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    Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

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    AlfaT8

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  AlfaT8 on Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:19 pm

    Looks like it's mostly done, now all we have to do is wait for the order to be given, any words from Rogozin, Shoygu or Putin?
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:49 pm

    hoom wrote:............
    The Goliath is completed now (& confirmed thats an Oscar looking tiny next to it)
    .........

    Compared to that Goliath entire shipyard looks tiny...



    There are two Oscars in overhaul there currently: К-132 Irkutsk and К-442 Chelabinsk

    https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/96818/

    You can clearly see other one in this pic:



    Fist ship laid down might be this civilian one for Rosneft. Anyone know what kind of ship this is?



    T-47

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  T-47 on Wed Aug 16, 2017 5:53 pm

    AlfaT8 wrote:Looks like it's mostly done, now all we have to do is wait for the order to be given, any words from Rogozin, Shoygu or Putin?

    PapaDragon put a link. words from Rogozin.

    PapaDragon wrote:.
    Civilian or military? confused

    Zvezda shipyard will lay down first four vessels in September 2017


    http://www.en.portnews.ru/news/243940/

    I think civilian. For Gazprom or Rosneft. They are the main investor in this shipyard after all. Also GPV 2025 doesn't have any indications that a shipyard with this size is needed right now.

    T-47

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  T-47 on Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:08 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Fist ship laid down might be this civilian one for Rosneft. Anyone know what kind of ship this is?


    I think that ship is a reinforced ice-class multi-functional support vessel. Rosneft ordered two of them, will be built on Zvezda shipyard.

    http://www.offshoreenergytoday.com/rosneft-orders-ice-class-support-vessels-at-zvezda-shipyard/
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    George1

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  George1 on Sun Aug 20, 2017 4:35 am

    About the future of the factory of SSK "Zvezda"

    Lay out and here. The interview is interesting because they do not talk with a big boss, but with a person directly from production.



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    George1

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  George1 on Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:28 pm

    Some photos of ships under construction in PJSC Shipyard "Severnaya Verf"

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2796766.html



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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Tue Sep 05, 2017 7:42 pm


    Zvezda drydock construction:






    https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/97623/
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Sep 06, 2017 12:20 pm

    .
    Pella undergoing upgrades, more pics in link:

    Зашивка стен нового эллинга ЛСЗ «Пелла»

    https://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/97655/


    Tingsay

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Tingsay on Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:55 pm


    Pella is in good hands!
    It needs to take on Project 20386 Derzky immediately. I'm certain they'll finish the job faster than Severnaya and Amur combined.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:33 pm

    Tingsay wrote:
    Pella is in good hands!
    It needs to take on Project 20386 Derzky immediately. I'm certain they'll finish the job faster than Severnaya and Amur combined.

    Agreed.

    Been saying that for quite some time, they are more than ready for corvettes.

    Austin

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:34 pm



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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:19 am

    I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs. They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:29 am

    miketheterrible wrote:I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs.  They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.

    This "corvette" is just another paper project by Krylov, it was posted here months ago.

    Some members are not up to date on some topics that is all. Happens to all of us.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Thu Sep 07, 2017 12:43 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs.  They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.

    This "corvette" is just another paper project by Krylov, it was posted here months ago.

    Some members are not up to date on some topics that is all. Happens to all of us.

    https://vpk.name/news/191574_voennomorskoi_flot_poluchit_narodnyii_korvet.html
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:02 am

    miketheterrible wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs.  They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.

    This "corvette" is just another paper project by Krylov, it was posted here months ago.

    Some members are not up to date on some topics that is all. Happens to all of us.

    https://vpk.name/news/191574_voennomorskoi_flot_poluchit_narodnyii_korvet.html

    What's it say?
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    Big_Gazza

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:15 am

    Austin wrote:


    It may be a Krylov vapour-ware project but it could find its way into a fab shop....  who knows?  It looks a nice design, and I'd say it takes low crew levels and high automation to the next level judging by its compact design and huge proportion of deck space allocate to weapons and sensors.

    Just a couple of notes however:

    1) The write up refers to 24x surface to surface missiles, but the model only shows two 3C-14 VLS
    2) I presume that structure to the aft of the 3C-14 VLS is the long range SAM?  It has 4 tubes, in groups of 2 set to starboard & port, presumably each holds 4x missiles, ie 16x total.  Never seen anything like this arrangement before...
    3) 32x short range missiles - where are these?  Is that a VLS partially visible on the hangar deck?  2x 16 round VLS works for me.

    Finally, there doesn't seem to be any reference to a Proj #?

    Tingsay

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  Tingsay on Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:55 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs.  They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.

    This "corvette" is just another paper project by Krylov, it was posted here months ago.

    Some members are not up to date on some topics that is all. Happens to all of us.

    https://vpk.name/news/191574_voennomorskoi_flot_poluchit_narodnyii_korvet.html

    What's it say?

    Well, the ship is basically a "budget" corvette. Costs a little more than Karakurts, but has more weapons, bigger displacement etc.
    Very 'Russian' , more cost effective than any other Russian ship. If what they claim is true, construction should start asap.

    But I have a feeling, it's a compromise between Project 20380s and Karakurts. While the Derzky is a compromise between 20380s and Groshkovs.
    That's not bad in and of itself, but it seems they foresee  the fact that the Russian Navy will continue to be the whipping boy of the Russian military  and that the speed in ship construction won't increase by lot for the foreseeable future.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:28 am

    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs.  They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.

    This "corvette" is just another paper project by Krylov, it was posted here months ago.

    Some members are not up to date on some topics that is all. Happens to all of us.

    https://vpk.name/news/191574_voennomorskoi_flot_poluchit_narodnyii_korvet.html

    What's it say?

    Pretty much about the ship and the interested parties in MoD about it. As noted before, the navy will face its budget cuts while the army is going to actually get budget increase. So in this regard, having to cut the budget of the navy but at same time Putin stating the importance it is for fielding a large navy in today's conflicts, I imagine that such ships will be rather important for Russia since that will pretty much meet all criteria mentioned. I'll give reason:
    - Almost as cheap as a Buyan-M
    - Having far more missiles than Buyan-M
    - Having real AD missiles than Buyan-M
    - Displacement roughly 2,000T

    This alone is indication that it could very well fit within the demands/needs of the Navy without breaking the bank. You get a semi-large ship with short range and long range AD missiles along with 24x Kalibr/Onyx missiles. This alone would make it better than some corvettes in Russia's navy and far better than any small missile ship.
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    hoom

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  hoom on Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:25 am

    Pella undergoing upgrades, more pics in link:
    Whats the upgrade though? Didn't seem to explicitly say in the link Question

    SLB

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  SLB on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:02 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:
    PapaDragon wrote:
    miketheterrible wrote:I figured as much they will do this. Apparently this new corvette will share same design as Lider but being smaller. In this regard, it greatly reduces costs.  They are also saying that this ship will be slightly more expensive than Buyan-M, which would mean it's a cheap system. Get multiple of shipyards building it, and Russia would have a serious navy.

    This "corvette" is just another paper project by Krylov, it was posted here months ago.

    Some members are not up to date on some topics that is all. Happens to all of us.

    https://vpk.name/news/191574_voennomorskoi_flot_poluchit_narodnyii_korvet.html


    IMHO this is the ship that should be built instead of the LCS wanabee that is the 20386.
    I understand that there is still R&D to be done, but keep building 20380 until that is completed.
    And maybe some weaponry could be traded for more autonomy, and one still would have
    a very potent platform with more range.

    I understand the Russian navy wanting to support its home industry by buying a platform (20386)
    clearly intended for the export market, but following that path it will end up with
    little more than the 20380 capabilities in vessels the size of a 11356.
    That's while I understood the 20385 wasn't viable with it's foreign engines, I never
    bought the argument that it was horrendously expensive.
    Does anyone realy think the 20386 will be cheaper than the 20385? Rolling Eyes

    SLB

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  SLB on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:34 pm

    And, while I'm at it I'll expand on the previous post to address other matters
    related to the Russian navy and shipbuilding.
    By all means update the Kuznetsov, the Kirovs and the Udaloys, and get the Gorshkov-M started,
    but that should be all for destroyer size and larger surface vessels.
    No LHDs, no Liders, no new aircraft carriers, please.
    Spare the rest of the money for what should be the real priority: the conventional and nuclear submarine fleet.
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    PapaDragon

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  PapaDragon on Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:46 pm

    SLB wrote:.......................
    IMHO this is the ship that should be built instead of the LCS wanabee that is the 20386.
    I understand that there is still R&D to be done, but keep building 20380 until that is completed.
    And maybe some weaponry could be traded for more autonomy, and one still would have
    a very potent platform with more range.

    I understand the Russian navy wanting to support its home industry by buying a platform (20386)
    clearly intended for the export market, but following that path it will end up with
    little more than the 20380 capabilities in vessels the size of a 11356.
    That's while I understood the 20385 wasn't viable with it's foreign engines, I never
    bought the argument that it was horrendously expensive.
    Does anyone realy think the 20386 will be cheaper than the 20385? Rolling Eyes

    This is pile of nonsense that needs to be forgotten ASAP before it becomes a meme like that anime style ''Lider'' destroyer or ''Shtorm'' ''supercarrier'' by the same design studio.

    This thing may have more missiles than 20380 but so does 20385 Gremashi. And just like 20385 Gremashi it is overstuffed but without benefit of longer range and endurance that Gremashi has.

    Other than armament this ''corvette'' is a joke.

    20386 Derzkii at least has the benefit of being under construction and being able to sail for more than couple of weeks.

    And claim that it's going to be cheaper than anything is bullshit of highest order. Armaments alone cost more than Buyan.

    20386 may or may not be cheaper than 20385 but it doesn't matter because it is usable vessel and not some idiotic fan-art like this crap they are trying to peddle.

    Just another scam. Third in a row from these idiots.

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  SLB on Thu Sep 07, 2017 2:53 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    SLB wrote:.......................
    IMHO this is the ship that should be built instead of the LCS wanabee that is the 20386.
    I understand that there is still R&D to be done, but keep building 20380 until that is completed.
    And maybe some weaponry could be traded for more autonomy, and one still would have
    a very potent platform with more range.

    I understand the Russian navy wanting to support its home industry by buying a platform (20386)
    clearly intended for the export market, but following that path it will end up with
    little more than the 20380 capabilities in vessels the size of a 11356.
    That's while I understood the 20385 wasn't viable with it's foreign engines, I never
    bought the argument that it was horrendously expensive.
    Does anyone realy think the 20386 will be cheaper than the 20385? Rolling Eyes

    This is pile of nonsense that needs to be forgotten ASAP before it becomes a meme like that anime style ''Lider'' destroyer or ''Shtorm'' ''supercarrier'' by the same design studio.

    This thing may have more missiles than 20380 but so does 20385 Gremashi. And just like 20385 Gremashi it is overstuffed but without benefit of longer range and endurance that Gremashi has.

    Other than armament this ''corvette'' is a joke.

    20386 Derzkii at least has the benefit of being under construction and being able to sail for more than couple of weeks.

    And claim that it's going to be cheaper than anything is bullshit of highest order. Armaments alone cost more than Buyan.

    20386 may or may not be cheaper than 20385 but it doesn't matter because it is usable vessel and not some idiotic fan-art like this crap they are trying to peddle.

    Just another scam. Third in a row from these idiots.



    It may well be truth that that this "corvette" is a joke and the third "scam" in a row from Krylov Institute.
    I also agree that the unit price of such ship must be way above than a Buyan-M.

    But it is also truth that 20386 is oversized and under-armed . It is the size of a 11356 so it must cost at least the
    same and to make it worse doesn't feature UKSK.

    Containerised weapon systems belong in patrol boats, assault ships, aircraft carriers and the like.
    Not in corvettes, frigates, destroyers or cruisers, since they are not efficient in terms of volume compared to VLS systems.

    It is a stupid idea in the LCS and it is a stupid idea in the 20386.

    T-47

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  T-47 on Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:23 pm

    Not arguing but still I'd like point out some stuffs.

    1. Again Pella is private shipyard, they won't do anything unless they see profit. They'll compromise a little to none about the price but yeah you can expect complete professionalism from them. Also I'm not sure if they have the sizable shipyard or the capability for Derzky right now, besides they are busy building Karakurts and other boats for their other clients.

    2. I'm not falling for Krylov Institute. There are already mentioned mismatch between the description and the picture by Big_Gazza. Also its hard to believe with that much weapon it'll be just 2KT! With a price near as Buyan-M lol! lol! lol! Personally I think Krylov needs a reform. They need to do better than producing troll ship models.

    3. Project 20386 is never intended to be an LCS. Just compare the armaments, LCS are tiny against it. 20386 are basically for supporting naval infantry and navy special forces. Thats why there are no fixed VLS. You can remove the container and put whatever the mission need ie BK-16/10 boats or other things. This ship is not the mainstream corvette. Beside this function it also has 16 Redut AD. Which even 11356 lacks! Another point is, it is not the size of 11356 (124M vs 109M, 20380/20381 104.5M and 20385 106M). So don't compare them. And its clearly not oversized and under-armed. Actually this new Krylov troll ship is undersized and over-armed!

    4. Just a thought of mine, there can be a version of Buyan with Redut only! They are capable of going through rivers and canals. So basically a river based Redut.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russian Naval Shipbuilding Industry: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:42 pm

    T-47 wrote:Not arguing but still I'd like point out some stuffs.

    1. Again Pella is private shipyard, they won't do anything unless they see profit. They'll compromise a little to none about the price but yeah you can expect complete professionalism from them. Also I'm not sure if they have the sizable shipyard or the capability for Derzky right now, besides they are busy building Karakurts and other boats for their other clients.

    2. I'm not falling for Krylov Institute. There are already mentioned mismatch between the description and the picture by Big_Gazza. Also its hard to believe with that much weapon it'll be just 2KT! With a price near as Buyan-M lol! lol! lol! Personally I think Krylov needs a reform. They need to do better than producing troll ship models.

    3. Project 20386 is never intended to be an LCS. Just compare the armaments, LCS are tiny against it. 20386 are basically for supporting naval infantry and navy special forces. Thats why there are no fixed VLS. You can remove the container and put whatever the mission need ie BK-16/10 boats or other things. This ship is not the mainstream corvette. Beside this function it also has 16 Redut AD. Which even 11356 lacks! Another point is, it is not the size of 11356 (124M vs 109M, 20380/20381 104.5M and 20385 106M). So don't compare them. And its clearly not oversized and under-armed. Actually this new Krylov troll ship is undersized and over-armed!

    4. Just a thought of mine, there can be a version of Buyan with Redut only! They are capable of going through rivers and canals. So basically a river based Redut.

    Most of Russian ships are undersized and over armed.  Krylov design is based upon the Lider design but shortened, and using commonality of parts will greatly reduce price, automation reduces number of people onboard.  Seeing as you are not building ships I assume, I figure your knowledge on the matter compared to Krylov is in serious question.  Already the MoD has shown interest so I am assuming their experts will do the preliminary tests of the design.

    PapaDragon wrote:
    SLB wrote:.......................
    IMHO this is the ship that should be built instead of the LCS wanabee that is the 20386.
    I understand that there is still R&D to be done, but keep building 20380 until that is completed.
    And maybe some weaponry could be traded for more autonomy, and one still would have
    a very potent platform with more range.

    I understand the Russian navy wanting to support its home industry by buying a platform (20386)
    clearly intended for the export market, but following that path it will end up with
    little more than the 20380 capabilities in vessels the size of a 11356.
    That's while I understood the 20385 wasn't viable with it's foreign engines, I never
    bought the argument that it was horrendously expensive.
    Does anyone realy think the 20386 will be cheaper than the 20385? Rolling Eyes

    This is pile of nonsense that needs to be forgotten ASAP before it becomes a meme like that anime style ''Lider'' destroyer or ''Shtorm'' ''supercarrier'' by the same design studio.

    This thing may have more missiles than 20380 but so does 20385 Gremashi. And just like 20385 Gremashi it is overstuffed but without benefit of longer range and endurance that Gremashi has.

    Other than armament this ''corvette'' is a joke.

    20386 Derzkii at least has the benefit of being under construction and being able to sail for more than couple of weeks.

    And claim that it's going to be cheaper than anything is bullshit of highest order. Armaments alone cost more than Buyan.

    20386 may or may not be cheaper than 20385 but it doesn't matter because it is usable vessel and not some idiotic fan-art like this crap they are trying to peddle.

    Just another scam. Third in a row from these idiots.

    You are aware that various professionals within the MoD themselves have shown interest in their designs, right?  Or are you simply being stupid for the sake of it?  As well, the intended purpose of the navy of the future is shore line defense more so than open water defense, excluding what may be in the Mediterranean.  And in most cases, of course the weapons will be more expensive than the ship, that is the whole point of the matter.

    I am curious to know your expertise in this matter that you can even proclaim the MoD personnel to be idiots.  Since you are smarter than them, you will need to explain to them how they will be able to afford these corvettes like Gremashi, with a budget that will be half of that what it was prior, for the navy (~2T Rubles compared to ~4T rubles) while being able to fulfill what Putin demanded for Navy in the next 13 years. To 20386 is expensive and the first ship was laid down in 2016, and wont be active till 2021. That is not only beyond comprehensible but it will not even come close to filling the needs of the Navy by the agreed 2030 date. So they will definitely need something else unless they speed up and expand construction of 20386 and thus reduce prices of the ship by commonality of parts.

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