Military Forum for Russian and Global Defence Issues


    IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Share

    sheytanelkebir

    Posts : 498
    Points : 515
    Join date : 2013-09-16

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  sheytanelkebir on Sat Mar 18, 2017 9:41 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Small drone 'shot with Patriot missile'

    A Patriot missile - usually priced at about $3m (£2.5m) - was used to shoot down a small quadcopter drone, according to a US general.

    The strike was made by a US ally, Gen David Perkins told a military symposium.

    "That quadcopter that cost 200 bucks from Amazon.com did not stand a chance against a Patriot," he said.

    Patriots are radar-targeted weapons more commonly used to shoot down enemy aircraft and ballistic missiles.

    "Now, that worked, they got it, OK, and we love Patriot missiles," the general said.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-39277940

    Bhahahaha..... lol!

    A frigin Patriot missile, just wow, F'ing wow, wtf happened to all those Stingers they had?

    It could of easily been shot down with a Bushmaster 25mm autocannon, but of course how will the US Private MIC turn in a profit to show for their quarterly reviews at their share holder meetings... Rolling Eyes

    once again. I don't quite see the relevance of this to Iraq since Iraq has neither patriots nor bushmasters, nor were any $200 drones shot down in iraq by such things. (they are brought down by sniper rifles usually).
    avatar
    AlfaT8

    Posts : 1334
    Points : 1341
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sat Mar 18, 2017 5:07 pm

    sheytanelkebir wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Small drone 'shot with Patriot missile'

    A Patriot missile - usually priced at about $3m (£2.5m) - was used to shoot down a small quadcopter drone, according to a US general.

    The strike was made by a US ally, Gen David Perkins told a military symposium.

    "That quadcopter that cost 200 bucks from Amazon.com did not stand a chance against a Patriot," he said.

    Patriots are radar-targeted weapons more commonly used to shoot down enemy aircraft and ballistic missiles.

    "Now, that worked, they got it, OK, and we love Patriot missiles," the general said.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-39277940

    Bhahahaha..... lol!

    A frigin Patriot missile, just wow, F'ing wow, wtf happened to all those Stingers they had?

    It could of easily been shot down with a Bushmaster 25mm autocannon, but of course how will the US Private MIC turn in a profit to show for their quarterly reviews at their share holder meetings... Rolling Eyes

    once again. I don't quite see the relevance of this to Iraq since Iraq has neither patriots nor bushmasters, nor were any $200 drones shot down in iraq by such things. (they are brought down by sniper rifles usually).

    calm posted a lot of pics of these drones being used in Iraq so it does have some relevance there, besides the article doesn't say which country used the Patriot.
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16302
    Points : 16933
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  GarryB on Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:21 am

    You should take a leaf out of the book of the Serbs and send up Hind helos with a PKM MG out the rear door to shoot down drones... low cost and unlike the serbs there is no air threat to your helos so they could operate with little chance of being shot down by a fighter aircraft...

    Of course mounting a PKM MG on your own fixed wing light drone with a couple of stingers would also be a very potent system that is cheaper to operate.

    Of course the main problem with using Stingers is that they are not so cheap but a burst of 7.62mm rounds would do the job. Of course if you can fly close enough a 12 gauge barrel barrel with a belt feed mechanism could greatly increase the chances of a hit with a few rounds against a small fast moving target like a drone... and still be very cheap.

    The short range of the 12 gauge rounds means you will need to get very close to the target but that just means identification should be no problem too.

    Even a special air burst 30mm grenade round could be used... with a laser range finder mounted on the UAV you could develop some 30mm rounds that detonate say at 250m range and then line up the target and lase it and use a ballistics computer to fire the weapon at the right time with air bursts all around the target ensuring a kill with 2-3 round only. This would be much better than a shotgun round needing your drone to get within 20m or so of the target to be effective.

    With a set time fuse the 30mm grenades would not be that expensive to develop. There are already what are called cargo rounds in 30 x 165mm cannon calibre for use by fighters against ground targets that explode at about 1km range to shower tungsten pellets at the target.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    sheytanelkebir

    Posts : 498
    Points : 515
    Join date : 2013-09-16

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  sheytanelkebir on Sun Mar 19, 2017 11:03 am

    iraqis are using jammers (blighter 400), long range sniper rifles (including locally made copies of steyr anti material rifles) and 23mm . they do the job well and dozens (maybe hundreds) of drones have been brought down. but of course these drones are cheap and almost every single isis man has one... so there are probably dozens flying around at any one time.

    its a new way of warfare in cities... individual drones accompanying 5-6 fighters with a couple of grenades on board in addition to cams. adds a lot of new variables to fighting in built up areas.

    However my point was, the previous posts by alfaT8 and magnumcromagnon were trying to imply that the iraqis were "dumb" and using patriots to shoot down $200 drones. Iraq does not possess patriot.

    They could have posted the above news snippet in an thread about any actual patriot operators in the middle east.








    locally made anti material rifle used against drones

    zarib

    Posts : 31
    Points : 33
    Join date : 2016-01-29

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  zarib on Sun Mar 19, 2017 5:08 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    sheytanelkebir wrote:
    magnumcromagnon wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Small drone 'shot with Patriot missile'

    A Patriot missile - usually priced at about $3m (£2.5m) - was used to shoot down a small quadcopter drone, according to a US general.

    The strike was made by a US ally, Gen David Perkins told a military symposium.

    "That quadcopter that cost 200 bucks from Amazon.com did not stand a chance against a Patriot," he said.

    Patriots are radar-targeted weapons more commonly used to shoot down enemy aircraft and ballistic missiles.

    "Now, that worked, they got it, OK, and we love Patriot missiles," the general said.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-39277940

    Bhahahaha..... lol!

    A frigin Patriot missile, just wow, F'ing wow, wtf happened to all those Stingers they had?

    It could of easily been shot down with a Bushmaster 25mm autocannon, but of course how will the US Private MIC turn in a profit to show for their quarterly reviews at their share holder meetings... Rolling Eyes

    once again. I don't quite see the relevance of this to Iraq since Iraq has neither patriots nor bushmasters, nor were any $200 drones shot down in iraq by such things. (they are brought down by sniper rifles usually).

    calm posted a lot of pics of these drones being used in Iraq so it does have some relevance there, besides the article doesn't say which country used the Patriot.

    Except Iraq does not have patriot missiles. So your post is irrelevant to Iraq.
    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16302
    Points : 16933
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  GarryB on Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:28 am

    I would assume the controllers of any Patriot system in the region would be US controlled and rather than a slur on Iraq, it sounds more like a suggestion that the US are not getting value for money... which of course is already a well know fact...

    I mean 100K Javelin missiles to take out a car or sniper position is excessive when an RPG will do the same job or a 10K Metis will do a better job.


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order

    sheytanelkebir

    Posts : 498
    Points : 515
    Join date : 2013-09-16

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  sheytanelkebir on Mon Mar 20, 2017 3:21 pm

    GarryB wrote:I would assume the controllers of any Patriot system in the region would be US controlled and rather than a slur on Iraq, it sounds more like a suggestion that the US are not getting value for money... which of course is already a well know fact...

    I mean 100K Javelin missiles to take out a car or sniper position is excessive when an RPG will do the same job or a 10K Metis will do a better job.

    which is fine. however completely irrelevant in this thread.
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 4495
    Points : 4674
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:05 pm

    sheytanelkebir wrote:
    GarryB wrote:I would assume the controllers of any Patriot system in the region would be US controlled and rather than a slur on Iraq, it sounds more like a suggestion that the US are not getting value for money... which of course is already a well know fact...

    I mean 100K Javelin missiles to take out a car or sniper position is excessive when an RPG will do the same job or a 10K Metis will do a better job.

    which is fine. however completely irrelevant in this thread.

    Sorry about that. Lets get back on track:

    avatar
    GarryB

    Posts : 16302
    Points : 16933
    Join date : 2010-03-30
    Location : New Zealand

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  GarryB on Tue Mar 21, 2017 12:36 am

    Well not completely irrelevant...

    I would suggest that you need to ensure value for money when cleaning up the dirt, and these drones seem to be a real threat for the Iraqi forces and it will only get worse over time so cost effective ways of dealing with them need to be sought and examined.

    I must say as per my post above my first thought was shotguns, but after thinking about it they have a good hit probability per round but a very limited effective range.

    Most other projectile options require multiple round bursts which increases cost.

    If the enemy is dropping ordinance from these drones then they could operate them quite high up which makes them a difficult target for small arms. Most MANPADS would be ineffective because of the low IR signature of most of these electric powered drones.

    I suspect the best weapon would be some sort of directed energy pulse weapon that melts their electronics without having to fire a shot... though you would have to be careful to prevent disabling your own aircraft flying around and of course the threat of it landing in enemy hands.

    As such I would probably go for an air based system with high power jammers that can be tasked the dual role of anti drone and anti IED roles... probably more expensive than using Patriots ironically, but fully reusable and able to do the job without the risk of capture.

    What are your thoughts?


    _________________
    “The West won the world not by the superiority of its ideas or values or religion […] but rather by its superiority in applying organized violence. Westerners often forget this fact; non-Westerners never do.”

    ― Samuel P. Huntington, The Clash of Civilizations and the Remaking of World Order
    avatar
    KoTeMoRe

    Posts : 3905
    Points : 3936
    Join date : 2015-04-21
    Location : Krankhaus Central.

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Tue Mar 21, 2017 1:19 am

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Small drone 'shot with Patriot missile'

    A Patriot missile - usually priced at about $3m (£2.5m) - was used to shoot down a small quadcopter drone, according to a US general.

    The strike was made by a US ally, Gen David Perkins told a military symposium.

    "That quadcopter that cost 200 bucks from Amazon.com did not stand a chance against a Patriot," he said.

    Patriots are radar-targeted weapons more commonly used to shoot down enemy aircraft and ballistic missiles.

    "Now, that worked, they got it, OK, and we love Patriot missiles," the general said.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-39277940

    Bhahahaha..... lol!

    A frigin Patriot missile, just wow, F'ing wow, wtf happened to all those Stingers they had?

    Patriot? Lol BBC pls no more fake news. Iraq doesn't have PAC's. Lol this bullshit.

    sheytanelkebir

    Posts : 498
    Points : 515
    Join date : 2013-09-16

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  sheytanelkebir on Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:16 am

    GarryB wrote:Well not completely irrelevant...

    I would suggest that you need to ensure value for money when cleaning up the dirt, and these drones seem to be a real threat for the Iraqi forces and it will only get worse over time so cost effective ways of dealing with them need to be sought and examined.

    I must say as per my post above my first thought was shotguns, but after thinking about it they have a good hit probability per round but a very limited effective range.

    Most other projectile options require multiple round bursts which increases cost.

    If the enemy is dropping ordinance from these drones then they could operate them quite high up which makes them a difficult target for small arms. Most MANPADS would be ineffective because of the low IR signature of most of these electric powered drones.

    I suspect the best weapon would be some sort of directed energy pulse weapon that melts their electronics without having to fire a shot... though you would have to be careful to prevent disabling your own aircraft flying around and of course the threat of it landing in enemy hands.

    As such I would probably go for an air based system with high power jammers that can be tasked the dual role of anti drone and anti IED roles... probably more expensive than using Patriots ironically, but fully reusable and able to do the job without the risk of capture.

    What are your thoughts?

    well as of right now they are using a combination of ground based jammers and sniper rifles. that deals with a large percentage of these irritants but it can't deal with them all since iraqi forces are also using the same types of mini drones themselves so they can't simply jam a broad area and of course often people on the ground don't know if the drone nearby is friend or foe either... its messy.

    cheap drones have added a new dimension to city warfare. its something i aluded to last year when i suggested that MBTs should operate with 3 small automated drones allowing one to be in the air at all times to improve their situational awareness.
    avatar
    AlfaT8

    Posts : 1334
    Points : 1341
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  AlfaT8 on Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:08 pm

    sheytanelkebir wrote:iraqis are using jammers (blighter 400), long range sniper rifles (including locally made copies of steyr anti material rifles) and 23mm . they do the job well and dozens (maybe hundreds) of drones have been brought down. but of course these drones are cheap and almost every single isis man has one... so there are probably dozens flying around at any one time.

    its a new way of warfare in cities... individual drones accompanying 5-6 fighters with a couple of grenades on board in addition to cams. adds a lot of new variables to fighting in built up areas.

    However my point was, the previous posts by alfaT8 and magnumcromagnon were trying to imply that the iraqis were "dumb" and using patriots to shoot down $200 drones. Iraq does not possess patriot.

    They could have posted the above news snippet in an thread about any actual patriot operators in the middle east.

    locally made anti material rifle used against drones

    Implying that "Iraqis" were dumb, no i am implying that whoever used it was an idiot, most likely the U.S itself.
    "Iraq does not possess patriot" no duh, i already responded to that.
    avatar
    AlfaT8

    Posts : 1334
    Points : 1341
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  AlfaT8 on Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:10 pm

    zarib wrote:

    Except Iraq does not have patriot missiles. So your post is irrelevant to Iraq.

    Drones are used against Iraq, lots of pics, so not completely irrelevant.
    avatar
    AlfaT8

    Posts : 1334
    Points : 1341
    Join date : 2013-02-02

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  AlfaT8 on Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:11 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    AlfaT8 wrote:
    Small drone 'shot with Patriot missile'

    A Patriot missile - usually priced at about $3m (£2.5m) - was used to shoot down a small quadcopter drone, according to a US general.

    The strike was made by a US ally, Gen David Perkins told a military symposium.

    "That quadcopter that cost 200 bucks from Amazon.com did not stand a chance against a Patriot," he said.

    Patriots are radar-targeted weapons more commonly used to shoot down enemy aircraft and ballistic missiles.

    "Now, that worked, they got it, OK, and we love Patriot missiles," the general said.

    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-39277940

    Bhahahaha..... lol!

    A frigin Patriot missile, just wow, F'ing wow, wtf happened to all those Stingers they had?

    Patriot? Lol BBC pls no more fake news. Iraq doesn't have PAC's. Lol this bullshit.

    And they don't mention who did it.
    avatar
    magnumcromagnon

    Posts : 4495
    Points : 4674
    Join date : 2013-12-05
    Location : Pindos ave., Pindosville, Pindosylvania, Pindostan

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:14 pm

    sheytanelkebir wrote:
    GarryB wrote:Well not completely irrelevant...

    I would suggest that you need to ensure value for money when cleaning up the dirt, and these drones seem to be a real threat for the Iraqi forces and it will only get worse over time so cost effective ways of dealing with them need to be sought and examined.

    I must say as per my post above my first thought was shotguns, but after thinking about it they have a good hit probability per round but a very limited effective range.

    Most other projectile options require multiple round bursts which increases cost.

    If the enemy is dropping ordinance from these drones then they could operate them quite high up which makes them a difficult target for small arms. Most MANPADS would be ineffective because of the low IR signature of most of these electric powered drones.

    I suspect the best weapon would be some sort of directed energy pulse weapon that melts their electronics without having to fire a shot... though you would have to be careful to prevent disabling your own aircraft flying around and of course the threat of it landing in enemy hands.

    As such I would probably go for an air based system with high power jammers that can be tasked the dual role of anti drone and anti IED roles... probably more expensive than using Patriots ironically, but fully reusable and able to do the job without the risk of capture.

    What are your thoughts?

    well as of right now they are using a combination of ground based jammers and sniper rifles. that deals with a large percentage of these irritants but it can't deal with them all since iraqi forces are also using the same types of mini drones themselves so they can't simply jam a broad area and of course often people on the ground don't know if the drone nearby is friend or foe either... its messy.

    cheap drones have added a new dimension to city warfare. its something i aluded to last year when i suggested that MBTs should operate with 3 small automated drones allowing one to be in the air at all times to improve their situational awareness.

    Two years ago I predicted that cheap drones carrying munitions attacking from above, would be the next significant asymmetrical threat, and I was right.

    sheytanelkebir

    Posts : 498
    Points : 515
    Join date : 2013-09-16

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  sheytanelkebir on Thu Mar 23, 2017 11:01 am

    I think these mini drones are an issue in iraq and syria only because the combatants themselves (I mean Iraqi and Syrian) also use the same cheap drones and thus restricting themselves from completely jamming the frequencies used by the enemy..

    Its a similar situation to mobile phone signals whereby both sides use it for communications and the government forces are loath to force the signals off! and they've been essentially allowing ISIS to not only freely communicate, but also the kuwaiti and qatari owned telcos (I am really serious!) in Iraq most probably pass location details of Iraqi officers and  the like to "friends".

    yes. Electronic warfare and sigint is at an excruciatingly idiotic level there. I remember nearly 3 years ago suggesting just switching off the TELCO masts! to no avail.


    in any conflict involving more developed countries, telco masts would be off and all "civilian" grade electronics wouldn't work in a heavily jammed environment. The likes of ISIS would be routed in no time since they would lose most of their situational awareness.

    JohninMK

    Posts : 4553
    Points : 4610
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:09 pm

    Is this a Trank?


    JohninMK

    Posts : 4553
    Points : 4610
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:15 pm

    Trump's son in law Jared, dressed as a rich Yank thinks he should, in chinos and blazer, when visiting a theatre of war, Iraq. All he needs is a swagger stick in his right hand Laughing



    Mmmm, looks like it could be some kind of uniform for civvies.



    Last edited by JohninMK on Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:29 pm; edited 2 times in total

    JohninMK

    Posts : 4553
    Points : 4610
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:22 pm

    You've heard of the Mother of all Battles, well, this is the Mother of all Conference Tables. US Military of course Laughing

    Jared with his new mate Joe, a 4* plus plus Smile Dunsford is his name.

    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 10228
    Points : 10716
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  George1 on Fri Apr 14, 2017 1:56 am

    Iraqi Army began to use Raysun MD-1 against suicide drones of ISIS



    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2549191.html



    _________________
    "There's no smoke without fire.", Georgy Zhukov

    avatar
    George1

    Posts : 10228
    Points : 10716
    Join date : 2011-12-22
    Location : Greece

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  George1 on Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:15 pm

    Kurdish Peshmerga will receive American artillery

    The Defense Security Cooperation Agency (DSCA) on April 18, 2017 sent a notice to the US Congress about the planned supply of weapons and military equipment to Iraq to equip two infantry brigades and two artillery divisions of the armed forces of the Kurdish regional government in northern Iraq "Peshmerga"). The delivery is approved by the US Department of State. The estimated cost of delivery of $ 295.6 million



    The delivery includes 36 repaired towed howitzer M119A2 caliber 105 mm out of stock, 4400 M16A4 automatic caliber 5.56 mm, 186 M240B machine guns of 7.62 mm caliber, 46 M2 machine guns of 12.7 mm caliber, 36 M1151 HMMWV cars, 77 M1151 cars HMMWV with additional reservation, etc. related property, including unspecified number of mortars, M1142 HMMWV vehicles, trucks, etc.

    The supply, apparently, will be made at the expense of American financing. Howitzer M119A2, as far as can be judged, will be the first field artillery systems officially supplied to Peshmerga.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2561842.html


    _________________
    "There's no smoke without fire.", Georgy Zhukov

    avatar
    max steel

    Posts : 2979
    Points : 3011
    Join date : 2015-02-12
    Location : South Pole

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  max steel on Wed Apr 26, 2017 9:03 pm

    Isis used 17 suicide car bombs 'to help leader Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi flee Mosul'

    avatar
    calm

    Posts : 1127
    Points : 1129
    Join date : 2015-12-19
    Location : Serbia

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  calm on Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:13 pm

    IS got royally fucked today in Syria and Iraq
    Iraq Joint Operations: "35 ISIS car bombs destroyed, 87 militants killed & 17 explosive vest seized in 1st day of Mutabijah ops"


    JohninMK

    Posts : 4553
    Points : 4610
    Join date : 2015-06-16
    Location : England

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  JohninMK on Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:22 am

    Interesting if true, could be more than meets the eye if one of the comments is correct

    Rami al-Lolah‏ @RamiAILoIah 2h2 hours ago

    ABSOLUTELY BIG! #BREAKING #USA Special Forces carried out ground raid to arrest high ranking Shiite militia PM commander in Miqdadiyah #Iraq

    https://twitter.com/RamiAILoIah/status/858058336838852608/photo/1
    avatar
    Benya

    Posts : 487
    Points : 491
    Join date : 2016-06-05
    Location : Budapest, Hungary

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  Benya on Sat May 06, 2017 10:23 am

    Iraqi forces are about to fully liberate the city of Mosul from ISIS

    Map made by South Front. It shows yesterday's progress in the city.


    Source: Arrow https://southfront.org/military-situation-in-iraqi-city-of-mosul-on-may-5-2017-map-update/

    Sponsored content

    Re: IRAQ - Fight on Islamic State: News #2

    Post  Sponsored content


      Current date/time is Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:25 am