    Modernized assault rifle ASM Val 6P30M





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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  GarryB on Tue Oct 17, 2017 5:30 am

    Nice, but the only obvious changes from the original AS are the picatinny mounts on the top and front handguard and the 30 round magazine instead of the 20 round mag...
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  Cyberspec on Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:24 am

    GarryB wrote:Nice, but the only obvious changes from the original AS are the picatinny mounts on the top and front handguard and the 30 round magazine instead of the 20 round mag...

    Yep. I think they've just dolled it up a bit to correspond to current tastes...definately looks better aesthetically
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  GarryB on Wed Oct 18, 2017 10:58 am

    In which case I would prefer the SR-3Ms as just looking a bit cooler.

    Actually it is amusing but the main criticism of the AKS-74U is that its short barrel means the 5.45mm round is not as accurate as in longer barrel versions like the AK-74 and other longer barrel models (even the carbine AK-105).

    A 9 x 39mm round does not need a long barrel for accuracy and neither does the 7.62 x 39mm round so a short barrel carbine in either of those two calibres should be the best option for a very short barrel carbine design.
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    The-thing-next-door

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    Re: Russian Assault Rifles & Machine Guns Thread: #2

    Post  The-thing-next-door on Mon Oct 30, 2017 6:04 pm

    Have they decided on the new assault standard issue rife yet?

    Hopefully its the A-545 or AK-12 I have a passionate hatred of pollymer.

    As for pollymer woulden't a the front section of the reciever on plastic assalt rifle melt when in use in a drawn out battle?


    That said I am currious about a plastic gun does anyone know what is the purpose this gun called the PP-90-M1 looks like a usefull way to arm a few million peaple at a moments notice?


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