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    Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

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    George1

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  George1 on Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:33 pm

    The Ivan Gren is expected to join Russia’s Northern Fleet.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  Militarov on Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:38 am

    George1 wrote:
    The Ivan Gren is expected to join Russia’s Northern Fleet.

    Interesting. I expected it to go to some "warmer" fleet.
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    George1

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  George1 on Thu Jun 21, 2018 2:20 am

    Militarov wrote:
    George1 wrote:
    The Ivan Gren is expected to join Russia’s Northern Fleet.

    Interesting. I expected it to go to some "warmer" fleet.

    Here in bmpd also says the same

    the ship was included in the Russian Navy with enrollment in the 121st brigade of landing ships of the Kola Fleet of the Northern Fleet.

    Photos and videos also











    https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3244438.html
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:25 am

    Militarov wrote:
    George1 wrote:
    The Ivan Gren is expected to join Russia’s Northern Fleet.

    Interesting. I expected it to go to some "warmer" fleet.

    Same here but then I gave it a thought: Navy definitely seems pleased with results they have been getting out of leased civilian cargo ships for Syrian campaign so no point reinventing the wheel. They can always get plenty more of those if they need any.

    OTOH, resupplying bases in the Arctic requires ships that can beach themselves and offload cargo directly on the shore without infrastructure and Gren fits the bill perfectly.
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    George1

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  George1 on Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:48 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    George1 wrote:
    The Ivan Gren is expected to join Russia’s Northern Fleet.

    Interesting. I expected it to go to some "warmer" fleet.

    Same here but then I gave it a thought: Navy definitely seems pleased with results they have been getting out of leased civilian cargo ships for Syrian campaign so no point reinventing the wheel. They can always get plenty more of those if they need any.

    OTOH, resupplying bases in the Arctic requires ships that can beach themselves and offload cargo directly on the shore without infrastructure and Gren fits the bill perfectly.

    maybe we see some 1-2 Ropucha class from other fleets (Northern since they get the bigger Ivan Gren) to be transferred in BSF

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:28 am

    OTOH, resupplying bases in the Arctic requires ships that can beach themselves and offload cargo directly on the shore without infrastructure and Gren fits the bill perfectly.
    Huh, makes sense I guess.
    Also possibly noteworthy that Ru been complaining that Norway is receiving more occupation security guarantee Marines.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Thu Jun 21, 2018 1:38 pm

    Edit: I see that was posted already Embarassed

    Anyways it occurs to me there was talk of physically swapping the engines round due to issue with backing, has that actually been done?
    Its kinda a big operation & I don't recall seeing any sign of it spending time in drydock with a big hole cut in it that I'd have expected for that.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Mon Jun 25, 2018 5:56 am

    So Charly015 has this comparison with a Ropucha which I think is pretty interesting


    And according to ppl at Balancer part of the reason its such a weird looking thing is it was originally supposed to be able to transit the river/canal system, was going to look like this

    later that requirement was removed so they raised the superstructure.

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Tue Aug 07, 2018 6:18 am

    Couple of 'beauty' shots


    Nice lighting at least dunno
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:54 pm

    Second ship Petr Morgunov won't be comissioned this year. Sea trials are scheduled to commence in the first half of next year.

    https://structure.mil.ru/structure/forces/navy/news/more.htm?id=12198589@egNews
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    GarryB

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  GarryB on Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:05 am

    And according to ppl at Balancer part of the reason its such a weird looking thing is it was originally supposed to be able to transit the river/canal system, was going to look like this

    It has been mentioned that many of the problems were likely created because it was a scaled up river boat rather than a proper sea going ship design.
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:26 am

    GarryB wrote:It has been mentioned that many of the problems were likely created because it was a scaled up river boat rather than a proper sea going ship design.

    Yes and after the scalling up appeared an interesting question: how to make ship stable in more challenging sea conditions? Supposedly they solved the problem during long trials. Still it's interesting that only two ships will be made and there's entire fleet of Ropuchas and Alligators to substitute. And some of those ships are from 1960s. Perhaps we can expect new LST design in the 2020s...my vote would be for larger number of faster smaller ships, like US Spearhead class, but more with Ropucha-like displacement.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:07 pm

    IG is on the move for transition to Northern Fleet.
    I see it being part of Northern fleet was actually mentioned at top of the page but its really pretty surprising, I'd thought Baltic or BSF would be likely destination.
    Doesn't strike me that the North would have much demand for amphibious capability Suspect
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    Hole

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  Hole on Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:24 pm

    They will use the ship for aggressions against poor little NATO countries like Norway. Very Happy Wink
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  PapaDragon on Sat Oct 20, 2018 4:58 pm

    hoom wrote:IG is on the move for transition to Northern Fleet.
    I see it being part of Northern fleet was actually mentioned at top of the page but its really pretty surprising, I'd thought Baltic or BSF would be likely destination.
    Doesn't strike me that the North would have much demand for amphibious capability Suspect

    North Fleet is what this ship is perfect for

    Syrian War showed that you don't need amphibious vessels to support operation in this day and age, commercial ships are more than up for task 90% of time

    Green is useful up north because it can deliver stuff to isolated bases on unprepared beaches
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    medo

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  medo on Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:23 pm

    hoom wrote:IG is on the move for transition to Northern Fleet.
    I see it being part of Northern fleet was actually mentioned at top of the page but its really pretty surprising, I'd thought Baltic or BSF would be likely destination.
    Doesn't strike me that the North would have much demand for amphibious capability Suspect

    Northern fleet have big demand for capable transport ships. They have to support many new arctic bases on Arctic islands and to bring additional troops and equipment if needed. Of course they will supply those bases with transport planes as they have airbases, but larger cargos could be brought only by ships. Don't forget, Russian next big project after Crimean bridge is Arctic railroad. They already build Sabetto port and this Arctic transport route is very important for Russia as it have dirrect acces to open Atlantic ocean. Russia is investing a lot to protect this Arctic route and those IG ships and icebreakers are part of this protection structure.
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    SeigSoloyvov

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Sat Oct 20, 2018 8:20 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    hoom wrote:IG is on the move for transition to Northern Fleet.
    I see it being part of Northern fleet was actually mentioned at top of the page but its really pretty surprising, I'd thought Baltic or BSF would be likely destination.
    Doesn't strike me that the North would have much demand for amphibious capability Suspect

    North Fleet is what this ship is perfect for

    Syrian War showed that you don't need amphibious vessels to support operation in this day and age, commercial ships are more than up for task 90% of time

    Green is useful up north because it can deliver stuff to isolated bases on unprepared beaches

    Depends what you mean for support operations in wartime civilian cargo subs would be destroyed by subs with ease. Russia has no risk to it's transports naval wise so yeah those kinda ships are more then fine for the job.
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Sat Oct 20, 2018 9:56 pm

    [quote="medo"]
    hoom wrote:Northern fleet have big demand for capable transport ships. They have to support many new arctic bases on Arctic islands and to bring additional troops and equipment if needed.  Of course they will supply those bases with transport planes as they have airbases, but larger cargos could be brought only by ships. Don't forget, Russian next big project after Crimean bridge is Arctic railroad. They already build Sabetto port and this Arctic transport route is very important for Russia as it have dirrect acces to open Atlantic ocean. Russia is investing a lot to protect this Arctic route and those IG ships and icebreakers are part of this protection structure.

    Yes, even without the questions of Northern sea route and resources, Arctic was always no. 1 priority for Russian navy, before Mediterranean.

    Not every island even has its airfield (e.g. Wrangel is protected because of its nature and construction of airfield is not possible).

    Besides, how many Ropuchas and Alligators went to Syria in the past 3 years? I would say that civilian cargo ships complemented them and not the other way around. Renting ships isn't exactly cheap.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Sun Oct 21, 2018 4:39 am

    Green is useful up north because it can deliver stuff to isolated bases on unprepared beaches
    Good point, though woudn't you want an ice-strengthened hull with icebreaker type bow for that?
    There are a bunch of supply/support ships like that in-build, maybe it'll move South after more of those get completed?
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    eehnie

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  eehnie on Mon Oct 22, 2018 1:14 pm

    verkhoturye51 wrote:
    medo wrote:Northern fleet have big demand for capable transport ships. They have to support many new arctic bases on Arctic islands and to bring additional troops and equipment if needed.  Of course they will supply those bases with transport planes as they have airbases, but larger cargos could be brought only by ships. Don't forget, Russian next big project after Crimean bridge is Arctic railroad. They already build Sabetto port and this Arctic transport route is very important for Russia as it have dirrect acces to open Atlantic ocean. Russia is investing a lot to protect this Arctic route and those IG ships and icebreakers are part of this protection structure.

    Yes, even without the questions of Northern sea route and resources, Arctic was always no. 1 priority for Russian navy, before Mediterranean.

    Not every island even has its airfield (e.g. Wrangel is protected because of its nature and construction of airfield is not possible).

    Besides, how many Ropuchas and Alligators went to Syria in the past 3 years? I would say that civilian cargo ships complemented them and not the other way around. Renting ships isn't exactly cheap.

    Almost all them have been used many times in the Syrian operation, with many of them over 30 travels. You are right, civilian cargo ships complemented them and not the inverse.

    It is very unlikely to see Russia without amphibious ships. In overall terms the Project 1171 and the Project 775 ships made the strongest part of the operation, proving to be useful.

    Taking into account the result of the operation in Syria, I tend to think that is likely to see Russia increasing the tonnage of its amphibious fleet in the future, by replacing some <500 tons amphibous ships with bigger ships. It would allow to avoid the purchase of non-amphibious dry cargo auxiliary ships.
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    verkhoturye51

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  verkhoturye51 on Mon Oct 22, 2018 2:54 pm

    eehnie wrote:Taking into account the result of the operation in Syria, I tend to think that is likely to see Russia increasing the tonnage of its amphibious fleet in the future, by replacing some <500 tons amphibous ships with bigger ships. It would allow to avoid the purchase of non-amphibious dry cargo auxiliary ships.

    That's the plan. IG was just the beginning, they are continuing with 8000 ton ships and Priboys/Lavinas.

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom on Tue Oct 23, 2018 2:40 am

    IG arrived in North https://bmpd.livejournal.com/3387708.html
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    George1

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  George1 on Wed Nov 14, 2018 5:33 pm

    Russia to start trials of large amphibious assault ship next year

    The large amphibious assault ship Pyotr Morgunov was floated out at the Yantar Shipyard on the Baltic coast on May 25

    KALININGRAD, November 14. /TASS/. The large amphibious assault ship Pyotr Morgunov under construction at the Yantar Shipyard in Kaliningrad on order from Russia’s Defense Ministry will start trials no later than March 2019, Shipyard CEO Eduard Yefimov said on Wednesday.

    "The Pyotr Morgunov is in a high degree of its readiness. The ship is expected to accommodate the crew in January, enter trials no later than February-March and begin shipbuilders’ sea trials in June," the chief executive was quoted by the Shipyard’s newspaper Vperyod as saying.

    The large amphibious assault ship Pyotr Morgunov was floated out at the Yantar Shipyard on the Baltic coast on May 25.

    The Pyotr Morgunov is the first serial-produced Project 11711 warship designed by the Nevskoye Design Bureau. The contract on the warship’s construction was concluded with Russia’s Defense Ministry in September 2014 and the warship was laid down in June 2015.

    The Pyotr Morgunov is the largest in its class and displaces 5,000 tonnes. The warship is expected to be accepted for service in the Russian Navy after all of its trials are over.

    The Pyotr Morgunov will be able to take on its board 13 main battle tanks, or 36 armored personnel carriers or infantry fighting vehicles. An option is envisaged for taking a marine infantry battalion on its board.

    The amphibious assault ship can also transport a reinforced marine infantry company with organic military hardware and land it with the use of pontoons.

    The amphibious assault ship is armed with 30mm six-barrel artillery guns and two Kamov Ka-29 transport/attack helicopters in its deck hangars.

    The Project’s lead ship Ivan Gren was floated out in Kaliningrad in May 2012. It was accepted for service in the Russian navy on June 20, 2018. It arrived at the Northern Fleet’s man naval base of Severomorsk in late October.


    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/1030868

    hoom

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  hoom Yesterday at 2:50 am

    It was supposed to be entering service by the end of this year Neutral
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Project 11711E: "Ivan Gren" class

    Post  PapaDragon Yesterday at 3:13 am

    hoom wrote:It was supposed to be entering service by the end of this year Neutral

    C'mon, you didn't actually believed that did you?

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