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    "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

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    mack8

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  mack8 on Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:24 pm

    Hi guys,

    Here's a new video of Kinzhal testing here:
    https://www.rt.com/news/420947-russian-hypersonic-missile-tests/


    So what you think, was Kinzhal part of the MiG-31BM upgrade from the get go? Or perhaps the rumour about a MiG-31BM2 standard was refering to this?
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Cyberspec on Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:38 pm

    Same video on Zvezda's Youtube channel




    Isos wrote:According to sputnik Kinzal was tested today on a mig 31. There was 200 flights of mig-31 with it since 2018.

    Over 250 take offs since the start of the year according to the commander in the video. He says the system is in experimental combat deployment and that the unit is capable of attacking targets day and night and in bad weather

    Vann7

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Vann7 on Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:39 am

    Isos wrote:This missile looks like an improved kh-15. They seem to have same flight profile.

    Yep..
    both of them are hypersonic .. and both achieve hypersonic speeds by launching them from very high altitudes.
    Difference is range is way higher for Dagger ,2000km.. versus 300km.. and the speed of Dagger is mach 10.. versus mach 5 of Kh-15 ( NATO name : AS-16 'Kickback') ,it also have other major upgrades.. like plasma . So is more a totally new missile but that use similar tactics.. to achieve its max speed.
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    JohninMK

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  JohninMK on Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:45 am

    Interesting blurring out in that video. Some comments here

    https://twitter.com/JosephHDempsey/status/972585472517197831
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    George1

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  George1 on Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:46 am

    are we sure that Khinzal is only anti-ship missile?
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    Isos

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Isos on Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:58 am

    George1 wrote:are we sure that Khinzal is only anti-ship missile?

    in the very first putin's video they used it against land target. Most of their antiship missile now have lannd attack capabilities so this one too.


    Last edited by Isos on Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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    Isos

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Isos on Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:04 am

    There are weired brown things behind the nose cone. Can it be MHD propulsion? Or something to generate plasma around the missile for stealthness ?
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Cyberspec on Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:08 am

    George1 wrote:are we sure that Khinzal is only anti-ship missile?

    Considering that it's developed from the Iskander and Kh-15, no reason why it couldn't be used against ground targets
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    George1

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  George1 on Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:52 am

    High-precision aviation missile system "Dagger" is designed to destroy land and sea targets.

    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3118102.html
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    GarryB

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  GarryB on Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:02 am

    We can't really say it was developed from the Iskander or the Kh-15... it certainly looks like an Iskander in shape but nothing more...

    The video shows a dark sky during launch so it is clearly launched at very high altitudes... if it is being released at high speed and high altitude and it reaches mach 10 then it clearly has a fully functioning scramjet motor... there is no way a standard ramjet could operate at such speeds.

    Pretty much all their new missiles seem to be multirole so it would not surprise me that there was a land attack model.

    The thing I find interesting is the rather large fairing that falls off the rear just before the main engine starts up...

    Perhaps there is another version of this weapon for slower aircraft like the Tu-22M3 where that large rear portion could be replaced by a solid rocket booster that accelerates the weapon to high altitude and high speed before the main engine starts up... such a weapon would be rather valuable to a Tu-22M3 strike aircraft in a land attack mission... such missiles could be used to deal with major SAM sites and radar bases and comms centres on its way to its target.

    It could probably carry four missiles externally on its external weapon points and in its internal weapon bay it could carry some of those shorter bodied cruise missiles they talked about a while back...

    Interesting.

    Arrow

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Arrow on Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:07 am

    has a fully functioning scramjet motor... there is no way a standard ramjet could operate at such speeds. wrote:

    The missile has no air inlets needed for the scramjet. It looks like it start a rocket engine.
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Cyberspec on Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:06 am

    GarryB wrote:We can't really say it was developed from the Iskander or the Kh-15... it certainly looks like an Iskander in shape but nothing more...

    The video shows a dark sky during launch so it is clearly launched at very high altitudes... if it is being released at high speed and high altitude and it reaches mach 10 then it clearly has a fully functioning scramjet motor... there is no way a standard ramjet could operate at such speeds.

    Some Russian commentators believe so...I saved a small portion from one analysis

    Analyzing the video, we can conclude that the attachment points of rocket "dagger" uses all 4 ventral suspension points intended for A-A missiles R-33 / C, the estimated length of the product corresponds to 6.5-7 meters, body diameter - about 1000-1100 mm.

    The appearance of the missile is similar to the short-range ballistic missile 9M723-1 "Iskander-M", which leads to a probable unification of "Dagger" and "Iskander" in many avionics modules, including: inertial navigation system, a control system (represented by a gyro-stabilized platform and digital FDC), active radar guidance system of the type (video noticeable radome ARGSN perhaps - product 9B918 from the scientific production association "radar MMS"), and a set of controls on the basis of aerodynamic rudders.

    The missile is launched and approaches the target in the startosphere where it's beyond the reach of enemy airdefences. Also the air resistance is low up there enabling the long range of the missile (less fuel is needed). Some are calling it an Aegis killer as it's designed to dive on the target at almost 90 degree angle...apparently the Aegis has trouble locking onto targets approaching from that direction...also the tremendous speed doesn't leave much reaction time

    ---

    Another source regarding land tartgets capabilty..

    Hypersonic missile system that can overcome any missile defense system in minutes. The complex is capable of accurately hitting stationary objects that are protected with concrete, including underground bunkers as well as moving targets....
    http://x-true.info/67519-kinzhal-porazil-zadannuyu-cel-v-hode-puska.html

    william.boutros

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  william.boutros on Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:31 am

    The more interesting news would be whether Russians are flirting with Tu-160 launching of ballistic missiles to circumvent european missile defenses and tu22 for salvo attacks on maritime threats.
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    TheArmenian

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  TheArmenian on Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:13 pm

    Kinzhal is just the beginning.
    There will be a series of Russian hypersonic missiles entering service in the future. One of them will be the Zirkon that will be arming various ships and submarines of the RuNavy.
    The Tu-160M and PAK-DA will certainly have their own arsenal of hypersonic missiles. Same goes with the Tu-22M3. Even the various Su-30,34,35 and 57 will get their share of smaller hypersonic missiles.


    Putin has declassified a few secret weapon systems in is speech on March the 1st.
    We can only guess what remains classified.
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:43 pm

    william.boutros wrote:The more interesting news would be whether Russians are flirting with Tu-160 launching of ballistic missiles to circumvent european missile defenses and tu22 for salvo attacks on maritime threats.


    They do but Kindzhal has one defined task: keep CVSGs at bay.  Tomahawk is like 2,500 km range. Kindzhal 2000km + 700 MiG 31 with high speed and high altitude. So neither escort not fighters have no change to close to Russian shores.





    TheArmenian wrote:Kinzhal is just the beginning.
    There will be a series of Russian hypersonic missiles entering service in the future. One of them will be the Zirkon that will be arming various ships and submarines of the RuNavy.
    The Tu-160M and PAK-DA will certainly have their own arsenal of hypersonic missiles. Same goes with the Tu-22M3. Even the various Su-30,34,35 and 57 will get their share of smaller hypersonic missiles.


    Putin has declassified a few secret weapon systems in is speech on March the 1st.
    We can only guess what remains classified.



    But the best is it DOES NOT fall under any ballistic arms' reduction treaty respekt respekt respekt
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    Isos

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Isos on Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:57 pm

    Now they should invest in satelites and detection tools. I think they have enough carrier killers in their arsenal.
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    zg18

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  zg18 on Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:59 pm

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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:03 pm

    Well I forgot about nuclear warhead for Kindzhal - with 2000 can reach almost to Benelux and from territory of Belorussia UK and France. Without any INF limitations Very Happy:D:D



    Isos wrote:Now they should invest in satellites and detection tools. I think they have enough carrier killers in their arsenal.

    Who they? Russians?
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    Isos

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  Isos on Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:27 pm

    Who they? Russians?

    Who else ? Of course russia.
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    GunshipDemocracy

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  GunshipDemocracy on Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:44 pm

    Isos wrote:
    Who they? Russians?

    Who else ? Of course russia.


    1) They do, all the time

    2) Kindzhal is in fact MRBM without treaty limitations
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    George1

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  George1 on Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:58 am

    Appears that Kinzhal makes use of MiG31's R-33 (Izdeliye 410 / NATO AA-9 Amos) AKU-410 panto-graphic ejector racks.

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    PapaDragon

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:02 pm

    George1 wrote:.............

    Okay, people keep saying how this missile has no air intakes but then what are those red things on it?

    When you account for guidance system and warhead that is exactly where intakes would be located.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:34 pm

    They may be sensors instead. Otherwise, I don't see reason for it to be covered.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:26 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:They may be sensors instead. Otherwise, I don't see reason for it to be covered.

    Intakes are always covered, same goes for jet engines
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: "Kinzhal" hypersonic aviation-missile complex

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:50 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:They may be sensors instead. Otherwise, I don't see reason for it to be covered.

    Intakes are always covered, same goes for jet engines

    Yes, I seem to recall now that covers for intakes are red.

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