Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Share
    avatar
    The Ottoman

    Posts : 187
    Points : 211
    Join date : 2015-09-25

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  The Ottoman on Mon Sep 18, 2017 4:37 pm

    Ankara Confirms Agreement with Baghdad on Iraq’s Unity

    Saeed Abdelrazek
    41 mins ago 14





    Ankara- Turkish reactions rejecting the referendum on the independence of Kurdistan region of Iraq, which is scheduled for next Monday, have continued. At a time when Ankara continued its warnings, hundreds of Turks and Turkmen demonstrated in Istanbul Sunday, rejecting the separation of the region. President Erdogan said at a press conference, before leaving Istanbul to the United States to attend the 72nd session of the United Nations General Assembly (UNGA), that Iraq and Turkey are on the same page as it comes to the issue of the protection of Iraq’s unity.

    Both countries have expressed in clear terms that they are opposed to Erbil’s plans to vote on whether to leave Iraq on September 25.

    Erdogan told reporters: “We will hold a separate meeting with Iraqi Premier Haidar al-Abadi, but as far as I see, we are looking in the same direction. What is this direction? The territorial integrity of Iraq.”

    The president said Turkey shares a 350-kilometer (217-mile) long border with Iraq, adding that both countries belong to the same civilization.

    Erdogan warned northern Iraq’s Kurdish Regional Government President Masoud Barzani again against holding a referendum on independence.

    “You knock our door and get any kind of support when you are in trouble, but you go your own way when it comes to the disintegration of Iraq.”

    He also said Turkey’s National Security Council and Council of Ministers will convene the same day on 22 September to discuss the referendum issue and will make a decision demonstrating the “ultimate stance” of the country on it.

    The referendum issue will also top the agenda during his meeting with US President Donald Trump, he added.

    https://english.aawsat.com/saeed-abdelrazek/news-middle-east/ankara-confirms-agreement-baghdad-iraqs-unity
    avatar
    Airman

    Posts : 392
    Points : 440
    Join date : 2016-10-15
    Location : Turkey

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Airman on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:12 pm

    Turkish army launches drill on Iraqi border ahead of KRG referendum













    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 11422
    Points : 11901
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  George1 on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:17 pm

    Ηοw Turkey will confront Israel now? Laughing


    _________________
    "There's no smoke without fire.", Georgy Zhukov

    avatar
    KiloGolf

    Posts : 2450
    Points : 2464
    Join date : 2015-09-01
    Location : Macedonia, Hellas

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  KiloGolf on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:22 pm

    Airman wrote:

    Trying to fit as much random kit in one frame lol1

    avatar
    Airman

    Posts : 392
    Points : 440
    Join date : 2016-10-15
    Location : Turkey

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Airman on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:46 pm

    It's a good platform for all kind of things such as Surface-to-air and Anti-tank missiles.





    avatar
    Airman

    Posts : 392
    Points : 440
    Join date : 2016-10-15
    Location : Turkey

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Airman on Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:32 am

    Turkish army expands the military drills in Habur-Silopi area.









    avatar
    Godric

    Posts : 546
    Points : 568
    Join date : 2015-04-30
    Location : Alba (Scotland)

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Godric on Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:19 pm

    Today they are calling for a Kurdish Iraq/Syria state ... tomorrow they could include Turkey and Iran that is why Turkey should tell the Israelis to mind their ain business
    avatar
    starman

    Posts : 189
    Points : 189
    Join date : 2016-08-10

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  starman on Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:15 pm

    par far wrote:
    "IRAQI VICE PRESIDENT: WE WILL NOT TOLERATE “ANOTHER ISRAEL” IN NORTHERN IRAQ."

    Very good to hear this. But if al-Maliki is speaking for Iran too, surely it'll do more than just close the border. Or maybe Turkey will do what's necessary. And that could lead to conflict with the Kurds of Syria too. Assad would be grateful. Smile Who knows, maybe by mid 2018 Syria and Iraq will be remarkably unified considering the situation now.
    avatar
    The Ottoman

    Posts : 187
    Points : 211
    Join date : 2015-09-25

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  The Ottoman on Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:24 pm

    A Kurdish state will erupt chaos in Turkey, Iraq, Iran and Syria.

    Thats 4 'potential' enemies less for Israel in the region.


    Turkey has 2 options with the same outcome:

    1.- Attack the new Kurdish Republic, and face a massive counter-attack from the United States.

    2.- Do nothing, and still face a massive attack from the United States.


    In both ways, the delivery of the S400 would be to late, also the massproduction of the domestic Turkish state-of-the-art-weapons (Altay tank, TFX fighterplane etc).

    Turkey will suffer and teared apart under a heavy rain of MOAB's. And Russia will lose another 'strategic' partner.

    This is written in the prophecy.

    avatar
    starman

    Posts : 189
    Points : 189
    Join date : 2016-08-10

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  starman on Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:46 pm

    The Ottoman wrote:A Kurdish state will erupt chaos in Turkey, Iraq, Iran and Syria.

    Thats 4 'potential' enemies less for Israel in the region.

    Right--Israel's real motivation.

    Turkey has 2 options with the same outcome:

    1.- Attack the new Kurdish Republic, and face a massive counter-attack from the United States.

    Sounds crazy. The US attacking Turkey??! The US has invested a lot in the Kurds but nobody in his right mind would alienate Turkey as well as Iraq and Iran, by backing them in a conflict.
    avatar
    The Ottoman

    Posts : 187
    Points : 211
    Join date : 2015-09-25

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  The Ottoman on Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:01 am

    starman wrote:

    Sounds crazy. The US attacking Turkey??! The US has invested a lot in the Kurds but nobody in his right mind would alienate Turkey as well as Iraq and Iran, by backing them in a conflict.

    Yes, all the classic signals are moving toward an US-attack at Turkey.

    If Turkey was not a NATO-member, this attack was already accomplished.

    After the Syrian peace-process, the Pentagon has 3 targets left: North Korea, Iran and Turkey. And Turkey is the most likely target.

    I sea in the Western media the same campaign against Turkey/Erdogan as the campaign against Iraq/Saddam.

    Dont forget that Saddam Hussain was a 'modern, loyal' servant of the US in the '80's and he was used against the Iran/Khomeini. And after that he wasn't needed anymore and the blackmail-campaign against him started.

    Turkey was also a good and loyal US ally and is used against Assad/Syria.

    And now I see the same blackmailing-campaign in the Western Media: ''Erdogan is a bloodthirsty dictator'' & ''Innocent people jailed in Turkey'' & ''Turkey is transorming to a sharia-state'' & ''Stop EU-negotiations'' & ''Turkey is pulling East to Russia'' & ''Dismember them from NATO'' & ''Sanction Turkey'' etc
    avatar
    Big_Gazza

    Posts : 1139
    Points : 1149
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Big_Gazza on Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:41 am

    The Ottoman wrote:
    starman wrote:

    Sounds crazy. The US attacking Turkey??! The US has invested a lot in the Kurds but nobody in his right mind would alienate Turkey as well as Iraq and Iran, by backing them in a conflict.

    Yes, all the classic signals are moving toward an US-attack at Turkey.

    If Turkey was not a NATO-member, this attack was already accomplished.

    After the Syrian peace-process, the Pentagon has 3 targets left: North Korea, Iran and Turkey. And Turkey is the most likely target.

    I sea in the Western media the same campaign against Turkey/Erdogan as the campaign against Iraq/Saddam.

    Dont forget that Saddam Hussain was a 'modern, loyal' servant of the US in the '80's and he was used against the Iran/Khomeini. And after that he wasn't needed anymore and the blackmail-campaign against him started.

    Turkey was also a good and loyal US ally and is used against Assad/Syria.

    And now I see the same blackmailing-campaign in the Western Media: ''Erdogan is a bloodthirsty dictator'' & ''Innocent people jailed in Turkey'' & ''Turkey is transorming to a sharia-state'' & ''Stop EU-negotiations'' & ''Turkey is pulling East to Russia'' & ''Dismember them from NATO'' & ''Sanction Turkey'' etc

    You're totally barmy.... The US attack Turkey, a NATO member and a nominally pro-Western democratic large nation controlling the access to the Black Sea? To support some hypothetical Kurdistan?

    That would be an effective way to collapse NATO and drive Turkey into a strategic relationship with Russia and her ME allies. Even the neo-con troglodytes are not as fucking stupid as that....
    avatar
    starman

    Posts : 189
    Points : 189
    Join date : 2016-08-10

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  starman on Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:58 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    That would be an effective way to collapse NATO and drive Turkey into a strategic relationship with Russia and her ME allies.  Even the neo-con troglodytes are not as fucking stupid as that....

    Right so the bottom line is, the US won't stop a Turkish attempt to thwart Kurdish independence. I hope that if Turkey intervenes it'll improve its relations with Iran and Assad, who also oppose independence, and cause a wider rift between Turkey and Israel, as the latter favors it.
    avatar
    Godric

    Posts : 546
    Points : 568
    Join date : 2015-04-30
    Location : Alba (Scotland)

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Godric on Wed Sep 20, 2017 2:04 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    The Ottoman wrote:
    starman wrote:

    Sounds crazy. The US attacking Turkey??! The US has invested a lot in the Kurds but nobody in his right mind would alienate Turkey as well as Iraq and Iran, by backing them in a conflict.

    Yes, all the classic signals are moving toward an US-attack at Turkey.

    If Turkey was not a NATO-member, this attack was already accomplished.

    After the Syrian peace-process, the Pentagon has 3 targets left: North Korea, Iran and Turkey. And Turkey is the most likely target.

    I sea in the Western media the same campaign against Turkey/Erdogan as the campaign against Iraq/Saddam.

    Dont forget that Saddam Hussain was a 'modern, loyal' servant of the US in the '80's and he was used against the Iran/Khomeini. And after that he wasn't needed anymore and the blackmail-campaign against him started.

    Turkey was also a good and loyal US ally and is used against Assad/Syria.

    And now I see the same blackmailing-campaign in the Western Media: ''Erdogan is a bloodthirsty dictator'' & ''Innocent people jailed in Turkey'' & ''Turkey is transorming to a sharia-state'' & ''Stop EU-negotiations'' & ''Turkey is pulling East to Russia'' & ''Dismember them from NATO'' & ''Sanction Turkey'' etc

    You're totally barmy....  The US attack Turkey, a NATO member and a nominally pro-Western democratic  large nation controlling the access to the Black Sea?  To support some hypothetical Kurdistan?

    That would be an effective way to collapse NATO and drive Turkey into a strategic relationship with Russia and her ME allies.  Even the neo-con troglodytes are not as fucking stupid as that....
    %

    trump has already made it clear he is at the end of his tether with NATO over the 2% scenario ... the reality is America is not only trying to destabilise Turkey it's doing the same to the EU ... if the EU falls a potential enemy is eliminated and America would end up exerting more control over the broken up EU and full control over Turkey
    avatar
    The Ottoman

    Posts : 187
    Points : 211
    Join date : 2015-09-25

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  The Ottoman on Wed Sep 20, 2017 3:18 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:

    You're totally barmy....  The US attack Turkey, a NATO member and a nominally pro-Western democratic  large nation controlling the access to the Black Sea?  To support some hypothetical Kurdistan?

    That would be an effective way to collapse NATO and drive Turkey into a strategic relationship with Russia and her ME allies.  Even the neo-con troglodytes are not as fucking stupid as that....

    That ''hypothetical Kurdistan'' is not just a hypothetical Kurdistan. It is the startfire, the beginstap for a Great-Israel from the Euphrates to the Nile.

    Its not a coincendence that everywhere between the Euphrates and the Nile there are ISIS-problems.

    Thats the reason why Israel said that they are thinking about a militairy intervention in East-Syria and thats why they are supporting the new Kurdish state.

    The courtcase again Reza Zarab, one of Erdogan's best friends and financial dude, is starting this october. They said that Erdogan's friends and ministers traded goods with Iran via US banks and in US dollars, despite the sanctions against Iran.

    If Turkey/Erdogan is guilty, then the US will kick them out of NATO and attack them.

    Lot of gains/resources/money in Turkey. A potential Israëli enemy less and the control of US ships in the Black Sea will give the Pentagan an orgasm.
    avatar
    JohninMK

    Posts : 5897
    Points : 5962
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  JohninMK on Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:47 pm



    On September 20, Iraqi Kurdistan Region President Masoud Barzani said at a public event in Suleiman city that there is “unfortunately no alternatives” offered by any side to replace the upcoming Kurdistan Region independence referendum on September 25.

    “Referendum is to reach a sacred objective, that is independence,” Barzani said at the event.

    Barzani also claimed that there will be post-independence talks with the Iraqi Federal Government backed by the international community to negotiate terms for Kurdistan leaving Iraq. Barzani claimed that such negotiation might take up to 2 years.

    Barzani claims about a “post-independence negotiations” are not backed by any facts. It’s highly unlikely that the Iraqi Federal Government would agree to such negations to give the Kurdistan Region its independence now.

    Some experts believe that, due the current worldwide support especially by Turkey and Iran, the Iraqi Federal Government may actually consider a military action against the newly formed Kurdish state.

    In a related development, Saudi official told the official Saudi Press Agency (SPA) on September 20, that Saudi Arabia “looks to the wisdom of President Barzani in not holding the referendum”. By this Saudi Arabia joined other regional countries in standing against the upcoming referendum.

    Moreover, the official warned that the referendum could lead to “negative consequences on the political, security and humanitarian fronts” in the region. The Saudi official called for negotiation between the Iraqi Federal Government and the Kurdistan Region Government to solve these issues.

    With the US, Turkey, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria and the Iraqi Federal Goverement all in the same front against the upcoming Kurdistan Region independence referendum, things for sure are getting harder for Barzani.


    https://southfront.org/iraqi-kurdistan-presndent-no-alternatives-for-independence-referendum/#sthash.xxug94gX.uxfs
    avatar
    starman

    Posts : 189
    Points : 189
    Join date : 2016-08-10

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  starman on Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:50 pm

    JohninMK wrote:
    Some experts believe that, due the current worldwide support especially by Turkey and Iran, the Iraqi Federal Government may actually consider a military action against the newly formed Kurdish state.

    "May actually consider military action"--they had better take it if they don't want Kurdistan permanently lost. Even if the Iraqis doubt the ability of their own forces to beat the Kurds they can ask for Iranian and Turkish help.



    With the US, Turkey, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Syria and the Iraqi Federal Goverement all in the same front against the upcoming Kurdistan Region independence referendum, things for sure are getting harder for Barzani.[/i]

    For a long time I had thought the Iraqi shiites were foolish to side with the Kurds against the sunnis. The Kurds don't relate to a united Iraq, want their own state hence shouldn't have been trusted. This new development may help reconcile the shiites and sunnis, as they both oppose the kurds. I hope so; it'll mean a better unified and stronger Iraq.
    avatar
    The Ottoman

    Posts : 187
    Points : 211
    Join date : 2015-09-25

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  The Ottoman on Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:02 pm

    The jews (Clinton, Albright) first broke up Yugoslavia by supporting the Croats and Bosnians against the Serbs, and now the jews (Netanyahu, Lieberman) are breaking Iraq by supporting the Kurds.
    avatar
    starman

    Posts : 189
    Points : 189
    Join date : 2016-08-10

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  starman on Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:20 pm

    The Ottoman wrote:The jews (Clinton, Albright)

    Clinton was no jew but I suppose it doesn't really matter here in the land of ZOG....


    and now the jews (Netanyahu, Lieberman) are breaking Iraq by supporting the Kurds.

    I don't think the Kurds got their idea of independence from them, or that jew support is a decisive factor. I think the effort is doomed to failure.
    avatar
    Airman

    Posts : 392
    Points : 440
    Join date : 2016-10-15
    Location : Turkey

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Airman on Thu Sep 21, 2017 5:17 pm

    Turkish army’s drill on Iraqi border enters fourth day
    avatar
    Airman

    Posts : 392
    Points : 440
    Join date : 2016-10-15
    Location : Turkey

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Airman on Fri Sep 22, 2017 7:40 pm

    avatar
    SeigSoloyvov

    Posts : 968
    Points : 972
    Join date : 2016-04-08

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Sat Sep 23, 2017 12:31 am

    Military action is the only action that will work the kurds will not hand over any land unless you crawl over their dead bodies.

    That is the reality of the situation.
    avatar
    Airman

    Posts : 392
    Points : 440
    Join date : 2016-10-15
    Location : Turkey

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Airman on Sat Sep 23, 2017 8:06 am

    M60A3's with SLAT Armor on the Iraqi border

    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 17957
    Points : 18531
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  GarryB on Sat Sep 23, 2017 8:14 am


    Right so the bottom line is, the US won't stop a Turkish attempt to thwart Kurdish independence.

    They haven't in the past...

    You're totally barmy.... The US attack Turkey, a NATO member and a nominally pro-Western democratic large nation controlling the access to the Black Sea? To support some hypothetical Kurdistan?

    Not to mention those US nuclear weapons currently stored in Turkey...

    Military action is the only action that will work the kurds will not hand over any land unless you crawl over their dead bodies.

    That is the reality of the situation.

    The Americans have a long history of "support" that turned out to be empty promises... they got shia Iraqis to rise up against saddam and hung them out to dry when saddam reacted just after desert storm. They did the same to the minority tribes that helped them in Vietnam and they will do the same to the Kurds...


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    KiloGolf

    Posts : 2450
    Points : 2464
    Join date : 2015-09-01
    Location : Macedonia, Hellas

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:56 am

    Airman wrote:

    Civvies doing all the heavy engineering lifting.
    The Turkish Army must be crippled after last year's coup attempt.

    Airman wrote:M60A3's with SLAT Armor on the Iraqi border


    They went with IKEA, good luck with that lol1
    Just make sure not to engage SAA, as good ol' hobo T-62M, let alone a T-72, can trash all that.

    Sponsored content

    Re: Iraqi Kurdistan Independence: Drivers and Regional Implications

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Mon May 28, 2018 7:02 am