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    Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

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    ricky123
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    Upgraded INS Sindhurakshak successfully carried out test launches of Club-S

    Post  ricky123 on Wed Feb 06, 2013 2:24 am

    The temperature is plus 4 Celsius under the ice and minus 10 above it, but it’s somewhat hot inside the robust hull. The crew of the INS Sindhurakshak has already made the revived ship its home and is now taking it south to its home station and combat duty area from the icy embrace of the White Sea.

    The INS Sindhurakshak is a diesel-electric submarine of the Indian Navy that underwent interim overhaul and modernisation at the Russian Severodvinsk-based Zvezdochka shipyard. A source in the United Shipbuilding Corporation told Rossiyskaya Gazeta that the submarine left factory waters on January 29 and set off on its way to open sea, accompanied by the Dickson and Captain Chadaev icebreakers. From the Russian shipyard, it normally takes the submarine about two months to reach its base site in Visakhapatnam, where the Eastern Naval Command of the Indian Navy is headquartered. This time, however, things are different, because the Indian submarine and its crew are travelling in the icy conditions of the Northern Sea Route for the first time.

    The INS Sindhurakshak
    The diesel-electric submarine INS Sindhurakshak was built in 1997 by the Admiralteiskie Verfi shipyard in St Petersburg for the Indian Navy. INS Sindhuvir, built to the same design, arrived in Severodvinsk the same year for intermediate overhaul and modernisation. It was followed by INS Sindhuratna, INS Sindhughosh and INS Sindhuvijay at three-to-four-year intervals. These submarines are designed to engage enemy submarines and surface vessels and defend naval bases, coast and sea communications, as well as for reconnaissance and patrolling.
    The INS Sindhurakshak is the fifth Indian submarine of the 877EKM project built and modernised in Russia. The contract for overhaul and modernisation was signed in June 2010 and in August, the ship arrived in Severodvinsk and was accepted by Zvezdochka Ship Repair Centre. Under the contract, the submarine has been armed with Club S anti-ship missiles; more than 10 Indian and imported systems have been mounted on the submarine, including the USHUS hydro-acoustic unit, the CCS-MK-2 communications system and the Porpoise radar installation. The INS Sindhurakshak has also had its cooling systems updated and undergone other operations to improve the submarine’s combat characteristics and safety.

    It was set afloat in June 2012 once the ship house operations had been completed. It successfully passed sea trials in the White Sea in November–December 2012 and tested its missiles and torpedoes. According to unofficial information, which was confirmed by Rossiyskaya Gazeta’s sources, both the sea and ground targets were hit at the first try.

    The handing-over ceremony was held on Saturday January 26, during India’s Republic Day celebrations. INS Sindhurakshak captain Commander Rajesh Ramkumar signed the official handover agreement and thanked the Russian shipbuilders, equipment suppliers and designers for their teamwork. Zvezdochka General Director Vladimir Nikitin noted the valuable experience in the integration of foreign and Russian naval systems that was accumulated during the project.

    “The Indian Navy is our traditional priority partner,” Nikitin said. “Over the last 15 years, we have repaired and modernised five Indian Kilo class submarines, supplied spare parts and equipment and provided maintenance of the ships in India. We are building on our successful cooperation in order to create an effective after-sales service system to maintain Russian-built Indian submarines at their stations.”

    Nikitin said he hoped that the shipyard would preserve its reputation for being a reliable and ambitious partner. Zvezdochka has already sent a proposal to the Indian side to carry out intermediate overhauls of Indian submarines, and repair and modernise other Indian vessels.

    According to Rossiyskaya Gazeta’s sources, the first of the five submarines modernised at Zvezdochka – INS Sindhuvir (1999) – has been in operation for more than a decade, the standard service time after intermediate overhaul. The other three are on their way and their future is being discussed now. It will be up to Delhi to officially decide, but Severodvinsk shipyard workers, who have made friends with the families of the Indian Navy sailors, hope that contracts will continue.

    “The handover of the ship is another stage in the evolution of military and technical cooperation,” says Severodvinsk Mayor Mikhail Gmyrin. “We are happy to see that the families of the Indian sailors temporarily residing in our northern city are engaged in social activities. It is also important that when crews of the submarines repaired at Zvezdochka get back home, our kids will keep writing to their friends.”

    Archangelsk Region Governor Igor Orlov, who started his professional career in the shipbuilding town on the White Sea, wished the INS Sindhurakshak a successful voyage to their native shores and handed the crew an icon of the Archangel Michael as a blessing and wish of long and trouble-free service. Renovation has started in Severodvinsk’s Yagra district homes, where the families of the Indian seamen lived not so long ago. The city authorities thus confirm that cooperation with India will continue.


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    Kilo on fire

    Post  runaway on Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:54 pm

    A Kilo submarine in India, the INS Sindhurakshak which recently underwent a refit in Russia has had an explosion and fire in port. She is sunk and 18 men are trapped inside.
    Probably an accident, and that leaves the question open how it will effect the new bid for Indian submarine replacement?
    As the Kilo as far as i know have a solid reputation and have not been prone to accidents.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  TR1 on Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:16 pm

    Jesus, horrible.

    RIP.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:15 pm

    Explosion on Indian Navy submarine INS Sindhurakshak possibly due to gas buildup

    The explosion on board the INS Sindhurakshak was possibly a result of the buildup of volatile hydrogen gas during a battery charging. Sources told India Today that the submarine had faced a similar explosion when she was docked in Visakhapatnam in February 2010 which killed one crew member.

    The navy's Board of Inquiry in 2010 pinned the cause to a faulty battery valve that leaked hydrogen. The submarine was lightly manned at the time of the accident and later sent for a 2.5-year refit to Russia that year. It had returned to the naval dockyard on April 29 this year after the refit that cost approximately $80 million.

    Conventional submarines like the Sindhurakshak are powered by a combination of diesel generators and electric batteries. The 2300-ton Sindhurakshak has 500 batteries. These have to be 'over charged' once every few months during which process each cell is manually checked. The presence of a large crew early in the morning points to a supervised battery overcharge.

    "The Kilo-class submarines do not have automatic monitoring systems which mean the overcharging is manually supervised," says a former Kilo-class submarine skipper. The built-up hydrogen during a battery charging is sucked out by two blowers. The performance of these blowers can be affected if a proper vacuum is not maintained in the exhaust pathway. If the vacuum as well as the exhaust pathway is not maintained, hydrogen settles in small pockets which can be triggered off by any small spark like a falling utility tool.

    Sindhurakshak is the ninth of a series of ten 'Sindhughosh' class submarines that were bought from the erstwhile Soviet Union beginning in 1985. India and China, with ten submarines each, are the world's largest operators of the Soviet-designed Kilo class submarines. Seven Indian Kilo-class submarines have been given mid-life refits in Russia. Refits of two other Kilo-class submarines, Sindhukirti and Sindhushastra, are underway at the naval dockyard in Vizag.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  sepheronx on Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:30 pm

    Very sad news. RIP to the dead

    Hope USC gets a new hole ripped in them, cause already the shipbuilding industry is facing lots of issues, especially on corruption and whatnot. This will definitely hurt Russia's chance in the future sales.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:33 pm

    Its too early to say because of USC work this issue has happened , it may be nothing to do with USC for all you know.

    Indian Navy has constituted a Board oF Enquiry and we will know the truth.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  sepheronx on Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:48 pm

    Austin wrote:Its too early to say because of USC work this issue has happened , it may be nothing to do with USC for all you know.

    Indian Navy has constituted a Board oF Enquiry and we will know the truth.
    If it was user error, that would be sad. If it was issue with the batteries, again, then USC should get into trouble and be forced to replace the sub as well as provide funding to the families of the lost sailors.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:53 pm

    Kilo Subs uses Indian made batteries by Indian Company they dont use Russian Batteries , Its made by Standard Batteries
    http://indiannavy.nic.in/book/submarine-arm

    Acquisition of Improved Russian Submarines

    Between 1986 and 1990, eight improved Russian submarines of the Kilo class were acquired. These submarines were quieter, had better sonar and used indigenously produced submarine propulsion batteries.

    But the issue is not battery per say but the process followed in charging them and if due to some issue like blower not working the Hydrogen has accumulated in the submarine which caused fire.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  sepheronx on Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:09 pm

    If it is battery issue or human error, fine, not USC fault. But if the blower failed, then it is USC fault.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:23 pm

    Indian Navy Chief Statement on the fire

    http://www.ndtv.com/blog/show/navy-submarine-ins-sindhurakshak-catches-fire-405468

    16:42 (IST) Navy chief DK Joshi on INS Sindhurakshak explosion:

    Currently the submarine is sitting in 3 metres below water, portion of the hull visible at all times
    Three officers and 15 sailors were on board at the time of the incident
    We don't know what caused the fire
    Whilst fuel, hydrogen ammunition are on board there are safeties built in
    Fire is not supposed to happen but quite obviously the safety mechanisms have not functioned
    Our diving teams have been able to open the main hatch
    They will attempt to create 2 or 3 water tight compartment within the boat

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:30 pm

    4.50 pm: Indian Navy chief Admiral D.K. Joshi on INS Sindhurakshak explosion-

    It took around two hours to douse the fire. We do not have all the answers right now.
    As of now we do not know what caused the fire or the explosion.
    Initially there was a smaller intensity explosion which caused a bigger explosion.
    Of the crew of 3 officers 2 were married and of the 15 sailors 6 were married. We hope for the best.
    From the video clips you can ascertain the intensity of explosion, we can imagine how small the reaction time was.
    Fires are not supposed to happen, but obviously the safety mechanisms have not functioned.
    We do not rule out the possibility of sabotage, but it seems unlikely. The inquiry board will go into detail.
    You cannot lose hope till you have sighted them (on death toll).
    We will release the names of those who were on board at an appropriate time.


    Read more at: http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/breaking-news-coverage-at-india-today-14082013/1/299424.html

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Austin on Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:34 pm

    I can remember 3 incident of my head where Russian Sub have had catastrophic failure there may be other which I dont recollect.

    Kursk Tragedy , All Life Lost
    Nerpa Tragedy , Many life Lost
    Indian Navy Kilo Incident , sub lost completely many life lost.

    Do Russian Submarine pay less attention to safety in design compared to Western Counterpart ?

    Do Russian Training have some shortcoming when dealing with Safety & Fire issue on board submarine ?

    Do Russian Weapons specifically torpedoes have a tendency to catch fire or explode compared to Western Ones ?

    No Trolling need some serious answers on this

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  sepheronx on Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:19 am

    Austin wrote:I can remember 3 incident of my head where Russian Sub have had catastrophic failure there may be other which I dont recollect.

    Kursk Tragedy , All Life Lost
    Nerpa Tragedy , Many life Lost
    Indian Navy Kilo Incident , sub lost completely many life lost.

    Do Russian Submarine pay less attention to safety in design compared to Western Counterpart ?

    Do Russian Training have some shortcoming when dealing with Safety & Fire issue on board submarine ?

    Do Russian Weapons specifically torpedoes have a tendency to catch fire or explode compared to Western Ones ?

    No Trolling need some serious answers on this
    An odd question, seeing as how Russia isn't the only one to have accidents with submarines, but recently, yes they had problems. Indian Kilo is the only Kilo submarine to have such an accident, and it seems to have happened twice to this Kilo submarine, so it may be linked to the build quality of this specific submarine. As for the other two, Kurks was really bad and Nerpa wasn't nearly as bad, but still bad. Both so happened to have happen after the collapse of the Soviet Union. USSR built many submarines but it seems that Russia had the real issues afterwards, and I really think it is linked to not build quality, but maintenance quality and quality of training/personnel.

    Dunno what you mean regarding the torpedoes though, kinda odd question.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  GarryB on Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:39 am

    A lot of assumptions thrown around here on this thread already... I would just say that any process involving the refuelling of a vessel involves danger and therefore also safety measures and procedures.

    If you are filling your mercedes with petrol at a petrol station whose fault is it if a fire starts?

    Lots of answers... the owner of the petrol station... the owner for clearly not following safety procedures... but the best answer is how about we wait for the investigation to find out the actual facts in this situation rather than throw around our sht to see what sticks.

    Lots of countries have accidents with subs... whether it is running aground, or sinking japanese fishing vessels while surfacing, or indeed sinking oneself with your own torpedo that was jettisonned because it was faulty.

    Hopefully they will find survivors... RIP to those who have lost their lives in this.


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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  sepheronx on Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:02 am

    GarryB wrote:A lot of assumptions thrown around here on this thread already... I would just say that any process involving the refuelling of a vessel involves danger and therefore also safety measures and procedures.

    If you are filling your mercedes with petrol at a petrol station whose fault is it if a fire starts?

    Lots of answers... the owner of the petrol station... the owner for clearly not following safety procedures... but the best answer is how about we wait for the investigation to find out the actual facts in this situation rather than throw around our sht to see what sticks.

    Lots of countries have accidents with subs... whether it is running aground, or sinking japanese fishing vessels while surfacing, or indeed sinking oneself with your own torpedo that was jettisonned because it was faulty.

    Hopefully they will find survivors... RIP to those who have lost their lives in this.
    I was very wrong in my jump to conclusions, and yes, I admit, I am bad for it.

    I will wait for further judgement.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  flamming_python on Thu Aug 15, 2013 1:17 am

    Austin wrote:Kursk Tragedy , All Life Lost
    Nerpa Tragedy , Many life Lost
    Indian Navy Kilo Incident , sub lost completely many life lost.
    Looked up info on wiki and other sources about the other accidents that we had over the last 25 years.
    I'll leave you to make your own conclusions about the things you asked about.
    Personally - I see a lot of fuck-ups.

    K-84 (2011), caught on fire while in dry dock in Murmansk. Fire erupted as a result of welding on the outer hull causing sparks that ignited the wooden scaffolding, which in turn ignited the sub's rubber coating. The sub was subsequently lowered into the water and the fire was eventually extinguished, with possible minor damage to a few of the sub's system aside from the destruction of the rubber coating.
    No-one died thankfully
    Failure of fire-safety on the part of the dock workers and flammable materials used during work on the sub.

    B-414 (2006), a short-circuit caused a fire to break out in the electromechanical section of the sub while it was deployed in the Barents Sea. Automatic systems fired, shutting down the reactor and localizing the fire. The crew extinguished the fire a while later.
    2 men died from Carbon Monoxide poisoning.
    Failure of the electric systems or wiring.

    AS-28 minisub (2005), was moving around somewhere not far from Kamchatka in the Far East, got it's propeller snagged the aerial of a hydrophone array, and also managed to get entangled in some fishing nets. It sank right to the sea-bed. The Russian Navy promptly requested international assistance and Putin ordered Ivanov to personally oversee the rescue operation. The British, Japanese and American navies sent men and equipment to assist the operation and in the end the sub was freed and surfaced when a British remote-controlled deep-water vehicle cut the lines entangling it.
    No deaths, everyone surfaced alive and well
    Not sure what the failure was in this time; probably just bad luck.
    Positive sides are the lessons learnt by the Russian leadership from the Kursk disaster in terms of requesting assistance, successful co-ordination of rescue efforts by different navies, the high amount of attention paid to it at the highest levels of leadership, logical actions of the crew aimed at conserving oxygen and energy.

    K-159 (2003), rusted old Soviet hulk that was extremely poorly maintained, was being towed to another location and kept afloat with pontoons. Sunk when one of the pontoons ripped off during a squall.
    Lost with all hands onboard but one (9 died in total)
    Failure of poor pontoons (not airtight), their fastening to the hull, officers overlooking the towing operation, and Admiral Suchkov who despite being woken up and notified of the incident at HQ made made no attempt to save the crew.

    K-278 (1989); an experimental nuclear attack sub, a fire broke out (possibly as the result of faulty electrics) which rapidly spread via electric cables bypassing the various bulkhead doors and fireproofing, resulted in the destruction of 2 ballast tanks and their subsequent flooding, propulsion failed, when the the ballast tanks were ordered to be blown the compressed air pipe of one of the ballasts ruptured and fed the fire even more, even mixing in with flammable materials in another section and adding them to the mix too. The sub surfaced and most of the crew evacuated into the icy waters, while others stayed to fight the fire. The sub sunk again while a few men were still on-board. These crewmembers and officers boarded the escape capsule, which ejected and surfaced but only one of them managed to leave it before the capsule sank again.
    42 died in total; only 4 of which died because of the actual fire and fumes.
    Failure of electric system and wiring, fireproofing and materials, automatic firefighting system which failed, compressed air system connected to the ballasts which ruptured when it was supposed to do its job and the escape capsule which managed to sink itself. Some of the crew and officers were at fault too as the situation apparently wasn't handled as it was supposed to have been and there were several fatal decisions made.
    The positive sides were the heroism showed by key members of the crew, very fast response by naval search and rescue which dropped life-rafts for the sailors, quick response of another vessel.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Sujoy on Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:23 am

    Footage of the Multiple Explosions on the (INS Sindhurakshak) Kilo Class Submarine



    All 18 sailors on board are now confirmed dead . Initial reports suggest that a Torpedo went off in the Weapons Bay .

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  TR1 on Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:13 am

    Austin wrote:I can remember 3 incident of my head where Russian Sub have had catastrophic failure there may be other which I dont recollect.

    Kursk Tragedy , All Life Lost
    Nerpa Tragedy , Many life Lost
    Indian Navy Kilo Incident , sub lost completely many life lost.

    Do Russian Submarine pay less attention to safety in design compared to Western Counterpart ?

    Do Russian Training have some shortcoming when dealing with Safety & Fire issue on board submarine ?

    Do Russian Weapons specifically torpedoes have a tendency to catch fire or explode compared to Western Ones ?

    No Trolling need some serious answers on this
    None of those 3 have much in common, so looking for a similar problem is futile.



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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  TR1 on Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:26 am

    http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?230046-INS-Sindhurakshak-catches-fire-at-naval-dockyard-in-Mumbai&p=6834942&viewfull=1#post6834942

    Makes me sick seeing these photos.

    People speculating about the explosion need to be slapped.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:39 am

    Have there been incidents with fatalities on NATO made boats recently?

    I've heard that if the kursk sank because of an explosion by its torpedo's propellant. Does this have to do with poor maintenance or the torpedo itself. I watched a western documentary on this issue and it said the if the Kursk had  NATO made torpedos such an accident would have much lesser chances of taking place.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Firebird on Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:01 am

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Have there been incidents with fatalities on NATO made boats recently?

    I've heard that if the kursk sank because of an explosion by its torpedo's propellant. Does this have to do with poor maintenance or the torpedo itself. I watched a western documentary on this issue and it said the if the Kursk had  NATO made torpedos such an accident would have much lesser chances of taking place.
    On the Kursk, it was possibly a Squall torpedo that caused the disaster. (Altho it could have been anything that caused it - even a collision with an American object has been suggested).

    The Squall is a phenomenal torpedo. It can move at a vastly greater speed than the US, or any other equivalent eg FIVE TIMES THE SPEED, or maybe even more.

    Sadly, for the early Squall, there may have been a terrible cost to this greater speed.
    I am sure that the modern Squall is perfectly safe, and much better than NATO equivalents, provided proper procedures and maintenance are adhered to.

    Either way, there have been a fair number of disasters on American subs (much suppressed too).
    I think its much too early to speculate what caused the Indian disaster. At this stage they arent ruling out sabotage, or explosions outside the vessel. So who knows what the cause was?

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  GarryB on Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:17 pm

    The early (western) speculation was that it was Squal, but i actual fact it cannot have been Squal as Squal does not use HTP propellent, it has a solid propellent.

    I rather suspect the early speculation was largely to discredit the rocket propelled torpedo that is better than any NATO torpedo currently in service.

    Problems with HTP fuelled torpedoes are not new... a British sub tied up in dock many years ago had a similar problem but because they were in dock there was far less casualties.

    HTP is dangerous, but most torpedo fuels are dangerous.

    Saying it wouldn't have happened if it was a western sub is ridiculous... especially when western subs have sunk themselves with their own faulty torpedoes in the past.


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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  Stealthflanker on Thu Aug 15, 2013 8:01 pm

    Firebird wrote:
    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Have there been incidents with fatalities on NATO made boats recently?

    I've heard that if the kursk sank because of an explosion by its torpedo's propellant. Does this have to do with poor maintenance or the torpedo itself. I watched a western documentary on this issue and it said the if the Kursk had  NATO made torpedos such an accident would have much lesser chances of taking place.
    On the Kursk, it was possibly a Squall torpedo that caused the disaster. (Altho it could have been anything that caused it - even a collision with an American object has been suggested).

    The Squall is a phenomenal torpedo. It can move at a vastly greater speed than the US, or any other equivalent eg FIVE TIMES THE SPEED, or maybe even more.
    The cause was leaky Type 65 torpedo..that still using peroxide fuel.

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  KomissarBojanchev on Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:09 pm

    Are there any Russian torpedos proposed for production that don't use HTP?

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    Re: Indian Navy and Naval Aicraft: News

    Post  runaway on Fri Aug 16, 2013 7:04 pm

    KomissarBojanchev wrote:Are there any Russian torpedos proposed for production that don't use HTP?
    As i have heard, the HTP torpedoes was taken out of service.

    I go along with the battery theory, but if they had a weapon explosion it means the fire or first explosion went through the whole sub. Because the batteries are located to the rear and bottom, and not under the torpedo room?

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