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    Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

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    GarryB
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  GarryB on Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:15 am

    They have a shortage of personnel in other areas... hopefully these people can be transferred to safer jobs that also need to be done, and that the automation in the new depots makes things much safer for everyone.


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    George1
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:29 am

    Russia to Substitute Over 50% of Ukrainian Defense Products by End of 2015

    Russia plans to replace over 50 percent of foreign-made products with domestically-built ones under its import substitution program, a representative of the Russian Defense Ministry said. He added that Russia's defense industry is developing more rapidly amid Western sanctions.

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) – The Russian Defense Ministry plans to replace over 50 percent of foreign products with domestically-built ones as part of its import substitution program which aims to provide alternatives to foreign defense industry components that are no longer available because of Western anti-Russia sanctions.

    "If we talk about Ukraine, we will substitute some of their components by 53% by the end of the year," a ministry representative told journalists on Friday, adding that the substitution of all the products will amount to 67 percent.

    He stressed that Russia’s defense industry is developing more rapidly amid sanctions imposed against Russia over its alleged involvement in the Ukrainian crisis.

    "We will construct many outdated units over again by ourselves, we do not need the old Ukrainian ones," the representative said.

    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/military/20150731/1025241887.html#ixzz3hSn6UDRb


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    Austin
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  Austin on Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:13 am

    I wonder how devaluation of Rouble affected the armament program , when rouble was 34 to a dollar the 20 trillion spending was around 650 Billion USD.

    Today the rouble at 60 its around half of that value and inflation too is much higher.

    So how does it affect the purchase and spending ?

    NationalRus
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  NationalRus on Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:20 am

    Austin wrote:I wonder how devaluation of Rouble affected the armament program , when rouble was 34 to a dollar the 20 trillion spending was around 650 Billion USD.

    Today the rouble at 60 its around half of that value and inflation too is much higher.

    So how does it affect the purchase and spending ?

    badly but it is managable so long nothing gets importet from the producing companies, as soon as a factory needs to import somthing the price will skyrocket under such a inflated rubel

    sepheronx
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Jul 31, 2015 1:41 pm

    Austin wrote:I wonder how devaluation of Rouble affected the armament program , when rouble was 34 to a dollar the 20 trillion spending was around 650 Billion USD.

    Today the rouble at 60 its around half of that value and inflation too is much higher.

    So how does it affect the purchase and spending ?

    60 Rub to USD isn't half first off (of what it was.  35rub/USD would make 70rub/usd half).  Second, inflation is at 0% so far these last months.

    As well, a huge portion of tech has been import substituted or found a cheaper alternative source (mostly China, South Korea, etc compared to USA, France, Germany).  So the devaluation but finding much cheaper source balanced it out.  Thirdly, since production is done by state run companies, costs of military goods for Russia is significantly less.  It was estimated that Su-3S for example may cost Russia in the $30+M range per aircraft, which is a lot cheaper than estimated export cost.

    As well, costs of the goods are in Roubles, so like NationalRus said, only parts that gets imported.  Domestic ones don't change or barely changes at all.  Major issue is cost of labour, and that still isn't a problem for Russia.

    NationalRus wrote:
    Austin wrote:I wonder how devaluation of Rouble affected the armament program , when rouble was 34 to a dollar the 20 trillion spending was around 650 Billion USD.

    Today the rouble at 60 its around half of that value and inflation too is much higher.

    So how does it affect the purchase and spending ?

    badly but it is managable so long nothing gets importet from the producing companies, as soon as a factory needs to import somthing the price will skyrocket under such a inflated rubel

    Are you sure it affects it badly?  Because we are not seeing it so far.  Orders are still huge, import substitution is now a thing, and they have increased drastically the modernization of the armed forces.

    ____________________________________________________________

    I suggest some people here start to familiarize themselves with concepts of GDP Nominal, GDP Purchasing Power Parity, and things like exchange rates.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purchasing_power_parity
    Important quote:
    For example, suppose that two countries produce the same physical amounts of goods as each other in each of two different years. Since market exchange rates fluctuate substantially, when the GDP of one country measured in its own currency is converted to the other country's currency using market exchange rates, one country might be inferred to have higher real GDP than the other country in one year but lower in the other; both of these inferences would fail to reflect the reality of their relative levels of production. But if one country's GDP is converted into the other country's currency using PPP exchange rates instead of observed market exchange rates, the false inference will not occur.

    and

    For example, if the value of the Mexican peso falls by half compared to the US dollar, the Mexican Gross Domestic Product measured in dollars will also halve. However, this exchange rate results from international trade and financial markets. It does not necessarily mean that Mexicans are poorer by a half; if incomes and prices measured in pesos stay the same, they will be no worse off assuming that imported goods are not essential to the quality of life of individuals. Measuring income in different countries using PPP exchange rates helps to avoid this problem.

    Effectively, if Russia is successful for even half or a tad more in import substitution, they can drop costs significantly.  Probably to more than what they were when Rouble was 35Rubs/USD.

    NationalRus
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  NationalRus on Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:09 pm

    Are you sure it affects it badly? Because we are not seeing it so far. Orders are still huge, import substitution is now a thing, and they have increased drastically the modernization of the armed forces.

    i didnt say thing were not getting bought anyway, but that doesnt mean that the bill isnt is higher now, so if a product is 100% made at home it isnt critical but if parts are imported or even materials are imported to make ourselfs parts = much higher bill with a weak rubel

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Jul 31, 2015 6:10 pm

    NationalRus wrote:
    Are you sure it affects it badly?  Because we are not seeing it so far.  Orders are still huge, import substitution is now a thing, and they have increased drastically the modernization of the armed forces.

    i didnt say thing were not getting bought anyway, but that doesnt mean that the bill isnt is higher now, so if a product is 100% made at home it isnt critical but if parts are imported or even materials are imported to make ourselfs parts = much higher bill with a weak rubel

    That is true, but the question is, which parts exactly? Now that the parts can no longer be purchased from the west, they have to be purchased elsewhere. I'll give an example: The MIPS processor for the Radar on Irbis-E was coming from a US based company. But since they can no longer purchase such processor, I imagine they will end up using their own MIPS (Be it Baikal processor), or the Elbrus 2C+ (which was proposed apparently for N036) or some other one from China or Taiwan.

    Many components before, were coming from the west. Now that a lot of those are pretty much none purchasable, I imagine they had to find alternatives. And in many cases, the alternatives from China/Taiwan/S.Korea are much cheaper than coming from the west.

    Then there is the fact that many components are still making its way from Ukraine to Russia. But the Hyrvina is doing pretty bad in itself (and they don't get the benefits behind a devalued currency since Ukraine barely produces much these days), so shouldn't be much more or any more expensive than before.

    BTW, I suggest people to go on over to the Economic thread that I started, and give your opinion as to if we should close all other economic threads to have just 1 thread.

    Thank you.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:08 am

    This guy has tremendous ideas!!

    Russian deputy PM suggests creating separate defense subprogram for engine-making


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  GarryB on Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:31 pm

    The main point is that with foreign technology now being so expensive it makes sense to buy domestic.

    The penalty is that the domestic model might not have the same performance as the imported model, but at least now the money being spent is being spent within the Russian economy instead of going into some foreigners pocket.

    Russian workers are earning money instead of foreign workers.


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  sepheronx on Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:53 pm

    Very true. But regarding performance one, the best part is for plants whom already make engines of a specific type, can start producing of multitude of types. As they already have experience in designing and making engines, they can use what they already designed and made, as the basis for the more powerful and capable engines. Example is the engines being used for the Steregushy corvettes and soon to be used for various types of Russia's surface fleet:

    http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/65865/?pid=675274#comments

    http://www.vz.ru/news/2015/5/12/744826.html

    http://www.kolomnadiesel.com/news/?id=721

    Project Canada
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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  Project Canada on Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:18 pm


    The penalty is that the domestic model might not have the same performance as the imported model, but at least now the money being spent is being spent within the Russian economy instead of going into some foreigners pocket.

    can't this be corrected overtime? like as local manufacturers gain experience from making their own production models, they should be able to update their products and come up with new and better designs periodically

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  GarryB on Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:53 am

    Another point is that when things are made overseas then Russian companies don't get money to invest in their products, so they have little chance of improving their products and becoming more competitive.


    there are of course negatives too... a Russian company might know it is the only choice for producing something in the volume required and therefore not work to develop their product... they get lazy...

    Hopefully that wont be a problem... and the money spent on domestic production and the experience gained in that production will lead to upgrading tooling and production methods to make them even more competitive on the international market...


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Sun Sep 20, 2015 7:06 pm

    Putin: MIC will consider six candidates of new general designer DIC


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  flamming_python on Mon Sep 21, 2015 2:53 pm

    George1 wrote:Putin: MIC will consider six candidates of new general designer DIC

    Yeah, as long as they don't put Rogozin as chief designer of the Russian MIC, I'm good with that.

    But I won't feel safe until I hear it's not so for sure, that guy seems to get around everywhere these days.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Sep 21, 2015 4:51 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    George1 wrote:Putin: MIC will consider six candidates of new general designer DIC

    Yeah, as long as they don't put Rogozin as chief designer of the Russian MIC, I'm good with that.

    But I won't feel safe until I hear it's not so for sure, that guy seems to get around everywhere these days.

    What makes you think he designs anything? Rogozin largely holds a figure-head position.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  PapaDragon on Mon Sep 21, 2015 5:44 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    George1 wrote:Putin: MIC will consider six candidates of new general designer DIC

    Yeah, as long as they don't put Rogozin as chief designer of the Russian MIC, I'm good with that.

    But I won't feel safe until I hear it's not so for sure, that guy seems to get around everywhere these days.

    Rogozin designs precisely nothing...

    From what I managed to piece together his job is to forcefully and repeatedly insert footwear up the posterior orifices of various underperforming MIC managers.

    Gotta say, he's been doing excellent job on that ''front'' since results are improving constantly. thumbsup

    Hand that holds the whip, rules the world! lol1

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Mon Sep 21, 2015 6:38 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    flamming_python wrote:
    George1 wrote:Putin: MIC will consider six candidates of new general designer DIC

    Yeah, as long as they don't put Rogozin as chief designer of the Russian MIC, I'm good with that.

    But I won't feel safe until I hear it's not so for sure, that guy seems to get around everywhere these days.

    Rogozin designs precisely nothing...

    From what I managed to piece together his job is to forcefully and repeatedly insert footwear up the posterior orifices of various underperforming MIC managers.

    Gotta say, he's been doing excellent job on that ''front'' since results are improving constantly. thumbsup

    Hand that holds the whip, rules the world! lol1

    He actually designed a good number during the negotiation with France. clown

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Tue Dec 29, 2015 4:21 pm

    Russia’s sole manufacturer of armored vehicles may grind to a halt over debts

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/847583


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  GarryB on Thu Dec 31, 2015 2:02 am

    Russias maker of tracked IFVs is not Russias only maker of armoured vehicles.

    UVZ makes armata and T-90s... Kamaz and several other manufacturers make armoured vehicles too.

    And the whole story is about not paying a gas bill... sounds like it is really sensationalist crap not actually worth posting...


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Wed Feb 10, 2016 12:11 am

    Russia’s only infantry fighting vehicle manufacturer files for bankruptcy

    KMZ in 2015 struck a long-term contract with Russia’s Defense Ministry to supply in 2015-2017 more than 200 BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicles to Russian army units

    YEKATERINBURG, February 9. /TASS/. A bankruptcy petition regarding Kurganmashzavod (KMZ) - Russia’s only enterprise manufacturing infantry fighting vehicles (BMP) - has been filed with the Kurgan Arbitration Court, the court press service told TASS Tuesday.

    The petitioner is MTE Group registered in Moscow.

    "The petition is connected with arrears on lease contracts of MTE Group and KMZ. Earlier the companies struck an amicable agreement, under which KMZ was to pay in two stages 41 million rubles ($515,000) of total debt on lease payments and some 1.9 million rubles ($23,800) of cancelation penalty," the press service said.

    The court said Kurganmashzavod only paid 276,000 rubles ($3,460) out of the debt. "That’s why MTE Group demands that the plant be recognized bankrupt and that a bankruptcy commissioner be appointed," it said.

    The petition was filed February 5 and has not yet been accepted for hearing. TASS was unable to get a comment from the plant.

    KMZ, making part of Tractor Plants concern, is Russia’s only enterprise producing infantry fighting vehicles being in operational service with the armies of nearly 30 countries.

    KMZ in 2015 struck a long-term contract with Russia’s Defense Ministry to supply in 2015-2017 more than 200 BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicles to Russian army units.

    KMZ had wage arrears and a debt for gas to Gazprom mezhregiongaz Kurgan company.

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/855565

    What a Face pale


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Sat Mar 05, 2016 7:08 am

    Kalashnikov arms manufacturer raised investment into production sites upgrade in 2015

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/economy/860412


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sat Mar 05, 2016 9:04 am

    George1 wrote:
    Russia’s only infantry fighting vehicle manufacturer files for bankruptcy

    KMZ in 2015 struck a long-term contract with Russia’s Defense Ministry to supply in 2015-2017 more than 200 BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicles to Russian army units

    YEKATERINBURG, February 9. /TASS/. A bankruptcy petition regarding Kurganmashzavod (KMZ) - Russia’s only enterprise manufacturing infantry fighting vehicles (BMP) - has been filed with the Kurgan Arbitration Court, the court press service told TASS Tuesday.

    The petitioner is MTE Group registered in Moscow.

    "The petition is connected with arrears on lease contracts of MTE Group and KMZ. Earlier the companies struck an amicable agreement, under which KMZ was to pay in two stages 41 million rubles ($515,000) of total debt on lease payments and some 1.9 million rubles ($23,800) of cancelation penalty," the press service said.

    The court said Kurganmashzavod only paid 276,000 rubles ($3,460) out of the debt. "That’s why MTE Group demands that the plant be recognized bankrupt and that a bankruptcy commissioner be appointed," it said.

    The petition was filed February 5 and has not yet been accepted for hearing. TASS was unable to get a comment from the plant.

    KMZ, making part of Tractor Plants concern, is Russia’s only enterprise producing infantry fighting vehicles being in operational service with the armies of nearly 30 countries.

    KMZ in 2015 struck a long-term contract with Russia’s Defense Ministry to supply in 2015-2017 more than 200 BMP-3 infantry fighting vehicles to Russian army units.

    KMZ had wage arrears and a debt for gas to Gazprom mezhregiongaz Kurgan company.

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/855565

    What a Face pale

    The petition hasn't been heard let alone awarded with actual judgement.

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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Tue Mar 22, 2016 1:36 am

    Crimean defense plants receive state contracts — Putin

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/863516


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Thu Mar 24, 2016 4:27 am

    Russia’s major tank producer restructures its debt to Czech Export Bank — official

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/economy/864640


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    Re: Status of Russian Military Industrial Complex (MIC)

    Post  George1 on Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:26 pm

    New facilities of Concern "Kalashnikov" in Izhevsk





















    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1875673.html


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