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    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK

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    hoom

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    Post  hoom on Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:58 am

    Was rumored a bit back but apparently Alrosa is confirmed being reassigned to Baltic.
    https://topwar.ru/145578-s-chernomorskogo-flota-na-baltijskij-alrosa-idet-sluzhit-na-baltiku.html
    Google translate wrote:The Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Navy made a decision to redeploy the submarine "Alrosa" from the Black Sea Fleet to the Baltic Fleet, Izvestiya reports with reference to the military leadership of the Russian Navy.

    In the military department this redeployment was explained by the almost complete absence of an underwater fleet in the Baltic and the arrival of new submarines on the Black Sea Fleet. The submarine will be included in the Red Banner Leningrad Naval Base (LenVMB) of the Baltic Fleet. Later, the submarine will be sent for modernization. Earlier, "Alrosa" made the transition to the Baltic, in 2011 she arrived in Kronstadt, where the scheduled repair was.

    It should be noted that at present there are only two submarines of the project 877 still built on the Baltic - the Vyborg and the Dmitrov. At the same time, the Vyborg submarine built in 1983 was not modernized for a long time and was not repaired and it is planned to withdraw it from the fleet. "Dmitrov" in the period 2014 - 2018 was under repair in Kronstadt.

    With only 2 Kilos in Baltic & not new ones it makes sense.
    Also possibly what happened with Alrosa: They went too deep while working up after coming out of that 2011 maintenance, nearly sank the thing.
    That would make sense for why its had a long maintenance involving the pipes etc so soon after a major refit in 2011 unshaven

    Question would be how they get it back to the Baltic?
    Montreux convention allows it out for repairs as in 2011 but is it in condition to be able to make it to Baltic on its own and if its really poked from the incident then it might not be much use in Baltic either Suspect
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    Post  George1 on Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:40 pm

    hoom wrote:Was rumored a bit back but apparently Alrosa is confirmed being reassigned to Baltic.
    https://topwar.ru/145578-s-chernomorskogo-flota-na-baltijskij-alrosa-idet-sluzhit-na-baltiku.html
    Google translate wrote:The Commander-in-Chief of the Russian Navy made a decision to redeploy the submarine "Alrosa" from the Black Sea Fleet to the Baltic Fleet, Izvestiya reports with reference to the military leadership of the Russian Navy.

    In the military department this redeployment was explained by the almost complete absence of an underwater fleet in the Baltic and the arrival of new submarines on the Black Sea Fleet. The submarine will be included in the Red Banner Leningrad Naval Base (LenVMB) of the Baltic Fleet. Later, the submarine will be sent for modernization. Earlier, "Alrosa" made the transition to the Baltic, in 2011 she arrived in Kronstadt, where the scheduled repair was.

    It should be noted that at present there are only two submarines of the project 877 still built on the Baltic - the Vyborg and the Dmitrov. At the same time, the Vyborg submarine built in 1983 was not modernized for a long time and was not repaired and it is planned to withdraw it from the fleet. "Dmitrov" in the period 2014 - 2018 was under repair in Kronstadt.

    With only 2 Kilos in Baltic & not new ones it makes sense.
    Also possibly what happened with Alrosa: They went too deep while working up after coming out of that 2011 maintenance, nearly sank the thing.
    That would make sense for why its had a long maintenance involving the pipes etc so soon after a major refit in 2011 unshaven

    Question would be how they get it back to the Baltic?
    Montreux convention allows it out for repairs as in 2011 but is it in condition to be able to make it to Baltic on its own and if its really poked from the incident then it might not be much use in Baltic either Suspect

    Logic move. And when Pacific fleet also will recieve the 6 Improved Kilo ordered then some old Kilos from there will be transferred to baltic and northern fleet as well
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    Post  hoom on Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:35 pm

    Rare, interesting angle on Veliki Novgorod
    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 03-6634229-4788891

    and an Alrosa 'progress' pic
    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 5203b9860c38
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    Post  George1 on Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:36 pm

    Kalibr reload in Kilo class submarine in Tartus, Syria

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    Post  hoom on Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:43 pm

    I gotta say I like those horizontal loading tray things much more than the 'traditional' angled hole from above.
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    Post  Isos on Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:29 am

    https://medium.com/indo-pacific-geomill/vietnamese-navy-kilo-submarines-77ce5dc97b0b

    Nice article.
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    Post  hoom on Thu Nov 08, 2018 5:17 am

    Apparently Vyborg has been decommissioned from Baltic Fleet https://flotprom.ru/2018/%D0%91%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%B9%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9%D0%A4%D0%BB%D0%BE%D1%8227/

    And rather optimistically they're suggesting Alrosa will be back in service & transferred to Baltic Fleet in 2019 https://flotprom.ru/2018/13%D0%A1%D1%80%D0%B74/
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    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:28 pm

    hoom wrote:Apparently Vyborg has been decommissioned from Baltic Fleet https://flotprom.ru/2018/%D0%91%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%B9%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9%D0%A4%D0%BB%D0%BE%D1%8227/

    And rather optimistically they're suggesting Alrosa will be back in service & transferred to Baltic Fleet in 2019 https://flotprom.ru/2018/13%D0%A1%D1%80%D0%B74/

    I don't remember Vyborg doing anything of note for quite a while, looks like she simply reached her retirement date

    Ladas are coming along at decent pace so it's expected
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    Post  hoom on Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:33 pm

    Ladas are coming along at decent pace so it's expected
    FIFY.
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:36 pm

    hoom wrote:Apparently Vyborg has been decommissioned from Baltic Fleet https://flotprom.ru/2018/%D0%91%D0%B0%D0%BB%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%B9%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9%D0%A4%D0%BB%D0%BE%D1%8227/

    And rather optimistically they're suggesting Alrosa will be back in service & transferred to Baltic Fleet in 2019 https://flotprom.ru/2018/13%D0%A1%D1%80%D0%B74/

    Kronshtadt should be joining the fleet early next year so it makes sense they have to prepare the crew for the lada.
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    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:38 pm

    hoom wrote:
    Ladas are coming along at decent pace so it's expected
    FIFY.

    Well not counting the second which had to be rebuilt from the ground up I mean that's near 15 years at this point.

    The third one should be commissioned in 4-5 years.

    It takes them three years to make improved Kilos so the time frame on the third isn't terrible for it being the second boat once the redesign happened
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    Post  hoom on Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:08 pm

    Kronshtadt should be joining the fleet early next year so it makes sense they have to prepare the crew for the lada.
    Isn't it going to North fleet with St Petersburg?

    Anyway, given no obvious progress with Alrosa repair its hard to see it finishing, working up & transiting to Baltic by the end of 2019.
    Edit: oh they're not actually saying transition during 2019, its repair to be completed by end of 2019 Embarassed

    It takes them three years to make improved Kilos
    2yrs for the last pair for BSF, 21mths for the mighty Krasnodar.
    Though 3 is probably about right average.
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    Post  George1 on Tue Nov 20, 2018 1:04 pm

    Inside the B-261 Novorossiysk. Commissioned in 2014. The first out of six diesel-electric Improved Kilo-class submarines which joined the Russian Black Sea Fleet in 2014-2016.

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    Post  Hole on Sun Nov 25, 2018 5:26 pm

    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 016410
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    Post  hoom on Tue Nov 27, 2018 11:34 am

    Alrosa this month, definitely not showing any sign of being ready to move to Baltic anytime soon.
    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 24-6900017-871
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    Post  hoom on Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:56 am

    Some form of actual action
    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 08-6954693-871

    And this is a cool shot
    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 02-6930361-pl-pr.-877-vsplytie
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    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 Empty Project 636.3 Submarines for Russian Pacific Fleet

    Post  zardof on Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:38 pm

    Benya wrote:Names of Project 636.3 Submarines for Russian Pacific Fleet Revealed

    The third, fourth, and fifth Project 636.3 diesel-electric submarines for the Russian Pacific Fleet will be named Magadan, Ufa, and Mozhaisk, revealed Igor Ponomaryov, the United Shipbuilding Corporation vice-president for defense production.

    Project 877/636: Kilo class SSK - Page 14 Project_636.3_ssk_russia
    Project 636.3 ssk russiaA Project 636.3 submarine of the Russian Black Sea Fleet transiting in the Dutch EEZ. Royal Netherlands Navy picture.

    "The fleet officials decided on the names Magadan, Ufa, and Mozhaisk. The sixth submarine’s name has not been chosen yet," he said.

    The first two Project 636.3 submarines for the Pacific Fleet were laid down in July. They got the names of Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky and Volkhov,

    Project 636.3 submarines belong to the third-generation diesel-electric boats. They are believed to be among the word’s most silent subs. They can gather surface speed of up to 20 knots and dive to around 300 m. The submerged endurance is 45 days. The submarine has a crew of 52. Its submerged displacement is around 4,000 tonnes. It is planned to build six such submarines for the Pacific Navy by the year 2022.

    Arrow https://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5513-names-of-project-636-3-submarines-for-russian-pacific-fleet-revealed.html

    Anybody knows when the 2 first will be launched ? They have been laid down 28/07/2017 so it s time !!!!!
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    Post  verkhoturye51 on Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:56 pm

    Anybody knows when the 2 first will be launched ? They have been laid down 28/07/2017 so it s time !!!!!

    Good timing, Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky is to be launched at the end of this month.
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    Post  zardof on Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:02 pm

    verkhoturye51 wrote:
    Anybody knows when the 2 first will be launched ? They have been laid down 28/07/2017 so it s time !!!!!

    Good timing, Petropavlovsk-Kamchatsky is to be launched at the end of this month.

    Many thanks
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    Post  hoom on Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:31 am

    So according to https://ru.euronews.com/2019/03/14/russian-submarine-in-bosphorus-on-way-to-mediterranean
    Krasnodar went out through the Bosphorus  scratch
    The Russian diesel-electric submarine Krasnodar passed through the Bosphorus from the Black Sea to the Marmara. This is one of the newest submarines, based on the Novorossiysk base of the Navy. She was commissioned in 2015 and is able to carry on board, in particular, cruise missiles "Caliber" with a range of up to 2 thousand kilometers. It is assumed that Krasnodar will join the Russian grouping in the Mediterranean.

    Under the current rules, the submarine passed through Istanbul in a surface position. She was accompanied by boats and the ship of the Turkish coast guard.

    For Krasnodar this is not the first trip to the Mediterranean Sea. The submarine participated in operations in Syria, in particular, attacked the Caliber missiles with the alleged positions of militants of the Islamic State terrorist group. In July 2017, Krasnodar took part in the maritime parade in the port of Tartus.

    This would be a flagrant breach of the Montreaux Convention & I don't see why Turkey would allow it so I don't believe it.
    The video is dated appropriately but I'm pretty sure it must be showing an older Northward transit.

    Stary Oskol was recently reported going out on a patrol
    https://flot.com/2019/%D0%A7%D0%B5%D1%80%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%BC%D0%BE%D1%80%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9%D0%A4%D0%BB%D0%BE%D1%8285/
    It would be allowed to visit a Turkish port in the Bosphorus I believe so could be mis-reporting of that?

    Edit: well heck, found several landmarks in that vid via Google Earth & that is indeed a Kilo heading South Shocked
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    Post  Isos on Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:13 am

    Well 3 Grigorovitch + 6 imp kilo is huge for black sea fleet while PF and NF haven't got anything new since long time. I wouldn't be surprised if it never comes back and go to the pacific or in the north as tensions keep growing with nato.

    Turkey is not a big threat anymore.
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    Post  GarryB on Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:14 am

    This would be a flagrant breach of the Montreaux Convention & I don't see why Turkey would allow it so I don't believe it.

    The straight belongs to Turkey, that convention is an international document regarding international passage through the straight, but at the end of the day it is what Turkey wants to do... if they say fuck it, you can go through, then that is fine.

    I notice they didn't let any American ships through during the little events around the crimean bridge and the incident with the Ukrainians... the US was left asking germany to send boats through...
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    Post  hoom on Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:38 am

    at the end of the day it is what Turkey wants to do... if they say fuck it, you can go through, then that is fine.
    No, Turkey can't just ignore the Convention, otherwise it'd have allowed the US to send a full CV battlegroup through at least sometime during the Cold War.

    There have been a few marginal calls in the past but the language covering Submarine transits is very clear: only Subs built outside but for BS nations are allowed in & they're only allowed to go out for repair.

    If there isn't a good excuse for this transit then the US is gonna send a full CV Battlegroup through or at least keep a Burke for longer than 2 weeks in the near future.
    Its really not in the interests of Russia to break the convention.
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    Post  verkhoturye51 on Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:04 am

    only Subs built outside but for BS nations are allowed in & they're only allowed to go out for repair.

    Subs made these transits frequently in the Soviet era. They headed for repairs in Yugoslavia, Libya or Baltic sea. The last example was Alrosa in 2011.


    Article 12

    Coastal powers of the Black sea will be eligible through the Straits, in order to return to their base, their submarines built or bought outside this sea if Turkey was notified in advance of the tab or purchase. Submarines belonging to these powers may equally pass through the Straits for repair at shipyards, located outside this sea, provided that accurate data on this will be given to Turkey. In both cases, the submarines will have to sail in daytime, and, moreover, on the surface, and pass through the Straits alone.
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    Post  hoom on Sat Mar 16, 2019 10:49 am

    Yes, as I said its allowed out for repairs.
    If it goes to Syria for some missile launches first and/or to do some faux 'repairs' at Tartous they're endangering the convention.

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