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    Syrian War: News #18

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    GarryB

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  GarryB on Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:59 pm

    In 1 Russian video I saw it's claimed that the Russian S-400 shot it down while aiming at those Israeli F-16s, but they don't want to admit it. I doubt it- not with the IL-20 still in the area.

    If it had been the S-400 then it would have been 4 dead F-16s and one landed Il-20... why do you think China and India and Turkey and Saudi Arabia want to buy S-400?

    And why the US does not want any of them to buy it?

    Russia’s Long-Term Interests Place Turkey Higher Than Syria
    Syria is being partitioned; Assad will have to live with it or die!

    Look at the link again... anything that starts with Jamestown.org might as well say American wet dream academy....

    Syria is not being partitioned... only Americans talk about that... and really what say will they have in the long term?

    If you listened to US sources Assad was a dead man 7 years ago... still in charge though...
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Sep 22, 2018 1:30 pm

    watching that video of the so called S-400, that definitely is not a S-400 launch. Way too slow of a missile launch.



    Plus it curves pretty quickly too after launch.
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    calm

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  calm on Sat Sep 22, 2018 3:12 pm

    Insider info from KP from meeting in Moscow

    Russians are not interesting in Israel theories about Hezbollah, Iran, and Syrian responsibility for death of Il-20 crew. Blame is on Israel for being there to strike some targets in a first place.

    Surovikin made it clear that it was the actions of Israeli aviation that provoked the tragedy that day. And reminded them of the words of Shoigu: "The fault for the downed Russian plane and the death of the crew lies entirely on the Israeli side." This is our principled position.

    Cooperation to continue, but serious adjustments to be made to the Russian-Israeli agreements(deconfliction line?) that were established three years ago. Question about 1minute warning from Israelis before the strike were very unpleasant question for israeli representatives.
    https://twitter.com/warsmonitoring/status/1043433663873134597
    https://t.co/tYPtF7EWaj
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    Skandalwitwe

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  Skandalwitwe on Sat Sep 22, 2018 6:38 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:watching that video of the so called S-400, that definitely is not a S-400 launch. Way too slow of a missile launch.

    Plus it curves pretty quickly too after launch.

    Are you joking? Every f**ing S-300/400 vid I've seen so far (and I've seen a lot) is comparable to this. Cold start, missile ignites and whoosh. And btw it's in the wrong thread.
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    d_taddei2

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  d_taddei2 on Sun Sep 23, 2018 2:35 pm

    Off topic ---- but what soviet AA missiles are still produced? Or is Russia giving syria old stocks? I'd imagine Sa-13,Sa-8 Sa-16, tunguska are still being produced. But what about the rest. Does Belarus produce?

    Seems syria must be getting through quite a lot of Sa-2, Sa-3, Sa-5 & Sa-6. Sorry for the NATO designation it's a habit from the army
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    GarryB

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  GarryB on Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:18 am

    I rather suspect the stocks of older missiles the Syrians are using were bought quite some time ago when they were considered newer for export.

    They might have sold some more ex stock missiles... they made them in enormous amounts...

    I remember reading them talk about the SA-1, which they stated they made in the 100,000s, and since the early 2000s had used about 13,000 as targets... for which they are still useful.

    From memory the SA-1 was liquid fuelled so they don't really expire... fuel them up and fire them...

    Newer missiles would also be made in enormous numbers and are also used as targets... the SA-8 in particular is command guided so you can launch up to 6 targets from one vehicle and control their flight profile to suit different attacking threats, while the 50kg payload means you can put in some jammer or telemetry equipment if you want to.

    Even old anti tank missiles are used... AT-3s were used to test the Igla against cruise missiles and other low flying small threats... the result was the Igla-S with a proximity fuse for engaging smaller targets.

    I agree, they seem to be using a few SAMs... no thanks to Israeli incursions, but that just speeds them to the point where they will need S-300s or newer systems... Smile
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:41 am

    Skandalwitwe wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:watching that video of the so called S-400, that definitely is not a S-400 launch. Way too slow of a missile launch.

    Plus it curves pretty quickly too after launch.

    Are you joking? Every f**ing S-300/400 vid I've seen so far (and I've seen a lot) is comparable to this. Cold start, missile ignites and whoosh. And btw it's in the wrong thread.

    Video claimed to be S-400 launch is way too slow even after ignition.
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    Isos

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  Isos on Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:15 am

    https://sputniknews.com/middleeast/201809241068279653-russia-syria-s-300/

    They are finally sending them to syria.
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    Isos

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  Isos on Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:18 am

    Russia will jam rdars, communication and sat navigation in mediteranean around syria according to Shoigu.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:40 am

    I don't think S-300 will be effective in hands of SAA. I think Israel will strike at them with long range missiles till they destroy them and SAA will be busy launching randomly in the air
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    BKP

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  BKP on Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:44 am

    Hear that? I think the other shoe is dropping...
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    Isos

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  Isos on Mon Sep 24, 2018 11:48 am

    miketheterrible wrote:I don't think S-300 will be effective in hands of SAA. I think Israel will strike at them with long range missiles till they destroy them and SAA will be busy launching randomly in the air

    They will be for sure manned by russians untill they destroy some israeli planes.

    Then we need to see what version they are sending. If it is the first old version it won't be that much effective.

    If is PMU2 then they could cover israeli air space easily.

    They will be protected by pantsirs for sure.
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    BKP

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  BKP on Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:08 pm

    Isos wrote:
    Then we need to see what version they are sending. If it is the first old version it won't be that much effective.

    If is PMU2 then they could cover israeli air space easily.

    IDK which version it corresponds to, but it is said to be one with 250 km range.

    Also:

    "Command posts of the Syrian troops and military air defense units will be equipped with automatic control system, which have been supplied only to the Russian Armed Forces. This will ensure the centralized management of all Syrian air defense forces and facilities, monitoring of the situation in the airspace and prompt target designation. Most importantly, it will ensure identification of all Russian aircraft by the Syrian air defense forces," Shoigu said.

    And,

    "Russia will jam satellite navigation, on-board radars and communication systems of combat aircraft, which attack targets in the Syrian territory, in the regions over the waters of the Mediterranean Sea bordering with Syria" Shoigu said.

    And,

    "We are convinced that the implementation of these measures will cool hotheads and prevent ill-considered actions threatening our servicemen. Otherwise we will have to respond in line with the current situation," Shoigu stated.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:11 pm

    I'm very happy with this response for sure. Pressure maybe from the military side against the federal government.

    But let's see about the placement of S-300's

    ATLASCUB

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  ATLASCUB on Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:14 pm

    There is no clearer language than: We will target any Israeli aircraft, vessel or means to militarily strike the Syrian state which by extension threatens our own personal spread wide in the country.

    Wording of the current measures still leaves political loopholes - which seems to me, goes along with what the Israeli defense minister said - their strategy is unchanged (the tactics will). We'll see for how long this holds before the Israeli's start striking again using some other routes and tactics. I mean striking through Jordan and Iraq isn't out of the picture here...

    This would look better if you had a Syrian air force with modern capable fighters to intercept and potentially down Israeli aircraft... defensive measures are half the pie.

    Ohh well.... better than nothing. dunno
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  JohninMK on Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:54 pm

    Please can we keep the discussion of Russian aid to Syria in the correct thread? This thread is supposed to be about what the Syrians are doing.

    The supply by Russia of the(se) S-300 seem to meet the description of the other Syria thread.

    Garry, is it possible to move these few posts over there?
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    Isos

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  Isos on Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:00 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Please can we keep the discussion of Russian aid to Syria in the correct thread? This thread is supposed to be about what the Syrians are doing.

    The supply by Russia of the(se) S-300 seem to meet the description of the other Syria thread.

    Garry, is it possible to move these few posts over there?

    S-300 going to syria is for this thread as its gonna be a syrian system opposed to israeli fighters that support terrorist. It's not russian bringing their own s-300 to protect their base.
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    BKP

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  BKP on Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:04 pm

    ^ 2nd that

    Tingsay

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  Tingsay on Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:39 pm

    This could backfire.
    If Syrians fuck up again (the IL-20 downing is partly a Syrian fuck up), Israel could be bragging about destroying S-300s.
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    d_taddei2

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  d_taddei2 on Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:40 pm

    GarryB wrote:I rather suspect the stocks of older missiles the Syrians are using were bought quite some time ago when they were considered newer for export.

    They might have sold some more ex stock missiles... they made them in enormous amounts...

    I remember reading them talk about the SA-1, which they stated they made in the 100,000s, and since the early 2000s had used about 13,000 as targets... for which they are still useful.

    From memory the SA-1 was liquid fuelled so they don't really expire... fuel them up and fire them...

    Newer missiles would also be made in enormous numbers and are also used as targets... the SA-8 in particular is command guided so you can launch up to 6 targets from one vehicle and control their flight profile to suit different attacking threats, while the 50kg payload means you can put in some jammer or telemetry equipment if you want to.

    Even old anti tank missiles are used... AT-3s were used to test the Igla against cruise missiles and other low flying small threats... the result was the Igla-S with a proximity fuse for engaging smaller targets.

    I agree, they seem to be using a few SAMs... no thanks to Israeli incursions, but that just speeds them to the point where they will need S-300s or newer systems... Smile

    So what you're saying is older missiles sa-3, sa-8 etc are no longer made but shitloads were made and in storage.

    Obviously syria isn't the only country using older soviet systems so Russia would be a supplier for these missiles to other countries as well. Countries do test/train their AD. And it also depends how they are stored. I wasn't sure if Belarus had the ability to produce Sa-3 or not.

    But S-300 is obviously a better choice. Old stocks of soviet missiles can't last for ever and like u said many types had been used for targets.
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    d_taddei2

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  d_taddei2 on Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:45 pm

    Tingsay wrote:This could backfire.
    If Syrians fuck up again (the IL-20 downing is partly a Syrian fuck up), Israel could be bragging about destroying S-300s.

    No system is perfect. And every system can be overcome. And Russia is now using S-400. The fact remains that the west don't like countries having
    S-300 and they still see it as a serious threat. And any potential buyer of S-300 will know that it's better than what they currently have.


    And on the other hand if it downs or deterrence works against Israeli aircraft then this could boost export sales and interest in S-300 in countries that cannot afford S-400 or countries Russia is only willing to sell S-300 over S-400.
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    calm

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  calm on Mon Sep 24, 2018 2:50 pm



    Sorry i had to. Laughing
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    SeigSoloyvov

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:04 pm

    Okay Calm that one was good, made me laugh.
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  JohninMK on Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:28 pm

    Isos wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:Please can we keep the discussion of Russian aid to Syria in the correct thread? This thread is supposed to be about what the Syrians are doing.

    The supply by Russia of the(se) S-300 seem to meet the description of the other Syria thread.

    Garry, is it possible to move these few posts over there?

    S-300 going to syria is for this thread as its gonna be a syrian system opposed to israeli fighters that support terrorist. It's not russian bringing their own s-300 to protect their base.

    OK I believe you, its going to be a SyAF system operated by the Syrians who are already trained! That means a reduced spec export system in the most highly visible installation anywhere. Do you really think the Russians will do that? Too much depends on it downstream.

    I'd put very good money on this being a maximum spec system operated by Russians for the foreseeable future, surrounded by lots of Syrians pretending that it is theirs.
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Syrian War: News #18

    Post  JohninMK on Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:29 pm

    SeigSoloyvov wrote:Okay Calm that one was good, made me laugh.

    Good comment Smile

    Meanwhile, wonder where that SAA 'stuff' is going.


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