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    M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

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    nemrod

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  nemrod on Fri Jul 01, 2016 4:48 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    ... just they're employed correctly by better trained personnel
    Or just because they this supposed trained personnel did not take risks, because of their cowardices ?

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    ...and according to their doctrine.

    Doctrine that relies on powerful aerial support, and numerical superiority, else they pass up any risks 'combats. Meanwhile, the T-55, or T-62's teams did not hesitate to take risks.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  AlfaT8 on Fri Jul 01, 2016 6:51 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    nemrod wrote:A friend of mine that knows very well the situation that is prevailing in Middle East told me that a syrian army's T-62 took out an M1 Abrams belonging to the terrorists dubbed "DAECH".





    This news did not surprised me, as I know that the powerful gun -115 mm/ smoothbore- of the T-62 could largely destroy any western tank in a fair combat.

    Wouldn't be surprised, armor of export M1s is a joke, SA lost quite a few in Yemen, there was also that time when Iraq tested Kornet against M1 the thing was hauled away with tarp covering the frontal armor so it didn't look good.

    Export M1 armour is far from a joke. Especially the post IAP ones.

    KSA lost quite of them due to its crews being little more than baboons with the gift of speech. All tanks would have faltered in those circumstances. Take the T90's in Syria, great workhorse, definitely not enough for garbage crews.

    Lets agree to disagree then, and IAP which variant is that, also the KSA had the A2S export variant of the A2 SEP so now i am laughing harder. Laughing

    And that T-90 the "rebels" got is useless, i have yet to see them turn that turret much less use it in combat, good for PR, but not much else.
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sat Jul 02, 2016 2:26 am

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    nemrod wrote:A friend of mine that knows very well the situation that is prevailing in Middle East told me that a syrian army's T-62 took out an M1 Abrams belonging to the terrorists dubbed "DAECH".





    This news did not surprised me, as I know that the powerful gun -115 mm/ smoothbore- of the T-62 could largely destroy any western tank in a fair combat.

    Wouldn't be surprised, armor of export M1s is a joke, SA lost quite a few in Yemen, there was also that time when Iraq tested Kornet against M1 the thing was hauled away with tarp covering the frontal armor so it didn't look good.

    Export M1 armour is far from a joke. Especially the post IAP ones.

    KSA lost quite of them due to its crews being little more than baboons with the gift of speech. All tanks would have faltered in those circumstances. Take the T90's in Syria, great workhorse, definitely not enough for garbage crews.

    Lets agree to disagree then, and IAP which variant is that, also the KSA had the A2S export variant of the A2 SEP so now i am laughing harder. Laughing

    And that T-90 the "rebels" got is useless, i have yet to see them turn that turret much less use it in combat, good for PR, but not much else.

    Nope we won't agree on anything. Especially on disagreeing on something as evident as the fact that you are well protected in an export M1A1/A2. IAP/AIM stands for Integrated managment Abrams Program/Abrams Integrated Managment. These tanks are well protected for front use. What they can't overcome, is poor crews, poor leadership and idiotic tactics.

    Same for the T90.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sat Jul 02, 2016 2:42 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    nemrod wrote:A friend of mine that knows very well the situation that is prevailing in Middle East told me that a syrian army's T-62 took out an M1 Abrams belonging to the terrorists dubbed "DAECH".





    This news did not surprised me, as I know that the powerful gun -115 mm/ smoothbore- of the T-62 could largely destroy any western tank in a fair combat.

    Wouldn't be surprised, armor of export M1s is a joke, SA lost quite a few in Yemen, there was also that time when Iraq tested Kornet against M1 the thing was hauled away with tarp covering the frontal armor so it didn't look good.

    Export M1 armour is far from a joke. Especially the post IAP ones.

    KSA lost quite of them due to its crews being little more than baboons with the gift of speech. All tanks would have faltered in those circumstances. Take the T90's in Syria, great workhorse, definitely not enough for garbage crews.

    Lets agree to disagree then, and IAP which variant is that, also the KSA had the A2S export variant of the A2 SEP so now i am laughing harder. Laughing

    And that T-90 the "rebels" got is useless, i have yet to see them turn that turret much less use it in combat, good for PR, but not much else.

    Nope we won't agree on anything. Especially on disagreeing on something as evident as the fact that you are well protected in an export M1A1/A2. IAP/AIM stands for Integrated managment Abrams Program/Abrams Integrated Managment. These tanks are well protected for front use. What they can't overcome, is poor crews, poor leadership and idiotic tactics.

    Same for the T90.

    Fine by me charly, your views wont change and neither will mine.
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    nemrod

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  nemrod on Sat Jul 02, 2016 11:18 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    Nope we won't agree on anything. Especially on disagreeing on something as evident as the fact that you are well protected in an export M1A1/A2. IAP/AIM stands for Integrated managment Abrams Program/Abrams Integrated Managment. These tanks are well protected for front use. What they can't overcome, is poor crews, poor leadership and idiotic tactics.
    With or without their gadgets like IAP/AIM, or you can bring the most well trained personnel -that rarely exist in KSA's ground forces-, the best tactics, that implies a very skills high commands -that does not exist KSA's ground forces- any M1 will be crushed by any russian anti tank missiles.
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Jul 02, 2016 2:28 pm

    nemrod wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    Nope we won't agree on anything. Especially on disagreeing on something as evident as the fact that you are well protected in an export M1A1/A2. IAP/AIM stands for Integrated managment Abrams Program/Abrams Integrated Managment. These tanks are well protected for front use. What they can't overcome, is poor crews, poor leadership and idiotic tactics.
    With or without their gadgets like IAP/AIM, or you can bring the most well trained personnel -that rarely exist in KSA's ground forces-, the best tactics, that implies a very skills high commands -that does not exist KSA's ground forces- any M1 will be crushed by any russian anti tank missiles.

    I don't think your statement makes much sense. The fist part is the exact opposite of the second part. I haven't heard of any armored formation deciding to carelessly drive and park their MBTs towards enemy ATGM traps and so on. Saddam's IQ Army and Assad's Seflie Arab Army are exceptions.

    Export or US M1s are pretty solid tanks.
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    KoTeMoRe

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Sun Jul 03, 2016 12:00 am

    I'd say that a protracted war will always cost assets, there's no question about it.

    It's also probably an unical setting. The "rebels" have fired more ATGM's than some armies have in inventory.
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    User 1592

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  User 1592 on Wed Aug 17, 2016 2:09 am

    M1 TTB : http://warfaretech.blogspot.com/2015/05/m1-tank-test-bed-ttb-with-unmanned.html
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    Gunfighter-AK

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  Gunfighter-AK on Tue Sep 13, 2016 6:18 pm

    May or may not being the wrong thread to ask in, but I've heard that the Saudis have lost 6 M1A2Ss, as of March. Has that number increased any?
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  AlfaT8 on Tue Sep 13, 2016 10:58 pm

    Gunfighter-AK wrote:May or may not being the wrong thread to ask in, but I've heard that the Saudis have lost 6 M1A2Ss, as of March. Has that number increased any?

    In the last discussion about this, we believed they lost around 20 and those are the ones that can be verified, some believe the actual lost is over 100.
    http://www.russiadefence.net/t4766p500-yemeni-conflict-news-2
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    Gunfighter-AK

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    Re: M1 Abrams Discussion Thread:

    Post  Gunfighter-AK on Wed Sep 14, 2016 1:29 am

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Gunfighter-AK wrote:May or may not being the wrong thread to ask in, but I've heard that the Saudis have lost 6 M1A2Ss, as of March. Has that number increased any?

    In the last discussion about this, we believed they lost around 20 and those are the ones that can be verified, some believe the actual lost is over 100.
    http://www.russiadefence.net/t4766p500-yemeni-conflict-news-2

    Cheers! Will take the discussion there.

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