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    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2

    PapaDragon
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    Post  PapaDragon on Mon May 01, 2017 9:19 pm


    Superjet net orders and deliveries (cumulative by year) as of 31 March 2017:

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 0db8e5cc2dea821d95d836e4db867987

    As you can see they already cleared 300 unit break-even number of orders, now they need to reach 300 units manufactured.

    Stretch version will be nice addition.
    kvs
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    Post  kvs on Mon May 01, 2017 10:04 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Superjet net orders and deliveries (cumulative by year) as of 31 March 2017:

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 0db8e5cc2dea821d95d836e4db867987

    As you can see they already cleared 300 unit break-even number of orders, now they need to reach 300 units manufactured.

    Stretch version will be nice addition.

    Oh my, 384 units after 10 years. I wonder what it will be like after 20?

    Recall this post:

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t1054p775-russian-civil-aviation-news#78327



    Kyo wrote:

    GORKI (Moscow Region), January 26 (Sputnik) – Russia plans to sell up to 1,000 MC-21 mid-range passenger jets within the next 20 years, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin said Monday. “The Irkut company plans to sell up to 1,000 of these planes over the next 20 years and we already have 175 solid orders,” Rogozin said during a meeting with Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev outside Moscow.

    This is just political posturing. While I'm sure they'll manufacture a couple hundred aircraft within 20 years, I'm just as sure it won't be 1,000. Not only is the market already heavily-saturated with competition, that competition includes long-proven products from Boeing and Airbus.

    Rogozin is prone to blustering anyway..

    Nobody wants Russian junk. LOL.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Tue May 02, 2017 1:00 am


    If nothing goes sideways MS-21 will be hitting some very decent numbers. It is a product that has some very tangible advantages over the competition (composite wings, passenger space, economy....)

    Superjet is sweet aircraft but it is pretty standard when it comes to features. Only real advantage is price. Still it is pulling it's weight. It will definitely leave it's mark in history of airliners.

    Also, one of Superjet's potential competitors (Mitsubishi Regional Jet ) has his some development problems recently:
    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2582480.html
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    Austin

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    Post  Austin on Tue May 02, 2017 5:53 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Superjet net orders and deliveries (cumulative by year) as of 31 March 2017:

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 0db8e5cc2dea821d95d836e4db867987

    As you can see they already cleared 300 unit break-even number of orders, now they need to reach 300 units manufactured.

    Stretch version will be nice addition.

    I am not sure if those data are correct , This one show 127 SSJ in Total has been produced till date

    http://superjet100.info/registry-english
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    Post  marat on Tue May 02, 2017 8:07 am

    kvs wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    Superjet net orders and deliveries (cumulative by year) as of 31 March 2017:

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 0db8e5cc2dea821d95d836e4db867987

    As you can see they already cleared 300 unit break-even number of orders, now they need to reach 300 units manufactured.

    Stretch version will be nice addition.

    Oh my, 384 units after 10 years.   I wonder what it will be like after 20?

    Recall this post:

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t1054p775-russian-civil-aviation-news#78327




    They produced  and delivered about 100+ in first 10 years, so post was right hundreds in first 20 years but not 1.000.


    Kyo wrote:
       
    GORKI (Moscow Region), January 26 (Sputnik) – Russia plans to sell up to 1,000 MC-21 mid-range passenger jets within the next 20 years, Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin said Monday.  “The Irkut company plans to sell up to 1,000 of these planes over the next 20 years and we already have 175 solid orders,” Rogozin said during a meeting with Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev outside Moscow.

    This is just political posturing. While I'm sure they'll manufacture a couple hundred aircraft within 20 years, I'm just as sure it won't be 1,000. Not only is the market already heavily-saturated with competition, that competition includes long-proven products from Boeing and Airbus.

    Rogozin is prone to blustering anyway..

    Nobody wants Russian junk.  LOL.

    But he was right. In first 10 years they have delivered slighty more then 100 of SSJ. And they will not produce 900 in next 10 years that is for sure. This year maybee they will have 30-35 newly produced SSJ.

    And last year they have just 20 new orders, that is quite bad.


    Last edited by marat on Tue May 02, 2017 8:14 am; edited 2 times in total
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    Post  marat on Tue May 02, 2017 8:12 am

    Austin wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    Superjet net orders and deliveries (cumulative by year) as of 31 March 2017:

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 0db8e5cc2dea821d95d836e4db867987

    As you can see they already cleared 300 unit break-even number of orders, now they need to reach 300 units manufactured.

    Stretch version will be nice addition.

    I am not sure if those data are correct , This one show 127 SSJ in Total has been produced till date

    http://superjet100.info/registry-english

    One information is about produced and another about delivered, there is a difference. After production sometimes months have to past in testing and costomisation befor they delevered plane to the costumer.
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    Austin

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    Post  Austin on Tue May 02, 2017 8:20 am

    IIRC the break even for SukhoiSuperjet was 180 Aircraft , So post that Sukhoi would be making handsome returns on this program.

    I wonder why Sukhoi is not trying to first capture the CIS market with SSJ and MS-21 program besides their own internal market that would easily translate to more than 600 -1000 aircraft
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    Post  marat on Tue May 02, 2017 8:34 am

    I think that main problem is maintenace network. Boing Airbus and even Embraer have several decades of creating maintenance network around the globe. So companies know that all malfunctions on their jets could be fixed in minimum time no matter where their jet is.

    Sukhoi is new in this business and very small number of companies use their jets for now and therefore there is huge gaps in globe wihout any maintenace facilities for SSJ.

    MS 21 will have the same problem.
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    Post  kvs on Tue May 02, 2017 11:09 pm

    marat wrote:

    But he was right. In first 10 years they have delivered slighty more then 100 of SSJ. And they will not produce 900 in next 10 years that is for sure. This year maybee they will have 30-35 newly produced SSJ.

    And last year they have just 20 new orders, that is quite bad.

    What the hell are you smoking. The 384 figure is the actual order book. No company ignores their order book.
    And regardless of your semantics, if you are going to count only the aircraft produced then 10 years is not
    valid and the more correct figure is under six years since the 5 years are just the bootstrap phase.
    So 20 years does not start in 2007.

    The clown I quoted is debunked on the basis of the posted figures. But this is an extrapolation to the MC-21
    which he alleges will never exceed 1000 units. Your basic "proof" by assertion.

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    Post  Svyatoslavich on Tue May 02, 2017 11:16 pm

    marat wrote:I think that main problem is maintenace network. Boing Airbus and even Embraer have several decades of creating maintenance network around the globe. So companies know that all malfunctions on their jets could be fixed in minimum time no matter where their jet is.

    Sukhoi is new in this business and very small number of companies use their jets for now and therefore there is huge gaps in globe wihout any maintenace facilities for  SSJ.

    MS 21 will have the same problem.
    Boeing is a partner of Sukhoi Civil Aircraft (SCA) for customer support outside of CIS. Mexico's Interjet (the second biggest customer of the type, after Aeroflot) has been operating the SSJ for many years with an impressive availability rate (above 99%), which puts it on a par with both Boeing and Airbus aircraft. So this is not a problem anymore.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Wed May 03, 2017 12:07 am


    UAC is working on developing maintenance network globally for MS-21.

    This is not something that they neglected even though it is not covered as much in the media.
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    Post  miketheterrible on Wed May 03, 2017 2:56 am

    So they are getting close to the 400 order range. Very impressive, for Sukhois first civil aircraft. Austin is right, break even was 180 (aircraft and engines) so the next 200 aircraft is just icing on top of this cake.

    Anyway, as I mentioned before, the government is looking at setting up a cheap regional airline company and they will order specifically SSJ's. I imagine they will for MS-21 as well.
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    Post  Austin on Wed May 03, 2017 4:46 am

    kvs wrote:What the hell are you smoking.   The 384 figure is the actual order book.   No company ignores their order book.  

    I think they are hard and soft orders , Last time Putin mentioned Superjet had an order of 150 aircraft

    But even I am looking for this data on actual order of Sukhoi Superjet .seems hard to find
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    Post  JohninMK on Wed May 03, 2017 9:25 pm

    03 May, 2017 SOURCE: Flightglobal Pro BY: David Kaminski-Morrow London

    Italian aerospace firm Leonardo has cut its shareholding in the SuperJet International joint venture to a minority.

    SuperJet International is responsible for selling the Russian-built Sukhoi Superjet 100 to Western markets and offering aftersales service for the type.

    Leonardo, which formerly held 51% of the Venice-based venture, confirms its current stake is just 10%. It also confirms the 90% majority is owned by the "other shareholder" in the venture, namely Russia's United Aircraft, through its Sukhoi arm. Leonardo had formerly been a partner in Sukhoi Civil Aircraft, which manufactures the Superjet 100, but last year revised its shareholding agreement with Sukhoi.

    This agreement involved Leonardo's exiting the production programme by selling its minority share of Sukhoi Civil Aircraft to the Sukhoi holding. Leonardo states, in its annual report for 2016, that the revised agreement also "entailed the acquisition of control by the Russian partner over SuperJet International".

    No financial terms have been disclosed. But Leonardo says: "The transaction also entailed an agreement on the repayment and rescheduling of... SuperJet International's debt to [Leonardo], backed by specific bank guarantees."

    Leonardo categorises SuperJet International as having "left the scope of consolidation" following the shareholders' agreement.
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    Post  Austin on Thu May 11, 2017 2:30 pm

    S7 plans to purchase 17 Embraer aircraft to the end of the year


    Подробнее на ТАСС:
    http://tass.ru/ekonomika/4243473


    I am wondering why does S7 not purchase SSJ-100 in LR configuration instead of Embraer ?

    They need to streamline purchase and if Russian option is available just forbid any Russian airlines to buy foreign aircraft
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    Post  miketheterrible on Thu May 11, 2017 2:58 pm

    Corruption of the private sector. Can't stop them unless you want to hurt investment opportunities. Hence why they are aiming at creating small regional airliners to support local made jets.

    Don't know why they purchase embraer jets. It was like my air Canada flight, flying an embraer and not a bombardier jet.

    Embrace 170 is also more expensive than SSJ-100 LR. So I wonder if Russian authorities are going to eventually approach and ask as to why they won't purchase it? Its more efficient than the Embraer, cheaper, and mostly domestically made. So there must be something else.

    It should also be entirely illegal to obtain a suitcase of money to make a decision.

    Unless Embraer is selling them at a loss, which is something Bombardier does.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Thu May 11, 2017 5:19 pm

    Austin wrote:S7 plans to purchase 17 Embraer aircraft to the end of the year

    Подробнее на ТАСС:
    http://tass.ru/ekonomika/4243473

    I am wondering why does S7 not purchase  SSJ-100 in LR configuration instead of Embraer ?

    They need to streamline purchase and if Russian option is available just forbid any Russian airlines to buy foreign aircraft

    Embraer E-170 and SSJ-100 may belong to same class but are not entirely compatible.

    On average E-170 carries 20 passengers less than SSJ-100 but has roughly 800km longer range.

    That and delivery date probably affected decision making.
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    Post  JohninMK on Thu May 11, 2017 8:29 pm

    Remarkable thing about this photo is that it could have been taken over much of northern Scandinavia.

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 4196627_original
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    Post  PapaDragon on Thu May 11, 2017 10:10 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Remarkable thing about this photo is that it could have been taken over much of northern Scandinavia.
    ..................

    Yup, pretty much only things that break the illusion are type of grass and KAMAZ fire-trucks.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Fri May 12, 2017 8:19 pm


    Fifth SSJ-100 delivered to CityJet:

    https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/93323/

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 C2RlbGFub3VuYXMucnUvdXBsb2Fkcy8zLzAvMzA5MTQ5NDQyNDk3M19vcmlnLmpwZWc_X19pZD05MzMyMw==

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    Post  Rmf on Sat May 13, 2017 10:02 pm

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 F_chau10
    engines seem way low
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    Post  PapaDragon on Sat May 13, 2017 11:09 pm

    Rmf wrote:Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 F_chau10
    engines seem way low



    Agreed, way too low...

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 Maxresdefault

    lol1
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    Post  kvs on Sat May 13, 2017 11:29 pm

    The fuselage is being propped up by the orange framework. The landing gear are not fully extended.
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    Post  JohninMK on Mon May 15, 2017 1:30 pm

    https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/picture-mc-21-undergoes-taxiing-and-ground-tests-437212/

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 Getasset
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    Post  kvs on Mon May 15, 2017 9:37 pm

    Scratch my previous post.

    There is zero issue here, look at the A320:

    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 ATRA_vorne_l
    Russian Civil Aviation: News #2 - Page 20 354EF8A200000578-3642744-image-a-14_1465994266566

    The bottom of the engines is aligned with the wheel axels. Looks to be identical to the clearance of the MC-21.

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