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    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

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    marat

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  marat on Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:59 am

    Mike you are not capable to have any discussion without insulting other members aren't you?

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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Singular_Transform on Sun Sep 17, 2017 12:31 pm

    Just for reference , The USS Gerald R. Ford story:
    First cut of steel : 11 August 2005
    Keel lay down : 13 November 2009
    Floated out :11 October 2013
    Formal delivery : 31 May 2017
    Full capability status ( as I read it is the equivalent of the delivery in the RuN ) : 2020?


    So, the building of the Ford actually takes 15 years.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:29 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    They need to take off their diapers, grow up and start working on frigates because they have corvettes and missile boats coming out of their asses.

    Not going to happen until the indigenous supply chain for marine gas turbines, power train, auxiliaries and all associated controls systems are complete and I'd guess these won't be fully online until 2018/19 (though the first examples of engines and gearboxes should be available 2017 for the Pr.22350 Adm Golovko).

    .................

    Lots of questions and possible issues with long-term operation of Gorshkov and Kasanatov, but at least its only 2 units....

    There is several year long gap between laying hull down and engine installation. Plenty of time to test out new engines. Basically they are wasting several years on nothing. 

    That is unless there aren't any problems with shortage of surface ships. But I honestly doubt it's the case.

    Gorshkov and Kasatonov will be fine, worst case scenario they just rip out Ukrainian engines and install Saturns down the road.
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    Singular_Transform

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Singular_Transform on Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:47 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:

    There is several year long gap between laying hull down and engine installation. Plenty of time to test out new engines. Basically they are wasting several years on nothing. 

    That is unless there aren't any problems with shortage of surface ships. But I honestly doubt it's the case.

    Gorshkov and Kasatonov will be fine, worst case scenario they just rip out Ukrainian engines and install Saturns down the road.



    It simply showing that you have no clue about the requirement of engine design/validation.

    Timeline:
    1.Subsystem
    Design -> manufacturing -> test
    2. full system
    assembly-> test

    The test is actually the lifetime test, means that you put the first units onto a test bench, and run it for the expected lifetime.

    So, if the unit expected to spend say 30 years on sea, with 25% deployment then you expected run run the test for 7.5 years.

    Of course you can say that the average workload is 30%, so if you run the test with 100% for 2.5 years then it will be an indicative about the performance.

    Best practice is if the test start with say 7 units, and if there is a failure then re-design, fix and continue the test .


    The subsequent units doesn't needs to go through the proto test, all that you need to prove is the manufacturing stayed within the tolerances, and the unit works within the specs.

    The test needs to be done with the assembled power train, including simulated shaft load , due to the characteristics of the gas turbine.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:22 pm

    '

    That doesn't change the fact that they are sitting idle

    If frigates need extra time then they should order more corvettes in the meantime instead of this 'one-by-one until forever' bullshit approach
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  KiloGolf on Sun Sep 17, 2017 5:41 pm

    Singular_Transform wrote:Just for reference , The USS Gerald R. Ford story:
    First cut of steel : 11 August 2005
    Keel lay down : 13 November 2009
    Floated out :11 October 2013
    Formal delivery : 31 May 2017
    Full capability status ( as I read it is the equivalent of the delivery in the RuN ) : 2020?


    So, the building of the Ford actually takes 15 years.

    A > 100,000 ton CV takes almost as much time to get operational as a RuN's new 5,000 ton LST. RUSSIA STRΟNK! lol1
    Not to mention that over a dozen of AB destroyers (or better cruisers) were inducted by the USN in the same time frame.



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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:35 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:

    I am almost afraid to ask but what's the status on this one?

    It was fun for a while but even I am getting all WTF? on this.

    It is seriously stretching my 2010-rule...
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  KiloGolf on Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:21 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    KiloGolf wrote:

    I am almost afraid to ask but what's the status on this one?

    It was fun for a while but even I am getting all WTF? on this.

    It is seriously stretching my 2010-rule...

    No idea, they kinda announced their Navy would accept it in 2017. Not sure what happened after that.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:28 pm

    Newer models seem to be rather fine. Earlier models not so much, going by Franco said. Predominantly, things didn't start to fix in production of Yak-130 till around 2011, and that was before Ukraine debacle. Really, Yak-130 is great, except for fact that it now requires total import substitution for it. They should have expected this at least since it was obvious even then how West treated Russia then, and how problematic Ukraine was then too (2004 should have been a wake up call for many in Russia, but I guess they needed a rehash 10 years later to get that cold water in the face).

    marat

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  marat on Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:31 pm

    Last news about Ivan Gren that i have found was from several weeks ago and he was on degaussing... again.
    Anyway it was anounced that he will join fleet not before November so they are still on track.
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  KiloGolf on Sun Sep 17, 2017 7:40 pm

    marat wrote:Last news about Ivan Gren that i have found was from several weeks ago and he was on degaussing... again.
    Anyway it was anounced that he will join fleet not before November so they are still on track.

    Good Lord geek

    Tingsay

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Tingsay on Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:16 pm

    While this is all sad for the Navy, it is true though that it is the least important branch of the Russian military. Neutral
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:33 pm

    Alright, i finally found it, it's called the Briz Corvette
    Had to type in "experimental russian corvettes" to find it.



    https://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5508-krylov-center-presents-concept-corvette-briz-at-army-2017.html

    Also, what's this???
    Trimaran Stealth Corvette?

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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  KiloGolf on Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:37 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:Alright, i finally found it, it's called the Briz Corvette
    Had to type in "experimental russian corvettes" to find it.



    https://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/news/defence-news/2017/august-2017-navy-naval-forces-defense-industry-technology-maritime-security-global-news/5508-krylov-center-presents-concept-corvette-briz-at-army-2017.html

    Also, what's this???
    Trimaran Stealth Corvette?


    lol1 lol1



    meanwhile the frigate and destroyer program's induction rates are running at turtle-fast pace lol1
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:43 pm

    Admiral grigorovich is actually within reason of 3 years. I don't know why they just don't build more of those.
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  KiloGolf on Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:50 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:Admiral grigorovich is actually within reason of 3 years. I don't know why they just don't build more of those.

    Agreed.

    If you ask me, they should have concentrated on them only. Just build them Grigorovich boats, for all major fleets, in big numbers. The Gorshkov seems too big and too complicated for Russia, they don't seem to be able to get the missiles right anyway.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:52 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:meanwhile the frigate and destroyer program's induction rates are running at turtle-fast pace lol1

    Sir, that is an insult to us Turtles.

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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Sun Sep 17, 2017 11:31 pm

    KiloGolf wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:Admiral grigorovich is actually within reason of 3 years. I don't know why they just don't build more of those.

    Agreed.

    If you ask me, they should have concentrated on them only. Just build them Grigorovich boats, for all major fleets, in big numbers. The Gorshkov seems too big and too complicated for Russia, they don't seem to be able to get the missiles right anyway.

    I wouldn't say complicated or anything. Brand new tech in it.  I would say having more grigorovich and gradually update them by both design and equipment through iterations.

    Missile test was completed on Gorshkov btw, so your info is rather outdated on it.  It was the highlight of the problem and it was resolved a while back. Now testing still commence for everything else.  It was rough and will be so till they start streamlining production of subcomponents. Redut is working though.

    http://foto-i-mir.ru/22350-gorshkov-161124/

    No one here understands the amount of systems and subcomponents Russia has to replace that Ukraine made. Engines is biggest one and Russia is still testing out their new engines. What would have allowed Gorshkov to be completed has now extended its deadline. Even Grigoroviches are being pushed back because of Ukrainian components, like - engines. I think most of you figured Russia made most of its stuff inside. It didn't. Instead it had to collect components from all over former soviet union in order to make a lot of their ships. Now that changes but it isn't a 1 or 2 year process.
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    kvs

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  kvs on Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:58 am

    Engine testing should be done before the middle of 2018 with serial production to follow. This is very plausible and
    consistent with various statements. So by the middle of 2018, the whole Ukrainian supply issue will be absolute
    history.
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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:22 am

    kvs wrote:Engine testing should be done before the middle of 2018 with serial production to follow.   This is very plausible and
    consistent with various statements.    So by the middle of 2018, the whole Ukrainian supply issue will be absolute
    history.  

    I would honestly bet money that there will be further delays after that. Neutral
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:38 am

    AlfaT8 wrote:
    kvs wrote:Engine testing should be done before the middle of 2018 with serial production to follow.   This is very plausible and
    consistent with various statements.    So by the middle of 2018, the whole Ukrainian supply issue will be absolute
    history.  

    I would honestly bet money that there will be further delays after that. Neutral

    Then do it.
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    KomissarBojanchev

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:01 am

    With the fiasco the lack of Ukrainian components is causing, i'm wondering why doesn't russia simply invade Ukraine and partition it, or at least stage a counter color revolution. The western leaders are convinced Russia has invaded Ukraine, so whats the point not to? There won't be any worse repercussions.

    Even if the disruption of the engine supply caused more damage to the Ukrainian economy, it hasn't helped destabilize the junta and with raw oppression, the galician scum aren't leaving kiev soon.
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    Isos

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Isos on Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:45 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:With the fiasco the lack of Ukrainian components is causing, i'm wondering why doesn't russia simply invade Ukraine and partition it, or at least stage a counter color revolution. The western leaders are convinced Russia has invaded Ukraine, so whats the point not to? There won't be any worse repercussions.

    Even if the disruption of the engine supply caused more damage to the Ukrainian economy, it hasn't helped destabilize the junta and with raw oppression, the galician scum aren't leaving kiev soon.

    Invading a poor country to have spare parts for military hardware ...
    Imagine the situation of russian eco if they add some 10 million poor people to their country that they need to feed and give them a job. The situation now is eeally good for Russia as everyone knoxs what obama did to ukraine, the gov is total bs, nato doesn t give a shit about them. Once ukrainian people get it they will implore russia ro help them ...
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    SeigSoloyvov

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Mon Sep 18, 2017 12:55 pm

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:With the fiasco the lack of Ukrainian components is causing, i'm wondering why doesn't russia simply invade Ukraine and partition it, or at least stage a counter color revolution. The western leaders are convinced Russia has invaded Ukraine, so whats the point not to? There won't be any worse repercussions.

    Even if the disruption of the engine supply caused more damage to the Ukrainian economy, it hasn't helped destabilize the junta and with raw oppression, the galician scum aren't leaving kiev soon.

    Why would Russia want the rats nest that is ukraine? they aren't exactly the richest country in the world and that would be a huge financial burden to take on for them. Western Ukrainians also hate Russia the eastern side is russian friendly.

    Conquering them really isn't worth it at all for Russia. Unless Putin was solely interested in just having the land.

    Ukraine offers them nothing...I mean maybe the shipyard but that alone doesn't justify taking ukraine on your wallet.
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    hoom

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  hoom on Mon Sep 18, 2017 3:26 pm

    Also, what's this???
    Trimaran Stealth Corvette?
    Rusich 1 from Zelenodolsk Design Bureau.
    Design puts the engines & fuel in the wings/outer hulls, intended to mostly operate with just the propulsion pods & main hull in the water, outer hulls skimming above.
    Props on front of the pods operate in completely clean water -> more efficient.

    Its an older concept displayed in 2015, officially abandoned sadly  cry
    They did build a 12m proof-of-concept which was allegedly successful.

    Decent length article here (in Russian) https://tvzvezda.ru/news/forces/content/201507210819-josl.htm

    More pics






    I'm a big fan of the idea & would love to see it in action.
    This CGI is cleaner & scales back the armament to something more reasonable for a 1500-2000ton ship.

    Sponsored content

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