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Project 955: Borei class SSBN

verkhoturye51
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Post  verkhoturye51 on Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:15 pm

Well okay that's some more material but still it doesn't make much sense.

So Virginia has an average noise of 95 dB and twice better would be 92 dB, considering that decibels dont scale lineraly. But Russian/Soviet 3rd gen SSBNs classes Akula, Kalmar and Delfin have noises of 100 - 110 dB at speed of 4 - 8 kn, according to this and this sources.

Meaning that a 92 dB Borey would need to be much more than five times more quiet than 3rd gen, even more than ten times! It would be the most quiet submarine in the world by far. But the only official estimate from the U.S. Office of Naval Intelligence suggests that Yasen is more quiet, although still noisier than capitallist Virginia.
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Post  Arrow on Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:43 pm

How much evaluate Yasen in dB? Borey-A has a new pupm jet propulsion. Yasen/YasenM standard screw.
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Post  Isos on Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:49 pm

verkhoturye51 wrote:Well okay that's some more material but still it doesn't make much sense.

So Virginia has an average noise of 95 dB and twice better would be 92 dB, considering that decibels dont scale lineraly. But Russian/Soviet 3rd gen SSBNs classes Akula, Kalmar and Delfin have noises of 100 - 110 dB at speed of 4 - 8 kn, according to this and this sources.

Meaning that a 92 dB Borey would need to be much more than five times more quiet than 3rd gen, even more than ten times! It would be the most quiet submarine in the world by far. But the only official estimate from the U.S. Office of Naval Intelligence suggests that Yasen is more quiet, although still noisier than capitallist Virginia.

No need for sources. No one will know those numbers on the net so everything you read is crap.

Neither would any official tell any real number. They will only say "our is better" since submarine and specially SSBN are highly classified.
verkhoturye51
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Post  verkhoturye51 on Mon Dec 17, 2018 8:27 pm

Propulsion is only one part of the story:

https://thaimilitaryandasianregion.wordpress.com/2017/04/08/yasen-graney-class-submarine-project-885885m/ wrote:The new layout method ECUs and auxiliary equipment, cooling systems and reduce the noise power allowed by 10-15 dB. Used vibration-laminated beams, stanchions, conduits and duct elements, other designs, reducing vibration noise by 10-30 dB. The equipment is mounted on a vibration-absorbing honeycomb body made of composite materials. Each structural unit is covered with sound-insulating panels. The housing is covered with a rubber protivogidroakusticheskim PLA coating. The boat used active damping system (SAG) to limit the noise of discrete frequency components of 50-500 Hz.

On SSGNs pr.885M expected use protivogidroakusticheskih type body coverings “Lightning-M” and “Lightning-M-control.” On submarines implemented outboard reinforcement circulation routes or analogous type “Fin”.

According to Miasnikov from Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology every generation is about 5 db quieter than the previous one so Borey and Yasen should both be about 95 db or roughly the same as Virginia. Perhaps Virginia 95 db, Yasen 96 db and Borey 97 db at 4 - 8 kn (just to give the idea of the order, not real numbers).
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Post  PapaDragon on Mon Dec 17, 2018 9:09 pm


SSBN base in Rybachy, Kamchatka is being expanded for more Boreis, so much for ''Bulava/Borei don't work''

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 DmVclczX0AA1XPQ

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 DmVb3_OWwAECcZ6
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Post  PapaDragon on Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:03 pm


And first daytime photo of Knyaz Vladimir at sea thumbsup

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 Qrmokd0wd2621
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Post  PapaDragon on Sat Dec 29, 2018 8:39 pm


Crappy low res pic of Knyaz Vladimir but better than nothing

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 DvlZPFxXgAEufSk
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Post  Hole on Sat Dec 29, 2018 9:56 pm

Argh! Those evil russkies use a evil cloud generating machine to annoy us!
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Post  zg18 on Sun Jan 13, 2019 2:34 pm

PapaDragon wrote:
Crappy low res pic of Knyaz Vladimir but better than nothing

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 DvlZPFxXgAEufSk

model

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 700UjN3
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Post  PapaDragon on Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:37 pm

zg18 wrote:.........

model

https://i.imgur.com/700UjN3.jpg


Oh man this is excellent thumbsup
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Post  SeigSoloyvov on Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:21 pm

Hole wrote:Argh! Those evil russkies use a evil cloud generating machine to annoy us!

They clearly borrowed Cobras weather dominator.
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Post  Hole on Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:28 pm

OMG!
Putin is cobra commander!
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Post  George1 on Sun Mar 24, 2019 4:36 pm

Russian Navy RIA Novosti (News media) reporting from RFS K-535 ‘Yury Dolgorukiy’,a Borei Сlass (project 955) SSBN submarine. More photos on the link

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 D2Z81CUXcAACGMY

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 D2Z81CMWkAAiVik

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 D2Z81CVWkAA8DZY

Project 955: Borei class SSBN - Page 29 D2Z81CXWoAAGzkm

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D2Z81CXWoAAGzkm.jpg
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Post  GarryB on Mon Mar 25, 2019 1:52 am

According to Miasnikov from Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology every generation is about 5 db quieter than the previous one so Borey and Yasen should both be about 95 db or roughly the same as Virginia. Perhaps Virginia 95 db, Yasen 96 db and Borey 97 db at 4 - 8 kn (just to give the idea of the order, not real numbers).

Hahahaha... reminds me of the weather reports here... from south to north major cities centres here are Invercargill, Dunedin, Christchurch, Wellington, Hamilton, Auckland... and the weather report for tomorrow is 18 degrees for Invercargill, 19 for Dunedin, 20 for Christchurch, 21 for Wellington, 22 for Hamilton, and 23 the nations high will be Auckland... except it never is...

I am sure where ever you are it is the same... and they are more often wrong than right... but hey it is all just guessing right?
verkhoturye51
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Post  verkhoturye51 on Mon Mar 25, 2019 10:56 am

I am sure where ever you are it is the same

Well, Yasen has arguably almost closed the gap in radiated noise with Seawolf and Virginia. Then US has opened the gap again with an acoustics improvement in Virginia submarines, starting with South Dakota. Russians then also made improvements with Yasen M. We'll have to wait for some patrol reports to tell if the gap has narrowed again.

For Borey there's much less data available. The only official data available just admit it's considerably quiter than Antey. This makes sense because pump-jet decreases high frequency broadband noise. However narrowband noise from flows can be big because of its huge hull.
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Post  GarryB on Fri Mar 29, 2019 3:16 am

What I am trying to say is that it is an accepted stereotype in New Zealand that the further south you go the colder you get, and they generally base all assumption on that pretext.

The problem with that logic is that it is often wrong... it possibly is colder in Dunedin than in Auckland on AVERAGE, but average numbers are average and not actual.

Also being closer to the south pole in the middle of summer it might get totally dark at 10pm at night and be light in the morning at about 5am, of course conversely in the middle of winter it gets light at 8am and dark at 5.30pm, but in Auckland the sunrise and sunset times don't really change that much... 6-7am and 6-7pm...

What I am trying to say is someone from Auckland who does not know any better could come down to central otago at the height of summer with a coat and long pants and sweat like they have never sweated before... or they can go to the same place in the middle of winter and see snow for the first time.

Basing assumptions and projecting ideas based on numbers that are estimated is stupid.

The Soviets were not really interested in very long range snipers, and they were not interested in super quiet subs for most of last century... that changed for the Russians for snipers in the 1990s and the mid 1970s for subs... right now there is no reason Russian equipment for sniper rifles or submarines would be inferior to any others made anywhere.

Well, Yasen has arguably almost closed the gap in radiated noise with Seawolf and Virginia.

Well I think you are looking the wrong way... I would say the Lada is better than all three in terms of noise.

We'll have to wait for some patrol reports to tell if the gap has narrowed again.

Why, do you think they will be honest?

Do you think they will even be relevant?

Imagine the Russians have been fitting noise makers to their subs for peace time and normal operations... any serious situation or combat arises and they turn it off and go full stealthy...

For Borey there's much less data available. The only official data available just admit it's considerably quiter than Antey. This makes sense because pump-jet decreases high frequency broadband noise. However narrowband noise from flows can be big because of its huge hull.

For operational use and training they have to go into international waters, but they don't have to reveal their true signatures...
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Post  dino00 on Wed Apr 17, 2019 8:50 pm

There are no plans for new laying of nuclear submarine missile carriers "Borey-A"

According to the head of the Rubin Central Engineering Bureau Igor Vilnit, further submarines of more advanced projects will be laid


MOSCOW, April 17th. / Tass /. Atomic missile submarines of the type "Borey-A" will no longer be laid. This was reported on Tuesday by TASS head of the Central Design Bureau for Marine Engineering "Rubin" Igor Vilnit.

"Borey-A" will not be pawned anymore, "said Vilnit.

He made it clear that in the future submarines of more advanced projects will be laid. “Everything will go according to plan,” the head of the bureau concluded.

https://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/6344752

This means Borey-B or wait for Husky?

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Post  Arrow on Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:25 pm

Lack of money. There will be no more 955A or more advanced 955B.
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Post  LMFS on Wed Apr 17, 2019 11:54 pm

Arrow wrote:Lack of money. There will be no more 955A or more advanced 955B.
Keep dreaming troll
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Post  dino00 on Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:07 am

Arrow wrote:Lack of money. There will be no more 955A or more advanced 955B.

Russia recorded a government budget surplus of 545.67 RUB Billion in March of 2019

https://tradingeconomics.com/russia/government-budget-value
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Post  LMFS on Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:34 am

dino00 wrote:Russia recorded a government budget surplus of 545.67 RUB Billion in March of 2019

https://tradingeconomics.com/russia/government-budget-value
The equivalent to more than 270 Su-35S Laughing
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Post  PapaDragon on Thu Apr 18, 2019 2:16 am


So those last two Boreis are getting cancelled?

Looks like Navy is changing their minds mid-project again as usual

Calling it now: they will drop the ball and get nothing after all is said and done

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Post  Big_Gazza on Thu Apr 18, 2019 5:54 am

PapaDragon wrote:
So those last two Boreis are getting cancelled?

Looks like Navy is changing their minds mid-project again as usual

Calling it now: they will drop the ball and get nothing after all is said and done

What a drama queen.  Sure you're not Indian? Suspect

So they will limit the 955 to 3 units and 955A to 5.  So what?  Clearly they are deciding to accelerate the follow-on Huksy SSBN variant.   Seriously, wtf is wrong with you?

Arrow wrote:
Lack of money. There will be no more 955A or more advanced 955B.

Yeah, no problem identifying you as a troll idiot jocolor
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Post  miketheterrible on Thu Apr 18, 2019 6:04 am

borey B (or as said, Husky variant since they want to streamline ) will be built instead. Only makes sense they are dropping older model.  Plus they are working on the next modular nuclear sub as mentioned by Tass news agency.

Ignore Arrow guys. He is a proven retard. He has zero knowledge of Russian economy or development and proven it time and time again.
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Post  PapaDragon on Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:09 pm

Big_Gazza wrote:
PapaDragon wrote:
So those last two Boreis are getting cancelled?

Looks like Navy is changing their minds mid-project again as usual

Calling it now: they will drop the ball and get nothing after all is said and done

What a drama queen.  Sure you're not Indian? Suspect

So they will limit the 955 to 3 units and 955A to 5.  So what?  Clearly they are deciding to accelerate the follow-on Huksy SSBN variant.   Seriously, wtf is wrong with you?


With me?

They were doing this same bullsh*t with corvettes: current version is not cool enough, let's cancel them and order cooler ones even though we are short on vessels, it takes forever to get new ones in production and even longer to actually build one

And when they finally got first new unit up and running they changed their mind again

Result: desperate shortage of corvettes

Just watch, they are about to do the same with SSBNs

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