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    Promising high-speed helicopter (PSV)

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:22 pm

    All I'm saying is they could take the Eurcopters' proven design, and add the Kamov's coaxial rotors, and also add the coaxial counter propellers seen on the Tu-95's, maybe with the difference of having the propellers attached to the ends of the rear tail wing, and have two additional wings in the front with weapon pylons.

    What eurocopter proven design... they put two turboprop engines on the wing tips of a helicopter... 50 years ago Mil put four jet engines on the wing tips of a helicopter too it is hardly new ground breaking stuff...

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    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:26 pm

    dino00 wrote:In JSC "Kamov" have developed a project synccopter, which can accelerate to 420 km / h

    Formed a general view and layout, as well as calculated aircraft performance characteristics of the aircraft, according to the developer’s presentation

    MOSCOW, April 24th. / Tass /. Kamov JSC (part of the Russian Helicopters holding) has developed a conceptual design of a prospective high-speed helicopter of a synchroter (or synchroopter) scheme with two main and one pusher propellers. The maximum design speed of the car reaches 420 km / h, follows from the presentation of the developer, a copy of which is available to TASS.

    A synccopter is a helicopter, in which two screws are mounted at a short distance from each other and rotate in opposite directions, while the trajectories of their blades intersect, the screws rotate "overlap". In order for the blades not to collide, their rotation is mechanically synchronized.

    The simulation showed the advantage of such a scheme - the efficiency is higher by 4% compared to the single and coaxial schemes, there is no disruption of the air flow from the screws, which occurs at high speeds. It is because of this effect that the helicopters of the classical schemes have reached their speed limit. Also, to increase the speed in the tail, a pushing screw was installed, the blades received tips of a special form, and their speed of rotation was reduced from 220 to 180 m / s.

    According to the presentation materials, the design result was a high-speed passenger helicopter with the following characteristics: take-off weight of 6500 kg, payload mass of 1000 kg, cruising speed of 357 km / h, maximum speed of 420 km / h, static ceiling of 4700 m, dynamic ceiling of 5600 m, range of 1228 km.

    More
    https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/6368633

    Kamov don't throw the towel attack

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    hoom

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    Post  hoom on Fri Apr 26, 2019 6:24 am

    Yes thats how I interpret that wording.
    Pretty interesting.

    That layout was used in some of the earliest helicopters, always seemed super counter-intuitive & dangerous to me -> evolution away from that to the 'conventional' single rotor plus tail rotor.

    But when you get your head around how they actually work mechanically it gives the advantages of contra-rotors while keeping large separation between the blades.
    Normal contra-rotors get a compression pulse when the blades pass over each other but with this layout they never really actually cross.
    Limits the number of blades though.
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Sat Apr 27, 2019 4:40 am

    Eliminates the need for a serious gearbox like a contrarotating mechanism, but I would suspect it would also influence flight performance like the ability to yaw the nose... with a tail rotor the tail rotor is only effective at low flight speeds because it is relatively small and at higher speeds the wind induced aerodynamic forces are fairly strong.

    With coaxial rotor layouts the momentum force of an entire set of main rotors (two sets, one going each way of course) means rudder turns or yawing can be performed over a much wider range of speeds forward backward or sideways...

    With this arrangement, I am guessing that is what the large tail structure is for which suggests yaw control would be most effective at reasonable forward speeds.
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    hoom

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    Post  hoom on Tue May 14, 2019 8:26 am

    Not sure where he got it but Charly015 appears to have a pic of the proposed config http://charly015.blogspot.com/2019/05/kamov-de-alta-velocidad.html
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    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Thu Aug 29, 2019 7:52 pm

    The "Kamov" announced a way to disperse the helicopter to 600 km / h

    In Russia, they found a way to increase the speed of a combat helicopter to 600 km / h. This was reported by TASS with reference to the leadership of JSC Kamov.

    Promising high-speed helicopter (PSV) - Page 5 1567084905_jekrana-2019-08-29-v-16_20_00

    The general designer of Kamov JSC Sergey Mikheev claims that his company managed to find a solution with which it is possible to increase the speed of a combat helicopter to 600 km / h. Mikheev reported this to reporters as part of the International Aviation and Space Salon MAKS-2019.

    The general designer of the design bureau notes that at the moment "we are behind the requirements that exist." The designer mentioned Boeing, which together with Sikorsky Corporation creates a promising car at a speed of 480-550 km / h. According to Sergei Mikheev, Russian programs do not yet have such indicators. However, he claims that a solution was found at Kamov.

    I managed to find a solution, I patented it that a combat helicopter can fly at a speed of more than 600 km / h.

    - quotes his words "Interfax".

    The main promising Russian helicopter is not developed by Kamova Design Bureau

    At present, in Russia, the development of a promising high-speed helicopter is being carried out by Milia Design Bureau. The Kamova design bureau, known for its active use of coaxial circuits in helicopter engines, has also developed its own version of a promising machine, but the Ministry of Defense is the main project of a competing bureau.

    The draft design of “Kamov” was a “syncopter” with two main and one thrust propeller. Its estimated speed was to reach 420 km / h. The design bureau is currently developing a new generation Lamprey marine helicopter.

    Russian perspective helicopter on the way

    A promising helicopter, which is currently being developed in the interests of the Russian Aerospace Forces, should go into production in 2022. About this when he was commander in chief of the Aerospace Forces of the Russian Federation, Viktor Bondarev reported. Initially, it was assumed that a civilian version of the machine would be developed, but it turned out to be too expensive for commercial operation, so all the developments were transferred to the military.

    At the moment, several countries are developing promising high-speed helicopters, since the maximum speed of modern rotary-wing aircraft usually does not exceed 300-350 km / h. At the moment, there is an extremely small number of cars that can overcome the bar of 400 km / h: these are S-97 Raider in the USA and Eurocopter X3 in Europe.

    https://topwar.ru/161854-v-kamove-zajavili-o-sposobe-razognat-vertolet-do-600-km-ch.html

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Fri Aug 30, 2019 6:19 am

    Hang on, if you read the actual article that does not have that Kaman american helicopter photo with it here:

    https://tass.com/defense/1075552

    They are talking about different things.... the syncrocopter design they talked about they said this:

    Earlier, Kamov came up with a sketch design of a synchro-copter with two lifting airscrews and one propeller. According to a presentation, the machine’s estimated speed is 420 kilometers per hour.

    But he also talks about a helicopter design that will allow flight up to 600km/h but he does not mention what rotor arrangement it uses... and being Kamov it could be a coaxial or a conventional for all we know.

    The article also mentions this:

    In May 2018, the chief of the holding company Helicopters of Russia, Andrei Boginsky, said the civilian version of a new generation high-speed helicopter turned out too costly for commercial use, so all the research and development the Industry and Trade Ministry had funded would be used in the next configuration meant for the military.

    Which is no great surprise... tilt rotor designs will have the same issue with costs that make them not viable for commercial development too.

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