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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

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    Resistance
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Resistance on Sat Jun 18, 2016 12:21 pm

    Unlike America's policy of regime change, which happened in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Ukraine, Syria, Russia's policy is friendship. After the Maidan coup, Poroshenko would have been overthrown by the people in a revolution. If was Putin who legitimized the coup government and prevented Ukrainian people from toppling Poroshenko. As a result, thousands of Ukrainians and Russians continue to die, the war continues on.

    Americans are atheists. They use Sun Tzu's strategy of deception to lie to Russians and win. Russians are Christians. Cannot lie. So Russians get tricked by Americans over and over again and lose. First USSR, then NATO on border, then Yugoslavia, then Iraq, then Libya, then Ukraine, then Syria.

    Putin should take a page from the Iranians. Smile on face. Stick in hand. That is the best foreign policy.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Jun 18, 2016 4:31 pm

    medo wrote:Don't forget, that ex-WP states went to NATO standard, so they don't produce old WP standard weapons and ammunition anymore. They supply with their stocks a half a million terrorist armies in Libya, Syria, Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan as well as state armies in Iraq and Afghanistan for more than a decade. Croatia, Romania and Bulgaria already clean well their old stocks. Hungary and Czech sell a lot of their stocks to Iraq. Only state, which could give from their stocks to Ukraine is Poland, but I have a little doubt here as Poland have its eye on Galicia to take it back.

    Poland, Slovakia and Bulgaria most definitely produce WP standard cartridges, rifles, MGs and RPGs of different kinds. I'd venture to say Poland is still very much in the 125 mm tank and 122 mm arty ammunition business. Bulgaria as we speak is receiving orders for weapons and cartridges for Libya, that somehow end up at the hands of the "moderates" in Syria.

    Ukraine can be easily supported by all these industries, as it already happened. With Kharkov online and this support from NATO, Ukraine can keep this scale of warfare (i.e. half of Donbas) for many decades to come.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine #25

    Post  Aristonicus on Sun Jun 19, 2016 12:32 pm

    VICE news apparently doesn't realize how bad this makes the Ukrops look:

    https://www.vice.com/read/nationalist-interest-v23n4

    Part I – Talks about some Western volunteers, who decided to join the Right Sektor battalion. Their personal stories show the quality of the personnel. Just one of them:

    “When he was 12 years old, Lang’s father attempted to murder his stepmother in a drunken rage. Lang Senior went to jail, and Junior had to live with his stepmother. At that point, he decided joining the army would be his best way out; at 17, he finished high school in order to do so. At 22, he’d completed two tours in Iraq and one in Afghanistan. Lang speaks glowingly of military life. In Novogrodovka, he strode around the barracks mimicking NATO assault postures—reloading while running, peering around buildings—and scrolled obsessively through US Army manuals on his phone for fun.

    Two years ago, Lang made local headlines when he deserted Fort Bliss in El Paso after his pregnant wife sent him videos of her sleeping with other men. Lang loaded his car with body armor, night-vision goggles, and two assault rifles, and he drove nonstop to North Carolina, where he set up a perimeter of land mines around her condominium and attempted to murder her. He only got several months’ jail time because, he says, the US Army knew that he had mental problems and did nothing to address them. “I told my commanders repeatedly that I was going to murder her,” he said. “The motherfuckers thought I was bluffing.” Lang received a dishonorable discharge, losing all veteran’s benefits, health insurance, and his gun license. Child-support payments mounted—he is currently $92,000 in debt—and consistent work never came. He spent time in and out of jail. His wife took his truck and home and filed a restraining order against him. Lang hasn’t seen either of his children in almost three years.

    Lang felt betrayed by the army. “You have a prison record, you can’t get a good-paying job, you can’t pay child support, you’re sent back to jail. Repeat.” But he still adored combat. Blackwater rejected him for being half-blind, he said. (He mentioned nothing about how his criminal record might have affected his application.) In February, after reading about the Battle of Ilovaisk, during which Russian separatists ambushed retreating Ukrainian soldiers, Lang got the idea to come to Ukraine. He’d heard that NATO veterans were highly valued on the front lines, where Ukrainian soldiers lacked even rudimentary medical training. He told me he chose Ukraine over Syria for two reasons. First, seeing Maidan on the news convinced Lang that Ukrainians were serious about their national war of liberation. “These people fucking want change.” Having served in Iraq, he thought that Iraqis were not serious about their sovereignty. “Iraqis give zero shits,” he said. Second, he takes Putin to be a communist. Lang, who describes himself as a strict constitutionalist, despises communism.”

    Also – a couple of words about their fearless squad commander, a true cossack and shiriy Ukrainian Semyon:

    “Command of the Voloveka fell to Simeon, the first civilian to steal a machine gun from a police officer at the Maidan and fire back. He was a household name in Ukraine and a legend within Right Sector. After Maidan, he’d survived the disastrous encirclement of the Ukrainian army at Ilovaisk. He’d been among the kyborgs, the vastly outnumbered Ukrainian soldiers and volunteers, including Right Sector members, who defended Donetsk airport from rebel besiegers in the days before Minsk II was signed. Simeon was an artist with a weapon called the TOW, a missile latched to a two-mile-long wire that he guided into enemy territory with a pair of small steering wheels. In late 2015, the Ukrainian state declared him a terrorist. His face was put on notice boards throughout Kiev. The Right Sectorites had converted his home in Ivano-Frankivsk into an armory. They placed Claymore mines on the underside of his porch, and they instructed his teenage son to activate the devices if the police arrived.

    Simeon’s presence in the barracks was outsized. His drinking sessions began shortly after he emerged each morning from his drab cement room, decorated with a few family photos and several Russian army helmets on the walls. “Brothers!” he would cry in a faux-American accent. He possessed no civilian clothes; his fatigues had become so matted with dried mud and engine grease they had hardened into the consistency of cardboard. For Simeon, the war in Donetsk was less about fighting the Russians than it was about proving something to Ukrainians back in Kiev. “Sixty percent of Ukraine wants to join Europe,” he told me one night while he was on guard duty. The occasional crack of artillery came from the east. “Their biggest concern is whether or not their WiFi works. Another twenty percent, well, these are pro-Russian trash. To them, the Soviet Union was a good thing. These types aren’t as big a problem as you might think. They can be killed. We in Right Sector are part of that remaining twenty percent that believes we have to take matters into our own hands in Ukraine. We can only fix our country when we fix ourselves individually.””

    And a few words about their equipment:

    “The members of the Voloveka frequently boasted that they possessed enough explosives to eradicate a small Ukrainian oblast. The battalion had smuggled in all of it—the six armor-plated trucks, the helmets and medical kits, the hundreds of boxes of ammunition—tirelessly, illegally, from every reach of Ukraine. The men used donations from the Ukrainian diaspora in Canada “for medical supplies” to purchase Kalashnikovs off Chechen arms dealers in Vienna, which were smuggled through the Carpathian Mountains by members of the Voloveka who caravanned out to western Ukraine every few months in battalion pickup trucks. They also claimed many guns off dead separatists. One afternoon, Fischer took me to the company armory—six windowless nooks on the second floor. The air was heavy with the waft of cat urine. Anti-aircraft missiles and RPGs lay haphazardly stacked everywhere like planks of wood. Fischer grabbed two rusty black mortars out of a moldy cardboard box. “A war museum in Lviv gave these to us,” he said, flipping them lightly between his palms. “Red Army issues from the Second World War. A lot of Ukrainian battlefield reenactors admire the work we’re doing out here. They send us these antiques all the time,” he said, tossing them back into the box. “The only problem with them is that they can easily detonate if you drive over a bump too quickly in the bus.””

    Part II – Talks about the peculiar grey zone in which the Right Sektor volunteer battalions find themselves even to this day:

    “At any moment the SBU—the Security Service of Ukraine—could have come and arrested every member of the Voloveka, whose presence on the front lines was illegal. But the Right Sectorites assured me this would never happen. When they needed help pursuing trucks they suspected of smuggling supplies into Donetsk, the SBU called the barracks for reinforcements. Most of the oblast was pro-Russian, so to help give the impression of occupation, local authorities encouraged Right Sector to drive its vehicles slowly through nearby villages and walk their streets with glocks in hand. (Though the residents of Novogrodovka despised Right Sector, they weren’t too proud to come to the barracks at night begging for food, which was always given. The drunk ones often fell into the moat.)

    The Ukrainian army was also technically obliged to arrest Right Sector members on sight at the front lines, but it didn’t. During the night, officers sympathetic to Right Sector’s cause filled the Voloveka’s school bus with rockets and other large-caliber guns forbidden by European monitors. Right Sector was the Ukrainian army’s way of getting around Minsk II while still hitting back at separatists who refused to allow international organizations anywhere near their trenches: Right Sector, Ukraine told inspectors, was out of its control. The local police also wouldn’t arrest any members of the Voloveka, to whom they outsourced their terrorism. Of course, when asked about their connection with Right Sector, Ukraine’s SBU, army, and police vigorously disavow it. But what I saw on the front lines was nothing short of active cooperation. The fighters of the Voloveka, for their part, were contemptuous of any cooperation with Kiev. But the fight could only turn against Ukraine once the more immediate threat in the Donbas had been destroyed.”

    Part III – contains guro, R 18+. I’d rather not quote it, just a quick excerpt:

    “Several weeks before I visited the Voloveka, a man had been picked up wandering the streets of Novogrodovka at night, drunk. Police confiscated his phone and found photos of him posing in front of Donetsk tanks on VK, a popular social network among Russian speakers. They brought him to the Right Sectorites, who locked him in a standing-room-only shower stall. The lights stayed on for a week. They beat him with a sock stuffed with sharpened rocks. They stripped him of his clothes and made him clean the barracks on his knees. An interrogation session involving repeated threats of deportation to Guantánamo Bay revealed only that the man came from a local village and apparently knew nothing about rebel troop movements. After a week, the police picked him back up and brought him to Kiev—presumably for a jail sentence, though no one could tell me what actually happened to him. “It is a pity to have to beat these people,” Kirschbaum said. “But I’d have more sympathy for them if we got any sort of similar treatment in Donetsk. Right Sector members captured there get their noses and ears cut off.””

    Werewolf
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Werewolf on Sun Jun 19, 2016 1:34 pm

    Vice News is FOX News owned branch since FOX and rest of the propaganda channels couldn't reach younger generations that is why Vice News was created, subtle propaganda always implying, speculating and asking suggestive questions to push anti-russian nonsense while the titles are WW2 Propaganda "Russian Roulette".

    Ivan the Colorado
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Ivan the Colorado on Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:04 am

    Werewolf wrote:Vice News is FOX News owned branch since FOX and rest of the propaganda channels couldn't reach younger generations that is why Vice News was created, subtle propaganda always implying, speculating and asking suggestive questions to push anti-russian nonsense while the titles are WW2 Propaganda "Russian Roulette".
    I just looked this up. Vice doesn't appear to have any connections to Fox and instead is owned by Disney.

    But the thing is that it's rather well known that all important domestic news outlets in the US are owned by a few of the elite and that elite has many ties with elected officials in the government. A system that would be referred to as "oligarchic" elsewhere in the world.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  JohninMK on Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:46 am

    Ivan the Colorado wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:Vice News is FOX News owned branch since FOX and rest of the propaganda channels couldn't reach younger generations that is why Vice News was created, subtle propaganda always implying, speculating and asking suggestive questions to push anti-russian nonsense while the titles are WW2 Propaganda "Russian Roulette".
    I just looked this up. Vice doesn't appear to have any connections to Fox and instead is owned by Disney.

    But the thing is that it's rather well known that all important domestic news outlets in the US are owned by a few of the elite and that elite has many ties with elected officials in the government. A system that would be referred to as "oligarchic" elsewhere in the world.
    Some might view 'many ties' as you put it so delicately, as more like 'total control over' given the financing of the US electoral system and the information gathering capabilities of the agencies there.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 6:31 pm

    NATO Besieges Russia. Exxon-Mobil Breaks the Siege. Stephen F. Cohen, NYU, Princeton University. EastWestAccord.com.


    https://audioboom.com/boos/4697369-nato-besieges-russia-exxon-mobil-breaks-the-siege-stephen-f-cohen-nyu-princeton-university-eastwestaccord-com?utm_campaign=embed&utm_content=retweet&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twittershare


    “…Tillerson's presence is particularly significant because he will be the most high-profile representative of U.S. business at a time when Washington is taking a harder line than Europe on the need to keep sanctions in place.

    Tillerson is among other oil major chief executives on the forum agenda, including Robert Dudley of BP, Claudio Descalzi from ENI, Schlumberger’s Paal Kibsgaard and Patrick Pouyanne of Total.

    In 2014 Exxon was forced by the sanctions to suspend its joint operations with Russia's top oil producer Rosneft ROSN.MM in the offshore Arctic Kara sea oil field, where they successfully performed exploration drilling.

    The sanctions prevent Western companies from giving Russia technology for Arctic offshore, deepwater and shale oil development. After Exxon stepping back, Rosneft has not resumed drilling in the Arctic Kara Sea, citing the sanctions.

    http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2016/06/14/reuters-exxon-ceo-back-at-russia-shindig-after-hiatus.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 6:33 pm

    20h37 17 juin 2016
    Russia as the existential threat: General Philip Breedlove campaigns for office in the Hillary Clinton administration


    http://usforeignpolicy.blogs.lalibre.be/archive/2016/06/17/russia-as-the-existential-threat-general-philip-breedlove-ca-1151738.html

    By lending its valuable ‘real estate’ to the campaign for office of one of the most outspoken Cold Warriors within the military, General Breedlove, the editorial board of Foreign Affairs magazine has shown yet again that it is incapable of guarding its neutrality or balance, incapable of hedging its bets against a Trump victory in November.

    by Gilbert Doctorow, Ph.D.



    The campaign for the presidency has now entered its conclusive phase with Hillary Clinton standing as the putative candidate of the Democrats and Donald Trump as the putative candidate of the Republicans. At this stage in the electoral cycle, Foreign Affairs magazine is doing what it traditionally does, showcasing on its pages candidates for appointive office in the cabinet of the next president whom the magazine’s editorial board would like to see installed.

    Thus, the current, July-August issue carries an article by Philip B. Breedlove, till recently Commander of the U.S. European Command and NATO’s Supreme Allied Commander, Europe. His piece, entitled “NATO’s Next Act” might more honestly be called “Why I Have Earned My Next Job as Secretary of Defense in the Administration of Hillary Clinton.”

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 6:35 pm


    Cowboy's daughter
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 6:48 pm

    IDPs fear new government resolution will cut benefits, fuel discrimination

    http://www.kyivpost.com/article/content/ukraine-politics/idps-fear-new-government-resolution-will-cut-benefits-fuel-discrimination-416463.html

    In addition to the cancellation of the resolution, the protesters outside the Ministry of Social Policy have four demands: return the right to vote to internally displaced people, provide subsidized housing, compensate for homes lost due to the war, and fire former Minister of Social Policy Pavlo Rozenko from the Cabinet of Ministers.


    The group also aimed to upend stereotypes about displaced people. One sign pasted on the wall of the Ministry of Social Policy read, “(We’re) Not Separatists.”


    A recent study by the United Nations Refugee Agency found that, though most Ukrainians have positive or neutral attitudes toward displaced people, attitudes in Kyiv were significantly worse. Forty percent of Kyiv residents associate increasing crime rates with displaced people, and 20 percent perceive a rise in social tension.


    At the June 14 rally, protesters wore t-shirts that read, “Citizen of Ukraine.” In a symbolic move, they slowly covered the t-shirts with stickers that read, “displaced person.” Gvazdyova said this was meant to represent how citizenship status was being eclipsed by the status of a displaced person.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:06 pm


    June 09 ,2016
    BY Dmitry Tamoikin
    Professor hit by car in Lithuania, kidnapped and tortured in Ukraine
    Eastern European Mafia behind the attacks



    http://ahtribune.com/world/europe/967-tamoikin.html

    This true story of a Ukrainian Professor Mikhail Tamoikin may sound like a script from a Hollywood action blockbuster, however all of this happened to him for real just last summer. After surviving this horrific ordeal, Prof. Tamoikin agreed to share his thoughts about those life and death events with the English audience.

    Last August Mikhail Tamoikin was kidnapped at gunpoint in the center of Kiev, chained and dragged into a car, taken to a boat, where he was beaten and tortured. Miraculously he managed to escape by jumping into the river and swimming for 12 km to safety. After calling the local police, Mikhail quickly learned that the corrupt Ukrainian government officials and “on the take” law enforcement officers were responsible for his kidnapping. Prof. Tamoikin managed to barely get out of Ukraine, moving to Lithuania, but that did not stop this international criminal candidate. Just two months later a second attempt on his life took place. An unmarked car with a masked driver intentionally hit Mikhail in Vilnius city, and when he survived that, these criminals, dressed as policemen, tried to finish the job.

    So what did Prof. Tamoikin do to have the most dangerous Eastern European Mafia with deep government ties after him? He single-handedly stopped perhaps the largest illegal sale of ancient gold artefacts in the world, worth over half a Billion dollars. It was organized by corrupt high-ranking Ukrainian officials, police officers and organized crimes groups, who are still after Mikhail to this day.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Khepesh on Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:31 pm

    Long video of visit to front line at Gorlovka by "Prapor", behind the camera, and others including "Shakhter", who was wounded, and another soldier who gets minor head wound. The very long line of traffic they pass is on the road to the checkpoint at Maiorsk, and shows it is an odd war with seemingly normal activity with civilians moving between the lines, trucks with goods etc, and yet fighting close by.


    And this photo is of Ukranian "doctor" Alexander Chernov, who on Ukranian TV has admitted that while working in ICU in hospital in Enakievo, he deliberately killed wounded VSN soldiers by carrying out procedures that would make it seem they had died of heart attack and other reasons that would not look suspicious at the time. http://colonelcassad.livejournal.com/2806816.html



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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Khepesh on Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:39 pm

    Video filmed by News Front, and with DONi and journalists from Lugansk, under fire from ukrops at Zaitsevo. They were so close to ukrops that they can be clearly seen moving in treeline just before they open fire. The soldier at end of video is Gorlovka combrig "Zhelazny" explaining that a ceasfire had been arranged for engineers to repair electricity cables, but ukrops opened fire anyway and they would have clearly seen it was journalists.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:43 pm

    [quote="Khepesh"]Long video of visit to front line at Gorlovka by "Prapor", behind the camera, and others including "Shakhter", who was wounded, and another soldier who gets minor head wound. The very long line of traffic they pass is on the road to the checkpoint at Maiorsk, and shows it is an odd war with seemingly normal activity with civilians moving between the lines, trucks with goods etc, and yet fighting close by.


    The cars / trucks they pass are moving from Eastern Ukraine to Western?

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Khepesh on Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:52 pm

    Moving between free DNR at Maiorsk checkpoint on North of Gorlovka to occupied DNR, and beyond.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:45 pm

    Khepesh wrote:Moving between free DNR at Maiorsk checkpoint on North of Gorlovka to occupied DNR, and beyond.

    Thank you, Khepesh. I'm curious are goods moving from Eastern Ukraine to Western, and what? if you know..

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  auslander on Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:28 am

    There was never a complete cessation of business between the orcs and Novorossiya. In fall and winter hundreds of thousands tons of coal are sent to the orcs without which their flats heating systems and power generating systems can not work. War is war and business is business although the removal of Ahkmetov from the scene and confiscation of his holdings may change the coal operation. However I doubt it, coal will still flow to the orcs.

    It's the same with Krimu. When right sector and half a dozen wanted Mejlis criminals showed up at the Krim borders last late summer to 'blockade' the border there was no blockade at all, they simply collected a fee to allow goods and private cars to enter and leave the peninsula. The true 'blockade' was on our side of the border. Since Krim and Sevastopol are now part of Russia that means that Russian law holds sway here and many orc goods and goods transshipped through orcland to Krim do not meet Russian standards. There was also a very large amount of contraband EU food products that are banned in Russia due to the sanctions imposed on EU in reply to the EU sanctions put on us.

    Another little fly in the ointment is the 'new' household appliances coming from orcland or transshipped through orcland from EU and it's hangers on have been found to be not new but 'reconditioned' or 'repaired' units passed off as new. This little foible led to some pretty draconian searches of many orc owned, and locally owned, appliance sales businesses with some pretty hefty fines and confiscations of merchandise presented as new but were indeed not new.

    The trucks with the contraband food are given the choice of return to orcland or have the food destroyed. Most choose to destroy the goods and then truck and driver stays in Krim. The other goods are either destroyed or clearly marked as used and returned to orcland.

    Now it they will just fix the damned roads down here......

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Godric on Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:55 pm

    a video from about a week ago I haven't seen posted yet from Italian TV in English subtitles ...



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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Ispan on Tue Jun 21, 2016 7:19 pm

    https://dninews.com/article/afu-possibly-strike-dpr-southern-and-western-territories-once

    AFU to possibly strike on DPR southern and western territories at once
    Tuesday, June 21, 2016 - 19:11

    The Head of the Donetsk People’s Republic Aleksandr Zakharchenko pointed out that the possibility of resuming the hostilities in Donbass was real.

    ‘The possibility of resuming the full-fledged military actions in Donbass is very real that’s why Ukraine is strengthening its forces.

    In the areas of Gorlovka and Novoazovsk there have been redeployed the big amount of tanks and artillery. Taking into account this situation, we can make a conclusion that they want to make two strikes at Gorlovka with access to the border with the Russian Federation and at Novoazovsk; there is again a border,’ pointed out Aleksandr Zakharchenko, the Head of the Donetsk People’s Republic.

    The DPR Head assured that the forces of the Republic had the necessary potential to repeal aggression.

    DONi News Agency

    Comment: I did a count, and the number of the bombardments and the intensity of the fighting has doubled this June in comparison with past months. This is not mere skirmishing and sporadic shelling, is all out position warfare.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Odin of Ossetia on Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:51 pm

    medo wrote:Don't forget, that ex-WP states went to NATO standard, so they don't produce old WP standard weapons and ammunition anymore. They supply with their stocks a half a million terrorist armies in Libya, Syria, Iraq, Yemen, Afghanistan as well as state armies in Iraq and Afghanistan for more than a decade. Croatia, Romania and Bulgaria already clean well their old stocks. Hungary and Czech sell a lot of their stocks to Iraq. Only state, which could give from their stocks to Ukraine is Poland, but I have a little doubt here as Poland have its eye on Galicia to take it back.


    Poland does not "eye Galicia."

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  OminousSpudd on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:44 am

    So there have been rumors floating around a lot of Russia actually having engaged and destroyed multiple US drones in Crimean airspace and also having captured a Global Hawk, landing it in Simferopol. There's zero evidence of any of this actually happening, and it seems to all have been sourced from the "Moment of Truth" Russian TV program. How likely is it that any of these claims have actually occurred? Is it possible they could occur without the world knowing due to "Invisible War" doctrine? Neutral



    Only bringing it up here because it's being picked up by just about every alternative site out there, and it's only a matter of time before MSM starts churning out the cries of propaganda.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  auslander on Wed Jun 22, 2016 9:55 am

    Until I see one landing at 35th Battery Museum in Sevastopol while playing The Star Spangled Banner on a PA system I call bovine scatology in this non story.

    There are plenty of drones along the Russia/orc border of Krim but to the best of my knowledge neither side violates the other's airspace.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Khepesh on Wed Jun 22, 2016 4:56 pm

    Of all the questions that Zakharchenko answered on the "direct line" to Kiev today, I repeat two.

    In answer to the question of when will Zakharchenko be in Kiev to give a press conference for the city's residents, he answered "It could happen a lot sooner than you can imagine"

    In answer to the question of if he thought it was possible for the continued existance of a unified Ukraine, Zakharchenko gave an answer that it was theoretically possible, and asked what is meant by a unified Ukraine, and that a Ukraine with any bandera ideologies is not possible. His answer indicated that bandera ideology would have to be totally eradicated, and he said about the banderas seeing themselves as a "master race", and people in Donbass simply as cattle, second class people to be used for labor. His actual answer was longer than that, but that is what the end line of his answer was.

    IMO, the language used, and not just in this direct line but all the others and other comments by Zakharchenko and Pushilin, are leading to a scenario in which it is envisaged that Ukraine in it's current form is finished and that the end result may be a "Novoukraina", as already told by Yurasumy last year, and possibly constructed as a confederation, or that all Novorossiya and all the left bank and possibly Kiev, will be absorbed by Russia and a border drawn to exclude the western oblasts. No matter what happens, I think it is a message to Kiev that they either swallow false pride and stop the ATO and withdraw from all of LDNR territory they occupy, therefore removing the possibility of a failed offensive by them turning into a liberation of all Novorossiya. But Poroshenko will not do this, so either there is coup or revolution in Ukraine to stop a disaster, or the regime under Poroshenko continues, and there will be war.

    ExBeobachter1987
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  ExBeobachter1987 on Wed Jun 22, 2016 7:29 pm

    Khepesh wrote:Of all the questions that Zakharchenko answered on the "direct line" to Kiev today, I repeat two.

    In answer to the question of when will Zakharchenko be in Kiev to give a press conference for the city's residents, he answered "It could happen a lot sooner than you can imagine"

    In answer to the question of if he thought it was possible for the continued existance of a unified Ukraine, Zakharchenko gave an answer that it was theoretically possible, and asked what is meant by a unified Ukraine, and that a Ukraine with any bandera ideologies is not possible. His answer indicated that bandera ideology would have to be totally eradicated, and he said about the banderas seeing themselves as a "master race", and people in Donbass simply as cattle, second class people to be used for labor. His actual answer was longer than that, but that is what the end line of his answer was.

    IMO, the language used, and not just in this direct line but all the others and other comments by Zakharchenko and Pushilin, are leading to a scenario in which it is envisaged that Ukraine in it's current form is finished and that the end result may be a "Novoukraina", as already told by Yurasumy last year, and possibly constructed as a confederation, or that all Novorossiya and all the left bank and possibly Kiev, will be absorbed by Russia and a border drawn to exclude the western oblasts. No matter what happens, I think it is a message to Kiev that they either swallow false pride and stop the ATO and withdraw from all of LDNR territory they occupy, therefore removing the possibility of a failed offensive by them turning into a liberation of all Novorossiya. But Poroshenko will not do this, so either there is coup or revolution in Ukraine to stop a disaster, or the regime under Poroshenko continues, and there will be war.

    Less talk, more results, please.

    Khepesh
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

    Post  Khepesh on Wed Jun 22, 2016 8:19 pm

    What

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #25

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