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    Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

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    airstrike
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    Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  airstrike on Mon Sep 05, 2016 9:55 pm

    Russia to buy back T-80 tanks and BMP-3 IFVs from South Korea

    http://echelon-defense.com/2016/09/06/russia-to-buy-back-t-80-tanks-abd-bmp-3-ifvs-from-south-korea/

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    Post  d_taddei2 on Tue Sep 06, 2016 8:01 am

    airstrike wrote:Russia to buy back T-80 tanks and BMP-3 IFVs from South Korea

    http://echelon-defense.com/2016/09/06/russia-to-buy-back-t-80-tanks-abd-bmp-3-ifvs-from-south-korea/



    seems a bit strange surely Russia has enough T-80's to use as spare parts and BMP-3 as well. And T-80 are being slowly phased out. Would be nice to send them to Syria for SAA and Hez. lol

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Tue Sep 06, 2016 9:17 am

    It is most likely like the US wanting to buy back Australias Hornets so it can sell them new F-35s.

    Except in this case I suspect Russian will likely be offering South Korea a tank and an IFV rather more potent than the ones they already have... unlike the US offer to Australia...


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Tue Sep 06, 2016 11:44 am

    GarryB wrote:It is most likely like the US wanting to buy back Australias Hornets so it can sell them new F-35s.

    Except in this case I suspect Russian will likely be offering South Korea a tank and an IFV rather more potent than the ones they already have... unlike the US offer to Australia...

    This would be right if Russia and South Korea would be allies like the US and Australia are.

    I think more that Russia wants to retire these weapons from South Korea giving them some money that will not be enough for South Korea to replace them by American equivalent warfare.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  whir on Tue Sep 06, 2016 12:15 pm

    eehnie wrote:I think more that Russia wants to retire these weapons from South Korea giving them some money that will not be enough for South Korea to replace them by American equivalent warfare.
    Wishful thinking, it's just a simple repurchase since those tanks were the secured deposit of a loan.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:53 pm

    whir wrote:
    eehnie wrote:I think more that Russia wants to retire these weapons from South Korea giving them some money that will not be enough for South Korea to replace them by American equivalent warfare.
    Wishful thinking, it's just a simple repurchase since those tanks were the secured deposit of a loan.

    Then South Korea will pay more or less to replace them...

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Wed Sep 07, 2016 11:48 am

    South Korea took the T-80 as debt repayment in the first place.

    AFAIK they have been popular and done the job required... but I suspect Russia would prefer to sell them T-90s instead.

    I also suspect they will want to sell them upgraded BMP-3s with better hull arrangements and perhaps better armament.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Wed Sep 07, 2016 1:42 pm


    I doubt seriously Russia wants to put T-90s together with the tanks of the US.

    The alone goal of these T-90 in their entire life would be to defend the land from troops of the north (and I mean not from North Korea), or to go to the north together with the US tanks.

    So, no. Nothing of this is in the interest of Rusia.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Fri Sep 09, 2016 9:43 am

    I think Russia wants to turn South Korea away from its dependence and focus on the US and one of the best ways to do that is to start selling them weapons technology, and developing joint developments with them...

    Russia has to expand the countries it trades with.

    It has pretty much lost most of its eastern european market for political reasons... though given time that might come back to an extent, but Russia can't just ignore US aligned countries... previously it offered excellent prices and rugged and effective if not totally sophisticated equipment.

    The new stuff is as sophisticated as any western stuff but the price has not increased to equal western equipment... an opportunity...


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Mon Sep 12, 2016 12:02 am


    Diplomatically maybe, but between this and to give them comeptent weapons at competitive price...

    South Korea today is closer to the United States as ally than all the NATO countries except Canada and the United Kingdom.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Mon Sep 12, 2016 5:33 am

    South Korea today is closer to the United States as ally than all the NATO countries

    I am sure that is OK with the Russians.

    They don't want to steal all of Americas friends... there is no reason however why SK cannot be a friend to Russia and the US.

    Obviously the US might have a problem with that... they have a stupid with us or with the terrorists attitude to international relations, but Russia is not tied by such stupid notions and neither does SK need to be.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Mon Sep 12, 2016 11:24 am


    South Korea friend of Russia and the US at same time... Well this is not possible.

    Recently Russia give one condition to Japan about an agreement of the Kurile Islands, and it was just to broke with the US. The condition for South Korea for modern weapon sales would be just the same. And we know this will not happen.

    The recovery of the T-80s is just to see not them used against troops of Russia or their allies. Without them, if South Korea wants to spend the same for its replacement will have worse tanks, it South Korea wants tanks of the same level will need to spend more.

    I see a rare love in this forum for South Korea, Turkey or Saudi Arabia, which are involved in wars against allies of Russia.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  Project Canada on Mon Sep 12, 2016 11:36 am

    eehnie wrote:

    Recently Russia give one condition to Japan about an agreement of the Kurile Islands, and it was just to broke with the US. The condition for South Korea for modern weapon sales would be just the same. And we know this will not happen.


    I really hope it doesn't happen, control over the Kuril islands shouldn't be negotiated in the first place. Russia and Japan can still maintain good economic/trade deals despite Japan's annoying claims for the islands, and even if Japan stops trade with Russia, possession of the islands under Russia is still more important. At the minute these territories are handed to Japan expect American bases to sprout there like mushrooms! It's a very bad deal like that of Alaska..,

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Tue Sep 13, 2016 10:37 am

    South Korea are currently building an enormous ship yard in Russia that will end up making oil tankers and heavy gas carrier ships and some military vessels up to an including carriers...

    They are hardly enemies.

    The current SK SAM is based on the S-400 smaller missiles (9M96 and 9M96M).

    A lot of the western electronics the Russians had previously imported were South Korean.

    If Russia can be friends with SK and NK then I don't see why there would be a problem with SK being friends with Russia and the US.

    Sure, the US will whine and moan and bitch but they are hardly going to stop being friends with SK... where else in the region can they base tens of thousands of US soldiers?

    The Japs don't want any more.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Tue Sep 13, 2016 1:59 pm

    GarryB wrote:South Korea are currently building an enormous ship yard in Russia that will end up making oil tankers and heavy gas carrier ships and some military vessels up to an including carriers...

    They are hardly enemies.

    The current SK SAM is based on the S-400 smaller missiles (9M96 and 9M96M).

    A lot of the western electronics the Russians had previously imported were South Korean.

    If Russia can be friends with SK and NK then I don't see why there would be a problem with SK being friends with Russia and the US.

    Sure, the US will whine and moan and bitch but they are hardly going to stop being friends with SK... where else in the region can they base tens of thousands of US soldiers?

    The Japs don't want any more.

    lol, yes, and Russia will help the reunification of Korea under the rule of South Korea.

    Will you say that the US and Russia are "hardly enemies" because of some plant of Chrevrolet in Russia and because the joint spacial work?

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:36 am

    lol, yes, and Russia will help the reunification of Korea under the rule of South Korea.

    Russia has done a shit load more to bring those two country fragments together in peace than all the bastards in Europe and the US combined.

    In Fact truth be told I don't think the US wants there to be peace there at all.

    Will you say that the US and Russia are "hardly enemies" because of some plant of Chrevrolet in Russia and because the joint spacial work?

    Chevrolet makes shit cars... not aircraft carriers.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Wed Sep 14, 2016 11:58 am


    Shit cars, but ignoring the part of the spacial program in your quote.... Not surprised...

    Your pro-South Korea logic is very rare. This country is itself a big aircraft carrier for the 25000+ US soldiers deployed in the country, that are there against China and against Russia. Habitually you talk very much about the presence of the US in Europe talking about to break nuclear treaties, but surprisingly you seem not disturbed by the presence of the US in South Korea. Your comments are a non-sense.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Fri Sep 16, 2016 2:15 am

    If the US wants to place thousands of its soldiers in South Korea and South Korea wants that too who am I to stop them wasting money because of their mutual stupidity.

    The fact is that Russia has no ideology to spread and US troops in South Korea are no threat to Russia.

    Comercially Russia and South Korea can benefit from cooperation.

    US troops in SK have done nothing to prevent cooperation between Russia and South Korea.

    They are just a stumbling block to peace with North Korea, which suits the US and no body else.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Fri Sep 16, 2016 11:33 am

    Kidding me? 25000+ US soldiers in South Korea is not a threat to Russia? Seoul is at 750 Km from Vladivostok...

    Also, in a conventional war South Korea has advantage over North Korea (numerically, technologically, economically,..), then the purpose of the of conventional forces of US presence is not against North Korea, is against other more powerful conventional forces in the area.

    Then, GarryB, North Korea hater...

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Sat Sep 17, 2016 9:53 am

    Kidding me? 25000+ US soldiers in South Korea is not a threat to Russia? Seoul is at 750 Km from Vladivostok...

    Justification for a few tactical nukes in the region.

    Certainly not a reason to not trade with South Korea.

    Also, in a conventional war South Korea has advantage over North Korea (numerically, technologically, economically,..), then the purpose of the of conventional forces of US presence is not against North Korea, is against other more powerful conventional forces in the area.

    China wont tolerate US forces based on their border in North Korea.

    They didn't in the 1950s and they wont now.

    Then, GarryB, North Korea hater...

    I have nothing against North Korea. Russia is actually making a few deals to open that country up and creating situations where it can actually make some money.

    Having a rail link from Asia to Europe going through South korea and north korea is to the benefit of both koreas.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Sat Sep 17, 2016 10:50 am

    It is absurd to think that Russia wants to sale T-90s to South Korea in replacement of the retired T-80s.

    China will not concede North Korea to the US and neither will do Russia.

    Trade, limited.

    The deployment of the US in South Korea is the most important deployment of the US in the continental Asia, and it is between 500 and 1000 Km from Vladivostok. It says all.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Sep 17, 2016 4:11 pm

    eehnie wrote:Kidding me? 25000+ US soldiers in South Korea is not a threat to Russia? Seoul is at 750 Km from Vladivostok...

    Well no lol1
    These men have no ability to mobilize and deploy anywhere near Russia and in a time-frame of less than a couple of months.

    eehnie wrote: This country is itself a big aircraft carrier for the 25000+ US soldiers deployed in the country, that are there against China and against Russia.

    Of those 20,000 Army troops I'm pretty sure only about half could be front-line combat troops. It's easier for the US to land a couple of brigades of Marines from Japan or Paratroopers and Strykers from their mainland against Russia, than use any of those less deployable Army soldiers from USFK.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  eehnie on Sun Sep 18, 2016 12:38 am

    KiloGolf wrote:
    eehnie wrote:Kidding me? 25000+ US soldiers in South Korea is not a threat to Russia? Seoul is at 750 Km from Vladivostok...

    Well no lol1
    These men have no ability to mobilize and deploy anywhere near Russia and in a time-frame of less than a couple of months.

    eehnie wrote: This country is itself a big aircraft carrier for the 25000+ US soldiers deployed in the country, that are there against China and against Russia.

    Of those 20,000 Army troops I'm pretty sure only about half could be front-line combat troops. It's easier for the US to land a couple of brigades of Marines from Japan or Paratroopers and Strykers from their mainland against Russia, than use any of those less deployable Army soldiers from USFK.

    The 25000+ are only the military forces, not civil, the entire structure is bigger. Plus, the infrastructure of the US in South Korea is significantly bigger, because the deployment was between 45000 and 75000 soldiers between 1955 and 1970, was between 34000 and 46000 soldiers between 1971 and 2004, and it was around 325000 soldiers in the time of the active phase of the war. In case of conventional war in Korea, this is not enough, but one of the main goals of this deployment is to open the door to a fast increase of the US troops surely until the levels of the active war in the 1950s.

    And all this has been and is between 500 and 1000 Km from Vladivostok.

    I would expect about this a reaction in agreement with what I see about the US deployments in East Europe.

    You guys are seriously kidding me...

    The last what Russia wants is to see T-90s together with this force instead of the T-80s.

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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  GarryB on Sun Sep 18, 2016 10:05 am


    The last what Russia wants is to see T-90s together with this force instead of the T-80s.

    When Russia sold the T-80s to South Korea it was one of their best tanks.

    Currently the T-90 is not their best available tank.

    If they do sell T-90 to South Korea it wont be the T-90AM domestic model it will be the T-90MS export model.

    They wont be selling them thousands of them... perhaps 50 to 100.

    Over all not enough to be significant in any way.


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    Re: Russia-South Korea Military cooperation issues

    Post  franco on Sun Sep 18, 2016 11:04 am

    South Korea produces it's own domestic tanks now so has no need to buy from anyone.

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