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    Su-35S: News

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    miketheterrible
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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Thu Dec 15, 2016 7:24 am

    http://vpk.name/news/170497_istochnik_rf_postavit_v_kitai_pervyie_chetyire_su35_do_25_dekabrya.html

    Source: Russia will deliver to China the first four su-35 to 25 Dec

    George1
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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  George1 on Mon Dec 19, 2016 5:19 am

    The first four Su-35s came back from Syria

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2331886.html


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    KomissarBojanchev
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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:49 pm

    This Binkov retard is at it again making an outlandish scenario where F-35s destroy anything using BVR and stealth.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:14 am

    youtube experts aren't experts. So why bother with them? The guy is clearly incompetent and retarded. So what?

    Militarov
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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Militarov on Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:20 am

    Werent some of you people few weeks back praising one of his videos? confused

    miketheterrible
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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:25 am

    dunno. It wasn't me. I recall someone saying his accent is fake and cant read the language.

    Outside of that, if anyone gets their knowledge from youtube videos some no-name idiot makes, shouldn't be given rights to procreate.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Militarov on Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:25 am

    miketheterrible wrote:dunno.  It wasn't me.  I recall someone saying his accent is fake and cant read the language.

    Outside of that, if anyone gets their knowledge from youtube videos some no-name idiot makes, shouldn't be given rights to procreate.

    He is Croatian.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Jan 11, 2017 1:29 am

    So that just furthers prove my point. Who gives a shit what a Croat thinks regarding Su-35 and F-35?

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Wed Jan 11, 2017 3:36 am

    I dunno, perhaps because he portrays himself as a completely unbiased and some kind of well read expert and many people are mislead? I just wanted to show some dumb crap that we can laugh at.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:01 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:I dunno, perhaps because he portrays himself as a completely unbiased and some kind of well read expert and many people are mislead? I just wanted to show some dumb crap that we can laugh at.

    If i told you I was the most unbiased person on this forums with two hot wives a shlong as big as a baby's arm and currently serving as a engineer for Russian aerospace while living in Canada, are you going to believe me?

    If so, I got a bridge to sell you.

    Lets be real here.  How does some fat kid who cant even speak Russian but pretends to be and then makes these god aweful video's to educate people when the only kind of people he educates and he is conforming to are idiots who have no idea how physics works, let alone how IADS or even Russian passive systems work?  His first mistake is thinking the F-35 is actually stealth.  But let me just let you sink this knowledge in - Youtubers are known to be losers and retards as well as horrifically uninformed.  Just because 4chan K users are good at guns and rifles, when it comes to any other systems, especially not NATO standard, they are clueless.  I am clueless about NATO systems to be honest besides some gimmicky systems like F-35 and M1A1 tanks.  Outside of that, dunno.  But you wont see me making videos with some stupid looking frog puppet and trying to be funny and informed when I am clearly not.

    Good thing is, such bullshit is good for Russia.  An enemy that is ill-informed is ill prepared to deal with the enemy and gives advantage to the Russians.  But I doubt anyone with any form of knowledge in the military industrial complex or even higher chain even watches these videos.  Wasted effort and time where the guy should be instead screwing woman and doing something else with his life.  Technically, that goes for the rest of us.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Isos on Wed Jan 11, 2017 6:41 pm

    lol! lol! lol! lol!

    His datas about aircrafts are his drawings hahahahhahha

    At least it's funny.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  HM1199 on Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:39 pm

    Hey guys i have some questions about the SU-35S  Very Happy , so when you go and check the internet experts in f16.net you can see all shapes and colors of insults towards the su35s , they say its radar is outdated its systems are 20 years behind etc etc , there are many people like this notably a guy called hornetfinn .
    Now the thing  i want to know is  what is so bad about it? Its radar seems to outrange any US fighter radar we have some data about ,  whats so bad about it to be called ''sub standard" as they do? this goes for the rest of the systems such as its RWR . The networking capabilities of the SU35s is also a target for their critics  , calling them ''basic limited networking" .Whats even weirder is that none of them really gives an argument to support the claims , apart from the ol' reliable ''russia is 20 years behind" .
    can someone please  explain from where those rediculous claims are emerging?

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  SeigSoloyvov on Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:26 pm

    HM1199 wrote:Hey guys i have some questions about the SU-35S Very Happy , so when you go and check the internet experts in f16.net you can see all shapes and colors of insults towards the su35s , they say its radar is outdated its systems are 20 years behind etc etc , there are many people like this notably a guy called hornetfinn .
    Now the thing i want to know is what is so bad about it? Its radar seems to outrange any US fighter radar we have some data about , whats so bad about it to be called ''sub standard" as they do? this goes for the rest of the systems such as its RWR . The networking capabilities of the SU35s is also a target for their critics , calling them ''basic limited networking" .Whats even weirder is that none of them really gives an argument to support the claims , apart from the ol' reliable ''russia is 20 years behind" .
    can someone please explain from where those rediculous claims are emerging?

    To put it simply it's the "Russia cannot make anything good crowd" trying to argue with these people are pointless. The systems aren't 2- years behind and if they really said that just remind them they are armchair generals and their opinion matters has much as a bag of shit.

    I mean F16.net is FILLd to the brim with fanboys and you cannot have a talk like this with fanboys

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  miketheterrible on Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:11 pm

    HM1199 wrote:Hey guys i have some questions about the SU-35S  Very Happy , so when you go and check the internet experts in f16.net you can see all shapes and colors of insults towards the su35s , they say its radar is outdated its systems are 20 years behind etc etc , there are many people like this notably a guy called hornetfinn .
    Now the thing  i want to know is  what is so bad about it? Its radar seems to outrange any US fighter radar we have some data about ,  whats so bad about it to be called ''sub standard" as they do? this goes for the rest of the systems such as its RWR . The networking capabilities of the SU35s is also a target for their critics  , calling them ''basic limited networking" .Whats even weirder is that none of them really gives an argument to support the claims , apart from the ol' reliable ''russia is 20 years behind" .
    can someone please  explain from where those rediculous claims are emerging?

    its people who do not know what they are talking about and have no knowledge on both electronics or physics, but talk anyway as if they are experts. Most cannot even explain what subsystems the aircraft has or its actual performance characteristics. They are simply just stupid people acting like children and pretending to be military experts.

    Who cares.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  HM1199 on Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:36 pm

    agreed , i always wondered how could they determine such things with no access to information .
    By the way guys , i want to ask , how does the Irbis e compare with AESA radars such as the apg 77 or 63v3 ? what are its advantages and weaknesses compared to those ?

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  KiloGolf on Thu Jan 12, 2017 6:46 pm

    HM1199 wrote:agreed , i always wondered how could they determine such things with no access to information .
    By the way guys , i want to ask , how does the Irbis e compare with AESA radars such as the apg 77 or 63v3 ? what are its advantages and weaknesses compared to those ?

    Fanboys don't need information, they group behind some false sense of superiority and that's it. Don't bother.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:23 pm

    HM1199 wrote:Hey guys i have some questions about the SU-35S  Very Happy , so when you go and check the internet experts in f16.net you can see all shapes and colors of insults towards the su35s , they say its radar is outdated its systems are 20 years behind etc etc , there are many people like this notably a guy called hornetfinn .
    Now the thing  i want to know is  what is so bad about it? Its radar seems to outrange any US fighter radar we have some data about ,  whats so bad about it to be called ''sub standard" as they do? this goes for the rest of the systems such as its RWR . The networking capabilities of the SU35s is also a target for their critics  , calling them ''basic limited networking" .Whats even weirder is that none of them really gives an argument to support the claims , apart from the ol' reliable ''russia is 20 years behind" .
    can someone please  explain from where those rediculous claims are emerging?

    F-16.net is worst place ever to discuss anything. Bunch of kids most of the time, tho they did have few actual pilots and engineers posting before, not sure what happened with those, i am not active there since forever.

    Su-35 might be abit lacky on integration and data fusion/data sharing compared to some avionic packages from the West but its big step forward from what earlier platforms like Su-27P offered and that is what matters.

    From where the claims are coming? Well they heard it around, saw it on youtube... but chronical lack of consumer products built in Russia on their markets isnt helping either. Image about USSR and Russia is twisted by media on fairly regular basis so... mix all that up. You could write a book on the matter.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:24 pm

    HM1199 wrote:agreed , i always wondered how could they determine such things with no access to information .
    By the way guys , i want to ask , how does the Irbis e compare with AESA radars such as the apg 77 or 63v3 ? what are its advantages and weaknesses compared to those ?
    Its not that they dont have access to information, just that they misinterpret it due to their bias and lofty understanding of how air battle actually works, their heads being filled with lockheed powerpoint presentations rather than sober analysis. As for Irbis, I have no idea, you make the videos, you tell me Very Happy. Anyway, with my limited understanding, I think the russian PESA doesnt have much of a disadvantage or may even be better at actual stealth detection due to increased power and range. As far as I know it is more economical on energy so it doesnt bulky APUs and other equipment that makes US fighters so heavy, preventing them from using their higher thrust advantage.  The main thing that PESA lacks is EW capabilities, giving the need for additional ECM pod equipment which the Su-35 can mount, further nullifying the advantage of AESA.

    I have always wondered if there was any basis in the massive circlejerks western fanboys have over AESA radars, treating thems as some golden standard unatainable by anyone except NATO. The only  thing I see that makes AESA stand out is EW capability. Can you tell me more advantages that make it so superior than PESA?

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:31 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    HM1199 wrote:Hey guys i have some questions about the SU-35S  Very Happy , so when you go and check the internet experts in f16.net you can see all shapes and colors of insults towards the su35s , they say its radar is outdated its systems are 20 years behind etc etc , there are many people like this notably a guy called hornetfinn .
    Now the thing  i want to know is  what is so bad about it? Its radar seems to outrange any US fighter radar we have some data about ,  whats so bad about it to be called ''sub standard" as they do? this goes for the rest of the systems such as its RWR . The networking capabilities of the SU35s is also a target for their critics  , calling them ''basic limited networking" .Whats even weirder is that none of them really gives an argument to support the claims , apart from the ol' reliable ''russia is 20 years behind" .
    can someone please  explain from where those rediculous claims are emerging?

    F-16.net is worst place ever to discuss anything. Bunch of kids most of the time, tho they did have few actual pilots and engineers posting before, not sure what happened with those, i am not active there since forever.

    Su-35 might be abit lacky on integration and data fusion/data sharing  compared to some avionic packages from the West but its big step forward from what earlier platforms like Su-27P offered and that is what matters.

    From where the claims are coming? Well they heard it around, saw it on youtube... but chronical lack of consumer products built in Russia on their markets isnt helping either. Image about USSR and Russia is twisted by media on fairly regular basis so... mix all that up. You could write a book on the matter.
    Ive always been perplexed why westerners drool over "data integration". It sounds more like a buzzword than a tangible advantage. I mean, if your aircraft is lacking in flying and weapon performance, how is the fact that your combat data is going to show on 1 display instead of 2 gonna help in the grand scheme of things?

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:51 pm

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:
    HM1199 wrote:agreed , i always wondered how could they determine such things with no access to information .
    By the way guys , i want to ask , how does the Irbis e compare with AESA radars such as the apg 77 or 63v3 ? what are its advantages and weaknesses compared to those ?
    Its not that they dont have access to information, just that they misinterpret it due to their bias and lofty understanding of how air battle actually works, their heads being filled with lockheed powerpoint presentations rather than sober analysis. As for Irbis, I have no idea, you make the videos, you tell me Very Happy. Anyway, with my limited understanding, I think the russian PESA doesnt have much of a disadvantage or may even be better at actual stealth detection due to increased power and range. As far as I know it is more economical on energy so it doesnt bulky APUs and other equipment that makes US fighters so heavy, preventing them from using their higher thrust advantage.  The main thing that PESA lacks is EW capabilities, giving the need for additional ECM pod equipment which the Su-35 can mount, further nullifying the advantage of AESA.

    I have always wondered if there was any basis in the massive circlejerks western fanboys have over AESA radars, treating thems as some golden standard unatainable by anyone except NATO. The only  thing I see that makes AESA stand out is EW capability. Can you tell me more advantages that make it so superior than PESA?

    Its simplier to develop low probability of intercept LPI capability with AESA due to nature of hardware. Hence its more resilient to jamming in theory, but again, its the reciever that you need to worry about when its about jamming.

    What you cant do with current PESA radars is to form multiple beams at different frequencies at the same time and then track all of them. Basically at the same time it can search both land and air, track multiple targets on both, guide missiles and do jamming. This naturally big time depends on radar, but this is what AESA is capable of as idea.

    AESA modules in general are easier to swap so maintenance is alot easier, you dont have only one single amplifier to generate radiation, but 1000-2000 or more of them so they are in general alot harder to be thrown out of order. On PESA if amplifier dies radar is..well done, needs to be taken off and sent to maintenance. On AESA, module dies, noone cares, you can switch it next week.

    PESA radars are heavier, bulkier, generate alot more heat, require extensive cooling solutions some of which require evaporators and special liquids. What AESA array as itself lacks unless steered is maximum scan angle.

    I mean.. people literally wrote books on the matter, but these are just few basic things.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  HM1199 on Thu Jan 12, 2017 7:57 pm

    Well yeah i do not think an AESA is overwhelmingly superior to a PESA , they have some advantages such as sensivity but they are not good to the point where PESA 's are ditched out of the game Wink
    Also i'm wondering if the RWR of the SU 35S is capable of dataecting LPI radar can someone answer?

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:04 pm

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    HM1199 wrote:Hey guys i have some questions about the SU-35S  Very Happy , so when you go and check the internet experts in f16.net you can see all shapes and colors of insults towards the su35s , they say its radar is outdated its systems are 20 years behind etc etc , there are many people like this notably a guy called hornetfinn .
    Now the thing  i want to know is  what is so bad about it? Its radar seems to outrange any US fighter radar we have some data about ,  whats so bad about it to be called ''sub standard" as they do? this goes for the rest of the systems such as its RWR . The networking capabilities of the SU35s is also a target for their critics  , calling them ''basic limited networking" .Whats even weirder is that none of them really gives an argument to support the claims , apart from the ol' reliable ''russia is 20 years behind" .
    can someone please  explain from where those rediculous claims are emerging?

    F-16.net is worst place ever to discuss anything. Bunch of kids most of the time, tho they did have few actual pilots and engineers posting before, not sure what happened with those, i am not active there since forever.

    Su-35 might be abit lacky on integration and data fusion/data sharing  compared to some avionic packages from the West but its big step forward from what earlier platforms like Su-27P offered and that is what matters.

    From where the claims are coming? Well they heard it around, saw it on youtube... but chronical lack of consumer products built in Russia on their markets isnt helping either. Image about USSR and Russia is twisted by media on fairly regular basis so... mix all that up. You could write a book on the matter.
    Ive always been perplexed why westerners drool over "data integration". It sounds more like a buzzword than a tangible advantage. I mean, if your aircraft is lacking in flying  and weapon performance, how is the fact that your combat data is going to show on 1 display instead of 2 gonna help in the grand scheme of things?

    Data fusion and data sharing is a science of its own, belive it or not. There are an actual huge alghoritms, those most complex using elements of AI even to determine which data to show, which to ignore, where to show it, is it going to be HUD, HMS, MFD... it brings data from all aircraft sensors, mixes them, does crossreferencing, throws out data which is clutter, false positives, and then gives away what pilots wants to see.

    Now back in time pilot on radar would see ground reflections, water reflections, big flocks of pigeons, friendly targets without any markings... what you see now is radar picture without all those shits and your friendly targets are auto checked by IFF and reported as such onto your HUD. On P-18 radar if you want to see if target is friendly or enemy you need to "scan" it twice, once to detect it and second time to scan it with engaged IFF pedal, then if target is friendly and transponder answers you get green mark next to it. Just giving this as an example how simple things like that affect overall performance.

    Now, what you mentioned, showing data of similar nature on 2 or 3 different places in cockpit is bad design, why make it easy if it can be complicated type of design. Grouping data for pilot to use is also very important, in combat pilots do not have minutes on disposal rather seconds to make some decisions, many of which depend on data readouts.

    Now data sharing, you need powerful datalink to share everything you pick on your sensors with other platforms around, now the data you share needs to be crossreferenced with their sensors, so they do not get double entries for an example.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  OminousSpudd on Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:14 pm

    My understanding was that the Irbis-E is more a PESA/AESA hybrid, with a work around for its mechanical oscillation (of course I've long since lost the source for that). We have an AESA vs PESA thread here: http://www.russiadefence.net/t5532-russian-pesa-and-aesa-radars-history

    And a thread with a bit more info concerning "vs." situations.
    http://www.russiadefence.net/t4799-su-35s-vs-usaf-fighters-f-22-f-35-f-a-18e-f-f-15

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  Militarov on Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:17 pm

    HM1199 wrote:Well yeah i do not think an AESA is overwhelmingly superior to a PESA , they have some advantages such as sensivity but  they are not good to the point where PESA 's are ditched out of the game Wink
    Also i'm wondering if the RWR of the SU 35S is capable of dataecting LPI radar can someone answer?

    We do not know, whoever says he does is full of shit. I know many claimed oposite on F-16.net and Indiadefence forum, and i bet that is why you are asking.

    LPIs have very low noise compared to background so it would be quite a challenge. Even if it does detect it, question is if it can decode it or guide missile via such weak noise. RWR is more of a countermeasure rather than "offensive" sensor.

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    Re: Su-35S: News

    Post  HM1199 on Thu Jan 12, 2017 8:53 pm

    Militarov , i see , so the signal is so weak it is tricky to use it to guide a missile , alright Smile , and does that mean a DRFM jammer is useless vs a LPI radar?


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