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    Serbia Breaking News:

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    SturmGuard

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  SturmGuard on Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:30 am

    Militarov,

    what can be said of Montenegrins? You have same people doing ultranationalist Serb thing in the '90s (including the leader), switching overnight to anti-Serb hysteria and confrontationalism? The worst thing is the historical nonsense they come up with, including their take on regional history, and their newly-fashioned Montenegrin language, whose grammar was written by a Croat and a Bosniak/Muslim, and "is based on old Podgorica Muslim folk speech" :DDD

    On the topic of WW2, I understand what you are writing about, I am fully aware of the statistics. However, as the German Army retreated, some part of the Volksdeutscher population went with them. Generally speaking, those that thought they had nothing to fear, chose to stay. It was to no avail, their properties were confiscated, they were "encouraged" to leave, executed, interred in camps and used for forced labour in various infrastructure projects.

    The same, actually even worse, can be said for the Italians. After the surrender of Italy, there were initially more Italians in Partisans than there were Bosniaks/Muslims. Yet, their fate was horrible, even though they were usually singled out in comparison to displays of savagery of "locals". In both cases, a miniscule fraction of both populations remained. Their homes and properties were filled up with various people. I recommend you to investigate the demographic engineering the Yugocommunists did in Dalmatia, Istria, Vojvodina and Kosovo, some eye-opening information there.

    The general characteristic was that there were no trials or investigations done, no justice was even attempted. The worst scum, murderers and criminals from "brotherly" nations were pardoned, accepted into the new order or left to live their lives, while entire historic populations were ethnically cleansed, and masses of POWs and civilians were summarily executed. Not to mention the persecution and reprisals of intellectuals, bourgeoise, White emigrees, royalists etc. If I remember correctly, around 10-15% of those killed in former Yugoslavia during WW2, were killed by Germans and Italians. The rest - by "brothers". The people who initially tried to resist foreign invaders and were taken to concentration camps (the Royal Yugoslav Army personnel - 200 000 of them) and those that chose to continue the resistance were percevied as enemies, as was the Kingdom, which is why Yugocommunists and Ustashe cooperated prior to war, and Yugocommunists viewed the aggresion as an excellent opportunity for an attempt at power usurpation, banking on the suffering of common people, which they exploited for their agenda.
    My family had partisans, but they immediately fell out of party favour. Interestingly, one grandpa due to "misunderstandings" concerning his church wedding (he was no devout Christian, just a traditionalist), which probably saved his life because he was supposed to go to USSR for military education. You know what happened to those who returned from USSR before Yugocommunists turned to the West.



    On the topic of Šešelj, I have heard some very convincing arguments about his UDBA-backed role of the Trojan horse to Serbian right/nationalist democratic politics.

    Something very similar to the now apparent role of both Dveri and the new DSS under Rašković. What else can be said about the party being supported by none other than Jasmina Vujić (I was aware of her background, positions and role due to my profession)? Just Google her, everyone. Or those ridiculous new totally-pro-Russian minor parties that fracture the vote?



    You are in deep shit, with no hope in sight. I don't know what is worse:
    -  50% of people voted for a coalition containing Rasim (for 16 years in all governments), Vuk Drašković, Babić, Vujin and which openly advocates euroatlantic integration (those same who demonised, dismantled and bombed you) AND good relations with Russia (yeah, something tells me that is mutually exclusive)

    - openly separatist and hostile entities are allowed in parliament (SDA, Ugljanin, Albanians, Vojvodina fifth-column)

    - a coalition hosting Latinka fuckin' Perović (I really hate that breed of people) of all people, managed to get into parliament


    At which point will the people wake up? I mean, there is absolutely no problem in identifying the underlying causes and culprits for the historic downfall of Serbia, the year can be precisely dated to either 1945, or even 1919. How many times does it take for people to finally get a hold of reality?
    The NATO agreement signed recently, which continues nicely on the previous one signed by Vuk Drašković while he was MFA, as well as the Bruxelles agreements, should amount to a treason. The economy is not doing well, neither are average wages and pensions.


    I hope that I managed to convey my thoughts and opinions to you well; these are just observations from a neighbour. Don't want to come off as an arrogant and/or condescending individual lecturing you on the subject of your country, just genuinely interested in your take on the matter.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Apr 26, 2016 3:43 am

    You are overthinking this Montenegro thing Sturm, history does not come into equation here and nations and religions can easily be invented per need.

    Only thing that matters is money. That is it. Nothing else. If tribe of cannibal mutants from Fukushima took over the world tomorrow and offered Montenegro cash in exchange for servitude they would jump on it no questions asked.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Apr 26, 2016 3:53 am

    I stay clear of domestic politics(very good mental healt tip) but one thing I noticed is that all ''pro-Russian'' parties here have is their plan which goes as follows:

    Step 1: Win elections

    Step 2: Make alliance with Russia

    Step 3: ?????????????

    Step 4: Profit

    Distinct lack of clarity regarding Step 3 is what makes me (and lot of other folks) think that their actual plan in fact has strict emphasis only on Steps 1 and 4.

    Which makes them very similar to their competition.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Sat Apr 30, 2016 3:33 pm



    Vučić the First
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Mon May 02, 2016 3:57 pm



    "A huge fire has ravaged a Serbian Orthodox Church in downtown Manhattan, on the day that Orthodox Christians are celebrating the Holy Easter. It took some 170 firemen several hours to bring the four-alarm blaze under control."
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    Odin of Ossetia

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Odin of Ossetia on Sun May 08, 2016 12:07 am

    SturmGuard wrote:Militarov,

    what can be said of Montenegrins? You have same people doing ultranationalist Serb thing in the '90s (including the leader), switching overnight to anti-Serb hysteria and confrontationalism? The worst thing is the historical nonsense they come up with, including their take on regional history, and their newly-fashioned Montenegrin language, whose grammar was written by a Croat and a Bosniak/Muslim, and "is based on old Podgorica Muslim folk speech" :DDD

    On the topic of WW2, I understand what you are writing about, I am fully aware of the statistics. However, as the German Army retreated, some part of the Volksdeutscher population went with them. Generally speaking, those that thought they had nothing to fear, chose to stay. It was to no avail, their properties were confiscated, they were "encouraged" to leave, executed, interred in camps and used for forced labour in various infrastructure projects.

    The same, actually even worse, can be said for the Italians. After the surrender of Italy, there were initially more Italians in Partisans than there were Bosniaks/Muslims. Yet, their fate was horrible, even though they were usually singled out in comparison to displays of savagery of "locals". In both cases, a miniscule fraction of both populations remained. Their homes and properties were filled up with various people. I recommend you to investigate the demographic engineering the Yugocommunists did in Dalmatia, Istria, Vojvodina and Kosovo, some eye-opening information there.

    The general characteristic was that there were no trials or investigations done, no justice was even attempted. The worst scum, murderers and criminals from "brotherly" nations were pardoned, accepted into the new order or left to live their lives, while entire historic populations were ethnically cleansed, and masses of POWs and civilians were summarily executed. Not to mention the persecution and reprisals of intellectuals, bourgeoise, White emigrees, royalists etc. If I remember correctly, around 10-15% of those killed in former Yugoslavia during WW2, were killed by Germans and Italians. The rest - by "brothers". The people who initially tried to resist foreign invaders and were taken to concentration camps (the Royal Yugoslav Army personnel - 200 000 of them) and those that chose to continue the resistance were percevied as enemies, as was the Kingdom, which is why Yugocommunists and Ustashe cooperated prior to war, and Yugocommunists viewed the aggresion as an excellent opportunity for an attempt at power usurpation, banking on the suffering of common people, which they exploited for their agenda.
    My family had partisans, but they immediately fell out of party favour. Interestingly, one grandpa due to "misunderstandings" concerning his church wedding (he was no devout Christian, just a traditionalist), which probably saved his life because he was supposed to go to USSR for military education. You know what happened to those who returned from USSR before Yugocommunists turned to the West.



    On the topic of Šešelj, I have heard some very convincing arguments about his UDBA-backed role of the Trojan horse to Serbian right/nationalist democratic politics.

    Something very similar to the now apparent role of both Dveri and the new DSS under Rašković. What else can be said about the party being supported by none other than Jasmina Vujić (I was aware of her background, positions and role due to my profession)? Just Google her, everyone. Or those ridiculous new totally-pro-Russian minor parties that fracture the vote?



    You are in deep shit, with no hope in sight. I don't know what is worse:
    -  50% of people voted for a coalition containing Rasim (for 16 years in all governments), Vuk Drašković, Babić, Vujin and which openly advocates euroatlantic integration (those same who demonised, dismantled and bombed you) AND good relations with Russia (yeah, something tells me that is mutually exclusive)

    - openly separatist and hostile entities are allowed in parliament (SDA, Ugljanin, Albanians, Vojvodina fifth-column)

    - a coalition hosting Latinka fuckin' Perović (I really hate that breed of people) of all people, managed to get into parliament


    At which point will the people wake up? I mean, there is absolutely no problem in identifying the underlying causes and culprits for the historic downfall of Serbia, the year can be precisely dated to either 1945, or even 1919. How many times does it take for people to finally get a hold of reality?
    The NATO agreement signed recently, which continues nicely on the previous one signed by Vuk Drašković while he was MFA, as well as the Bruxelles agreements, should amount to a treason. The economy is not doing well, neither are average wages and pensions.


    I hope that I managed to convey my thoughts and opinions to you well; these are just observations from a neighbour. Don't want to come off as an arrogant and/or condescending individual lecturing you on the subject of your country, just genuinely interested in your take on the matter.


    Your claims are based on what?


    You are comparing the Royal Yugoslav Army, which offered minimal resistance to the Germans, with the heroic Yugoslav Partisans?

    There is not even a real comparison between these two!


    If they were all pardoned then what is the whining about Bleiburg about?


    About Germans read here:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2204160/Darkest-atrocities-Nazis-laid-bare-secretly-recorded-conversations-German-prisoners-war.html


    That the Germans and Italians used proxies makes these two innocent?
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Sun May 08, 2016 12:41 am

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    SturmGuard wrote:Militarov,

    what can be said of Montenegrins? You have same people doing ultranationalist Serb thing in the '90s (including the leader), switching overnight to anti-Serb hysteria and confrontationalism? The worst thing is the historical nonsense they come up with, including their take on regional history, and their newly-fashioned Montenegrin language, whose grammar was written by a Croat and a Bosniak/Muslim, and "is based on old Podgorica Muslim folk speech" :DDD

    On the topic of WW2, I understand what you are writing about, I am fully aware of the statistics. However, as the German Army retreated, some part of the Volksdeutscher population went with them. Generally speaking, those that thought they had nothing to fear, chose to stay. It was to no avail, their properties were confiscated, they were "encouraged" to leave, executed, interred in camps and used for forced labour in various infrastructure projects.

    The same, actually even worse, can be said for the Italians. After the surrender of Italy, there were initially more Italians in Partisans than there were Bosniaks/Muslims. Yet, their fate was horrible, even though they were usually singled out in comparison to displays of savagery of "locals". In both cases, a miniscule fraction of both populations remained. Their homes and properties were filled up with various people. I recommend you to investigate the demographic engineering the Yugocommunists did in Dalmatia, Istria, Vojvodina and Kosovo, some eye-opening information there.

    The general characteristic was that there were no trials or investigations done, no justice was even attempted. The worst scum, murderers and criminals from "brotherly" nations were pardoned, accepted into the new order or left to live their lives, while entire historic populations were ethnically cleansed, and masses of POWs and civilians were summarily executed. Not to mention the persecution and reprisals of intellectuals, bourgeoise, White emigrees, royalists etc. If I remember correctly, around 10-15% of those killed in former Yugoslavia during WW2, were killed by Germans and Italians. The rest - by "brothers". The people who initially tried to resist foreign invaders and were taken to concentration camps (the Royal Yugoslav Army personnel - 200 000 of them) and those that chose to continue the resistance were percevied as enemies, as was the Kingdom, which is why Yugocommunists and Ustashe cooperated prior to war, and Yugocommunists viewed the aggresion as an excellent opportunity for an attempt at power usurpation, banking on the suffering of common people, which they exploited for their agenda.
    My family had partisans, but they immediately fell out of party favour. Interestingly, one grandpa due to "misunderstandings" concerning his church wedding (he was no devout Christian, just a traditionalist), which probably saved his life because he was supposed to go to USSR for military education. You know what happened to those who returned from USSR before Yugocommunists turned to the West.



    On the topic of Šešelj, I have heard some very convincing arguments about his UDBA-backed role of the Trojan horse to Serbian right/nationalist democratic politics.

    Something very similar to the now apparent role of both Dveri and the new DSS under Rašković. What else can be said about the party being supported by none other than Jasmina Vujić (I was aware of her background, positions and role due to my profession)? Just Google her, everyone. Or those ridiculous new totally-pro-Russian minor parties that fracture the vote?



    You are in deep shit, with no hope in sight. I don't know what is worse:
    -  50% of people voted for a coalition containing Rasim (for 16 years in all governments), Vuk Drašković, Babić, Vujin and which openly advocates euroatlantic integration (those same who demonised, dismantled and bombed you) AND good relations with Russia (yeah, something tells me that is mutually exclusive)

    - openly separatist and hostile entities are allowed in parliament (SDA, Ugljanin, Albanians, Vojvodina fifth-column)

    - a coalition hosting Latinka fuckin' Perović (I really hate that breed of people) of all people, managed to get into parliament


    At which point will the people wake up? I mean, there is absolutely no problem in identifying the underlying causes and culprits for the historic downfall of Serbia, the year can be precisely dated to either 1945, or even 1919. How many times does it take for people to finally get a hold of reality?
    The NATO agreement signed recently, which continues nicely on the previous one signed by Vuk Drašković while he was MFA, as well as the Bruxelles agreements, should amount to a treason. The economy is not doing well, neither are average wages and pensions.


    I hope that I managed to convey my thoughts and opinions to you well; these are just observations from a neighbour. Don't want to come off as an arrogant and/or condescending individual lecturing you on the subject of your country, just genuinely interested in your take on the matter.


    Your claims are based on what?


    You are comparing the Royal Yugoslav Army, which offered minimal resistance to the Germans, with the heroic Yugoslav Partisans?

    There is not even a real comparison between these two!


    If they were all pardoned then what is the whining about Bleiburg about?


    About Germans read here:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2204160/Darkest-atrocities-Nazis-laid-bare-secretly-recorded-conversations-German-prisoners-war.html


    That the Germans and Italians used proxies makes these two innocent?

    Royal Yugoslav army was destroyed from the inside, mostly by Croats. My grand-grand father that was mobilised at that time, said that supply trains that came to Montenegro from Croatia to resupply their advance towards Italians to aid the Greeks were literally sabotaged. Shells came without fuses, boots were all cut, only crates of handgrenades came with nothing inside, ammunition that came was not coresponding with rifles they had. So, they had to halt operations after only 3 days due to lack of everything, as nearest major supply centers were in Croatia, which delivered junk. On purpose naturally.
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    Odin of Ossetia

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Odin of Ossetia on Sun May 08, 2016 12:44 am

    Militarov wrote:
    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    SturmGuard wrote:Militarov,

    what can be said of Montenegrins? You have same people doing ultranationalist Serb thing in the '90s (including the leader), switching overnight to anti-Serb hysteria and confrontationalism? The worst thing is the historical nonsense they come up with, including their take on regional history, and their newly-fashioned Montenegrin language, whose grammar was written by a Croat and a Bosniak/Muslim, and "is based on old Podgorica Muslim folk speech" :DDD

    On the topic of WW2, I understand what you are writing about, I am fully aware of the statistics. However, as the German Army retreated, some part of the Volksdeutscher population went with them. Generally speaking, those that thought they had nothing to fear, chose to stay. It was to no avail, their properties were confiscated, they were "encouraged" to leave, executed, interred in camps and used for forced labour in various infrastructure projects.

    The same, actually even worse, can be said for the Italians. After the surrender of Italy, there were initially more Italians in Partisans than there were Bosniaks/Muslims. Yet, their fate was horrible, even though they were usually singled out in comparison to displays of savagery of "locals". In both cases, a miniscule fraction of both populations remained. Their homes and properties were filled up with various people. I recommend you to investigate the demographic engineering the Yugocommunists did in Dalmatia, Istria, Vojvodina and Kosovo, some eye-opening information there.

    The general characteristic was that there were no trials or investigations done, no justice was even attempted. The worst scum, murderers and criminals from "brotherly" nations were pardoned, accepted into the new order or left to live their lives, while entire historic populations were ethnically cleansed, and masses of POWs and civilians were summarily executed. Not to mention the persecution and reprisals of intellectuals, bourgeoise, White emigrees, royalists etc. If I remember correctly, around 10-15% of those killed in former Yugoslavia during WW2, were killed by Germans and Italians. The rest - by "brothers". The people who initially tried to resist foreign invaders and were taken to concentration camps (the Royal Yugoslav Army personnel - 200 000 of them) and those that chose to continue the resistance were percevied as enemies, as was the Kingdom, which is why Yugocommunists and Ustashe cooperated prior to war, and Yugocommunists viewed the aggresion as an excellent opportunity for an attempt at power usurpation, banking on the suffering of common people, which they exploited for their agenda.
    My family had partisans, but they immediately fell out of party favour. Interestingly, one grandpa due to "misunderstandings" concerning his church wedding (he was no devout Christian, just a traditionalist), which probably saved his life because he was supposed to go to USSR for military education. You know what happened to those who returned from USSR before Yugocommunists turned to the West.



    On the topic of Šešelj, I have heard some very convincing arguments about his UDBA-backed role of the Trojan horse to Serbian right/nationalist democratic politics.

    Something very similar to the now apparent role of both Dveri and the new DSS under Rašković. What else can be said about the party being supported by none other than Jasmina Vujić (I was aware of her background, positions and role due to my profession)? Just Google her, everyone. Or those ridiculous new totally-pro-Russian minor parties that fracture the vote?



    You are in deep shit, with no hope in sight. I don't know what is worse:
    -  50% of people voted for a coalition containing Rasim (for 16 years in all governments), Vuk Drašković, Babić, Vujin and which openly advocates euroatlantic integration (those same who demonised, dismantled and bombed you) AND good relations with Russia (yeah, something tells me that is mutually exclusive)

    - openly separatist and hostile entities are allowed in parliament (SDA, Ugljanin, Albanians, Vojvodina fifth-column)

    - a coalition hosting Latinka fuckin' Perović (I really hate that breed of people) of all people, managed to get into parliament


    At which point will the people wake up? I mean, there is absolutely no problem in identifying the underlying causes and culprits for the historic downfall of Serbia, the year can be precisely dated to either 1945, or even 1919. How many times does it take for people to finally get a hold of reality?
    The NATO agreement signed recently, which continues nicely on the previous one signed by Vuk Drašković while he was MFA, as well as the Bruxelles agreements, should amount to a treason. The economy is not doing well, neither are average wages and pensions.


    I hope that I managed to convey my thoughts and opinions to you well; these are just observations from a neighbour. Don't want to come off as an arrogant and/or condescending individual lecturing you on the subject of your country, just genuinely interested in your take on the matter.


    Your claims are based on what?


    You are comparing the Royal Yugoslav Army, which offered minimal resistance to the Germans, with the heroic Yugoslav Partisans?

    There is not even a real comparison between these two!


    If they were all pardoned then what is the whining about Bleiburg about?


    About Germans read here:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2204160/Darkest-atrocities-Nazis-laid-bare-secretly-recorded-conversations-German-prisoners-war.html


    That the Germans and Italians used proxies makes these two innocent?

    Royal Yugoslav army was destroyed from the inside, mostly by Croats. My grand-grand father that was mobilised at that time, said that supply trains that came to Montenegro from Croatia to resupply their advance towards Italians to aid the Greeks were literally sabotaged. Shells came without fuses, boots were all cut, only crates of handgrenades came with nothing inside, ammunition that came was not coresponding with rifles they had. So, they had to halt operations after only 3 days due to lack of everything, as nearest major supply centers were in Croatia, which delivered junk. On purpose naturally.


    Only that they put up hardly any fight in Serbia itself.

    You cannot blame everything on the Croat separatists.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Sun May 08, 2016 12:54 am

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    SturmGuard wrote:Militarov,

    what can be said of Montenegrins? You have same people doing ultranationalist Serb thing in the '90s (including the leader), switching overnight to anti-Serb hysteria and confrontationalism? The worst thing is the historical nonsense they come up with, including their take on regional history, and their newly-fashioned Montenegrin language, whose grammar was written by a Croat and a Bosniak/Muslim, and "is based on old Podgorica Muslim folk speech" :DDD

    On the topic of WW2, I understand what you are writing about, I am fully aware of the statistics. However, as the German Army retreated, some part of the Volksdeutscher population went with them. Generally speaking, those that thought they had nothing to fear, chose to stay. It was to no avail, their properties were confiscated, they were "encouraged" to leave, executed, interred in camps and used for forced labour in various infrastructure projects.

    The same, actually even worse, can be said for the Italians. After the surrender of Italy, there were initially more Italians in Partisans than there were Bosniaks/Muslims. Yet, their fate was horrible, even though they were usually singled out in comparison to displays of savagery of "locals". In both cases, a miniscule fraction of both populations remained. Their homes and properties were filled up with various people. I recommend you to investigate the demographic engineering the Yugocommunists did in Dalmatia, Istria, Vojvodina and Kosovo, some eye-opening information there.

    The general characteristic was that there were no trials or investigations done, no justice was even attempted. The worst scum, murderers and criminals from "brotherly" nations were pardoned, accepted into the new order or left to live their lives, while entire historic populations were ethnically cleansed, and masses of POWs and civilians were summarily executed. Not to mention the persecution and reprisals of intellectuals, bourgeoise, White emigrees, royalists etc. If I remember correctly, around 10-15% of those killed in former Yugoslavia during WW2, were killed by Germans and Italians. The rest - by "brothers". The people who initially tried to resist foreign invaders and were taken to concentration camps (the Royal Yugoslav Army personnel - 200 000 of them) and those that chose to continue the resistance were percevied as enemies, as was the Kingdom, which is why Yugocommunists and Ustashe cooperated prior to war, and Yugocommunists viewed the aggresion as an excellent opportunity for an attempt at power usurpation, banking on the suffering of common people, which they exploited for their agenda.
    My family had partisans, but they immediately fell out of party favour. Interestingly, one grandpa due to "misunderstandings" concerning his church wedding (he was no devout Christian, just a traditionalist), which probably saved his life because he was supposed to go to USSR for military education. You know what happened to those who returned from USSR before Yugocommunists turned to the West.



    On the topic of Šešelj, I have heard some very convincing arguments about his UDBA-backed role of the Trojan horse to Serbian right/nationalist democratic politics.

    Something very similar to the now apparent role of both Dveri and the new DSS under Rašković. What else can be said about the party being supported by none other than Jasmina Vujić (I was aware of her background, positions and role due to my profession)? Just Google her, everyone. Or those ridiculous new totally-pro-Russian minor parties that fracture the vote?



    You are in deep shit, with no hope in sight. I don't know what is worse:
    -  50% of people voted for a coalition containing Rasim (for 16 years in all governments), Vuk Drašković, Babić, Vujin and which openly advocates euroatlantic integration (those same who demonised, dismantled and bombed you) AND good relations with Russia (yeah, something tells me that is mutually exclusive)

    - openly separatist and hostile entities are allowed in parliament (SDA, Ugljanin, Albanians, Vojvodina fifth-column)

    - a coalition hosting Latinka fuckin' Perović (I really hate that breed of people) of all people, managed to get into parliament


    At which point will the people wake up? I mean, there is absolutely no problem in identifying the underlying causes and culprits for the historic downfall of Serbia, the year can be precisely dated to either 1945, or even 1919. How many times does it take for people to finally get a hold of reality?
    The NATO agreement signed recently, which continues nicely on the previous one signed by Vuk Drašković while he was MFA, as well as the Bruxelles agreements, should amount to a treason. The economy is not doing well, neither are average wages and pensions.


    I hope that I managed to convey my thoughts and opinions to you well; these are just observations from a neighbour. Don't want to come off as an arrogant and/or condescending individual lecturing you on the subject of your country, just genuinely interested in your take on the matter.


    Your claims are based on what?


    You are comparing the Royal Yugoslav Army, which offered minimal resistance to the Germans, with the heroic Yugoslav Partisans?

    There is not even a real comparison between these two!


    If they were all pardoned then what is the whining about Bleiburg about?


    About Germans read here:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2204160/Darkest-atrocities-Nazis-laid-bare-secretly-recorded-conversations-German-prisoners-war.html


    That the Germans and Italians used proxies makes these two innocent?

    Royal Yugoslav army was destroyed from the inside, mostly by Croats. My grand-grand father that was mobilised at that time, said that supply trains that came to Montenegro from Croatia to resupply their advance towards Italians to aid the Greeks were literally sabotaged. Shells came without fuses, boots were all cut, only crates of handgrenades came with nothing inside, ammunition that came was not coresponding with rifles they had. So, they had to halt operations after only 3 days due to lack of everything, as nearest major supply centers were in Croatia, which delivered junk. On purpose naturally.


    Only that they put up hardly any fight in Serbia itself.

    You cannot blame everything on the Croat separatists.

    Commander of the defence in my city for an example was Slovenian, he told soldiers to lay weapons and go homes. He himself went to greet advancing Germans, one his unit rejected orders and shot two German soldiers on motorcycle.. only two German victims in very wide area.

    Yugoslav army had people of various nations serving everywhere across the country, you have some shiny examples of Croats fighting actually, but very few. On other hand you have many examples like one i stated above. And overall defence doctrine of Yugoslav army was wrong, rushing to borders to defend them... there is a book "Pad Kraljevine Jugoslavije", 3 volumes, explaining why and how it happened, would take ages to rephase it.
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    Odin of Ossetia

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Odin of Ossetia on Sun May 08, 2016 1:08 am

    Militarov wrote:
    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    Odin of Ossetia wrote:
    SturmGuard wrote:Militarov,

    what can be said of Montenegrins? You have same people doing ultranationalist Serb thing in the '90s (including the leader), switching overnight to anti-Serb hysteria and confrontationalism? The worst thing is the historical nonsense they come up with, including their take on regional history, and their newly-fashioned Montenegrin language, whose grammar was written by a Croat and a Bosniak/Muslim, and "is based on old Podgorica Muslim folk speech" :DDD

    On the topic of WW2, I understand what you are writing about, I am fully aware of the statistics. However, as the German Army retreated, some part of the Volksdeutscher population went with them. Generally speaking, those that thought they had nothing to fear, chose to stay. It was to no avail, their properties were confiscated, they were "encouraged" to leave, executed, interred in camps and used for forced labour in various infrastructure projects.

    The same, actually even worse, can be said for the Italians. After the surrender of Italy, there were initially more Italians in Partisans than there were Bosniaks/Muslims. Yet, their fate was horrible, even though they were usually singled out in comparison to displays of savagery of "locals". In both cases, a miniscule fraction of both populations remained. Their homes and properties were filled up with various people. I recommend you to investigate the demographic engineering the Yugocommunists did in Dalmatia, Istria, Vojvodina and Kosovo, some eye-opening information there.

    The general characteristic was that there were no trials or investigations done, no justice was even attempted. The worst scum, murderers and criminals from "brotherly" nations were pardoned, accepted into the new order or left to live their lives, while entire historic populations were ethnically cleansed, and masses of POWs and civilians were summarily executed. Not to mention the persecution and reprisals of intellectuals, bourgeoise, White emigrees, royalists etc. If I remember correctly, around 10-15% of those killed in former Yugoslavia during WW2, were killed by Germans and Italians. The rest - by "brothers". The people who initially tried to resist foreign invaders and were taken to concentration camps (the Royal Yugoslav Army personnel - 200 000 of them) and those that chose to continue the resistance were percevied as enemies, as was the Kingdom, which is why Yugocommunists and Ustashe cooperated prior to war, and Yugocommunists viewed the aggresion as an excellent opportunity for an attempt at power usurpation, banking on the suffering of common people, which they exploited for their agenda.
    My family had partisans, but they immediately fell out of party favour. Interestingly, one grandpa due to "misunderstandings" concerning his church wedding (he was no devout Christian, just a traditionalist), which probably saved his life because he was supposed to go to USSR for military education. You know what happened to those who returned from USSR before Yugocommunists turned to the West.



    On the topic of Šešelj, I have heard some very convincing arguments about his UDBA-backed role of the Trojan horse to Serbian right/nationalist democratic politics.

    Something very similar to the now apparent role of both Dveri and the new DSS under Rašković. What else can be said about the party being supported by none other than Jasmina Vujić (I was aware of her background, positions and role due to my profession)? Just Google her, everyone. Or those ridiculous new totally-pro-Russian minor parties that fracture the vote?



    You are in deep shit, with no hope in sight. I don't know what is worse:
    -  50% of people voted for a coalition containing Rasim (for 16 years in all governments), Vuk Drašković, Babić, Vujin and which openly advocates euroatlantic integration (those same who demonised, dismantled and bombed you) AND good relations with Russia (yeah, something tells me that is mutually exclusive)

    - openly separatist and hostile entities are allowed in parliament (SDA, Ugljanin, Albanians, Vojvodina fifth-column)

    - a coalition hosting Latinka fuckin' Perović (I really hate that breed of people) of all people, managed to get into parliament


    At which point will the people wake up? I mean, there is absolutely no problem in identifying the underlying causes and culprits for the historic downfall of Serbia, the year can be precisely dated to either 1945, or even 1919. How many times does it take for people to finally get a hold of reality?
    The NATO agreement signed recently, which continues nicely on the previous one signed by Vuk Drašković while he was MFA, as well as the Bruxelles agreements, should amount to a treason. The economy is not doing well, neither are average wages and pensions.


    I hope that I managed to convey my thoughts and opinions to you well; these are just observations from a neighbour. Don't want to come off as an arrogant and/or condescending individual lecturing you on the subject of your country, just genuinely interested in your take on the matter.


    Your claims are based on what?


    You are comparing the Royal Yugoslav Army, which offered minimal resistance to the Germans, with the heroic Yugoslav Partisans?

    There is not even a real comparison between these two!


    If they were all pardoned then what is the whining about Bleiburg about?


    About Germans read here:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2204160/Darkest-atrocities-Nazis-laid-bare-secretly-recorded-conversations-German-prisoners-war.html


    That the Germans and Italians used proxies makes these two innocent?

    Royal Yugoslav army was destroyed from the inside, mostly by Croats. My grand-grand father that was mobilised at that time, said that supply trains that came to Montenegro from Croatia to resupply their advance towards Italians to aid the Greeks were literally sabotaged. Shells came without fuses, boots were all cut, only crates of handgrenades came with nothing inside, ammunition that came was not coresponding with rifles they had. So, they had to halt operations after only 3 days due to lack of everything, as nearest major supply centers were in Croatia, which delivered junk. On purpose naturally.


    Only that they put up hardly any fight in Serbia itself.

    You cannot blame everything on the Croat separatists.

    Commander of the defence in my city for an example was Slovenian, he told soldiers to lay weapons and go homes. He himself went to greet advancing Germans, one his unit rejected orders and shot two German soldiers on motorcycle.. only two German victims in very wide area.

    Yugoslav army had people of various nations serving everywhere across the country, you have some shiny examples of Croats fighting actually, but very few. On other hand you have many examples like one i stated above. And overall defence doctrine of Yugoslav army was wrong, rushing to borders to defend them... there is a book "Pad Kraljevine Jugoslavije", 3 volumes, explaining why and how it happened, would take ages to rephase it.


    That Slovene was by any chance the rabid anti-Communist Rupnik?

    All the generals in the Royal Yugoslav Army were either Serbs or Montenegrins, with the exception of a single Slovene, and that was Rupnik, and he was only a brigadier-general.

    The Royal Yugoslav Army was heavily dominated by the ethnic Serbs at the top. You cannot blame some Slovene for the minimal resistance it offered to the Germans in 1941.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Sun May 08, 2016 2:04 am

    Odin of Ossetia wrote:

    That Slovene was by any chance the rabid anti-Communist Rupnik?

    All the generals in the Royal Yugoslav Army were either Serbs or Montenegrins, with the exception of a single Slovene, and that was Rupnik, and he was only a brigadier-general.

    The Royal Yugoslav Army was heavily dominated by the ethnic Serbs at the top. You cannot blame some Slovene for the minimal resistance it offered to the Germans in 1941.

    No, he was colonel i belive, and i do not recall his name, he was infantry colonel that was commander of local military facility, batallion lvl with attached artillery company.

    That actually is not completely true:

    "Out of 24 separate command centers directly under General Staff only one was directly under officer that was Serban by nationality, rest were either directly under Croats or "Ex Austrohungarian officers". Kingdom was separated in 6 administrative zones, which matched army sections, only one had Serbian commander (Mirko Bogićević), two were under Croats (Romuald Manola and Eugen Kurelec) and three under Slovenians (Branko Tominshek, Danilo Tranpush and Ignjac Furlan).

    Royal Air force had 4 brigades, which of two had Croatian commanders (Dragutin Rupčić and Nikola Obuljen - both joined Ustaša movemen during first days of war). Out of 8 airforce squadrons, 6 were commanded by Slovenians and Croats, all of which except certain Ferd Gradišnik surrendered to the Germans or joined "Croatian" army during first days of the war.

    Royal Guard had two cavalary squadrons and both were commanded by ex Austro-Hungarian officers, certain Kokalj and Kraus, both joined Ustaša movement after 11th april.

    Out of 6 engineering batallions all 6 were commanded by Croats. Similar situation repeats itself in the rest of the armed forces"

    Source is book (rather a script) named "National structure of Royal Yugoslav Army" written by Branko Jevtić.


    marat

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  marat on Sun May 08, 2016 10:21 am

    Militarov wrote:
    Commander of the defence in my city for an example was Slovenian, he told soldiers to lay weapons and go homes. He himself went to greet advancing Germans, one his unit rejected orders and shot two German soldiers on motorcycle.. only two German victims in very wide area.

    Yugoslav army had people of various nations serving everywhere across the country, you have some shiny examples of Croats fighting actually, but very few. On other hand you have many examples like one i stated above. And overall defence doctrine of Yugoslav army was wrong, rushing to borders to defend them... there is a book "Pad Kraljevine Jugoslavije", 3 volumes, explaining why and how it happened, would take ages to rephase it.

    And why soliders lisned to him and didn fight? Most soliders were Serbs, most officers were Serbs, but almost none of them didint figh, nither Serbs nither Croats or Slovenians. Whole units staffed with mostly Serbs didnt fight at all, Belgrade was captured by recce squad. All towns in Serbia also fall to Germans without any fight.


    You really cannot blame Croats or Slovenians. And Slovenians acctually were quite loyal.

    Kingdom was rotten and nobody didnt wanted to fight for it. And thats applied to Serbs too not just for Croats.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Thu May 19, 2016 10:46 pm

    marat wrote:
    Militarov wrote:    
    Commander of the defence in my city for an example was Slovenian, he told soldiers to lay weapons and go homes. He himself went to greet advancing Germans, one his unit rejected orders and shot two German soldiers on motorcycle.. only two German victims in very wide area.

    Yugoslav army had people of various nations serving everywhere across the country, you have some shiny examples of Croats fighting actually, but very few. On other hand you have many examples like one i stated above. And overall defence doctrine of Yugoslav army was wrong, rushing to borders to defend them... there is a book "Pad Kraljevine Jugoslavije", 3 volumes, explaining why and how it happened, would take ages to rephase it.

    And why soliders lisned to him and didn fight? Most soliders were Serbs, most officers were Serbs, but almost none of them didint figh, nither Serbs nither Croats or Slovenians. Whole units staffed with mostly Serbs didnt fight at all, Belgrade was captured by recce squad. All towns in Serbia also fall to Germans without any fight.


    You really cannot blame Croats or Slovenians. And Slovenians acctually were quite loyal.

    Kingdom was rotten and nobody didnt wanted to fight for it. And thats applied to Serbs too not just for Croats.

    You expect from common peasants without officers and supplies to fight German army in 1941? And achieve what?

    Serbs did fight on many places during that war but they were isolated, betrayed, ill equiped, without supplies, they would give resistance for day, two and then retreat or go home, try to hide service rifle for later. You cant expect from people to fight frontline war without officers and real chain of command.

    And no, majority of officers were not Serbians at least not in units that really count in case of whar, airforce, navy, artillery... Serbs were majority in infantry that couldnt do much on its own.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Wed May 25, 2016 11:55 pm

    Abit about Serbian joining EU, by "Reality Check" from BBC. Suma sumarum "Even when Serbia gets right to join EU it will most likely be vetoed by other EU countries".

    "Accession could occur in 2020, less than three and a half years after the UK's referendum on EU membership" - Vote Leave
    The claim: Leave campaigners claim five countries: Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia and Turkey will join the EU soon.
    Reality Check verdict: The five countries are not going to join the EU any time soon and their admission to the EU - once they fulfil all the criteria - will be subject to a veto by the UK and all the other 27 existing EU countries.
    Leave campaigners say Albania, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia and Turkey - with a combined population of 88 million - are all in line to gain EU membership in the coming years.

    Michael Gove, who said on Friday, 20 May 2016, that the population of the UK would increase by between 2.6 million and 5 million by 2030, based his prediction on the "future migration from the A5 on the assumption of their accession in 2020".
    The Vote Leave campaign says that the EU enlargement is "an explicit policy of the European Commission and the British government".

    It accuses the Prime Minister David Cameron of misleading the public over his support for Turkey's EU membership.
    Penny Mordaunt MP, minister of state for the armed forces, who also campaigns for the UK to leave the EU, told Andrew Marr that Turkey would join the EU in the next eight years.

    She said that the British people would not get to vote on Turkey joining, and denied that the British government had a veto over Turkey's membership.

    'Not on the cards'
    So, will the EU admit the five new countries in the next few years? Does the UK have a veto on it and would it be prepared to use it in this case?

    European Commission President Jean Claude Juncker said in 2014: "Under my presidency of the commission, ongoing negotiations will continue … but no further enlargement will take place over the next five years". The mandate of the current commission's president expires on 1 November 2019.

    David Cameron has indeed been a strong supporter of the Turkish membership of the EU in the past. In July 2010, on a visit to Turkey, David Cameron warned France and Germany not to shut Turkey "out of the club".
    More recently, in October 2015, he said that the British government's policy on Turkey joining the EU had not changed, when asked about it in the House of Commons.

    But he has changed his line more recently and today he told Robert Peston that Turkey joining the EU was not "remotely on the cards […] any time soon".

    The UK, as well as all the other 27 EU countries, has a veto on any new country joining the EU.
    A veto on the new countries joining has been in place case ever since the European integration began.
    In 1963 French President Charles de Gaulle vetoed British membership of European Economic Community, the name for the EU at the time.

    Preparatory work?

    Once all the existing EU countries agree to admit a new member - and in the case of Turkey countries such as France, Cyprus and Greece have expressed serious reservations - this decision must then be approved by the European Parliament and be ratified by the parliaments of all existing EU states. Only then can a new country join the EU.

    There is no requirement in the UK to hold a referendum on a new country joining the EU - but it can do that if it chooses to. The UK has not held a referendum when the new countries joined in the past. Lord Owen, a former foreign secretary, and leave campaigners said today that "the EU is continuing the preparatory work for Turkey at an accelerating pace".
    The EU-Turkey deal from March 2016, on stemming the flow of refugees and migrants into the EU, included a confirmation by both sides that they would "re-energise the accession process".

    This process is already under a considerable strain, only two months after the deal.
    The EU promised short-term visa-free travel for Turkish citizens in the Schengen area, but it demanded that Turkey changes its anti-terror law in exchange.

    Turkish president Recep Tayyip Erdogan said he would not do so and added: "We'll go our way, you go yours."
    All would-be members take a long time to clear all the hurdles required to join the EU, because they are required to adopt and enforce all the current EU rules before they can be admitted to the bloc. Turkey has taken a particularly long time so far.

    It applied to join what was then the European Economic Community in 1987. It then waited 10 years to be declared "eligible" for accession talks, which finally started in October 2005. In 10 years Turkey only managed to adopt the rules on one of the 35 policy areas: science and research. In most other areas it has not even made a start. Montenegro started the policy area negotiations with the EU in 2012 and Serbia in December 2015. FYR Macedonia and Albania have not even started yet.

    It took Croatia, Poland and Hungary 10 years to complete the process. At the current rate, none of the five countries would be ready to join for some time to come."


    Source: http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36355138

    SturmGuard

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  SturmGuard on Fri May 27, 2016 3:10 pm

    Well, the Germans certainly knew who had resisted and who had the potential to be an actual troublemaker.

    They took almost 200 000 RYA prisoners to camps in Germany. Gestapo HQ in Serbia had more than 5000 files and the vast majority of resources and manpower dedicated to JVuO and Chetniks. In contrast, the Yugocommunists weren't even deemed worthy of Gestapo bother, being relegated to Nedić auxiliary government (which had minimal authority as Serbia was placed under direct German military rule).

    For all this "brave Yugo partisan resistance nonsense", their actual impact was negligible when it comes to Germans and Italians. Something like 10 000 German KIAs, most of it during Axis operations to eliminate Partisans. No concentration camps attacked, no offensives started, no resource and logistic attacks. They "liberated" some Yugoslav cities when Hitler was already dead and Soviet flags were raised in Berlin, Vienna, Prague. They only excelled in sacrificing their people en masse to save the incompetent leadership and scum Tito, forcefully mobilising common people and suffering huge losses. I almost forgot, they also excelled in provoking retributions against civilians, for example Vojnić region, due to actions of some "Heroes of the people".

    And just to remind you all, the Yugocommunists greeted the foreign invasion, proclaiming it a perfect opportunity for their revolution, among others. I won't go into further details about their writings and ideas. The consequences of their disastrous rule are evident to this day, as are the consequences of the thorough indoctrination and propaganda campaign.

    I cringe when I read foreign texts on Yugoslav partisan resistance against invaders and proclamations about the "greatest resistance movement". In reality, they are right there next to French. Unfortunately, we can't make 'Allo 'Allo because of the many tragic events during and after the war.

    Btw, I really like this talk of "weak Yugoslavia so no resistance". What can be said about SFRJ then? Was it attacked from multiple fronts by leading militaries in Europe? Where were you all dedicated and convinced Yugoslavs and Yugocommunists? That's right, hiding and keeping quiet, "minding your own business", just like the opportunistic, treasonous and cowardly lot you and your ancestors were.


    Serf mentality and ruthless opportunism; few good and brave people.


    Bleiburg is just the most media exposed case. Politicide, mass executions, ethnic cleansing (Volks and Italians), forced labour camps, elimination of "enemies of people" took place on a large scale.


    Last edited by SturmGuard on Fri May 27, 2016 3:34 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  PapaDragon on Fri May 27, 2016 3:25 pm

    Militarov wrote:Abit about Serbian joining EU, by "Reality Check" from BBC. Suma sumarum "Even when Serbia gets right to join EU it will most likely be vetoed by other EU countries".
    ..................

    Excellent!!!

    Maximum gain with least amount of hassle... but I don't think EU will last that long in it's current state.Cool
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Tue May 31, 2016 9:10 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Militarov wrote:Abit about Serbian joining EU, by "Reality Check" from BBC. Suma sumarum "Even when Serbia gets right to join EU it will most likely be vetoed by other EU countries".
    ..................

    Excellent!!!

    Maximum gain with least amount of hassle... but I don't think EU will last that long in it's current state.Cool  

    Well, politicians will get us into EU, one way or another, that is current goal and will happen... eventually.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Thu Jun 02, 2016 5:56 pm

    So, department of Bosniak Democratic Union of Sandžak from town of Sjenica protested and requested that Serbian Ministry of Defence halts planned military exercises on Pešter plateau that are part of "Morava 2016" military drills.

    They claim its demonstration of power with goal of placing fear into local mainly Muslim population.

    They say how Pešder is perfect for organic food production and that Serbian army will fire huge amounts of ammunition that will destroy the soil, all with ultimate goal to destroy natural enviorement in which Muslims live (sic). They say that is an act aganist Muslim tries to live peacefully with local Serbs.

    Source: http://mondo.rs/a908266/Info/Srbija/BDZ-trazi-da-se-zaustave-vojne-vezbe-na-Pesteru.html


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    Odin of Ossetia

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Odin of Ossetia on Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:19 am

    SturmGuard wrote:Well, the Germans certainly knew who had resisted and who had the potential to be an actual troublemaker.

    They took almost 200 000 RYA prisoners to camps in Germany. Gestapo HQ in Serbia had more than 5000 files and the vast majority of resources and manpower dedicated to JVuO and Chetniks. In contrast, the Yugocommunists weren't even deemed worthy of Gestapo bother, being relegated to Nedić auxiliary government (which had minimal authority as Serbia was placed under direct German military rule).

    For all this "brave Yugo partisan resistance nonsense", their actual impact was negligible when it comes to Germans and Italians. Something like 10 000 German KIAs, most of it during Axis operations to eliminate Partisans. No concentration camps attacked, no offensives started, no resource and logistic attacks. They "liberated" some Yugoslav cities when Hitler was already dead and Soviet flags were raised in Berlin, Vienna, Prague. They only excelled in sacrificing their people en masse to save the incompetent leadership and scum Tito, forcefully mobilising common people and suffering huge losses. I almost forgot, they also excelled in provoking retributions against civilians, for example Vojnić region, due to actions of some "Heroes of the people".

    And just to remind you all, the Yugocommunists greeted the foreign invasion, proclaiming it a perfect opportunity for their revolution, among others. I won't go into further details about their writings and ideas. The consequences of their disastrous rule are evident to this day, as are the consequences of the thorough indoctrination and propaganda campaign.

    I cringe when I read foreign texts on Yugoslav partisan resistance against invaders and proclamations about the "greatest resistance movement". In reality, they are right there next to French. Unfortunately, we can't make 'Allo 'Allo because of the many tragic events during and after the war.

    Btw, I really like this talk of "weak Yugoslavia so no resistance". What can be said about SFRJ then? Was it attacked from multiple fronts by leading militaries in Europe? Where were you all dedicated and convinced Yugoslavs and Yugocommunists? That's right, hiding and keeping quiet, "minding your own business", just like the opportunistic, treasonous and cowardly lot you and your ancestors were.


    Serf mentality and ruthless opportunism; few good and brave people.


    Bleiburg is just the most media exposed case. Politicide, mass executions, ethnic cleansing (Volks and Italians), forced labour camps, elimination of "enemies of people" took place on a large scale.



    I think that the Yugoslav Partisans killed:


    100 000 NDH troops and policemen.

    50 000 German troops and policemen.

    12 000 Italian troops and policemen.

    Some Bulgarians and Hungarians.


    On the other hand the Chetniks killed 10 000 NDH troops and policemen. They killed hardly any Germans, Italians, Bulgarians and Hungarians.


    WWII Chetniks:

    http://www.vojska.net/eng/world-war-2/chetniks/


    As far as attacking camps by Communist-led partisans, you may want to check this page:

    http://michalw.narod.ru/index-GL42.html


    There was an instance in Hungary when a local concentration camp was even evacuated because the Hungarians feared that it was to be attacked by the Yugoslav Partisans, albeit I guess that must have been somewhere close to the border.
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    OminousSpudd

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  OminousSpudd on Thu Aug 18, 2016 10:17 am


    Not breaking news, but an explicit illustration of what Americans think of Serbia. sniper
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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:42 pm

    OminousSpudd wrote:
    Not breaking news, but an explicit illustration of what Americans think of Serbia. sniper


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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Mon Nov 07, 2016 3:37 pm

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    Militarov

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  Militarov on Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:31 pm

    "Serbia has deported a group of Russians suspected of involvement in a coup plot in neighbouring Montenegro, the Guardian has learned, in the latest twist in a murky sequence of events that apparently threatened the lives of two European prime ministers.

    The plotters were allegedly going to dress in police uniforms to storm the Montenegrin parliament in Podgorica, shoot the prime minister, Milo Ðjukanović, and install a pro-Moscow party. The Russian fingerprints on the October plot have heightened intrigue about Moscow’s ambitions in a part of Europe hitherto thought to be gravitating towards the EU’s orbit. A group of 20 Serbians and Montenegrins, some of whom had fought with Moscow-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine, were arrested in Podgorica, the Montenegrin capital. In Serbia, meanwhile, several Russian nationals suspected of coordinating the plot were caught with €120,000 and special forces uniforms.

    According to the Belgrade daily, Danas, the Russians also had encryption equipment and were able to keep track of Đjukanović’s whereabouts. Diplomatic sources told the Guardian the Belgrade government quietly deported the Russians after the intervention of the head of the Russian security council, Nikolai Patrushev, who flew to Belgrade on 26 October in an apparent effort to contain the scandal. The country’s interior minister, Nebojša Stefanović denied the government carried out any deportations connected to the plot.

    A source close to the Belgrade government said Patrushev, a former FSB (federal security service) chief, apologised for what he characterised as a rogue operation that did not have the Kremlin’s sanction. In Moscow, a Security Council official told Tass that Patrushev “didn’t apologise to anyone, because there is nothing to apologise for”."


    Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/11/serbia-deports-russians-suspected-of-plotting-montenegro-coup
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  KiloGolf on Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:53 pm

    Militarov wrote:"Serbia has deported a group of Russians suspected of involvement in a coup plot in neighbouring Montenegro, the Guardian has learned, in the latest twist in a murky sequence of events that apparently threatened the lives of two European prime ministers.

    The plotters were allegedly going to dress in police uniforms to storm the Montenegrin parliament in Podgorica, shoot the prime minister, Milo Ðjukanović, and install a pro-Moscow party.  The Russian fingerprints on the October plot have heightened intrigue about Moscow’s ambitions in a part of Europe hitherto thought to be gravitating towards the EU’s orbit. A group of 20 Serbians and Montenegrins, some of whom had fought with Moscow-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine, were arrested in Podgorica, the Montenegrin capital. In Serbia, meanwhile, several Russian nationals suspected of coordinating the plot were caught with €120,000 and special forces uniforms.

    According to the Belgrade daily, Danas, the Russians also had encryption equipment and were able to keep track of Đjukanović’s whereabouts. Diplomatic sources told the Guardian the Belgrade government quietly deported the Russians after the intervention of the head of the Russian security council, Nikolai Patrushev, who flew to Belgrade on 26 October in an apparent effort to contain the scandal. The country’s interior minister, Nebojša Stefanović denied the government carried out any deportations connected to the plot.

    A source close to the Belgrade government said Patrushev, a former FSB (federal security service) chief, apologised for what he characterised as a rogue operation that did not have the Kremlin’s sanction. In Moscow, a Security Council official told Tass that Patrushev “didn’t apologise to anyone, because there is nothing to apologise for”."


    Source: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/11/serbia-deports-russians-suspected-of-plotting-montenegro-coup

    Remember it's the Guardian. Same paper with Aleppo hospitals, etc. Not that Djukanovic is not pushing his luck here.
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sun Nov 27, 2016 8:18 pm

    Storm the parliament? Wut? In case people don't know what the area looks like it's basically driveway from a bridge with a rundown building, you would have less issues actually rigging the place with explosives and making it go dust instead of trying to occupy it and get blockaded.

    Also closer way out of Podgorica is...Albania or a boat to Italy. FFS I don't exactly know what it was about but there's no way in hell people were being paid 120K for this and the Russians were officially involved. Just way too funny though.


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    Re: Serbia Breaking News:

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      Current date/time is Thu Sep 21, 2017 4:13 pm