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    Emerging Technologies ideas

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    nomadski

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    Re: Emerging Technologies ideas

    Post  nomadski on Mon Dec 04, 2017 11:58 am

    https://www.tasnimnews.com/en/news/2017/12/04/1591768/iranian-turkish-french-scientists-winners-of-2nd-edition-of-mustafa-prize


    I was thinking about artificial intelligence machines . In order for machines to become truly intelligent , then they have to do self learning . Like a human . So programmers , must use analog of human learning and apply to machine . For humans apart from sensory organs , there is the programme of avoiding pain and obtaining pleasure . This is at the root of human reproduction and human need to survive and obtain food and human need to avoid injury . Also humans learn by trial and error . Like a child . So if computer robot manufacturer can use nano technology in the body of robot to simulate pain and also an algorithm for learning by trial and error to save energy like human . Then machine becomes self learning .
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    GarryB

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    Re: Emerging Technologies ideas

    Post  GarryB on Tue Dec 05, 2017 6:38 am

    The crippling thing however with AI is that you can't just get it to generate the rules it has worked out for itself to use.

    A good example was in the 1980s there was an AI programme designed that could automatically detect the presence or absence of a tank or armoured vehicle in an image.

    The goal was the ability to create software that could automatically detect targets and draw the crew of a tanks attention to the threat.

    They basically took thousands of photos with tanks... some in full view some partial view and some hidden with camouflage and they put the AI programme through tests to "learn" what was wanted.

    The software worked brilliantly and had a 96% success rate in the lab, so they rolled it out and hailed it as the next best thing... this software could monitor 24/7 and find targets quickly for the crew... who would not want that?

    Anyway in the field it was rubbish, and didn't spot a single tank or armoured vehicle.

    The point is that to train the software you give it examples to look at and it tells you which is which and then you feed in the correct results so it tries to work out how to find what it is supposed to find by itself.. there are no rules written like look for sharp hard angles or particular patterns (like wheels or guns or tracks), so you can't just ask the software why it thinks a photo of an open field has a tank in the middle when it clearly does not.

    After years of analysis it turns out the sample photos were the problem. It seems the photos with tanks in them were all taken on sunny days and the photos without tanks on gloomy cloudy days and what it actually learned from the learning process was how to tell the difference between a cloudy day and a sunny day...

    Also would point out the aversion to pain in humans is to prevent damage.. . look at leprosy to work out why that is important.

    For many machines the fact that doing something might cause it damage is not a good reason for it to stop doing what it is doing.

    Imagine a rescue robot that walks into a burning building to save humans... if it wont enter the building because the exterior paint might be damaged then it is not much good for purpose.

    Once it has found a person and is carrying them out it would pay for it to avoid going the shortest route out through the centre of the fire to prevent damage to the person they are rescuing.

    There is no need for a machine to worry about reproduction or its own survival... when there are almost 8 billion people on this planet right now there is little reason to create artificial humans.. except for jobs no sane human would do like watch Fox News or CNN or the BBC.


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    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

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    jhelb

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    Re: Emerging Technologies ideas

    Post  jhelb on Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:43 pm

    GarryB wrote:The crippling thing however with AI is that you can't just get it to generate the rules it has worked out for itself to use

    Garry, if someone ( like myself ) intends to start a career in AI (especially in the Defence sector) what are the things he needs to learn that will enable him to land a job with major companies like Rostec etc ? Thanks.
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    GarryB

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    Re: Emerging Technologies ideas

    Post  GarryB on Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:07 am

    My advice is before taking on any tertiary education talk to the ministry of defence people and find out what sort of skills and quals are needed first.
    They might even be able to assist.

    No point in doing a university degree and finding out the military prefers you do their specific course of training instead.... bit of a waste...


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    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
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    nomadski

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    Re: Emerging Technologies ideas

    Post  nomadski on Mon Apr 09, 2018 11:18 am

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1076567008702696


    @jhelb

    I once tried to enrol in UK university to study applied maths at higher level . But my application was verbally rejected , because the course was tailored for military applications . So it is as important what you study as well as where !

    I thought about recent announcement by Russia MOD , that their nuclear powered cruise missile was immune to ALL air defence . How is this possible ? If I am right , this propulsion unit must be low weight , so a heavy heat exchanger can not be used . The core must be directly cooled by incoming air . Also since no pilots in this craft , then no need for heavy shielding . Therefore massive radiation in vicinity of craft .

    The effect of radiation on CCD'S is well known . As well as other electronics . No shielding can be arranged around the SAM , as it needs exposed areas for reception and communication . I was wondering if a long endurance drone or even ground stations can use this principle to direct radiation at space and disable all missile electronics . Types of radiation emitted can be controlled to stop local radiation , and say just put out X ray or Gamma ray in directional beam ? No immediate pollution . Can we do this ? Should be allowed within NPT .
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    GarryB

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    Re: Emerging Technologies ideas

    Post  GarryB on Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:10 am

    With the nuclear engine it might be as simple as using new heat resistant materials that can put up with enormous temperatures that gets cooled below melting temperatures by the airflow through the engine... most low flying missiles are very difficult to stop, and after WWIII has started and ICBMs and SLBMs and other more exotic weapons have laid waste to much of the planet the chances of shooting down cruise missiles becomes dramatically more complicated... the other aspect would be that you really don't know what the targets will even be, and you really don't have any idea when the attack will take place... these missiles might fly down to the south Pacific ocean and fly in 1000km wide orbital circles for 4 or 5 months and then head north to attack their targets. What state will enemy defences be in at that stage? Civil society will have broken down and people will be hungry... the first priority will be food and helping the sick and injured... and trying to work out how to start rebuilding...


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    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

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