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    P-800 Oniks and BrahMos

    navyfield
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    Post  navyfield Sun Sep 21, 2014 6:46 pm

    hm launch shaft looks shallow in the water considering light conditions ,and launch rocket engine burned out by the time missle turned on its side.
    looks like yakhont is very depth limited for its launch parameters no more then 10 ,20m,  , suggesting submarine must come close to surface in order to launch so it will be more easily detectable.
    i expected more. cry
    Mike E
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    Post  Mike E Sun Sep 21, 2014 8:22 pm

    You are *actually right for the first time ever*. It does appear to be launched from shallow waters.... However, it is claimed that it will be able to be launched from 60 meters under the ocean, which is *much* deeper than what is shown in ths video. You expected, and they delivered.... It might even be possible that it could be launch from even deeper, but I'll have to wait and see...
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Tue Sep 23, 2014 6:56 am

    hm launch shaft looks shallow in the water considering light conditions ,and launch rocket engine burned out by the time missle turned on its side.
    looks like yakhont is very depth limited for its launch parameters no more then 10 ,20m, , suggesting submarine must come close to surface in order to launch so it will be more easily detectable.
    i expected more.

    WOW... amazing analysis... did you also note they keep firing over and over again but only during the day time, so clearly it doesn't work at night... which is a real limitation... Twisted Evil

    I also suspect it was videoed in the northern hemisphere so it likely can't be fired south of the equator either... what a crap missile Twisted Evil
    navyfield
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    Post  navyfield Tue Sep 23, 2014 3:04 pm

    Mike E wrote:You are *actually right for the first time ever*. It does appear to be launched from shallow waters.... However, it is claimed that it will be able to be launched from 60 meters under the ocean, which is *much* deeper than what is shown in ths video. You expected, and they delivered.... It might even be possible that it could be launch from even deeper, but I'll have to wait and see...
    i doubt it can be launched from more then 20m ,it takes time to steer the missile and clear the surface by few meters...its the weak spot for yakhont.
    Mike E
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    Post  Mike E Tue Sep 23, 2014 3:06 pm

    navyfield wrote:
    Mike E wrote:You are *actually right for the first time ever*. It does appear to be launched from shallow waters.... However, it is claimed that it will be able to be launched from 60 meters under the ocean, which is *much* deeper than what is shown in ths video. You expected, and they delivered.... It might even be possible that it could be launch from even deeper, but I'll have to wait and see...
    i doubt it can be launched from more then 20m ,it takes time to steer the missile and clear the surface by few meters...its the weak spot for yakhont.
    A) Yes, it is rated to be launched from a depth of 60 meters.

    B) It prepositions itself over the water, so that doesn't mean a thing...

    C) Not a weak-point, and the missile launched was a Brahmos...
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Thu Sep 25, 2014 7:33 am

    No body has mentioned that to offset the limit of launching in shallow water and only in daytime that over the couple of days I have been watching that video literally hundreds of missiles have been launched from that one tube and they still keep coming...
    navyfield
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    Post  navyfield Thu Sep 25, 2014 2:22 pm

    Mike E wrote:
    navyfield wrote:
    Mike E wrote:You are *actually right for the first time ever*. It does appear to be launched from shallow waters.... However, it is claimed that it will be able to be launched from 60 meters under the ocean, which is *much* deeper than what is shown in ths video. You expected, and they delivered.... It might even be possible that it could be launch from even deeper, but I'll have to wait and see...
    i doubt it can be launched from more then 20m ,it takes time to steer the missile and clear the surface by few meters...its the weak spot for yakhont.
    A) Yes, it is rated to be launched from a depth of 60 meters.

    B) It prepositions itself over the water, so that doesn't mean a thing...

    C) Not a weak-point, and the missile launched was a Brahmos...
    any proof for 60m depth capable launch claim???
    Werewolf
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    Post  Werewolf Thu Sep 25, 2014 2:25 pm

    navyfield wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    navyfield wrote:
    Mike E wrote:You are *actually right for the first time ever*. It does appear to be launched from shallow waters.... However, it is claimed that it will be able to be launched from 60 meters under the ocean, which is *much* deeper than what is shown in ths video. You expected, and they delivered.... It might even be possible that it could be launch from even deeper, but I'll have to wait and see...
    i doubt it can be launched from more then 20m ,it takes time to steer the missile and clear the surface by few meters...its the weak spot for yakhont.
    A) Yes, it is rated to be launched from a depth of 60 meters.

    B) It prepositions itself over the water, so that doesn't mean a thing...

    C) Not a weak-point, and the missile launched was a Brahmos...
    any proof for 60m depth capable launch claim???

    Any proof from you that it can not?

    Who'S claim has more weight, some idiot on a forum that only bitches like a little pussy or manufactorer of submarine and SLBM?
    navyfield
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    Post  navyfield Thu Sep 25, 2014 2:33 pm

    allot of foaming but still no link or any substantial evidence Rolling Eyes ,welcome to my ignore list....
    Mike E
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    Post  Mike E Thu Sep 25, 2014 6:39 pm

    navyfield wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    navyfield wrote:
    Mike E wrote:You are *actually right for the first time ever*. It does appear to be launched from shallow waters.... However, it is claimed that it will be able to be launched from 60 meters under the ocean, which is *much* deeper than what is shown in ths video. You expected, and they delivered.... It might even be possible that it could be launch from even deeper, but I'll have to wait and see...
    i doubt it can be launched from more then 20m ,it takes time to steer the missile and clear the surface by few meters...its the weak spot for yakhont.
    A) Yes, it is rated to be launched from a depth of 60 meters.

    B) It prepositions itself over the water, so that doesn't mean a thing...

    C) Not a weak-point, and the missile launched was a Brahmos...
    any proof for 60m depth capable launch claim???
    Yes, go to *any* source that has information on the Brahmos! They are bound to have at least a little info on the subject of launching depth, and I guarantee that you can find one (I know I can)....

    To everybody else; if you are so pissed off by this guy, just request he be banned rather than returning insults.... - As GarryB one said to me "it lowers yourself to their level".
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Sat Sep 27, 2014 7:22 am

    I remember on another forum there were posters who wanted to know stuff, but didn't want to ask nicely so they turned it into an argument to try to get others to search the internet for the information for them.

    You made the claim this missile can only be fired from shallow water... you back it up with manufacturers figures to prove it.
    Mike E
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    Post  Mike E Fri Oct 10, 2014 12:15 am

    What do you guys think of this article; http://gizmodo.com/why-americas-navy-is-so-concerned-about-these-russian-m-1641323648/all ? 

    In typical Western fashion, they fail to mention that the Onyx has a greater range than the Yakhont, and that is has a lower flight altitude of 10 m... Don't even bother to mention how they call the Phalanx and SeaRAM "exotic", what a joke! - On a side note, couldn't the Onyx's speed be adjusted via its ramjet?
    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB Fri Oct 10, 2014 9:00 am

    I suspect the writer meant to put "such weapons as Phalanx and Sea Ram or exotic weapons like EM guns:. or some such thing.

    Moskit does not have 4 ramjet engines... it has one... it has four air intakes for that one ramjet engine... don't look at the front of an aircraft to see how many engines it has... look at the rear.

    On a side note, couldn't the Onyx's speed be adjusted via its ramjet?

    A ramjet engine burns fuel subsonically, so for the ramjet it is the same situation as a turbojet engine... at high speed it has to balance air coming into the intake as subsonic speed so the engine does not choke, but having the air exit the engine at the highest speed possible to maximise thrust.

    Flying at low altitude the top speed of the Onyx is probably mach 1.8-1.9 in the thick air at low altitude.

    At high altitude it can fly rather faster in the thinner colder air, but very low altitude offers the maximum opportunity for surprise.

    Amusingly the article didn't mention the pack tactics the missiles adopt when attacking targets and how they can operate together to maximise their effect.

    they also didn't mention the Klub missile that travels long ranges at subsonic speeds till it gets close to the target area and then launches a Mach 2.9 final rocket stage to penetrate the final layer of defences... ie Phalanx and Sea RAM.... likely the fastest low flying anti ship missile available until ramjet powered missiles become available... obviously the Kh-32 will come in faster but from a high altitude dive....
    Mike E
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    Post  Mike E Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:29 pm

    GarryB wrote:I suspect the writer meant to put "such weapons as Phalanx and Sea Ram or exotic weapons like EM guns:. or some such thing.

    Moskit does not have 4 ramjet engines... it has one... it has four air intakes for that one ramjet engine... don't look at the front of an aircraft to see how many engines it has... look at the rear.

    On a side note, couldn't the Onyx's speed be adjusted via its ramjet?

    A ramjet engine burns fuel subsonically, so for the ramjet it is the same situation as a turbojet engine... at high speed it has to balance air coming into the intake as subsonic speed so the engine does not choke, but having the air exit the engine at the highest speed possible to maximise thrust.

    Flying at low altitude the top speed of the Onyx is probably mach 1.8-1.9 in the thick air at low altitude.

    At high altitude it can fly rather faster in the thinner colder air, but very low altitude offers the maximum opportunity for surprise.

    Amusingly the article didn't mention the pack tactics the missiles adopt when attacking targets and how they can operate together to maximise their effect.

    they also didn't mention the Klub missile that travels long ranges at subsonic speeds till it gets close to the target area and then launches a Mach 2.9 final rocket stage to penetrate the final layer of defences... ie Phalanx and Sea RAM.... likely the fastest low flying anti ship missile available until ramjet powered missiles become available... obviously the Kh-32 will come in faster but from a high altitude dive....
    Probably...

    That makes sense about the speed, but that is more of a "scram-jet issue* than a *ramjet one*. Not to say it doesn't have effect.

     - The article (because of the source) would never mention the "wolf-pack" tactics or longer range etc. Their sources are wiki for the most part!
    GarryB
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    P-800 Oniks and BrahMos - Page 3 Empty Onyx/BrahMos

    Post  GarryB Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:09 am

    With a scramjet engine things are made much easier because the air coming in does not need to be slowed down to subsonic speeds and then accelerated through the engine back up to high supersonic speeds to generate thrust.

    Air coming in at mach 3 can be further accelerated and generate rather more thrust in a scramjet engine at any height.

    It mentions Onyx has double the range of Moskit... Moskit had a range of something like 110-120km in the original version (that entered service in the early 1980s on Sovremmeny Class Destroyers).

    Onyx is known to have a range of at least 500km and often quoted in the 500-700km range.
    Viktor
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    Post  Viktor Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:56 pm

    Very Happy russia

    Brahmos-M

    P-800 Oniks and BrahMos - Page 3 BNGGHRj
    George1
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    Post  George1 Mon Nov 10, 2014 8:03 pm

    Viktor wrote:Very Happy russia

    Brahmos-M

    P-800 Oniks and BrahMos - Page 3 BNGGHRj

    is this the air-launched variant of brahmos?
    Cyberspec
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    Post  Cyberspec Mon Nov 10, 2014 9:31 pm

    George1 wrote:

    Brahmos-M



    is this the air-launched variant of brahmos?

    Yes, I think so....it's significantly shorter than the original and if I remeber correctly it should be faster (over mach 3)
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    Post  George1 Mon Nov 16, 2015 4:11 am

    The russian version of P-800 (Oniks) has a range of about 600km??
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    Post  Austin Mon Nov 16, 2015 5:27 am

    George1 wrote:The russian version of P-800 (Oniks) has a range of about 600km??

    500 km in Hi-Lo Profile
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    Post  Arrow Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:02 am

    P-800 has range about 300km.
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    Post  George1 Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:51 am

    Arrow wrote:P-800 has range about 300km.

    The export version, "Yakhont"
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    Post  George1 Fri Jan 29, 2016 2:46 pm

    The rocket complex "Onyx" will be upgraded

    Project 22350 frigates will be armed with "Onyx" missiles

    Russia and India have compiled a list of countries which can supply "BrahMos"
    George1
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    Post  George1 Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:57 pm

    First Export Contract for BrahMos Cruise Missiles to Be Signed in 2016

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20160420/1038300606/brahmos-export-contract.html#ixzz46P12uOl9
    max steel
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    Post  max steel Thu May 19, 2016 10:24 pm

    IronsightSniper wrote:What Garry said. The Klub is a far more superior and entertaining missile than the Onyx. Anywho, I give the Sea Ram, Sea Sparrow, and ESSM a good chance of intercepting the first 1 or 2 Onyx/Klubs. However, after doing the some radar horizon formulas, the maximum detection range of a 5 meter skimming Klub(3 meters will put it danger close to ocean waves, converting it into a Shkval) against an AN/SPY-1 mounted 16 meters equals to about 25.7 km. Traveling at 986 meters per second(M. 2.9), that would make the time from detection to impact out to 26 seconds. Against a Phalanx, penetration of the ship's defensive systems are almost guaranteed. Against Sea Ram, Sea Sparrow, and ESSM, again, good chance that the first 2 Klubs will get hit. Against the Steregushchy class of corvettes(2 are commissioned, each can carry 6 Klubs), that would mean a saturation fire of 12 Klubs, with minimal losses to them due to AEGIS. Assuming they're fired against a Nimitz class, assume 4 are intercepted, 8 Klubs = 1.6 tonnes of explosives detonating within the Nimitz. From Kinetic energy alone, each would generate about 20 kg of TNT equivalent upon impact, and depending on where they hit, I give it a fair probability of sinking said carrier.

    seems plausible

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