Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Share
    avatar
    PapaDragon

    Posts : 5033
    Points : 5141
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:15 pm

    T-47 wrote:So the first 60 products will still use the current engine?

    No. They will go with new one from the get go.

    They plan to buy full package. They tried piecemeal approach with first Su-35 and got burned.

    T-47

    Posts : 79
    Points : 81
    Join date : 2017-07-17
    Location : Planet Earth

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  T-47 on Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:30 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    No. They will go with new one from the get go.

    They plan to buy full package. They tried piecemeal approach with first Su-35 and got burned.

    So only the first 12 will be with current engine right?
    avatar
    PapaDragon

    Posts : 5033
    Points : 5141
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:25 pm

    T-47 wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    No. They will go with new one from the get go.

    They plan to buy full package. They tried piecemeal approach with first Su-35 and got burned.

    So only the first 12 will be with current engine right?

    No.

    There will be no serial aircraft with current engine. Only ones built so far have placeholder engines.

    All serial aircraft will come with Izdelie-30 engines (new ones) from the get go.
    avatar
    Kimppis

    Posts : 306
    Points : 312
    Join date : 2014-12-23

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Kimppis on Sat Aug 05, 2017 12:02 am

    So is the final number of Su-57s going to be around 160? Just saw the number mentioned on Russia Insider. I thought VKS was supposed to get around 200-250 of them? Of course, who knows at this point. I suppose it's kind of pointless to "speculate" because the plane is going to remain in production for decades to come. But yeah, just wondering...
    avatar
    miketheterrible

    Posts : 1117
    Points : 1117
    Join date : 2016-11-06

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Aug 05, 2017 12:16 am

    Kimppis wrote:So is the final number of Su-57s going to be around 160? Just saw the number mentioned on Russia Insider. I thought VKS was supposed to get around 200-250 of them? Of course, who knows at this point. I suppose it's kind of pointless to "speculate" because the plane is going to remain in production for decades to come. But yeah, just wondering...

    I guess they figure around the amount mentioned with its current configuration and not replacing aircraft. It will end up being in greater numbers when other variants exist and has to replace other aircraft in current inventory.
    avatar
    PapaDragon

    Posts : 5033
    Points : 5141
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon on Sat Aug 05, 2017 5:00 am

    miketheterrible wrote:
    Kimppis wrote:So is the final number of Su-57s going to be around 160? Just saw the number mentioned on Russia Insider. I thought VKS was supposed to get around 200-250 of them? Of course, who knows at this point. I suppose it's kind of pointless to "speculate" because the plane is going to remain in production for decades to come. But yeah, just wondering...

    I guess they figure around the amount mentioned with its current configuration and not replacing aircraft. It will end up being in greater numbers when other variants exist and has to replace other aircraft in current inventory.

    From everything I gathered it looks like that VKS is not only satisfied with performance of Su-30/34/35, they are extatic.

    They did not expect them to prove themselves this well and coupled with advances in SAMs and radars they feel that they can keep relying on them more than they expected.

    This would mean that they are not in a hurry to get T-50s as much as before. They will still get them of course but they will be in less of a rush.

    Syria changes everything again.

    I don't think there will be a cap on T-50s numbers. 160 or 200 of doesn't matter. Look at Su-27. It's derivatives are still rolling off the production lines with no signs of stopping.

    Same will happen with T-50 over time.

    T-47

    Posts : 79
    Points : 81
    Join date : 2017-07-17
    Location : Planet Earth

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  T-47 on Sat Aug 05, 2017 5:39 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    From everything I gathered it looks like that VKS is not only satisfied with performance of Su-30/34/35, they are extatic.

    They did not expect them to prove themselves this well and coupled with advances in SAMs and radars they feel that they can keep relying on them more than they expected.

    This would mean that they are not in a hurry to get T-50s as much as before. They will still get them of course but they will be in less of a rush.

    Syria changes everything again.

    I don't think there will be a cap on T-50s numbers. 160 or 200 of doesn't matter. Look at Su-27. It's derivatives are still rolling off the production lines with no signs of stopping.

    Same will happen with T-50 over time.

    Agreed, you don't need stealth in all cases.
    avatar
    PapaDragon

    Posts : 5033
    Points : 5141
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:00 pm

    Looks like 11th one is flying:

    https://naked-science.ru/article/tech/novyy-su-57-sovershil-svoy-pervyy

    Article:

    http://theduran.com/russias-new-su-t-50-fifth-generation-fighter-gets-new-engine-and-new-name/

    Svyatoslavich

    Posts : 321
    Points : 330
    Join date : 2015-04-22
    Location : Buenos Aires

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Svyatoslavich on Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:59 am

    Until there isn't something more official (from Sukhoi, for example), we can't be really sure. Until now,. Sukhoi has always confirmed the first flight in the same day, and pictures appeared a couple of days later.
    By the way, what about T-50-10? Is it a static test frame (like T-50-7), or will it fly later?
    avatar
    Big_Gazza

    Posts : 711
    Points : 731
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Big_Gazza on Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:31 pm

    Looks like it is now official: The PAK FA or Sukhoi T-50 will receive the service designation of Su-57.

    https://www.rt.com/news/399291-fifth-generagion-fighter-named/

    The Russian military will name the country’s first fifth-generation fighter jet ‘Sukhoi Su-57,’ the commander of the Russian Air Force has confirmed. The aircraft was dubbed ‘PAK FA’ and ‘T-50’ during its development.

    “The decision has been taken, the plane has been christened. Su-57 is what we are going to call it now,” Gen. Col. Viktor Bondarev told Zvezda, the Russian Defense Ministry’s official TV channel.
    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 10245
    Points : 10733
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  George1 on Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:43 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:Looks like it is now official:  The PAK FA or Sukhoi T-50 will receive the service designation of Su-57.

    https://www.rt.com/news/399291-fifth-generagion-fighter-named/

    The Russian military will name the country’s first fifth-generation fighter jet ‘Sukhoi Su-57,’ the commander of the Russian Air Force has confirmed. The aircraft was dubbed ‘PAK FA’ and ‘T-50’ during its development.

    “The decision has been taken, the plane has been christened. Su-57 is what we are going to call it now,” Gen. Col. Viktor Bondarev told Zvezda, the Russian Defense Ministry’s official TV channel.

    Yes.
    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2782390.html

    Now it is only left to know the NATO code-name


    _________________
    "There's no smoke without fire.", Georgy Zhukov


    par far

    Posts : 1404
    Points : 1561
    Join date : 2014-06-26

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  par far on Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:22 pm

    George1 wrote:
    Big_Gazza wrote:Looks like it is now official:  The PAK FA or Sukhoi T-50 will receive the service designation of Su-57.

    https://www.rt.com/news/399291-fifth-generagion-fighter-named/

    The Russian military will name the country’s first fifth-generation fighter jet ‘Sukhoi Su-57,’ the commander of the Russian Air Force has confirmed. The aircraft was dubbed ‘PAK FA’ and ‘T-50’ during its development.

    “The decision has been taken, the plane has been christened. Su-57 is what we are going to call it now,” Gen. Col. Viktor Bondarev told Zvezda, the Russian Defense Ministry’s official TV channel.

    Yes.
    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2782390.html

    Now it is only left to know the NATO code-name


    Who cares.

    Svyatoslavich

    Posts : 321
    Points : 330
    Join date : 2015-04-22
    Location : Buenos Aires

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Svyatoslavich on Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:01 am

    NATO codenames make no sense at all since we now know the original designation.
    Hell, what am I saying.... NATO makes no sense at all.
    avatar
    Big_Gazza

    Posts : 711
    Points : 731
    Join date : 2014-08-25
    Location : Melbourne, Australia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Big_Gazza on Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:00 am

    George1 wrote:Now it is only left to know the NATO code-name

    Given that HATO codes names are a complete wank and are chosen to be as demeaning as possible, it'll be something less than illustrious...

    Flouncer... Flopper... Flatworm... maybe the'll bring back fish-based names? Fishboard, Fishcake, Fishbox, blah blah, endless HATOstani drivel....

    I wonder what the RuAF boys will call her?
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16315
    Points : 16946
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  GarryB on Sat Aug 12, 2017 2:05 pm

    Actually what you guys are talking about is the ASCC code names used to identify Soviet and Russian and other aircraft (Chinese etc).

    I remember reading an article in a western magazine about the process where names were changed to make them less flattering... the MiG-15 was going to be called Falcon originally, but was changed to Fagot... the Tu-22 was originally going to be called Beauty... but that was changed to Blinder.

    My suggestion is the Scottish martial art of Fuk-U...


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    PapaDragon

    Posts : 5033
    Points : 5141
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon on Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:34 pm

    GarryB wrote:Actually what you guys are talking about is the ASCC code names used to identify Soviet and Russian and other aircraft (Chinese etc).

    I remember reading an article in a western magazine about the process where names were changed to make them less flattering... the MiG-15 was going to be called Falcon originally, but was changed to Fagot... the Tu-22 was originally going to be called Beauty... but that was changed to Blinder.

    My suggestion is the Scottish martial art of Fuk-U...

    Considering that Tu-22 carried nukes I'd say Blinder is definitely appropriate. Sounds cool.

    I heard that they are sitting on name Firefox (like the movie) for next Russian fighter jet.
    avatar
    franco

    Posts : 2396
    Points : 2434
    Join date : 2010-08-18

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  franco on Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:39 pm

    Maybe the F(ph)antom Suspect
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16315
    Points : 16946
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  GarryB on Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:50 am

    Can't be Phantom with any spelling... these words have to be clear even over bad radio communications, so having a Russian plane called the same thing as something in the German Air Force or the Air Force of Iran does not make sense and breaks their rules.

    Having a Blinder of a game is having a good game, so I suspect that label slipped in because the powers that be misunderstood the context.

    Ironically the Tu-22M family have a heavy SEAD role with large ARM weapons like the Kh-22M to engage land based radar and major SAM bases, so Blinder would have worked there too.

    Of course all the confusion regarding the Tu-22Ms existence and creation seems to suggest a little backfire in the plan to get it operational, though it is a much better aircraft especially in the last model M3 version.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    hoom

    Posts : 530
    Points : 530
    Join date : 2016-05-06

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  hoom on Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:55 pm

    If there is any justice it'll be Firefox Cool

    Great pic from MAKS via Reddit

    T-47

    Posts : 79
    Points : 81
    Join date : 2017-07-17
    Location : Planet Earth

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  T-47 on Sat Aug 19, 2017 3:42 pm

    I'd reserve the name Firefox for MiG-41 (Or whatever the new interceptor designation)
    avatar
    hoom

    Posts : 530
    Points : 530
    Join date : 2016-05-06

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  hoom on Sat Aug 19, 2017 3:57 pm

    Hmm, you may be right Razz
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16315
    Points : 16946
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  GarryB Today at 10:39 am

    Well Firefox was supposed to be a mach 5 plus aircraft...

    But isn't there a military call sign of fox fire to denote a weapon launch or something?

    That might make such a combination ineligible.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    PapaDragon

    Posts : 5033
    Points : 5141
    Join date : 2015-04-26
    Location : Fort Evil, Serbia

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  PapaDragon Today at 12:37 pm


    Firestorm?

    Sponsored content

    Re: PAK-FA, T-50: News #4

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:32 pm