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    Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu May 03, 2018 5:54 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Well freak accidents happen the Russians also crashed a Panstir S1 today also.

    when they have accidents they come in spades tho the panstir can easily be repaired.

    The real question is why didn't the pilots eject from the SU-30 they should have been able to realize it was a lost cause, the loss of the aircraft is understandable the loss of the pilots isn't. that could have been easily avoided.

    They probably got themselves caught up in trying to salvage the aircraft and lost sight of overall situation

    It happens
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Isos on Thu May 03, 2018 6:38 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Well freak accidents happen the Russians also crashed a Panstir S1 today also.

    when they have accidents they come in spades tho the panstir can easily be repaired.

    The real question is why didn't the pilots eject from the SU-30 they should have been able to realize it was a lost cause, the loss of the aircraft is understandable the loss of the pilots isn't. that could have been easily avoided.

    I think they tried to save the fighter because with 1 engine it can still fly but the pilot has to be very carrefull. However at very low altitude and at the speed of a plane you can drop hundreds of meter in maters of seconds.

    There was a video of a mig-29 crashing at an airshow because it lost an engine. It was turning on the right and the engine (the one closer to the ground) stoped while the other one was at full power so it pushed the fighter on the ground but pilot ejected.

    Here it is I found it :




    Vann7

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Vann7 on Thu May 03, 2018 7:58 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:.....
    I will not be surprised if the planes were Shot down... and Russia hiding this............


    And nobody was surprised when it turned out that you are full of shit as always

    http://tass.ru/proisshestviya/5173535



    Only thing keeping you off ignore list is shortcut bug on main page that hits every time a clown on ignore list posts something.Should they ever fix that then on the list you go and I will never have to suffer through your crap again.

    You are always on the defensive on anything ,that points negatively Russia.... ie.. A FANBOY.
    It was SPutnik itself ,that released secret archives of many dog fights ,encounters between Soviet Union
    and AMericans that never were published ,during the cold war.. with Americans and Russians killed.. This things
    happens all the time.. Unintended/intended consequences were people die from both sides.. You have the Russian private contractors killed by American airforce airstrike ,that they first denied...but later after pressure claimed a dozen
    of Russian citizens "not part of the army" were killed near the SDF zones..
    Israel is even worse.. they never admit any wrong or downplay the damages.. is called damage control and all nations do it.... and israeli planes have been shutdown many times.. not just the last one..

    So all this things happens..all the times in wars... from both sides.. There is the chinesse report about British Special forces captured in Damascus..until that time it was just rumors but later was reported by SPutnik news too.. And naturally British Government never told anything about it...and that same chinese report saying about 2,500 american military forces in Damascus eastern Ghouta ,that were killed by Russian airforce in retaliation for the attacks. and then suddenly US was very desperate to attack Syria.. when Russia was bombing Eastern Ghouta...and the accusations of chemicals began.

    The operations of eastern ghouta began ,by coincidence , the next day after it was claimed by Pentagon ,they bombed
    pro Assad militia in Syria and that they dont believe there was Russian soldiers there... obviously they were lying..
    thats the way they speak to justify their actions... and to claim that Russia military is not aware of any Private military contractor from Russia operating in Syria , is non sense... Russia military needs to know the positions of any force
    whether is syrian army ,or iranian or hezbolah or Private Russian security... they need  to know so that they don't end
    bombing their own forces that fight on their side against ISIS and other NATO backed terrorist.
    So i stand by what i said BOZO.. It will not be surprising if the plane was Shotdown by Americans ,Israel or any of its coalition. A terrorist who sneak in Syrian coast ,with an advanced manpad could have done it.. and shutting down the plane when was taking off.. But until now , there is no evidence that it was shotdown...but it is a possibility. Specially
    when weather was good and Both Pilots did not ejected from the plane...which is rare.. A Rail Gun or energy weapon or EW deployed in Cyprus NATO military base could have done it..

    So you can't deny US ,NATO or Israel will not have the motives to do it.. they do... and if it happened ,then Russia will
    have valid reasons to hold the facts , so to be allowed to do a response to its enemies...and hit them back when they less expect it... But in any case... there is no evidence of any side of the story .. other than Russian military words...
    but no videos released of the whole thing. just a photo without a plane that could be anything. a detonated mine.. etc.

    To have clear proof of what happened a full video of the plane will have to be released..the moment the plane start falling..and for some strange reasons they did not eject.  Neutral   that doesn't make sense. that they will give away their lives if their plane don't respond. Could it be an accident..? yes.. but so it will not be surprising if it was shutdown too...
    we will know for sure , withing days.. if it was an accident or act of war.. IF it was an attack ,Russia retaliation will be
    Big and so NATO or Israeli planes falling from the skies by "birds" or other "mysterious reasons" ,will only add fuel to the the version that Russia was attacked. it will be interesting to see US coalition planes over northen Syria if they fly normally there or if suddenly NATO suspended all air flight operations.


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    auslander

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  auslander on Thu May 03, 2018 9:10 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Only thing keeping you off ignore list is shortcut bug on main page that hits every time a clown on ignore list posts something.
    Should they ever fix that then on the list you go and I will never have to suffer through your crap again.

    He and his various clones have been on my STFU list for a long time, it was simple to do. Something changed on the site?
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu May 03, 2018 9:21 pm

    auslander wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    Only thing keeping you off ignore list is shortcut bug on main page that hits every time a clown on ignore list posts something.
    Should they ever fix that then on the list you go and I will never have to suffer through your crap again.

    He and his various clones have been on my STFU list for a long time, it was simple to do. Something changed on the site?

    Problem is with those little orange square shortcuts on main page that send you to first unread post. I use them a lot.

    But if somebody who is on ignore list posts in the meantime then that shortcut sends you to last post so it basically becomes useless.

    It's not a problem with usual clowns on my ignore list because they don't post often but with Vann who spams this place with text- walls 24/7 it's not an option because all those shortcuts instantly become useless due to his constant spamming.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Militarov on Thu May 03, 2018 10:15 pm

    https://syria.liveuamap.com/en/2018/3-may-syria-seems-a-pantsir-s1-belonging-to-russian-convoy

    Suspect
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  JohninMK on Thu May 03, 2018 10:59 pm

    Militarov wrote:https://syria.liveuamap.com/en/2018/3-may-syria-seems-a-pantsir-s1-belonging-to-russian-convoy

    Suspect
    From the crash location I'd say it was either going to or coming from the Russian S-400 site up in the hills.
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Isos on Fri May 04, 2018 1:16 am

    A french newspaper published something new about the western strike in Syria.

    It says concerning russian forces that there was a A-50 in the sky during the missile strike and that the grigorovich frigate and another ship made agressive manoeuvres (jaming or maybe radar lock, it isn't said what were those manoeuvres) against 2 french FREMM and that's why they could lunch their missiles so the third FREMM lunched its own missiles.
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    HUNTER VZLA

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  HUNTER VZLA on Fri May 04, 2018 3:45 am

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Well freak accidents happen the Russians also crashed a Panstir S1 today also.

    when they have accidents they come in spades tho the panstir can easily be repaired.

    The real question is why didn't the pilots eject from the SU-30 they should have been able to realize it was a lost cause, the loss of the aircraft is understandable the loss of the pilots isn't. that could have been easily avoided.







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    nomadski

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  nomadski on Fri May 04, 2018 10:41 am

    RIP to pilots of Russia who died . I was thinking before that two things could be done to help pilots in air . In conflict zones . First the installation of remote controlled fuel shut off valve to engines . Because if plane is hit by birds or missile , then plane may loose electrics and not be able to shut engine . Ground control can send signal to shut engine . And stop fire in engine . Valve has own power pack and is isolated from plane electrics . Second is to allow ground control to remote eject pilots . For reason that pilot may be disorientated . As may be case here . And not eject on time .
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  GarryB on Sat May 05, 2018 7:43 am

    Problem is that depending on the severity of the bird strike you might not want fuel shut down to that engine... you might want to restart it...

    No one will be going to the funeral for the aircraft... it is sad that they did not just eject, but clearly being professionals they thought they could save the plane.

    RIP to the crew.


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    flamming_python

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  flamming_python on Sat May 05, 2018 3:28 pm

    nomadski wrote:Second is to allow ground control to remote eject pilots . For reason that pilot may be disorientated . As may be case here . And not eject on time .  

    Then Israel or the US or whoever else is conducting ELINT on the Russian Group of Forces in Syria will hack the protocol and use it to remotely eject pilots out of Su-30s in case of confrontation to avoid even having to fight the Russian aircraft.
    Or even without confrontation.. the occasional glitch or freak accident..
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sat May 05, 2018 5:34 pm

    Marat Musin, head of ANNA news has died. More info to come.

    Вечная память! Requiescat In Pacem.
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    archangelski

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  archangelski on Sat May 05, 2018 6:50 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:Marat Musin, head of ANNA news has died. More info to come.

    Вечная память! Requiescat In Pacem.

    RIP. Sad news, apparently a heart attack in Russia.
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    TheArmenian

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  TheArmenian on Sun May 06, 2018 12:53 am

    RIP Marat Musin

    You took journalism to higher levels.
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    magnumcromagnon

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Sun May 06, 2018 12:57 am

    RIP.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  GarryB on Sun May 06, 2018 2:13 am

    Second is to allow ground control to remote eject pilots . For reason that pilot may be disorientated . As may be case here . And not eject on time .

    The Yak-38 and Yak-38M as well as the Yak-41 had automatic ejection systems that were activated during landing and takeoffs... some of the most dangerous times for crashes. Because of this these aircraft had a high crash rate but low fatality rates.

    If the sink rate was too high or the angles went beyond certain numbers the crew were automatically ejected.

    I would want to know more facts about the crash before suggesting every aircraft gets such a system fitted.


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    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  JohninMK on Mon May 07, 2018 10:47 pm

    More bad news, two more flyers dead. RIP.


    Capt(N)
    ‏ @Capt_Navy
    5m5 minutes ago

    the KA-52 helicopter of the ????????#Russian Air Force crashed in ????????#Syria. Both pilots died.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Militarov on Mon May 07, 2018 11:06 pm

    JohninMK wrote:More bad news, two more flyers dead. RIP.


    Capt(N)
    ‏ @Capt_Navy
    5m5 minutes ago

    the KA-52 helicopter of the ????????#Russian Air Force crashed in ????????#Syria. Both pilots died.

    "Russian Ka-52 helicopter has crashed during a routine flight over eastern regions of the Syrian Arab Republic. Both pilots were killed,” the Ministry said.

    Bodies of the pilots have been recovered by a search and rescue team and delivered to the base airfield. According to the preliminary data the crash was caused by a malfunction of the machine, the Russian military said."
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Isos on Mon May 07, 2018 11:18 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:More bad news, two more flyers dead. RIP.


    Capt(N)
    ‏ @Capt_Navy
    5m5 minutes ago

    the KA-52 helicopter of the ????????#Russian Air Force crashed in ????????#Syria. Both pilots died.

    "Russian Ka-52 helicopter has crashed during a routine flight over eastern regions of the Syrian Arab Republic. Both pilots were killed,” the Ministry said.

    Bodies of the pilots have been recovered by a search and rescue team and delivered to the base airfield. According to the preliminary data the crash was caused by a malfunction of the machine,  the Russian military said."

    They are using their hardware too much. They should send new one and investigate those used and repaire them.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Militarov on Mon May 07, 2018 11:28 pm

    Isos wrote:
    They are using their hardware too much. They should send new one and investigate those used and repaire them.

    Ka-52s havent been flying all that much tbh compared to some other platforms. Also it seems they didnt get to use ejection seats.
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Isos on Mon May 07, 2018 11:39 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    Isos wrote:
    They are using their hardware too much. They should send new one and investigate those used and repaire them.

    Ka-52s havent been flying all that much tbh compared to some other platforms. Also it seems they didnt get to use ejection seats.

    I've seen somewhere that they are hard to use at very low altitude.

    They are using them in hard condition too. The desert and the high temperatures are not helpfull for the material there.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon May 07, 2018 11:43 pm

    RIP to the crew. Unfortunately, the more they fly, the more likely accidents happen. Ka-52 still being rather new and having tests in hard climate is needed. Too bad ejection seats weren't used.

    Kommersant is being retarded again, claiming it was shot down. Of course, no evidence and couldn't explain how the aircraft and the crew were taken to the AFB so quickly either.
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    d_taddei2

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  d_taddei2 on Mon May 07, 2018 11:53 pm

    Isos wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:More bad news, two more flyers dead. RIP.


    Capt(N)
    ‏ @Capt_Navy
    5m5 minutes ago

    the KA-52 helicopter of the ????????#Russian Air Force crashed in ????????#Syria. Both pilots died.

    "Russian Ka-52 helicopter has crashed during a routine flight over eastern regions of the Syrian Arab Republic. Both pilots were killed,” the Ministry said.

    Bodies of the pilots have been recovered by a search and rescue team and delivered to the base airfield. According to the preliminary data the crash was caused by a malfunction of the machine,  the Russian military said."

    They are using their hardware too much. They should send new one and investigate those used and repaire them.

    Another no ejection of pilots. Another sad day for Russia

    Vann7

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    Re: Russian military intervention and aid to Syria #13

    Post  Vann7 on Tue May 08, 2018 1:44 am

    The same day of Putin Inauguration ,in the most dangerous zone , and KA-52 crashing..
    and again , apparently both pilots did the unthinkable and not ejected.. ??? Suspect

    the first report Sputnik used the word Downed.. but later was changed to crashed..
    after clarifications of RUSSIA MOD..

    Sorry but i don't buy it...
    It pretty much looks that it was shot down...
    So either Russia military forgot to add Counter Electronics to the hellicopter..
    or they don't work so well at all..

    Other things could have shot down it..

    -Railguns
    -Energy Guns,
    -kamikazi Drones attack..
    -Air defenses deployed by US in eastern Syrian
    -or shot down by another US combat plane..

    in any case ,this is now a repetitive pattern... every 3-4 days in Syria you see
    a major slap in the face of Russia.. either NATO/ISRAEL bombing Syrian army
    or a Russian soldiers killed .  by "mysterious reasons".. and even accidents in the
    ground too..  This looks like a major low level war happening ,between US and Russia ,
    that media is not aware..

    Hope Putin have fun celebrating the Soviets victory ,while Russia military is suffering
    almost every day unacceptable losses in Syria.   No

    what is more intriguing in all this.. is the fact that Russia military does not know
    exactly what happened ... Shocked   Didn't  the pilots can talk by Radio if a problem shows up ????
    How is possible that A ka-52 crash ,with no radio communications between the Pilots and Russia military
    airports.. ?? it also suggest the KA-52 was alone flying ,not with any escort..  since Russia military
    not really sure if it was an accident.  This should be an awakening call for Russia military and Putin
    they need to do something to change this pilots casualties in so few time... I simply don't buy it..
    This only reinforce , the calls ,that the previous plane was also Shot down and not an "Accident"

    Su-30 +Ka-52 pilots killed.. in 3-4 days.  No

    This crashes will have a major demoralizing problem in Russia military..
    and Some heads needs to roll in Russia military.. Even a technical malfunction
    is consequence of negligence . So either it was mechanical negligence , or it was shot down by Intelligence
    Negligence on not understanding the danger for the pilots in sending them to that mission..  Im on record
    saying.. with the Su-30 crash.. that in 2-3 days we will know for sure what happened.. by monitoring tensions
    and social media.. and other mysterious incidents. now we have a another mysterious incident. So will not be surprising if Both the Su-30 and Ka-52 was attacked in the same day ,and it was done by a foreign Nation .
    and the Pantsir "Accident" is connected to this..  So a low level war could be happening already . US
    military is also experiencing mysterious accidents too... more frequent . But in case of US.. they report
    their accidents happening in US territory during training not in Syria.. but it could be a smoke screen to cover the loses
    in Syria. same for Israel.. anyone remembers the F-35 damaged by a Bird ? according to Israel? the same day
    Syria army told hit an F-35 in Syria ?



    Last edited by Vann7 on Tue May 08, 2018 2:27 am; edited 6 times in total

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