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    Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

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    gaurav

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  gaurav on Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:34 pm

    Vladimir79 wrote:It clearly stalled out .. why ..??

    That I am not sure .What I am sure is that Antonov fleet has to be disbanded. It was very old air frame , old aircraft and most of the problems
    occur during landing. Many of the problems are removed if the aircraft is bought new . Any average person can tell that.
    TU-154 I donno what precautions Russian airforce are taking to fly that aircraft. But clearly the fleet needs renewal .
    Transport aviation is the weakest link of Russian army and they need to look into that.
    They are sacrificing precious Russian army officers by continuing to fly this Antonov fleets.

    They can keep AN-148 but ..other Antonov s need to be done away with. Every blame will be put into pilots when they are not responsible.
    when Russia is already facing population (reverse pressure) and too much attention is being payed into Russian deaths ..
    in that environment Russian army must quickly take decisive measure in securing transport fleet.

    This same incident with China nobody asks .. because they have huge population. Chinese air force would be thinking maybe we can have couple more of such crashes.

    It seems that CIA crashed that saratov airlines AN -148 but this an-26 was just a fatigue , spent air frame.


    Russian rocket engg says that we can look into satellite crash from every theory ..but had it been a new launcher then there wouldnt be any problem

    Karl hausofer wrote:Why are Russian roads more dangerous than Finnish roads even when there is a similar climate in these countries? It's the mentality of people.
    Bang on target. Correct
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    ultimatewarrior

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  ultimatewarrior on Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:46 pm

    A couple of months ago a Su-24 crashed near Khmeimim at both crew were martyred. What Russia should do is stop flying decades old planes. Give all Su-24 to SAA and fly only Su-34. Should have been done a long time ago.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  miketheterrible on Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:46 pm

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Vladimir79 wrote:
    gaurav wrote:
    MikeTerrible wrote:People here thinking it was shot down. Very stupid. Plus, iets a 30 year old antanov....

    Mann absolutely correct .
    Everyone is thinking it was shot down. no mann very old airframe .. almost fully spent aircraft
    still in active duty what do you expect . We need Russ gov to regularly check RDF for updates/policy guidance .Only then they will start spending on aviation platforms and get them on active duty in Russian army.

    It clearly stalled out, the question is why?  
    Why are Russian roads more dangerous than Finnish roads even when there is a similar climate in these countries? It's the mentality of people.

    Are they? How do you know? Which roads? From where?

    I also figure you never figured out the difference between Finland and Russia. Hint: size and population.

    Guarantee you there are more paved roads in Russia than Finland. Also guarantee you that those are also newely paved roads.
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    gaurav

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  gaurav on Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:50 pm

    Ultimatewarrior wrote:A couple of months ago a Su-24 crashed near Khmeimim at both crew were martyred. What Russia should do is stop flying decades old planes. Give all Su-24 to SAA and fly only Su-34. Should have been done a long time ago

    Bang on target Cool
    Exactly only 2 pilots were killed and Syrian war was in cold phase so nobody was paying attention.
    But now everyone is paying attention.. the top echelon Russian officer core has been wiped out
    now the heat is being felt by Russ gov. and of course Russ elections are near and Putin must be feeling the heat.

    Karl Haushofer

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:17 pm

    gaurav wrote:the top echelon Russian officer core has been wiped out
    How do you know? Have the names of deceased been released?

    Karl Haushofer

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:19 pm

    Major general Vladimir Eremeev is among the dead.

    https://lenta.ru/news/2018/03/06/general_mo/
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    gaurav

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  gaurav on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:22 pm

    Mini WW2 loss .. always Russia ..

    MAGA MAKE Antonov Great Again from Putin ..

    RECORD Breaking 27 Russian officers wiped out

    AN-26 crash

    At the An-26 in Syria, 27 Russian officers were killed, including Major-General - the Russian Defense Ministry
    03/06/2018 22:59:24
         *** There were no civilians on board
         
          (Added 4th paragraph)
         
          Moscow. March, 6. INTERFAX-AVN - In the wake of the An-26 crash in Syria, 27 officers, including a major general, were killed, the Russian Defense Ministry reported.
          "As a result of the tragedy, 27 officers were killed, one of them in the rank of Major-General, as well as ensigns and servicemen of the contract service," the Defense Ministry said.

    Karl Haushofer

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:22 pm

    So what know? It appears that Russia paid a terrible price today for flying these outdated aircraft.

    Will Russia learn? And why is it that every time something catastrophic like this has to happen before action is taken?

    It happened in 1941 too. Stalin was at sleep while the Germany was invading USSR. His sleep cost USSR millions of lives.

    And now? Will the sleep continue after losing these officers?


    Last edited by Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:24 pm; edited 1 time in total

    Karl Haushofer

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:23 pm

    gaurav wrote:Mini WW2 loss .. always Russia ..

    MAGA MAKE Antonov Great Again from Putin ..

    RECORD Breaking 27 Russian officers wiped out

    AN-26 crash

    At the An-26 in Syria, 27 Russian officers were killed, including Major-General - the Russian Defense Ministry
    03/06/2018 22:59:24
         *** There were no civilians on board
         
          (Added 4th paragraph)
         
          Moscow. March, 6. INTERFAX-AVN - In the wake of the An-26 crash in Syria, 27 officers, including a major general, were killed, the Russian Defense Ministry reported.
          "As a result of the tragedy, 27 officers were killed, one of them in the rank of Major-General, as well as ensigns and servicemen of the contract service," the Defense Ministry said.

    Shoigu's head should roll.

    Karl Haushofer

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:25 pm

    Russia's central bank is using its currency to buy US dollars instead of safe planes to Russian army.

    Vann7

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Vann7 on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:26 pm

    Vladimir79 wrote:

    It clearly stalled out, the question is why?  



    Yep.. it was too slow.. that looks more like a pilot error..
    The plane was even far from the landing road. and in the wrong angle ? So either the pilot fall asleep ,
    or he mistakenly lower too much the speed .

    and in the last second the plane lose energy and collapse.. So it was not a manpad.. or a missile.
    Looks pretty much like Pilot error..  and Russia military that will need to retrain the pilots ,how to land
    in Syria airbase, Poor people inside..  The tower control , even when i dont know Russian , was yelling
    at the pilot what it seems to be ,you are too low or raise the nose .. or something of the like.  and
    the pilot did nothing.  So looks as if the pilot very amateur mistake..  perhaps the plane was too heavy
    with cargo and the pilot mistakenly lower the speed too much..and bang.

    People that have some experience with realistic simulations of planes flight , knows..that in landing ..
    there is a limit minimum speed ,that you can't cross to early. and if you go below it.. the Plane will lose control and fall like a Rock.  And this minimum speed for landing and angle of landing is not the same always ,depend on how
    heavy is the plane ,how much people and cargo ,if it is full or empty.  To save the plane he had to accelerate the plane dramatically and lift the nose to abort the landing and retry the landing from a correct angle..

    So is really rare ,why he didn't raise the nose.. when he was so far from the landing road. Maybe he was very inexperienced or controls got stuck and could not lift the plane angle. he could even saved people if he land on the wing first ,so it takes most of the impact. I have seen videos of 747 Boeign Pilots ,landing with all engines broken ,on its belly.. sliding and saving most people in the plane.. So this landing seemed as if the pilot fall asleep. Because
    he not even tried to save the plane.



    Last edited by Vann7 on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:41 pm; edited 2 times in total

    Karl Haushofer

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:32 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Vladimir79 wrote:
    gaurav wrote:
    MikeTerrible wrote:People here thinking it was shot down. Very stupid. Plus, iets a 30 year old antanov....

    Mann absolutely correct .
    Everyone is thinking it was shot down. no mann very old airframe .. almost fully spent aircraft
    still in active duty what do you expect . We need Russ gov to regularly check RDF for updates/policy guidance .Only then they will start spending on aviation platforms and get them on active duty in Russian army.

    It clearly stalled out, the question is why?  
    Why are Russian roads more dangerous than Finnish roads even when there is a similar climate in these countries? It's the mentality of people.

    Are they? How do you know? Which roads? From where?

    I also figure you never figured out the difference between Finland and Russia. Hint: size and population.

    Guarantee you there are more paved roads in Russia than Finland. Also guarantee you that those are also newely paved roads.

    Road fatalities per 100,000 vehicles per year:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate

    Russia: 53.4
    Finland: 4.4
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    gaurav

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  gaurav on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:39 pm

    Aircraft should be capable enough to do what the pilot is trying to do even with overload ..(slight overload) ..
    This plane was just not responding to anything .. any pilot cmds ..it was falling like a rock from start ..

    Vann7

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Vann7 on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:47 pm

    gaurav wrote:Aircraft should be capable enough to do what the pilot is trying to do even with overload ..(slight overload) ..
    This plane was just not responding to anything .. any pilot cmds ..it was falling like a rock from start ..

    if he manage to get close to the base.. it means the controls did worked.. and the pilot was in control of the plane.
    He simply enters in the wrong angle at the base and fly too slow. So looks like a real amateur mistake..because he does not do anything when told to lift the plane.. or maybe engines lost all power in the last few seconds..

    For now is clear it was not shot down as some believed.. which was not impossible ,knowing how hostile NATO is
    against Russia lately. it remains to be seen if it was pilot error as if look ,poor training.. or if plane lost all fuel about the time he was about to land.
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    Neutrality

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  Neutrality on Tue Mar 06, 2018 10:54 pm

    The amount of verbal diarrhoea in this thread is crazy. Some guys here are complete loonies.

    "WW2 mini loss" , "Stalin was sleep while USSR was being invaded".

    If you need the proper medication, please seek your closest physician.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #12

    Post  GarryB on Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:38 am

    For now is clear it was not shot down as some believed.. which was not impossible ,knowing how hostile NATO is
    against Russia lately. it remains to be seen if it was pilot error as if look ,poor training.. or if plane lost all fuel about the time he was about to land.

    You don't know how much I wish you had been the pilot Vann... you would have saved the day... or died trying like the actual pilot did.

    RIP to the crew and passengers, and apologies to any who are offended by the vulture trolls who use such tragedies to push their agenda that Russia should bankrupt herself and buy all new crash proof planes and vehicles and Putin needs to be replaced by someone less soft on Russias enemies like Uncle Joe Stalin...

    He would sort everyone out by killing half the population to make the other half behave... scratch that will save lives...


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