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    Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:11 am

    Militarov wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:Still puts into question of Mikoyans lack of quality. They always seem to have an issue of some sort, with their new jets. And they also have had returns from Algeria due to poor quality compared to Sukhoi.

    Sucks but oh well. Signs that maybe MiG-35 may not be a good buy till Sokol plant and Mikoyan can get their crap together.

    Actually Algeria was protesting due to fact MiG concern used some already produced parts that they had stockpiled from 90s that were kept in storages. Algeria claimed they were mislead and expected all the parts to be brand new.

    Algeria wanted a switch deal too, it's a lot more complex than simply MiG being asses. But MiG gave them a convenient excuse to walk off the deal and have SU's instead.

    Btw Brand spanking new F-35 caught fire while landing less than a week ago. I'm sure this F-35 gig should bring shame on Boeing...oh wait. Let's stop this non-sense.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Militarov on Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:05 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:Still puts into question of Mikoyans lack of quality. They always seem to have an issue of some sort, with their new jets. And they also have had returns from Algeria due to poor quality compared to Sukhoi.

    Sucks but oh well. Signs that maybe MiG-35 may not be a good buy till Sokol plant and Mikoyan can get their crap together.

    Actually Algeria was protesting due to fact MiG concern used some already produced parts that they had stockpiled from 90s that were kept in storages. Algeria claimed they were mislead and expected all the parts to be brand new.

    Algeria wanted a switch deal too, it's a lot more complex than simply MiG being asses. But MiG gave them a convenient excuse to walk off the deal and have SU's instead.

    Btw Brand spanking new F-35 caught fire while landing less than a week ago. I'm sure this F-35 gig should bring shame on Boeing...oh wait. Let's stop this non-sense.

    Noone cares if that happens to BAE, Boeing or Lockeed Martin really. Sales are there, their lobying power is beyond imagination, maintenance support they offer is immense, spares inflow is also spectacular. MiG is struggling to deliver even spares to old MiG-29 operators. Boeing however faced big issues when B737s had major accidents, as sales dropped and many operators tried switching to Airbus, that is how it is.

    And its abit different as F-35 is in IOC, MiG-29K is allegedly service ready for 3-4 years already now, and the damn thing caught fire, was flushed and repaired onboard the ship. I wouldnt say a word if it was brand new design crashing on flight tests... but its not really new design and it crashed before even ever seeing any combat, and you can count all of them on your fingers.
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    medo

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  medo on Tue Nov 15, 2016 9:09 am

    GarryB wrote:
    MiG-31BM could not bring any capability, which Su-30SM and Su-35 doesn't have there already. Su-35 have more capable radar and Su-30SM could as well work as small AWACS with its WSO in back seat, like MiG-31BM could


    Apart from the obvious... the MiG-31BM can fly at mach 2.6 for up to 20 minutes or Mach 2.4 for the entire mission and can carry RVV-BD missiles with a flight range of about 300km.

    Speed and missile range are important in an interceptor...


    Su-35 could carry RVV-BD as well and can supercruise.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Nov 15, 2016 2:14 pm


    Well finally:

    Russia's Admiral Kuznetsov Aircraft Carrier Begins Combat Operations in Syria

    Read more: https://sputniknews.com/military/201611151047453340-admiral-kuznetsov-syria/


    Russian Admiral Grigorovich Frigate Targets Terrorists in Syria With Missiles

    Read more: https://sputniknews.com/military/201611151047453617-frigate-syria-missiles/


    Seven Russian S-300 Air Missile Defense Systems Deployed in Syria

    Read more: https://sputniknews.com/military/201611151047455462-s-300-syria-russia/
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Tue Nov 15, 2016 2:59 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:Still puts into question of Mikoyans lack of quality. They always seem to have an issue of some sort, with their new jets. And they also have had returns from Algeria due to poor quality compared to Sukhoi.

    Sucks but oh well. Signs that maybe MiG-35 may not be a good buy till Sokol plant and Mikoyan can get their crap together.

    Actually Algeria was protesting due to fact MiG concern used some already produced parts that they had stockpiled from 90s that were kept in storages. Algeria claimed they were mislead and expected all the parts to be brand new.

    Algeria wanted a switch deal too, it's a lot more complex than simply MiG being asses. But MiG gave them a convenient excuse to walk off the deal and have SU's instead.

    Btw Brand spanking new F-35 caught fire while landing less than a week ago. I'm sure this F-35 gig should bring shame on Boeing...oh wait. Let's stop this non-sense.

    Noone cares if that happens to BAE, Boeing or Lockeed Martin really. Sales are there, their lobying power is beyond imagination, maintenance support they offer is immense, spares inflow is also spectacular. MiG is struggling to deliver even spares to old MiG-29 operators. Boeing however faced big issues when B737s had major accidents, as sales dropped and many operators tried switching to Airbus, that is how it is.

    Mig has no issues issuing spares for the 29 fleet, that's an absolute myth. What is going on though is that MiG is wanting to get out of shitty underpriced contracts that they were forced to write, because they cannot sell anything anymore. This comes directly from the choice Russia made to basically kill the two manufacturer conglomerate back in the 1990's.

    Also the only thing that should have made RAC MiG some dough was shot down because most of the NATO operators are becoming former ones and they are bypassing MiG for parts. Last laugh was Poland offering Bulgaria a overhaul and maintenance deal while they don't have the IP to make anything regarding maintenance. Try that with Boeing.

    Mig is simply caught in a multilayered shitstorm that has nothing to do with them being suddenly the lesser gypsum, just the victims of a political choice, historical fallout and basically a savage market.

    Most of this has ironically to do with Mig Losing their entries at the MO when the USSR went down.

    If Kamov wasn't propped by their Chinese design contract, they would be in the same ditch, right now.



    And its abit different as F-35 is in IOC, MiG-29K is allegedly service ready for 3-4 years already now, and the damn thing caught fire, was flushed and repaired onboard the ship. I wouldnt say a word if it was brand new design crashing on flight tests... but its not really new design and it crashed before even ever seeing any combat, and you can count all of them on your fingers.
    The Mig29K is ready for service and one plane f*cked up (for reasons we don't know). The F35 is Green condition ready as well, and it has been for 10 years, yet it sporadically catches fire, bugs, lapses etc. Let's not start calling people names before having some perspective.



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    JohninMK

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  JohninMK on Tue Nov 15, 2016 3:01 pm

    Moments ago Russian Defense Minister Sergey Shoigu announced that the Russian military launched a large-scale operation against terrorists stationed in Homs and Idlib provinces of Syria.

    "Today at 10:30 and 11:00 we launched a large-scale operation against the positions of Islamic State and Al-Nusra [terrorist groups] in the provinces of Idlib and Homs," Shoigu said at a meeting between Russian President Vladimir Putin and the top leadership of the Russian Armed Forces.

    The Russian "Admiral Grigorovich" frigate located next to Syria's coast targeted terrorists in Syria with Kalibr cruise missile strikes, Shoigu said. The "Admiral Grigorovich [frigate] takes part in the operation. Today, it launched Kalibr cruise missiles on [terrorist] targets that had been confirmed by intelligence data and determined in advance," the minister said at a meeting of Russian President Vladimir Putin with top officials of the Russian Armed Forces.
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    Khepesh

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Khepesh on Tue Nov 15, 2016 4:58 pm

    Video from Defense Ministry today
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    TheArmenian

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  TheArmenian on Tue Nov 15, 2016 5:18 pm

    Ha ha ha,
    So Bastion has dual anti-ship and anti-surface modes.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Militarov on Tue Nov 15, 2016 6:09 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:Still puts into question of Mikoyans lack of quality. They always seem to have an issue of some sort, with their new jets. And they also have had returns from Algeria due to poor quality compared to Sukhoi.

    Sucks but oh well. Signs that maybe MiG-35 may not be a good buy till Sokol plant and Mikoyan can get their crap together.

    Actually Algeria was protesting due to fact MiG concern used some already produced parts that they had stockpiled from 90s that were kept in storages. Algeria claimed they were mislead and expected all the parts to be brand new.

    Algeria wanted a switch deal too, it's a lot more complex than simply MiG being asses. But MiG gave them a convenient excuse to walk off the deal and have SU's instead.

    Btw Brand spanking new F-35 caught fire while landing less than a week ago. I'm sure this F-35 gig should bring shame on Boeing...oh wait. Let's stop this non-sense.

    Noone cares if that happens to BAE, Boeing or Lockeed Martin really. Sales are there, their lobying power is beyond imagination, maintenance support they offer is immense, spares inflow is also spectacular. MiG is struggling to deliver even spares to old MiG-29 operators. Boeing however faced big issues when B737s had major accidents, as sales dropped and many operators tried switching to Airbus, that is how it is.

    Mig has no issues issuing spares for the 29 fleet, that's an absolute myth. What is going on though is that MiG is wanting to get out of shitty underpriced contracts that they were forced to write, because they cannot sell anything anymore. This comes directly from the choice Russia made to basically kill the two manufacturer conglomerate back in the 1990's.

    Also the only thing that should have made RAC MiG some dough was shot down because most of the NATO operators are becoming former ones and they are bypassing MiG for parts. Last laugh was Poland offering Bulgaria a overhaul and maintenance deal while they don't have the IP to make anything regarding maintenance. Try that with Boeing.

    Mig is simply caught in a multilayered shitstorm that has nothing to do with them being suddenly the lesser gypsum, just the victims of a political choice, historical fallout and basically a savage market.

    Most of this has ironically to do with Mig Losing their entries at the MO when the USSR went down.

    If Kamov wasn't propped by their Chinese design contract, they would be in the same ditch, right now.



    And its abit different as F-35 is in IOC, MiG-29K is allegedly service ready for 3-4 years already now, and the damn thing caught fire, was flushed and repaired onboard the ship. I wouldnt say a word if it was brand new design crashing on flight tests... but its not really new design and it crashed before even ever seeing any combat, and you can count all of them on your fingers.
    The Mig29K is ready for service and one plane f*cked up (for reasons we don't know). The F35 is Green condition ready as well, and it has been for 10 years, yet it sporadically catches fire, bugs, lapses etc. Let's not start calling people names before having some perspective.


    Well they lagged behind almost a year in delivery of spares for one our MiG-29 here actually. One two seater was grounded due to borrowing some wing composites to single seater (apparently one of the maintenance crew guys stood on it and it shattered) and was standing there for quite a while with no spares, even tho they were paid upfront to MiG, its first hand info. I am actually not sure if they were delievered even now, probably were by now.

    Well ye, F-35 is in IOC but they did not send it to Syria to crash on a first day now, didnt they Smile?

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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Militarov on Tue Nov 15, 2016 6:51 pm

    TheArmenian wrote:Ha ha ha,
    So Bastion has dual anti-ship and anti-surface modes.

    Well its basically cruise missile so it was expected.
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    OminousSpudd

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  OminousSpudd on Tue Nov 15, 2016 8:34 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:Still puts into question of Mikoyans lack of quality. They always seem to have an issue of some sort, with their new jets. And they also have had returns from Algeria due to poor quality compared to Sukhoi.

    Sucks but oh well. Signs that maybe MiG-35 may not be a good buy till Sokol plant and Mikoyan can get their crap together.

    Actually Algeria was protesting due to fact MiG concern used some already produced parts that they had stockpiled from 90s that were kept in storages. Algeria claimed they were mislead and expected all the parts to be brand new.

    Algeria wanted a switch deal too, it's a lot more complex than simply MiG being asses. But MiG gave them a convenient excuse to walk off the deal and have SU's instead.

    Btw Brand spanking new F-35 caught fire while landing less than a week ago. I'm sure this F-35 gig should bring shame on Boeing...oh wait. Let's stop this non-sense.

    Noone cares if that happens to BAE, Boeing or Lockeed Martin really. Sales are there, their lobying power is beyond imagination, maintenance support they offer is immense, spares inflow is also spectacular. MiG is struggling to deliver even spares to old MiG-29 operators. Boeing however faced big issues when B737s had major accidents, as sales dropped and many operators tried switching to Airbus, that is how it is.

    Mig has no issues issuing spares for the 29 fleet, that's an absolute myth. What is going on though is that MiG is wanting to get out of shitty underpriced contracts that they were forced to write, because they cannot sell anything anymore. This comes directly from the choice Russia made to basically kill the two manufacturer conglomerate back in the 1990's.

    Also the only thing that should have made RAC MiG some dough was shot down because most of the NATO operators are becoming former ones and they are bypassing MiG for parts. Last laugh was Poland offering Bulgaria a overhaul and maintenance deal while they don't have the IP to make anything regarding maintenance. Try that with Boeing.

    Mig is simply caught in a multilayered shitstorm that has nothing to do with them being suddenly the lesser gypsum, just the victims of a political choice, historical fallout and basically a savage market.

    Most of this has ironically to do with Mig Losing their entries at the MO when the USSR went down.

    If Kamov wasn't propped by their Chinese design contract, they would be in the same ditch, right now.



    And its abit different as F-35 is in IOC, MiG-29K is allegedly service ready for 3-4 years already now, and the damn thing caught fire, was flushed and repaired onboard the ship. I wouldnt say a word if it was brand new design crashing on flight tests... but its not really new design and it crashed before even ever seeing any combat, and you can count all of them on your fingers.
    The Mig29K is ready for service and one plane f*cked up (for reasons we don't know). The F35 is Green condition ready as well, and it has been for 10 years, yet it sporadically catches fire, bugs, lapses etc. Let's not start calling people names before having some perspective.


    Well they lagged behind almost a year in delivery of spares for one our MiG-29 here actually. One two seater was grounded due to borrowing some wing composites to single seater (apparently one of the maintenance crew guys stood on it and it shattered) and was standing there for quite a while with no spares, even tho they were paid upfront to MiG, its first hand info. I am actually not sure if they were delievered even now, probably were by now.

    Well ye, F-35 is in IOC but they did not send it to Syria to crash on a first day now, didnt they Smile?

    No they did worse. They went and exported them. The only thing keeping those F-35s in the air is blackmail and dirty politics.

    Sales are there, their lobying power is beyond imagination, maintenance support they offer is immense, spares inflow is also spectacular.

    ^ Helps when you run the foreign policy of the nation you supposedly serve. I love it when people think there's genuine competition on a global level between NATO arms sales and US. Sort of like Airbus selling off their electronics division to Boeing.
    As for spares, well, if they're anything like GDLS or Boeing in the early 2000s then I'm reeeally not surprised. The contracts they get people to sign are about as atrocious as they get.
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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  calm on Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:25 pm

    #Syria #Damascus #WesternGhouta #Syrian Video/photographer/Journalist/ taking a selfie with #Russia #Russian #RU Soldier.

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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:48 pm



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    franco

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  franco on Tue Nov 15, 2016 10:53 pm

    Story the S.300V moved into southern Aleppo. Find the 7 batteries figure a little hard to swallow. Could be warning off the Turks and NATO Air Forces from doing too much in Aleppo and Homs.

    https://www.almasdarnews.com/article/russia-redeploys-anti-aircraft-missiles-aleppo/

    PS: it could also be that the Russians have given some S-300PS's to the Syrian as has been rumored.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:02 pm


    Kalibrs and Bastions destroying fairy orphanage and unicorn farm Cool

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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  calm on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:04 pm

    Su-33 with bomb under belly and FAB-500 M54 close up
    From this videos


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    medo

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  medo on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:43 pm

    So, Su-33 finaly made their first combat strikes in Syria.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Militarov on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:52 pm



    Interesting claim that it can carry "up to 52 aircraft". I wonder in which configuration, 52 Su-25UTG Very Happy?
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Militarov on Tue Nov 15, 2016 11:53 pm

    medo wrote:So, Su-33 finaly made their first combat strikes in Syria.

    I still never saw them taking off with any air to ground warload... anyone got pic?
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    medo

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  medo on Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:04 am

    Militarov wrote:
    medo wrote:So, Su-33 finaly made their first combat strikes in Syria.

    I still never saw them taking off with any air to ground warload... anyone got pic?

    On the photo with Ana Knishenko posted by calm, one Su-33 have a bomb placed on hardpoint between the engines. Maybe they don't want to risk with taking off from carrier with bombs under air intakes.
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    Militarov

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Militarov on Wed Nov 16, 2016 12:18 am

    medo wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    medo wrote:So, Su-33 finaly made their first combat strikes in Syria.

    I still never saw them taking off with any air to ground warload... anyone got pic?

    On the photo with Ana Knishenko posted by calm, one Su-33 have a bomb placed on hardpoint between the engines. Maybe they don't want to risk with taking off from carrier with bombs under air intakes.

    Ah, i missed that one.

    Soo... one FAB-500...
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    Cyberspec

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  Cyberspec on Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:19 am

    Militarov wrote:
    TheArmenian wrote:Ha ha ha,
    So Bastion has dual anti-ship and anti-surface modes.

    Well its basically cruise missile so it was expected.

    Kind of a big deal actually, since most people assumed it was Anti-Ship only
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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  calm on Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:48 am

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    GarryB

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  GarryB on Wed Nov 16, 2016 9:58 am

    Su-35 could carry RVV-BD as well and can supercruise.

    Supercruising is not actually relevant to an interceptor.

    For a fighter on combat air patrol supercruise allows it to cover large amounts of airspace, maximises its missile range while reducing the effective range of enemy missiles and aircraft if they need to accelerate to supersonic speed to engage.

    For an Interceptor flying very fast even if you use an enormous amount of fuel is what is important... intercepting the target as early as possible as far away from what you are protecting is the key.

    The Su-35 and MiG-35 are likely to use the RVV-BD eventually, but we are talking about Russian military aircraft now... and only the MiG-31BM can carry the R-37M operationally.

    Ha ha ha,
    So Bastion has dual anti-ship and anti-surface modes.

    Developed with India and their Brahmos missiles.

    Well ye, F-35 is in IOC but they did not send it to Syria to crash on a first day now, didnt they Smile?

    No. Despite plenty of opportunities to do so, they have not sent them anywhere near a real conflict... wonder why....

    Kind of a big deal actually, since most people assumed it was Anti-Ship only

    It was.

    There was never previously any requirement to engage ground targets with what are basically anti ship missiles.

    After the Gulf war the Russians decided they wanted land attack missiles and so the Klub family was developed and the Indian requirement for land attack capability for the Brahmos means that the Yakhont and the Onyx it is based upon likely got the same capability too.

    The question is do these missiles have guidance systems based on Brahmos or Klub for land attack...


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    calm

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #10

    Post  calm on Wed Nov 16, 2016 11:13 am

    Area of strikes. Hint about possible direction of upcoming offensive?Geolocations via @obretix Carrier group/distance,not perfectly correct wrote:

    https://twitter.com/warsmonitoring/status/798828032836321280



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