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    Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

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    medo

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  medo on Sun Jul 07, 2013 2:59 pm

    TheArmenian wrote:The Russians have told and shown us only what they wanted us to know and see of the Vityaz system.
    Their military industry is becoming more and more domestic oriented and decreasing its dependency on exports. I have noticed that over the last few years, they are more secretive on many programs. Take CLUB for example...we have seen only export versions.
    I suspect there a lot more to Vityaz and also the S-400 than we have seen.


    True. Vityaz was shown to Putin and MoD delegation and we could be sure, that journalists, who escort delegation, were not allowed to see everything.

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Rpg type 7v on Sun Jul 07, 2013 5:00 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    except km-sam is already operational and in mass production...
    while viutaz is not even in testing...it lags allot.
    there is a reason new assembly buildings for A-A are under construction.

    No big surprise that KM-SAM is in production and operational... the UAE got Pantsir-S1 first too... for the same reason... they paid for it.
    they were introduced at about the same time. Vytaz is not even tested -yet.It was announced in late 90s .... This is too slow and too much money is wasted is slow programs.
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    medo

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  medo on Sun Jul 07, 2013 6:40 pm

    South Korean money? Missiles were first developed for S-300 and later S-400 use. Later were used for KM-SAM, where AA cooperate in its development and than Russian MoD start with Vityaz project with many things already developed. Anyway any development take its time to build and test components and a complex as a whole.
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    TR1

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  TR1 on Sun Jul 07, 2013 9:40 pm

    Rpg type 7v wrote:
    GarryB wrote:
    except km-sam is already operational and in mass production...
    while viutaz is not even in testing...it lags allot.
    there is a reason new assembly buildings for A-A are under construction.

    No big surprise that KM-SAM is in production and operational... the UAE got Pantsir-S1 first too... for the same reason... they paid for it.
    they were introduced at about the same time. Vytaz is not even tested -yet.It was announced in late 90s .... This is too slow and too much money is  wasted is slow programs.

    Just because it was announced, does not mean serious work started.

    What do you know about the money spent on the program? Talking out of your ass again?

    Rpg type 7v

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Rpg type 7v on Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:17 pm

    TheArmenian wrote:The Russians have told and shown us only what they wanted us to know and see of the Vityaz system.
    Their military industry is becoming more and more domestic oriented and decreasing its dependency on exports. I have noticed that over the last few years, they are more secretive on many programs. Take CLUB for example...we have seen only export versions.
    I suspect there a lot more to Vityaz and also the S-400 than we have seen.

    good point... vytaz is still not in full production for few more years , maybe that hall will be full of machines and workers latter ,for now its empty.
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    TR1

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  TR1 on Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:21 pm

    Rpg type 7v wrote:
    TheArmenian wrote:The Russians have told and shown us only what they wanted us to know and see of the Vityaz system.
    Their military industry is becoming more and more domestic oriented and decreasing its dependency on exports. I have noticed that over the last few years, they are more secretive on many programs. Take CLUB for example...we have seen only export versions.
    I suspect there a lot more to Vityaz and also the S-400 than we have seen.

    good point... vytaz is still not in full production for few more years , maybe that hall will be full of machines and workers latter ,for now its empty.

    Or maybe that hall is not for final assembly?

    Are you really this thick?

    Rpg type 7v

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Rpg type 7v on Tue Jul 09, 2013 10:32 pm

    TR1 wrote:
    Rpg type 7v wrote:
    TheArmenian wrote:The Russians have told and shown us only what they wanted us to know and see of the Vityaz system.
    Their military industry is becoming more and more domestic oriented and decreasing its dependency on exports. I have noticed that over the last few years, they are more secretive on many programs. Take CLUB for example...we have seen only export versions.
    I suspect there a lot more to Vityaz and also the S-400 than we have seen.

    good point... vytaz is still not in full production for few more years , maybe that hall will be full of machines and workers latter ,for now its empty.

    Or maybe that hall is not for final assembly?

    Are you really this thick?

    Such a BIG and large hall not used for anything much??? affraid ...yeah talk avout wasting resourses....Rolling Eyes 
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    sepheronx

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  sepheronx on Wed Jul 10, 2013 4:44 am

    Rpg type 7v wrote:
    TR1 wrote:
    Rpg type 7v wrote:
    TheArmenian wrote:The Russians have told and shown us only what they wanted us to know and see of the Vityaz system.
    Their military industry is becoming more and more domestic oriented and decreasing its dependency on exports. I have noticed that over the last few years, they are more secretive on many programs. Take CLUB for example...we have seen only export versions.
    I suspect there a lot more to Vityaz and also the S-400 than we have seen.

    good point... vytaz is still not in full production for few more years , maybe that hall will be full of machines and workers latter ,for now its empty.

    Or maybe that hall is not for final assembly?

    Are you really this thick?

    Such a BIG and large hall not used for anything much???  affraid ...yeah talk avout wasting resourses....Rolling Eyes 

    You are daft.

    If you noticed, it was a showcasing of the Vityaz system. It really wasn't that large looking, at least nowhere near as to the facility I work at.

    What I find amazing is how you can put 2+2 together by looking at 1 picture of a few angles.
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    TheArmenian

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  TheArmenian on Thu Jul 11, 2013 7:38 am

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    gaurav

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  gaurav on Sat Jul 13, 2013 6:37 pm

    Designation of Vityaz system: S-350E

    I converted your pdf to English by google translation..

    There is no word on the missiles used in S-350E.
    So nothing can be said about the missiles/weapons as such.Cool

    There is no official interview/comment from the manufacturer about the missiles.
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    TheArmenian

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  TheArmenian on Sun Jul 14, 2013 7:47 am

    gaurav wrote:
    Designation of Vityaz system: S-350E

    I converted your pdf to English by google translation..

    There is no word on the missiles used in S-350E.
    So nothing can be said about the missiles/weapons as such.Cool

    There is no official interview/comment from the manufacturer about the missiles.

    It is mentioned several times in the article. probably your google translation sucks.

    Все эти аспекты учтены ОАО «ГСКБ
    «Алмаз-Антей» при разработке перспективной
    зенитной ракетной системы (ЗРС) средней
    дальности С-350Е, которая.....
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    George1

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  George1 on Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:09 pm

    Russia to Unveil New Air Defense System at MAKS-2013

    MOSCOW, August 24 (RIA Novosti) – Russia’s Almaz-Antei corporation will showcase for the first time its newest S-350E Vityaz mid-range air defense system at the upcoming MAKS-2013 air show near Moscow, the company said.

    The Vityaz, which is expected to replace the outdated S-300 systems, is superior to similar foreign models, according to Almaz-Antei statement released on Friday.

    The new Russian system was reportedly shown to President Vladimir Putin during his June 19 visit to a St. Petersburg plant where it is being manufactured by the Almaz-Antei corporation.

    The system has been in the works since 2007 and features advanced all-aspect phased array radar, a new mobile command post and a launcher carrying 12 vertical-launch missiles, which will use a variant of the 9M96 active radar homing missile, according to the company.

    Almaz-Antey plans to hand over the system to the Russian Defense Ministry for testing before the end of 2013 and start deliveries to the Russian military next year.

    The Vityaz will complement the Morfey, the S-400 and the S-500 air defense systems in the future aerospace defense network to engage targets at ranges from five to 400 kilometers, and at altitudes from five meters to near space.
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    Viktor

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Viktor on Mon Aug 26, 2013 4:41 pm

    2 Radar per battery?! for achieving ultimate

    - 16 aerodynamical targets with 32 missiles per battery

    - 12 ballistic (tactical) targets with 24 missiles per battery





    The structure AAMS include:

    - command and control point (FDR) 50K6E

    - multifunction radar (MFR) 50N6E (up to 2 units)Shocked Shocked Shocked 

    - launchers (PU) 50P6E (up to 8 units) with twelve anti-aircraft guided missiles, medium-range 9M96E2 (developer - of "ICD" Torch "to them. PD Grushin").


    The main highlight of the AAMS is a multi-function radar detection of air targets of a new type has no analogues in Russia. This station is the main communication tool of S-350E, running in a circular and sectoral modes and provides support for up to 100 targets. Management of MPR and PU are remotely controlled from the point of command and control, which can be removed from them at a distance of 2 km. All components of the unified air defense missile systems placed on the chassis BAZ-69092-012, manufactured by JSC "Bryansk Wheeled Tractor Plant." The launcher is designed for the transportation, storage, automatic prelaunch and launch anti-aircraft missiles. Missile launches are possible at intervals of 2 seconds System C-350E is capable of hitting up to 16 wind or up to 12 ballistic targets, the maximum number of simultaneously induced SAM - 32. This provides aerodynamic loss targets at ranges from 1.5 to 60 km and altitude - from 0.01 to 30 km, and ballistic - from 1.5 to 30 km, and from 2 to 25 km, respectively. Time to bring funds AAMS on alert after a march of only five minutes, a crew - 3 people. The system has high mobility and survivability, can operate autonomously, conducting independent military operations, as well as in the air-defense groups in the management of higher command posts. Combat operation of S-350E is fully automatic, and provides only a crew trained to work AAMS and controls the subsequent course of the fighting.


    LINK







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    flamming_python

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  flamming_python on Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:03 am

    Viktor wrote:2 Radar per battery?! for achieving ultimate
    'Ultimate' would be something like the Buk series, with a radar each per launcher

    The main highlight of the AAMS is a multi-function radar detection of air targets of a new type has no analogues in Russia. This station is the main communication tool of S-350E, running in a circular and sectoral modes and provides support for up to 100 targets. Management of MPR and PU are remotely controlled from the point of command and control, which can be removed from them at a distance of 2 km. All components of the unified air defense missile systems placed on the chassis BAZ-69092-012, manufactured by JSC "Bryansk Wheeled Tractor Plant." The launcher is designed for the transportation, storage, automatic prelaunch and launch anti-aircraft missiles. Missile launches are possible at intervals of 2 seconds System C-350E is capable of hitting up to 16 wind or up to 12 ballistic targets, the maximum number of simultaneously induced SAM - 32. This provides aerodynamic loss targets at ranges from 1.5 to 60 km and altitude - from 0.01 to 30 km, and ballistic - from 1.5 to 30 km, and from 2 to 25 km, respectively. Time to bring funds AAMS on alert after a march of only five minutes, a crew - 3 people. The system has high mobility and survivability, can operate autonomously, conducting independent military operations, as well as in the air-defense groups in the management of higher command posts. Combat operation of S-350E is fully automatic, and provides only a crew trained to work AAMS and controls the subsequent course of the fighting.
    What is the S-350 supposed to replace exactly? Anyone have an answer?
    Because by these specifications it looks like a sort of medium-range SAM system similar to the Buk-M2/M3 or S-125 Pechora; rather than a follow on for the S-300 system.
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    Stealthflanker

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Stealthflanker on Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:33 am

    flamming_python wrote:
    What is the S-350 supposed to replace exactly? Anyone have an answer?
    Because by these specifications it looks like a sort of medium-range SAM system similar to the Buk-M2/M3 or S-125 Pechora; rather than a follow on for the S-300 system.
    This thing supposedly used to replace the old S-300PS that still using shorter range 5V55 family with range of only 75-92 Km.

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    Viktor

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Viktor on Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:10 pm

    Few points:

    - I believe AAMS in Russia vocabulary referes to regimental setup of air defense systems (in that case minimum 2 batteries make one regiment (AAMS)

    - It seems that per battery S-350E will be able to shoot down 16 aerodynamical targets with 32 missiles and 12 ballistic with 24 missiles

    - 8 launchers per battery for a 12 missile launcher makes 96 missiles which is enough for 3 shootings (36 missile salvo) and 48 targets

    - Vityaz is said to be ready by 2015 (and thats 2.5 years away). I believe we will see 60 and 120-150km range missile integrated

    - Radar is apparently something to brag about so I dont doubt 150km range missiles we will see.

    - Perhaps MAKS-2013 will reveal some more info about it.
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    medo

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  medo on Tue Aug 27, 2013 5:06 pm

    Considering it is about S-350E (export), I think export version will use only shorter range 9M96 missile, while domestic will for sure use 100+ km range missiles.

    I wonder if those export S-350E missiles are same as for Buk-M3? Buk-M3 should have around 70 km range.
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    Sujoy

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Sujoy on Tue Aug 27, 2013 9:37 pm

    flamming_python wrote:What is the S-350 supposed to replace exactly? Anyone have an answer?
    Apart from the S 300PS , S 350 could replace older SAMs like the S-125 adding multiple-target and anti-missile capabilities at the same time . Also , there should be 2 configurations of the S 350 :

    1.A configuration optimized for protecting against high-precision weapons & UAVs ( Simultaneous engagement of 8 targets). 4 launchers with 32 small missiles.

    2. A multi role version . 2 radars and 8 launchers .

    9M96 missile - 40km range with passive IR homing
    9M100 - IR guided approx 10km range .
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    TR1

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  TR1 on Tue Aug 27, 2013 10:59 pm

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    Viktor

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Viktor on Tue Aug 27, 2013 11:40 pm

    Sujoy wrote:
    flamming_python wrote:What is the S-350 supposed to replace exactly? Anyone have an answer?
    Apart from the S 300PS , S 350  could replace older SAMs like the S-125 adding multiple-target and anti-missile capabilities at the same time . Also , there should be 2 configurations of the S 350 :

    1.A  configuration optimized for protecting against high-precision weapons & UAVs ( Simultaneous engagement of 8 targets). 4 launchers with 32 small missiles.

    2. A multi role version . 2 radars and 8 launchers .

    9M96 missile - 40km range with passive IR homing
    9M100 - IR guided approx 10km range .
    1. Even Pancir-S1 is excellent replacement of S-125 Very Happy 

    2. Every Vityaz is a multirole version on its own and can shoot down UAV, ballistic missiles, winged missiles, fighters etc

    3. I believe there will be no setups other than one. One shooting radar per one battery. 16 targets per shooting radar for aerodynamic targets and 12 for ballistic ones (double the missiles)

    4. It could be that 9M96 missiles will be the only type of missiles that we will see with Vityaz in Russian service because there will be no need for mixed missile combo as there will always be Morfei somewhere around. Thats how Russian air defense work. However that setup can be interesting for export to countries that have limited amount of money.

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    Viktor

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Viktor on Tue Aug 27, 2013 11:49 pm

    TR1 wrote:http://bmpd.livejournal.com/602540.html

    Nice pics of Vityaz!

    Can you please translate this picture - from bottom up Very Happy 

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    SOC

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  SOC on Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:16 am

    At the bottom:

    -16 aircraft engaged at once
    -12 ballistic targets engaged at once
    -32 missiles in flight at once, implying two per target
    -1.5 to 60 km range against aircraft
    -10 to 30,000 m altitude against aircraft
    -1.5 to 30 km range against missiles
    -2000 to 30,000 m altitude against missiles
    -5 minute setup time
    -Dunno the last one

    The middle:

    -50K6E command post
    -50N6E radar
    -50L6E TEL with 12 9M96E2 tubes
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    TR1

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  TR1 on Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:25 am

    Stealing my thunder SOC.


    Range is very curious. Why would they curtail range so much even for an export product? We know 9m96 can reach out farther.
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    Viktor

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  Viktor on Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:29 am

    Than I guess we have yet to see 50L6E with longer range missiles.

    Im sure we will see 120+km range version as already shown version of 9M96E2 has 120km range.

    Tnx SOC/TR1 (got to learn Russian) Very Happy 
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    SOC

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    Re: Vityaz (S-350E) SAM System

    Post  SOC on Wed Aug 28, 2013 12:40 am

    TR1 wrote:Stealing my thunder SOC.


    Range is very curious. Why would they curtail range so much even for an export product? We know 9m96 can reach out farther.
    Hell if I know. I'll make you a deal though, if things work out the way I hope they will I'll be at the next MAKS and I'll ask!

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