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    Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

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    andalusia
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    Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  andalusia on Mon Aug 29, 2016 11:38 pm

    I heard a lot of Americans always referring to the Soviet Union trying to take over the world during the Cold War for Communism.  I want to know was this true? Was it propaganda?  There is a saying that American soldiers sacrifice by defending the freedom of people worldwide; do you guys believe in that?  They say that American troops defend Americans freedoms.  People here believe that as a religion.  Was the USSR planning to take away American freedoms during the Cold War?  

    http://tvnewslies.org/tvnl/index.php/editorial/jesse-richards-commentary/20246-our-troops-do-not-protect-our-freedom-and-we-should-stop-thanking-them-for-doing-so.html

    Svyatoslavich
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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  Svyatoslavich on Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:17 am

    Yes, it was true in the sense that the Soviet Union wanted to impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world. It even got at odds with other Marxist countries that didn't follow the exact Soviet rules, like China, Albania and (to a lesser extent) Yugoslavia.
    What is also true, on the other hand, is that the US was trying to do exactly the same: impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world. Now, 25 years after the end of the Soviet Union, Russia is a pragmatical country which tries to have normal and mutually beneficial relations with other states, respecting their sovereignity, while the US is still playing the old game: trying to impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world.

    GarryB
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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  GarryB on Tue Aug 30, 2016 11:14 am

    I heard a lot of Americans always referring to the Soviet Union trying to take over the world during the Cold War for Communism. I want to know was this true? Was it propaganda?

    The soviet union was never in a position to "take over the world".

    The US did more to take control of the world...

    There is a saying that American soldiers sacrifice by defending the freedom of people worldwide; do you guys believe in that? They say that American troops defend Americans freedoms. People here believe that as a religion. Was the USSR planning to take away American freedoms during the Cold War?

    America only sent in their troops when it was in their interests, and their interests often had more to do with mineral wealth or economics than any freedoms.

    American troops didn't even defend American freedoms for Americans... ask the black people... or the 99% who are not embarrassingly wealthy... you know... the 60-70% who work for a living.

    Yes, it was true in the sense that the Soviet Union wanted to impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world.

    Russia has been the victim of western aggression for more than 3 hundred years and this has nothing to do with communism and everything to do with colonialism.

    Of course where it had the power the Soviets installed friendly to them governments... eastern europe, Afghanistan etc etc, but the US does that in peacetime now undermining their own democratic values by promoting often violent coloured revolutions that end in death and chaos so they can send in oil company representatives and infrastructure manufacturers to clean up and to clean up in concrete and financial terms.

    It even got at odds with other Marxist countries that didn't follow the exact Soviet rules, like China, Albania and (to a lesser extent) Yugoslavia.

    The Soviet Union was a bullied kid with few friends that all the rich kids picked on and would play games with by getting them into fights with other children... divide and conquer.

    It is a bit rich claiming the Soviet Union wanted to take over the world considering the US foreign policy... they called the 20th century the American century... how arrogant is that?

    Even more so considering the size of the British empire for much of the last century or two...

    Now, 25 years after the end of the Soviet Union, Russia is a pragmatical country which tries to have normal and mutually beneficial relations with other states, respecting their sovereignity, while the US is still playing the old game: trying to impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world.

    Agree with this... for the last few decades the US has lost its way and clearly believes its own propaganda.

    Check out my signature...


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    George1
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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  George1 on Tue Aug 30, 2016 1:25 pm

    That was Reagan's propaganda in 80s lol! USSR seek a global communist state


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    andalusia
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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  andalusia on Tue Aug 30, 2016 11:43 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    I heard a lot of Americans always referring to the Soviet Union trying to take over the world during the Cold War for Communism.  I want to know was this true? Was it propaganda?

    The soviet union was never in a position to "take over the world".

    The US did more to take control of the world...

    There is a saying that American soldiers sacrifice by defending the freedom of people worldwide; do you guys believe in that?  They say that American troops defend Americans freedoms.  People here believe that as a religion.  Was the USSR planning to take away American freedoms during the Cold War?  

    America only sent in their troops when it was in their interests, and their interests often had more to do with mineral wealth or economics than any freedoms.



    American troops didn't even defend American freedoms for Americans... ask the black people... or the 99% who are not embarrassingly wealthy... you know... the 60-70% who work for a living.



    Yes, it was true in the sense that the Soviet Union wanted to impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world.

    Russia has been the victim of western aggression for more than 3 hundred years and this has nothing to do with communism and everything to do with colonialism.

    Of course where it had the power the Soviets installed friendly to them governments... eastern europe, Afghanistan etc etc, but the US does that in peacetime now undermining their own democratic values by promoting often violent coloured revolutions that end in death and chaos so they can send in oil company representatives and infrastructure manufacturers to clean up and to clean up in concrete and financial terms.

    It even got at odds with other Marxist countries that didn't follow the exact Soviet rules, like China, Albania and (to a lesser extent) Yugoslavia.

    The Soviet Union was a bullied kid with few friends that all the rich kids picked on and would play games with by getting them into fights with other children... divide and conquer.

    It is a bit rich claiming the Soviet Union wanted to take over the world considering the US foreign policy... they called the 20th century the American century... how arrogant is that?

    Even more so considering the size of the British empire for much of the last century or two...

    Now, 25 years after the end of the Soviet Union, Russia is a pragmatical country which tries to have normal and mutually beneficial relations with other states, respecting their sovereignity, while the US is still playing the old game: trying to impose its political, economical and cultural regime over the entire world.

    Agree with this... for the last few decades the US has lost its way and clearly believes its own propaganda.

    Check out my signature...

    American propaganda says their freedoms are responsible because the troops are serving in the military and fighting and dieing overseas in wars. I don't see the connection. I just wonder do others around the world feel the same as Americans?

    Hey Garry B:  
    Many blacks would have no problem signing up to fight a war against Russia.

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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  Svyatoslavich on Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:25 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Russia has been the victim of western aggression for more than 3 hundred years and this has nothing to do with communism and everything to do with colonialism.
    That is true, but you have to consider the underlying ideology of the Soviet Union: Marxist Communism. For Marx, socialism has to be implemented in the entire world so that communism, the perfect social order, can appear, when there will be no property, no inequalities, no states, no wars, no crimes, etc. So the Soviet Union was doing it best to spread its own version of socialism (which they considered the proper one) to the entire world, even to very distante countries in Africa, South America, Southeast Asia. Of course, as one of the two superpowers sometimes it had to acommodate with the US for pragmatic reasons (after the Cuban revolution, they stopped supporting armed revolutionaries in South America, and probably Soviet intelligence was involved in sharing data about Che Guevara to the US as he insisted in making revolutions in the entire continent), but the strategic goal of the Soviet Union was to implement socialism in the entire world.
    The Russian Empire, and now the Russian Federation, on the other hand, have no ilusions about some utopic "perfect social order" that has to be imposed over the entire world, and therefore can engage in realistic and pragmatic relations with other countries seeking mutually beneficial relations.

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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  GarryB on Wed Aug 31, 2016 12:01 pm

    Hey Garry B:
    Many blacks would have no problem signing up to fight a war against Russia.

    And I am sure most Americans think America is a force for good in the world, but in actual fact America is a force for America.

    I am often told by internet warriors how as a New Zealander I should be grateful that I am not speaking Japanese right now and that it was the US who saved me and my country.

    They really don't like it when I point out that the blockade by the US and British before WWII of Japan forced them to accelerate their expansion to find resources they were being denied by the blockade... the US and UK created the situation where Japan first looked north for oil and resources and when they got a bloody nose in that short bloody conflict with the Soviet Union they turned south for resources... oil rubber wood etc etc.

    More to the point the US did nothing until the Japanese attacked them in Pearl Harbour... up until that point they didn't lift a finger to help New Zealand or Australia.

    The US didn't help anyone else... it helped itself... the fact that it was useful to us was incidental.

    but the strategic goal of the Soviet Union was to implement socialism in the entire world.

    And the goal of the west is to spread their own religion and politics... it has never been about everyone being democratic or socialist... the US has undermined more democratic elections than the Soviet Union ever did...

    The Russian Empire, and now the Russian Federation, on the other hand, have no ilusions about some utopic "perfect social order" that has to be imposed over the entire world, and therefore can engage in realistic and pragmatic relations with other countries seeking mutually beneficial relations.

    Ironically the Russian empire absorbed neighbours and freed neighbours quite a lot... depending upon their situation and interests.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    andalusia
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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  andalusia on Thu Sep 01, 2016 5:02 am

    GarryB wrote:
    Hey Garry B:  
    Many blacks would have no problem signing up to fight a war against Russia.

    And I am sure most Americans think America is a force for good in the world, but in actual fact America is a force for America.

    I am often told by internet warriors how as a New Zealander I should be grateful that I am not speaking Japanese right now and that it was the US who saved me and my country.

    They really don't like it when I point out that the blockade by the US and British before WWII of Japan forced them to accelerate their expansion to find resources they were being denied by the blockade... the US and UK created the situation where Japan first looked north for oil and resources and when they got a bloody nose in that short bloody conflict with the Soviet Union they turned south for resources... oil rubber wood etc etc.

    More to the point the US did nothing until the Japanese attacked them in Pearl Harbour... up until that point they didn't lift a finger to help New Zealand or Australia.

    The US didn't help anyone else... it helped itself... the fact that it was useful to us was incidental.

    Very enlightening post Garry B.  I didn't know the US and Britain blockaded Japan.

    http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/01/07/troop-worship/

    http://disinfo.com/2016/03/the-fallacy-of-troop-worship/

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    Re: Was Soviet Union trying to take over the World?

    Post  GarryB on Thu Sep 01, 2016 8:35 am

    Most American documentaries are crap... I don't want to say that but it is true.

    An exception is the Oliver Stone documentaries on the history of the US.

    They cover all the major events but actually look deeper into why they happened.

    The average US doco will say the war in the Pacific started when the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbour, but the Oliver stone doco actually looked into why they attacked.

    Equally it delves into the european theatre of the war and includes information like the Soviets approaching Poland asking for an alliance... which the Poles flatly refused... they wanted closer relations with Germany.

    The Soviets approached the British and were told to talk to the poles.

    Stalin wasn't an idiot... he recognised Hitler as being dangerous, but the non aggression pact with Germany was the only offer on the table... there were no offers from Britain or Poland so the choice was to sign and get half of Poland or not sign and have german forces that much closer to Moscow.

    Friends don't need Non Aggression Pacts.

    As the two major powers that suffered the most from WWI before 1933 when Hitler took power there was a lot of cooperation and joint work between Germany and the Soviet Union. After hitler took power there was only raw material purchases... and if you are going to bitch about Stalin trading with Hitler then you will need to bitch about IBM selling computers to the germans... well data collation machines.

    The really frustrating thing for me is when newbies claim the US won WWII all on its own and the Soviets only survived because General Winter and Lend Lease won the day for them, the replies tend to under rate the war effort of the west... when my dad is bigger than yours it is because your dad is tiny and weak...

    If the Soviets only survived because of the cold and lend lease you could say the British survived by running away and the US survived by not turning up until the Germans were rather damaged already.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

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