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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

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    Ispan

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  Ispan on Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:21 pm

    Btw, we should start a new thread

    More info available on the attack on Krasnogorovka sector. I was puzzled of why the Novorussians would attack precisely here, it was a response to mortar shelling on Donetsk residential areas from this outpost.

    Scale seems to have been much larger than a simple coup de main against a platoon blockhouse. Given the panic in Ukrainian networks and the involvement of tanks and BMP it was at least a company sized attack. Casualties in this fight must have been into the dozens, on both sides, easily equating normal daily casualties on all the front.

    The Novorussians not only took the position but even prowled all the way to Krasnogorovka proper, though these were just probing attacks during the pursuit phase.


    Mage reckons that the casualties must be also high on the Novorussian side as it was the attacker, but all reports coincide that the Ukrops were taken by surprise and the position was easily taken. Most NAF casualties must have been incurred in the follow up fights, the probing towards the town and holding late against Ukrainian bombardments and counterattacks, though with the tables turned, the Ukranians must have suffered much more casualties in attempting to retake the position.


    Mage believes that the own losses wich are significant, is why there has been silence in the Novorussian media regarding this operation. Though I believe it as as likely that it has been censored for political reasons, since this was the first time since 2015 that the NAF are allowed to make an attack and gain ground

    http://chervonec-001.livejournal.com/1943325.html

    Google trans. excerpt


    Here is a chronicle of events:

    On the night from Thursday to Friday, from 13 to 14 July, the APU opened a mortar shell at Staromikhaylovka. I emphasize, not our positions, namely residential buildings. Two houses were damaged. One civilian was wounded. In the morning there was a report of the correspondent of VGTRK Alexander Sladkov.
    - On the night from Friday to Saturday from 14 to 15 July, the shelling was repeated, but already more powerful, artillery worked.
    - On Saturday evening, July 15, again, there was artillery shelling.
    - On Sunday evening, July 16, again shelling and again destroyed houses in Staromikhaylovki.
    - In the morning there was a report about the press service of the NM DNR.
    - In the night from Monday to Tuesday 17 on 18 July, a civilian died in Staromikhaylovka, one more civilian was killed and another two were injured, another civilian was injured in Kuibyshev district.
    - On Tuesday, July 18th, that part of the front was quiet.
    - But on Wednesday July 19, Thursday July 20 and until Friday July 21, every evening and night Petrovsky district, Staromikhailovka Kirov district and the Kuibyshev district was subjected to strong mortar and artillery strikes. Every day there were wounded civilians, as well as destroyed houses and infrastructure.

    Most likely, from 19 to 20 July, an order was given to suppress the mortar and artillery batteries of the APU with available means, which have been killing civilians and military republics for a week already. The next day, Ukrainian media filled the news with the fact that Novorussians attacked their positions and even beaten something there. Reported about the many dead servicemen of the Armed Forces and so on. Although according to the information provided by the Ukrainian media, 9 soldiers were quoted, and only 4 were killed in the Krasnogorovka district.

    Notice in the Svetlodarsk arc area in December 2016, they had killed 80 soldiers and injured more than 200, but there was a silence in the Ukrainian media. The same situation occurred with the exacerbation of the YaBP in January 2017, there were also many deaths of about 60 servicemen and about 120 were wounded and were also quiet.

    And here 9 was lost, and on all 450 km to the front and such attention.


    Comment: IMO, "Mage" is wrong and misjudging events somewhat. There indeed was a Novorussian attack and was larger than a simple raid. The fact that they attacked at all, and did so with tank support triggered a panic among both the Ukranian defenders of the position, that fled as soon as they saw they were outnumbered and outgunned, and the Ukranian networks, wich activated the "The Russians are coming!" script, admitting ten dead in a single day is a fearful blow to the Ukrainian morale, wich keeps pretending there is no war and just there are a few casualties through accidents and non-combat losses everyday. As "Mage" points out, 10 dead that is just the daily average for the whole front on a quiet day.

    So in order to cover tens of dead, they make a lot of noise and flag waving about a fraction of them, and attributing them to other causes (mines, accidental explosions) other than they have lost a position. Covering a big lie with a small lie with some truth in it.

    Only a single prisoner was taken in the position, wich suggests most of the platoon was wiped out in the fight, that would make at least 20 dead in the first night alone. Judging by previous experience, and the intensity of the fighting reported probably the actual casualties are similar to the examples from the winter quoted above.

    ATLASCUB

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  ATLASCUB on Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:33 am

    Mattis visit will be a good one to follow...

    A lot will be happening soon, starting tomorrow with the sanctions vote. Not so much the deep state pushing the sanctions in Congress but Trump's veto...a yes or a no.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:45 pm

    ATLASCUB wrote:Mattis visit will be a good one to follow...

    A lot will be happening soon, starting tomorrow with the sanctions vote. Not so much the deep state pushing the sanctions in Congress but Trump's veto...a yes or a no.

    Trump's veto boils down to two things: either he veto the whole thing due to lack of evidence of Russian election interference or he signs the bill thus admitting that he came into office illegally​ and should be impeached.

    Let's see how intelligent Orange Orangutan really is. But if he thinks that he will get democrats and neocons off his back by signing the bill then he is in for a big surprise because what comes after that will be a child's play compared to now.

    Also it look like Tillerson has had enough and has decided to leave the whole shitshow:

    https://sputniknews.com/us/201707251055846370-tillerson-early-resignation/

    JohninMK

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:44 pm

    A Trump veto can be overturned by a 2/3 majority in Congress so don't assume he can, or even will.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  miketheterrible on Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:30 pm

    So that Volker guy wants to sell weapons to Kiev since he said it shouldn't be a problem. I think that is violation of Minsk in itself. Glad Putin at least stated Ukraine is breaking the agreements.

    https://en.news-front.info/2017/07/25/putin-kiev-failed-to-enact-minsk-accords-in-normandy-4-phone-talks/

    Guy is a dipshit and I would be happy if he stepped on a landmine
    https://www.novorosinform.org/news/72588
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/40712385
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    franco

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  franco on Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:00 pm

    A John McCain man.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  ATLASCUB on Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:53 pm

    JohninMK wrote:A Trump veto can be overturned by a 2/3 majority in Congress so don't assume he can, or even will.

    His veto will be more of a symbolic action rather than a substantive action. The man has been conquered by the bureaucracy/deep state so it's more about him still waging a fight or waving the white flag for the billionth time. His domestic agenda has been hijacked and his foreign policy is almost non-existent. The man is all but defeated and we're not even a year in. People in his own administration conspire to get him impeached - I mean it's impressive watch. Impeachment will be one of the most blatant coup de'tat in american political history. Either he gets impeached or he co-opts to stay afloat and ride his term. Co-opting will make him merely a puppet with his strings pulled. It takes a lot of moral degradation and abuse to subject oneself, a man like Trump (who had everything and didn't need the presidency), to be the subject of his enemies - political hacks and spooks. Empire problems...

    As it concerns Russia... the "unacceptable state of relations" will become the new normal, ink dried - and there is nothing Russia can do about it - other than escalate - something Russia is avoiding like a plague...for obvious reasons. Blow after blow....
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  miketheterrible on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:37 pm

    franco wrote:A John McCain man.

    tell me about it. The Russians I think want to get the US to make the first move in helping break Minsk agreement so it forces the Russians to act that would benefit them. I can't think of any other reason to keep approving idiots who are technically banned (their organizations) from Russia while being a medium during Ukraine issue.

    According to Graham, this dolt never went beyond the ATO line.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:59 pm

    Roll up! Roll up! Once in a generation bargains. Take your place (if you are invited) for the Great Ukrainian Fire Sale.

    Maybe it took so long for good reasons. Perhaps they had to flush from the 'in crowd' those TPTB didn't want to benefit? Also, they most importantly had have the time to publicly establish, with the attempted port sale last year which generated almost zero interest, some really low price expectations.

    This was necessary so that the prices that will be achieved (already agreed with known purchasers?) don't look like another blatant asset strip by the Western banksters of an ex USSR economy, albeit this one is a bit delayed compared to Russia and Poland.


    Almost 900 state companies will be privatized in Ukraine before the end of 2020, including large banks, industrial plants and three film studios. Their list was promulgated by the Ministry of Economic Development and Trade of the country. "Out of 3444 state enterprises, 893 are subject to privatization in 2017-2020" - the press service of the ministry said.

    Among the largest assets to be privatized are the State Food and Grain Corporation of Ukraine, Oschadbank, Privatbank, the State Export-Import Bank of Ukraine, the company Centrenergo, the Agrarian Fund, Ukrgazbank and Turboatom.

    The companies of Ukraine's Medicines, Electrotyazhmash Plant, Electronmash, a number of mines and trading seaports, salt plants (State Enterprise Genichesky Solezavod and State Enterprise Artemsol) are planning to privatize over the next three years. The same goes for the National Circus of Ukraine and circuses in such areas as Kharkiv, Dnepropetrovsk, Zaporizhzhya, Odessa, Lviv.

    National film studio of feature films named after Alexander Dovzhenko, Ukrainian studio of documentary films and Ukrainian film studio of animated films are similarly looking for a buyer. The list also includes the Ukrainian state construction corporation Ukrbud, Aerosvit Airlines, and others.


    http://www.fort-russ.com/2017/07/ukraine-for-sale-900-state-owned.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Wed Jul 26, 2017 1:07 pm

    Not sure of what, why and when on this, the link just points at north of Donetsk.

    Liveuamap‏ account @Liveuamap 10m10 minutes ago

    Ukraine cut electricity to occupied parts of Donetsk and Luhansk regions https://liveuamap.com/en/2017/26-july-ukraine-cut-electricity-to-occupied-part-of-donetsk … via @HromadskeUA

    Hromadske.UA‏ @HromadskeUA

    З 26 липня на окуповану територію Донеччини не поставляють електроенергію
    From July 26 to the occupied territory of the Donetsk region does not supply electricity

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Wed Jul 26, 2017 1:45 pm

    A delay but the healthy interest rate clock is still running. Probably suits the Russians to delay it a bit.

    KIEV (Reuters) - A London court has agreed to a request from Ukraine to suspend judgment in a $3 billion Eurobond case brought by Russia until Kiev's appeal against the verdict is concluded, the Ukrainian finance ministry said on Wednesday.

    "The Court accepted Ukraine's position and granted a further suspension of the judgment until Ukraine's appeal has been concluded," the ministry said.

    It said the appeal would be heard by the English Court of Appeal in January 2018.
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    auslander

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  auslander on Wed Jul 26, 2017 4:08 pm

    JohninMK wrote:Not sure of what, why and when on this, the link just points at north of Donetsk.

    Kiev de facto did that long ago. Novorossiya has generated their own electric and gets some electric from Mother. No big deal on Kiev cutting the last few lines, they weren't in use for months.
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    Rodion_Romanovic

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  Rodion_Romanovic on Thu Jul 27, 2017 10:34 am

    https://www.rt.com/business/397547-ukraine-antonov-company-liquidation/

    it is starting the liquidation of Antonov, according to RT...

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:40 pm

    JohninMK wrote:A delay but the healthy interest rate clock is still running. Probably suits the Russians to delay it a bit.

    KIEV (Reuters) - A London court has agreed to a request from Ukraine to suspend judgment in a $3 billion Eurobond case brought by Russia until Kiev's appeal against the verdict is concluded, the Ukrainian finance ministry said on Wednesday.

    "The Court accepted Ukraine's position and granted a further suspension of the judgment until Ukraine's appeal has been concluded," the ministry said.

    It said the appeal would be heard by the English Court of Appeal in January 2018.
    A bit more on this, apparently the suspension referred to is stopping the Russians seizing Ukrainian assets prior to the appeal. In the meantime Moscow has issued this. Note that the interest that Kiev will have to pay due to their appeal is rolling up at over $670,000 a day.

    Yandex translated
    July 26, 2017, Moscow. Today, London's High Court has clarified the verdict from March 29, 2017, issued in favor of Russia's claim to Ukraine, filed in connection with default of the debtor on the debt to the Russian Federation.

    The court obliged Ukraine to pay the Russian Federation the par value of bonds in the amount of $ 3 billion. USA, in 2013, purchased with funds from the national welfare Fund, the unrealized amount of the coupon payment in the amount of $ 75 million. United States and penalty interest on these amounts. Interest on the principal amount of the bonds shall be payable at the rate of 8% per annum interest on the amount outstanding coupon rate "3-month LIBOR in US dollars plus 2% per annum". Penalty interest is calculated from 21 December 2015 and made on the date of full execution of the obligations. Thus, each day of delay will cost the state budget of Ukraine (Ukrainian taxpayer) more than 673 thousand. USA.

    In addition, the High Court of London has obliged Ukraine to compensate for Russian Federation part of the costs of judicial proceedings, in the amount of 2.8 million pounds, 50% of which the debtor must pay no later than September 20, 2017 moreover, the Court held that the requirement of Russia in respect of compensation by Ukraine of the rest of the costs incurred because of a debtor's obligations on the bonds, will be considered after the decision was filed in June this year, Ukraine's appeal against verdict of the High Court of London. Hearings in the Court of Appeal is scheduled for January 2018.

    In the short time remaining to appeal, the High Court in London extended until the expected verdict on appeal the validity of the previously adopted resolution, which excludes the possibility of adopting coercive measures to return Ukraine borrowed funds.

    The Ministry of Finance assumes that established the High Court of London, the facts will be the necessary and sufficient basis for approval by the Court of Appeal of the verdict in favor of Russia.

    The official web site of the Ministry of Finance of the Russian Federation: http://minfin.ru/ru/press-center/?id_4=34807&area_id=4&page_id=2119&popup=Y#ixzz4o1en0wzL
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  KiloGolf on Thu Jul 27, 2017 6:17 pm

    ever wondered what meth, KFC and bath salts does to a human?



    In Misha we trust lol1
    Total insanity.




    Porky has revoked his citizenship Laughing

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Jul 27, 2017 11:59 pm

    Still in Ukraine

    The former Governor of the Odessa Regional State Administration, Mikhail Saakashvili, has stated the following in an interview with one of the Ukrainian publications;

    "I'll stay here in Kiev, no problem, I'll stay in Kiev without citizenship" - Saakashvili said.

    Saakashvili is currently renting an apartment in Kiev, but he says he may leave in the Autumn. No one knows where to.

    "Or we'll see, maybe I'll buy something small here." We managed to sell one of our apartments in Georgia " - Saakashvili explained.

    He went on to criticise the Poroshenko government, who signed the decree for the loss of Saakashvili's citizenship, stating that the regime has sealed its own fate and will be finished in no time.

    Saakashvili is unlikely to return to Georgia, where he is wanted for trial. But he is good friends with Mr. Senator McCain - where will he be offered asylum, we wonder?


    http://www.fort-russ.com/2017/07/stateless-man-saakashvili-unphased-by.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  JohninMK on Fri Jul 28, 2017 12:08 am

    What is it guys like this are on?

    US special envoy to Ukraine continues to make arguments for the justification of new US arms deliveries to the Ukraine.

    "The troops of the DPR and LPR now have more tanks than all the countries of Western Europe combined." Where this is true or an exaggeration is unknown - it was stated by the US Special Representative for Ukraine, Kurt Volker, in an interview with the television channel "Now".

    "First, Russia is already in Ukraine with all its heavy weapons, there are now more tanks here than all the countries of Western Europe combined; it is a very, very large military contingent. An even larger contingent is concentrated in Russia at the borders Ukraine, Russia has every right to do this, this is its territory, they can deploy as many military personnel as they want, so this decision will not "provoke" Russia to do something they have not yet done. This will not change the balance of power " - noted Volker.

    In his view, the allocation of weapons to Ukraine "will not provoke Russia, but will provide an opportunity to protect itself in case of escalation of the conflict."

    "If we make this decision, it will enable Ukraine to protect itself if Russia takes further steps on Ukrainian territory." Russia says it does not do anything and is not going to do it. "If this is so, the supply of protective weapons then does not carry any risk " - he declared.


    http://www.fort-russ.com/2017/07/there-are-more-tanks-in-donbass-than.html
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    Ispan

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  Ispan on Fri Jul 28, 2017 4:55 pm

    The militia of DNR managed to advance their positions for half a kilometer and to push back  the Ukrainian group of punishers in yet another section of the front near Donetsk. This was reported in her blog by the military correspondent Marina Kharkova - the newspaper "Politnavigator"


    - Would be grateful if somebody found her blog.


    Also in Avdeyevka sector, read that thanks to incessant digging of saps, the Novorussians soon will drive forward their positions and have fire dominance over the disputed "Promko", the industrial zone.
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    GarryB

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  GarryB on Sat Jul 29, 2017 8:39 am

    In his view, the allocation of weapons to Ukraine "will not provoke Russia, but will provide an opportunity to protect itself in case of escalation of the conflict."

    "If we make this decision, it will enable Ukraine to protect itself if Russia takes further steps on Ukrainian territory." Russia says it does not do anything and is not going to do it. "If this is so, the supply of protective weapons then does not carry any risk " - he declared.

    I believe the term is "This guy is as thick as pig shit" applies here.

    If I understand it... his logic is that because Russia is arming the eastern ukrainians so they can defend themselves (without any actual evidence that they are actually arming them) then NATO should provide Kiev with weapons.

    He claims Russia wont respond to NATO arming Kiev but says NATO must respond to Russia arming the eastern ukrainians.

    What a dick.

    Perhaps when NATO arms Kiev the Russians might do more than just start arming the eastern ukrainians... evidence so far seems to show it is not the weapons that are the problem... ask Georgia or Saudi Arabia... flash new toys don't matter that much.


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    miketheterrible

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  miketheterrible on Sat Jul 29, 2017 8:42 am

    GarryB wrote:
    In his view, the allocation of weapons to Ukraine "will not provoke Russia, but will provide an opportunity to protect itself in case of escalation of the conflict."

    "If we make this decision, it will enable Ukraine to protect itself if Russia takes further steps on Ukrainian territory." Russia says it does not do anything and is not going to do it. "If this is so, the supply of protective weapons then does not carry any risk " - he declared.

    I believe the term is "This guy is as thick as pig shit" applies here.

    If I understand it... his logic is that because Russia is arming the eastern ukrainians so they can defend themselves (without any actual evidence that they are actually arming them) then NATO should provide Kiev with weapons.

    He claims Russia wont respond to NATO arming Kiev but says NATO must respond to Russia arming the eastern ukrainians.

    What a dick.

    Perhaps when NATO arms Kiev the Russians might do more than just start arming the eastern ukrainians... evidence so far seems to show it is not the weapons that are the problem... ask Georgia or Saudi Arabia... flash new toys don't matter that much.

    It has been indicated that the Russians are more than willing to help out the eastern Ukrainians.

    Which also brings up a funny point - they contradict themselves in the very same sentences. Firs they say Russia is responding by arming the eastern side (or outright calls them Russians), but state the Russian's wont retaliate if they arm Kiev. Isn't exactly what the Russians doing now is considered retaliation? Seems there is a serious decline in mental capabilities of the politicians in the United States.
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:44 am

    Savchenko announced her intention to run for President of Ukraine



    People's Deputy Nadiya Savchenko declared her intention to run for the post of head of the Ukrainian state. In an interview with the Glavkom news website published on Thursday, when asked if she would run, she replied, "I will take part. What will be after that will be seen later."

    "To participate in the presidential campaign, in reality, it doesn’t take much: 2.5 million hryvnia ($96,400 USD) to register. The fund is being opened and discussed candidly. I am collecting money for the Presidency," the parliamentarian said.

    http://uawire.org/news/savchenko-announced-her-intention-to-run-for-president-of-ukraine
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:03 pm



    lots of Polish kit and helmets seen here.
    Somebody seems to have sold out their own military's supplies to Ukropia.
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Jul 29, 2017 12:31 pm



    @07:07

    Is that an Ukrainian (look at double white strips) T-72 obj 1989, that they try to call "Russian"?
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Jul 29, 2017 2:33 pm



    what's the verdict on T-72B3 being present in Ukraine? True, false, what?
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

    Post  Regular on Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:34 am

    KiloGolf wrote:

    lots of Polish kit and helmets seen here.
    Somebody seems to have sold out their own military's supplies to Ukropia.

    Haha, look at comments on Youtube. Polish people are saying - we hate banderovci, fuck you fascist azov. Poles are not pro-russian by any means, but they don't pretend that shit doesn't smell!
    Also polish equipment is nothing new, it's their gov that supplied Ukrops.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #26

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