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    Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

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    Bolt

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Bolt on Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:24 pm

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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  calm on Sun Dec 11, 2016 5:54 pm

    45.35 - 54.47
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    eehnie

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  eehnie on Sun Dec 11, 2016 7:44 pm

    GarryB, the alone purpose of the list was to remind which weapons are available today in the Russian arsenals and in what degree, that can be used to give to the big amounts of Syrian soldiers something above the man-portable material. The purpose was to have in an small place a list of heavy warfare where you can find for sure the weakest/less capable/less modern weapons that Russia has today in order to see what can go to Syria.

    It is possible to talk extensively about the use and specifications of every weapon, but this was not the purpose. In adition to the names of the weapons I added only the nominal group to make more clear the list, and a little comment about the bigger or lower availability of every weapons group. You can like it or not but towed Surface-Air, Surface-Surface and Artillery weapons have been replaced by self propelled weapons of the same types since the 1960s, and it has not been new orders of heavy towed warfare or development of new heavy towed warfare for the Russian Armed Forces since the the fall of the Sovietic Union (1991) except in the case of some of the biggest Surface-Surface missiles, which purpose you know. This is the reality.

    Then better to remind the list again:

    Surface-Air Towed: (Gradually replaced by equivalent self propelled weapons)
    ZU-23-2 23mm

    Artillery Towed: (Gradually replaced by equivalent self propelled weapons)
    2B9 Vasilek 82mm
    2A19/29 (M)T-12 100mm
    2B16 Nona-K 120mm
    2A36 Giatsint-B 152mm
    2A18 D-30 122mm
    2A65 Msta-B 152mm

    Surface-Air Self Propelled: (Reserves not satured)
    SA-13
    ZSU-23-4 23mm
    SA-4 without ammunition (missiles)
    SA-6
    SA-8

    Surface-Surface Self Propelled: (Reserves satured)
    BM-21 Grad
    SS-1 Scud
    SS-C-3
    SS-21 Tochka
    BM-27

    Artillery Self Propelled: (Reserves satured)
    2S9 120mm
    2S23 120mm
    2S3 152mm
    2S4 240mm
    2S7 203mm
    2S1 122mm

    Tanks: (Reserves satured)
    T-80 125mm
    T-72 125mm

    Infantry: (Reserves in the point of saturation)
    BTR-60 (not sure if availabe)
    BMD-1
    BTR-70
    BMP-1
    BRDM-2
    BTR-D
    BMD-2

    Interceptor: (Reserves not satured)
    MiG-25
    MiG-31

    Fighters + Fighters Air Superiority: (Reserves not satured)
    MiG-23
    MiG-29/35

    Ground Attack: (Reserves satured)
    Su-25
    MiG-27
    Su-17/20/22
    Su-24

    Strategic Bombers: (Reserves not satured)
    Tu-95
    Tu-22

    Multirole: (Reserves not satured)
    Su-30

    Maritime Patrol: (To be gradually replaced as warfare concept by strategic bombers with antisubmarine capabilities + reconnaissance shipborne UAVs of long range)
    Be-12
    Il-38
    Tu-142

    Combat Helicopters: (To be gradually replaced as warfare concept by equivalent unmanned helicopters)
    Mi-24/25/35
    Mi-14
    Ka-27/28/29/31/32/35
    Mi-28
    Ka-50/52

    and try to think which are the weakest/less capable/less modern heavy weapons that Russia can send to Syria. Taking into account the details about every weapon that can not be explained in the list, my conclussion is the following:

    1.- 2B9 Vasilek 82mm (maybe until to finnish them)
    2.- ZU-23-2 23mm (maybe until to finnish them, around 450 in 2012)
    3.- (M)T-12 100mm
    4.- ?

    Reasons to be considered in my opinion the weakest/less capable/less modern of the list (without forget their positive features):
    - Heavy weight that makes them towed weapons, which means to have not own mobility. To have some mobility it is necessary weapon+vehicle.
    - Lack of protection for their crews while are used.
    - Good availability of the weapons of its group in the Russian arsenals.
    - Additional vulnerability if can work only inside the range of the portable/man-portable weapons of the adversary. The case of the 2B9, the ZU-23-2 (except in its initial anti-aircraft role) and the (M)T-12.
    - High relative age.
    - Lower fire power compared to the weapons of (at least) their weight+role.

    Which is your alternative to the 2B9 and the ZU-23-2? It is easy to criticise without give alternative, but Russia would need alternative to send to Syria.


    Last edited by eehnie on Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:41 am; edited 9 times in total
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sun Dec 11, 2016 7:59 pm

    calm wrote:45.35 - 54.47

    Couple of nice take outs at 50+, there's one headshot straight out of Hollywood.



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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  PapaDragon on Sun Dec 11, 2016 8:54 pm

    calm wrote:45.35 - 54.47



    50:39 it's than new Kalashnikov combat robot but was that taken in Syria? Sand kinda looks like it...

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    auslander

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  auslander on Sun Dec 11, 2016 9:08 pm

    It do certainly look like it, don't it? Be nice to have some verification, and I'll quality that before a couple retards chime in as 'ironclad verification, not someones juvenile fantasies'.
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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  calm on Mon Dec 12, 2016 1:15 am

    "Colonel Vadim" from @vesti_news Ru SOF report is Vadim Baikulov who was awarded Hero of Russia for Syria in March 2016

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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  KiloGolf on Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:26 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    calm wrote:45.35 - 54.47

    Couple of nice take outs at 50+, there's one headshot straight out of Hollywood.


    woah!

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    franco

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  franco on Mon Dec 12, 2016 2:49 am

    See mention that the Tu.214R flew back to Russia from Syria today and was heading to Kazan which is where the factory is located. Wonder if we will hear what that is all about?

    Vann7

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Vann7 on Mon Dec 12, 2016 7:51 am

    Most see video.. Russian special forces operations in Syria.  
    There is a lot of fun stuff of Russian soldiers in action blowing up terrorist
    and others nice shots Smile

    Video is larger version of one posted before.


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    Khepesh

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Khepesh on Mon Dec 12, 2016 9:51 am

    While there are of course Arabs who can organize and fight, the Egyptian Lt. General Saad El Shazly who organized the crossing of the Suez in 1973, they are, as I think we all know, long on fiery speeches and boasting, but have nothing behind them. Often were they have had some success it is because there is a European directly leading them or controlling behind the scenes. In 19th Century the Ottoman general staff was led for a time by Mehmed Ali Pasha, but known as Ludwig to his friends as he was born in Brandenburg. In the 19th Century the Prussians-Germans created the best general staff system in the world. Jordan lost Jerusalem and the West Bank, but they were not humiliated and their small tank forces fought very well. And who was the creator of Jordanian Army? Glubb Pasha, otherwise known as Lt. General Sir John Bagot Glubb, an Englishman. Then there is the most famous of all "Arab" leaders, Laurence of Arabia, and without him there may not even have ever been a Jordan and Syria. Pride is important to Arabs, as to all of us, but they have shown they can accept foreign leadership and that they have had the greatest successes under foreign leadership. Perhaps now time for a Russian general to be in Damascus in active command, perhaps some "Ivan Pasha".....
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:51 am

    franco wrote:See mention that the Tu.214R flew back to Russia from Syria today and was heading to Kazan which is where the factory is located. Wonder if we will hear what that is all about?

    SAR issue.
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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  calm on Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:38 pm

    english subs
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  KiloGolf on Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:25 am









    AegeanHawk
    ‏@AegeanHawk
    #AlexandrTkachenko fully loaded #RussianArmy #military vehicles en route to #Syria #ChiosStrait
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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  calm on Thu Dec 15, 2016 11:16 am

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    zg18

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  zg18 on Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:18 am

    Russian soldiers in Aleppo with new cammo


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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:37 pm

    Specter-D/AR? Omg pls guys mind those uniforms, Ukrops are going to get cwazy!
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    JohninMK

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  JohninMK on Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:41 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:




    AegeanHawk
    ‏@AegeanHawk
    #AlexandrTkachenko fully loaded #RussianArmy #military vehicles en route to #Syria #ChiosStrait
    All we can see is the top deck. The interesting stuff is safely out of sight on the lower deck and protected from the sea breezes and nosy eyes.

    This is a Ro-Ro ferry that we have heard or seen very little about since she was acquired. I can only remember one other picture of her activities on the Syrian Express. Being a 'civilian merchant ship' probably helps but it also adds some substance to the 700,000 tons shipped to Syria claim as one trip by her is equal many of the very well reported Large Landing Craft trips.
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    zorobabel

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  zorobabel on Mon Dec 19, 2016 5:38 pm

    The Russian ambassador to Turkey has been shot.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Militarov on Mon Dec 19, 2016 6:37 pm

    zorobabel wrote:The Russian ambassador to Turkey has been shot.

    Killed*
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    eehnie

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  eehnie on Mon Dec 19, 2016 6:52 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    zorobabel wrote:The Russian ambassador to Turkey has been shot.

    Killed*

    According to some news:

    "The gunman who had shot and killed the Russian ambassador to Turkey Andrei Karlov is identified as Mevlüt Meet Altıntaş, 22, a (riot) police officer from Ankara, Turkey."
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Militarov on Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:07 pm

    eehnie wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    zorobabel wrote:The Russian ambassador to Turkey has been shot.

    Killed*

    According to some news:

    "The gunman who had shot and killed the Russian ambassador to Turkey Andrei Karlov is identified as Mevlüt Meet Altıntaş, 22, a (riot) police officer from Ankara, Turkey."

    Yes.



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    Hannibal Barca

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Hannibal Barca on Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:13 pm

    There are really only two options. Either Erdogan did this or someone who wants to undermine Erdogan. Russia should define who is behind and react accordingly.
    IMO Russia does a great job and how establishment receive this is the perfect indication. As of Turkey is really turning into a failed state.
    It is not a remote possibility to have the fate of Syria I think.
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    zorobabel

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  zorobabel on Mon Dec 19, 2016 7:27 pm

    Erdogan has allowed this tumor to spread. He thinks he can harness Islamo-fascism for his own purposes.

    Vann7

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #11

    Post  Vann7 on Mon Dec 19, 2016 10:24 pm

    And this are the so called "moderates", a muslin who worked as police and who appears
    to be civilized for his business like clothing ,and appearance. 

    This all shows there is a serious problem with Islam,that nobody wants to admit. About the
    low morals and values that islam promote.. 
     He goes and kill a civilian diplomat in Turkey and later praise his fake GOD as if he thinks what he did was heroic and something to be praised. So he committed a suicide ,because there was no way he could escape alive. And this shows exactly why the middle east is the Hell hole it is. Were a significant part of the muslins.. shows so low morals and values and so little appreciation not only for other lives but also for their own. and are so brainwashed to think ,there is a God anywhere supporting his criminal actions.

    his kind of behavior is not different than ISIS , after they commit a crime on an unarmed
    civilians ,they scream like crazy Alak wahakabar. like a zombie religious fanatic will do. 

    This is why Muslins will never have peace.. as long they do not abandon Islam. They cannot get along with each other. Neither Shia with Sunnis.. neither SUnnis with Sunnis , their religion does not teach them to have tolerance for other opinions that thinks differently and neither Islam teach muslins to appreciate their lives.. They actually praise people that kill themselves as martyr in the name of 
    their fanatic religion and fake God.  Only when muslins realize there is a real problem with Islam
    and it is what allows nations like US and Israel to easily turn muslins to fight each other for decades ,while they wait every side ,exterminate each other for later them take the Oil for them.

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