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    Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

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    magnumcromagnon
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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:41 pm

    OminousSpudd wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Zivo wrote:
    Vann7 wrote:
    Look at how erratic and in fear is now the  American politicians when speaking
    about Syria. She was asked a question about Syria and you could see from a mile how nervous
    she became and gave an erratic answer that had nothing to do with the conflict in Syria..  lol1




    We need to use force against Russia in Syria.. because.. err.. mm..
    because you need to see how close they fly so close to our (american) borders..   lol1

    Wow, what a dumb bitch.

    Does she even realize how impossibly stupid her suggestion is? I really hope she watches that interview later tonight and starts kicking herself for that comment.

    Oh, fantasizing about those Topols, isn't she.

    I see what you did there KoTeMoRe. Laughing

    She wants dat Russian woo...err...dat white Russian popplars between her legs. Wink


    Last edited by magnumcromagnon on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

    KoTeMoRe
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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:43 pm

    I'm sorry I slipped. clown

    sepheronx
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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  sepheronx on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:45 pm

    Militarov wrote:
    medo wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    New strike from last night.



    "Old" one from yesterday.

    Seems they hit same place again with something more potent as you can see where the entrance to that underground facility is, some good flashes are happening.

    Nice to see that Su-34 use satellite guided KAB-500S bombs. Interesting is, that those night pictures are made from higher altitude. Are they from UAV or from Su-24M2 or Su-34 optical sight? If they are from their optical sight, that could prove they have FLIR camera inside for day night all weather operations.

    I guess we cant be sure till they release more info on it. However SU34 should have integral UOMZ Platan electro-optical targeting system, from what we know it has laser designator and CCD TV channel, its somewhat of modern Kaira that was on SU24 but from all what we know it doesnt have FLIR/Thermal. However few times Russians have been spotted flying with French Thales Damocles FLIR/Target laser designation pods on SU24/34/30, apparently they even got licence to produce them, not sure how far that went its not hard to check. Russian option was SAPSAN-E pod, its still not fielded, after it "lost" in competition with Thales Damocles, i guess now they will finally finish it coz of sanctions.

    So ill be bad Rusophile and say its probably UAV (French pod maybe... but we havent seen them there for now).

    Built in system does indeed have laser designator and CCD TV (IR I presume) but no thermal and no pods.  Sapsan-E wasn't produced due to poorer performance and Domacles, even though they obtained licenses, never went more than a few.  There wasn't a huge demand for Thermal imaging pods I suppose.  But there was one shown recently on MiG-35 and the 101KS-N being developed for PAK FA (and I imagine others will receive it as well).


    As for the guided munitions, well, we don't really know too much.  The presumed issues with Glonass chips are long history issue as glonass devices are now more in circulation and growing.  But about the munitions?  I have a feeling  Russia barely ordered any for years due to the surplus stock of soviet era missiles mixed in with the idea of using more dumb munitions but with new targeting systems (Gefast & T upgrade on Su-24M2's as an example) which greatly increases the precision strikes with dumb bombs.  Things like Laser bombs and TV guided bombs seem to be far more common than glonass guided bombs, that is for sure.

    sepheronx
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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  sepheronx on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:53 pm



    This was the pod shown at MAKS 2015 on the MiG-35, thanks to KRATOS for posting the image over at keypub.


    Last edited by sepheronx on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:54 pm; edited 1 time in total

    max steel
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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  max steel on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:53 pm



    Unconfirmed Footage - Russian Air Force Aircraft attacking Al-Lataminah @ Northern Homs Countryside.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Militarov on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:56 pm

    sepheronx wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    medo wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    New strike from last night.



    "Old" one from yesterday.

    Seems they hit same place again with something more potent as you can see where the entrance to that underground facility is, some good flashes are happening.

    Nice to see that Su-34 use satellite guided KAB-500S bombs. Interesting is, that those night pictures are made from higher altitude. Are they from UAV or from Su-24M2 or Su-34 optical sight? If they are from their optical sight, that could prove they have FLIR camera inside for day night all weather operations.

    I guess we cant be sure till they release more info on it. However SU34 should have integral UOMZ Platan electro-optical targeting system, from what we know it has laser designator and CCD TV channel, its somewhat of modern Kaira that was on SU24 but from all what we know it doesnt have FLIR/Thermal. However few times Russians have been spotted flying with French Thales Damocles FLIR/Target laser designation pods on SU24/34/30, apparently they even got licence to produce them, not sure how far that went its not hard to check. Russian option was SAPSAN-E pod, its still not fielded, after it "lost" in competition with Thales Damocles, i guess now they will finally finish it coz of sanctions.

    So ill be bad Rusophile and say its probably UAV (French pod maybe... but we havent seen them there for now).

    Built in system does indeed have laser designator and CCD TV (IR I presume) but no thermal and no pods.  Sapsan-E wasn't produced due to poorer performance and Domacles, even though they obtained licenses, never went more than a few.  There wasn't a huge demand for Thermal imaging pods I suppose.  But there was one shown recently on MiG-35 and the 101KS-N being developed for PAK FA (and I imagine others will receive it as well).


    As for the guided munitions, well, we don't really know too much.  The presumed issues with Glonass chips are long history issue as glonass devices are now more in circulation and growing.  But about the munitions?  I have a feeling  Russia barely ordered any for years due to the surplus stock of soviet era missiles mixed in with the idea of using more dumb munitions but with new targeting systems (Gefast & T upgrade on Su-24M2's as an example) which greatly increases the precision strikes with dumb bombs.  Things like Laser bombs and TV guided bombs seem to be far more common than glonass guided bombs, that is for sure.

    Yeah i know about 101KS-N, but its not in play here for sure Smile. Yeah, Sapsan wasnt performing good enough to be obtained in numbers and Domacles it seems was too expencive due to components bought from France, despite having licence Russians still were buying some key components from original producer.

    In general guided ammunition in Russia is somewhat of a long term issue, even tho they had some decent solutions even back in 80s they werent procured in significant numbres, as i said above in some post, in last few years Russia was ordering major guided missiles (i am talking about major size cruise missiles and anti shipping missiles) in amounts less than 100 per year. And US alone bought almost 250.000 GPS JDAM sets since 1997. (naturally decent portion was spent) so in terms of cheap "smart" warload Russia is really lagging behind. On top of everything Kosmos seems to have issues with production of enough dual GPS/Glonass reciever chips.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  sepheronx on Thu Oct 01, 2015 11:58 pm

    Awesome video. Those Mi-25's moving in a formation launching rockets is definitely very Russian as you notice such types of formations and engagements during Russia's various snap drills. In most video's showcasing such engagements with helicopters, it is usually one or two seen.

    As for the IVECO's; Italy must just be loving this and Russia gets to get rid of those monstrosities.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:02 am

    Militarov wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Militarov wrote:
    medo wrote:
    Militarov wrote:

    New strike from last night.



    "Old" one from yesterday.

    Seems they hit same place again with something more potent as you can see where the entrance to that underground facility is, some good flashes are happening.

    Nice to see that Su-34 use satellite guided KAB-500S bombs. Interesting is, that those night pictures are made from higher altitude. Are they from UAV or from Su-24M2 or Su-34 optical sight? If they are from their optical sight, that could prove they have FLIR camera inside for day night all weather operations.

    I guess we cant be sure till they release more info on it. However SU34 should have integral UOMZ Platan electro-optical targeting system, from what we know it has laser designator and CCD TV channel, its somewhat of modern Kaira that was on SU24 but from all what we know it doesnt have FLIR/Thermal. However few times Russians have been spotted flying with French Thales Damocles FLIR/Target laser designation pods on SU24/34/30, apparently they even got licence to produce them, not sure how far that went its not hard to check. Russian option was SAPSAN-E pod, its still not fielded, after it "lost" in competition with Thales Damocles, i guess now they will finally finish it coz of sanctions.

    So ill be bad Rusophile and say its probably UAV (French pod maybe... but we havent seen them there for now).

    Built in system does indeed have laser designator and CCD TV (IR I presume) but no thermal and no pods.  Sapsan-E wasn't produced due to poorer performance and Domacles, even though they obtained licenses, never went more than a few.  There wasn't a huge demand for Thermal imaging pods I suppose.  But there was one shown recently on MiG-35 and the 101KS-N being developed for PAK FA (and I imagine others will receive it as well).


    As for the guided munitions, well, we don't really know too much.  The presumed issues with Glonass chips are long history issue as glonass devices are now more in circulation and growing.  But about the munitions?  I have a feeling  Russia barely ordered any for years due to the surplus stock of soviet era missiles mixed in with the idea of using more dumb munitions but with new targeting systems (Gefast & T upgrade on Su-24M2's as an example) which greatly increases the precision strikes with dumb bombs.  Things like Laser bombs and TV guided bombs seem to be far more common than glonass guided bombs, that is for sure.

    Yeah i know about 101KS-N, but its not in play here for sure Smile. Yeah, Sapsan wasnt performing good enough to be obtained in numbers and Domacles it seems was too expencive due to components bought from France, despite having licence Russians still were buying some key components from original producer.

    In general guided ammunition in Russia is somewhat of a long term issue, even tho they had some decent solutions even back in 80s they werent procured in significant numbres, as i said above in some post, in last few years Russia was ordering major guided missiles (i am talking about major size cruise missiles and anti shipping missiles) in amounts less than 100 per year. And US alone bought almost 250.000 GPS JDAM sets since 1997. (naturally decent portion was spent) so in terms of cheap "smart" warload Russia is really lagging behind. On top of everything Kosmos seems to have issues with production of enough dual GPS/Glonass reciever chips.

    That was 7 years ago and I believe Rostec owns the company.  In other words, I can bet you that production is significantly higher (as the radio agencies have been in a massive upswing since the failures of 2008 Georgian war, and are producing brand new radio technology and glonass recievers especially for troops.  I don't know about dual purpose ones though, they may not make many of them).  If not for dual purpose chips, then for pure glonass.  As for those guided missile orders, I will need citations on those as I don't really believe it.


    Last edited by sepheronx on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:03 am; edited 1 time in total

    KoTeMoRe
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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:03 am

    That's from Centr 2015 I think.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  mack8 on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:04 am

    Quite certain that video is not from Syria, but from recent exercises in Russia. Rogozin posted that video on his page yesterday i think so probably some thought it's from Syria.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  x_54_u43 on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:07 am

    I am very confident that these were Orlan drones, or perhaps a different Russian drone.

    Unless Russia operates another foreign UAV other than the Hermes 450 or the ScanEagle, then these were certainly an Orlan type drone, unlikely to be an Eleron or a Zala however.

    Edit: Looking at the Star doc on Russian UAVs it could be the high performance rear engined Eleron-3.

    Camera cursor seems to be similar, with the cursor the same style as well. Left scale is absent, however a yellow arrow is present in the night strike videos, perhaps a GPS marker coordinate, showing the objective.



    Above is Orlan. Below is Eleron-3.



    Last edited by x_54_u43 on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:14 am; edited 1 time in total

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:13 am

    x_54_u43 wrote:I am very confident that these were Orlan drones, or perhaps a different Russian drone.

    Unless Russia operates another foreign UAV other than the Hermes 450 or the ScanEagle, then these were certainly an Orlan type drone, unlikely to be an Eleron or a Zala however.

    So far the Shahed drone has been good. And there's the CH-4...

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:16 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    x_54_u43 wrote:I am very confident that these were Orlan drones, or perhaps a different Russian drone.

    Unless Russia operates another foreign UAV other than the Hermes 450 or the ScanEagle, then these were certainly an Orlan type drone, unlikely to be an Eleron or a Zala however.

    So far the Shahed drone has been good. And there's the CH-4...

    Are those even in Russian service though?

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  x_54_u43 on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:19 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    So far the Shahed drone has been good. And there's the CH-4...

    And so the shills come out to play, do you really think Russia would use and operate Iranian or Chinese drones for these ops with the VKS?

    I would recommend looking at the pictures posted with my edit to my previous post. Meanwhile, I will look for my Syrian Su-24 photos showing their optical systems in use. I will also find the Su-34's as well.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:21 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    x_54_u43 wrote:I am very confident that these were Orlan drones, or perhaps a different Russian drone.

    Unless Russia operates another foreign UAV other than the Hermes 450 or the ScanEagle, then these were certainly an Orlan type drone, unlikely to be an Eleron or a Zala however.

    So far the Shahed drone has been good. And there's the CH-4...

    Are those even in Russian service though?

    Syria and Iraq have allies outside of Russia.

    Shahed = Iranian aid

    CH-4 = Chinese aid

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  sepheronx on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:24 am

    But this is of a Russian engagement, and I agree that Russia would be using their own in this case. Eleron3 being indeed most likely.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Zivo on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:25 am

    max steel wrote:

    Unconfirmed Footage - Russian Air Force Aircraft attacking Al-Lataminah @ Northern Homs Countryside.

    No, footage from Center-2015 with arabic pasted over it.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Militarov on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:25 am

    Somewhat of a live updates on air strikes in Syria, by both RuAf and Syrian air force:

    http://qasioun.net/en/breakingList/

    Their articles are mostly junk but at least times and strikes are somewhat of a legit source.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  zg18 on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:25 am

    Russia military journalist briefing


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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Strizh on Fri Oct 02, 2015 12:49 am

    How did the Su24M hit the targets during nighttime ???

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Zivo on Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:02 am

    Strizh wrote:How did the Su24M hit the targets during nighttime ???

    New targeting pod with a highly sensitive microphone that can home in on the allah akbars.




    Laughing






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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:08 am

    x_54_u43 wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    So far the Shahed drone has been good. And there's the CH-4...

    And so the shills come out to play, do you really think Russia would use and operate Iranian or Chinese drones for these ops with the VKS?

    I would recommend looking at the pictures posted with my edit to my previous post. Meanwhile, I will look for my Syrian Su-24 photos showing their optical systems in use. I will also find the Su-34's as well.

    1. Shut your filthy mouth.
    2. Russians have been operating with Shahed and other Iranian drones for about 4 years, helping Assad. They are "Surprized" by the actual quality of the IRGC.
    3. The Chinese drones aren't exactly treason, they're a good off the shelf alternative to what Russia cannot buy or produce for now. If Russia has better luck with Dozor or other designs, then fine, until then Russia is stuck with Forpost and other less than adequate tools. Eleron for instance is a short range tactical drone. To get coverage over 100km they're no good.



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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  zg18 on Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:08 am

    New video from Russia24


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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Militarov on Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:12 am



    That was 7 years ago and I believe Rostec owns the company.  In other words, I can bet you that production is significantly higher (as the radio agencies have been in a massive upswing since the failures of 2008 Georgian war, and are producing brand new radio technology and glonass recievers especially for troops.  I don't know about dual purpose ones though, they may not make many of them).  If not for dual purpose chips, then for pure glonass.  As for those guided missile orders, I will need citations on those as I don't really believe it.

    Well when you combine anti shipping, guided and cruise missiles orders probably never went over 100 per year, even that my estimate is probably to high. I have exact figures on Kh31/35 for 2009. - 2010. from Tactical Missile Corporation yearly report published partially by https://wikileaks.org/gifiles/attach/176/176265_mdb_3_2011_sm.pdf sadly i cant find way of obtaining their annyal report, this is for both AG and AS versions.

    Later Russians ordered some 3M54s for modernised Kilos and Buyan-M ships, i guess we can count them in whole this guided ammunition story. Some Onix based missiles for Bastions and similar. But they have very small orders of actual guided ammunition in general.

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    Re: Russian Military involvement and aid to Syria #2

    Post  Militarov on Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:17 am

    x_54_u43 wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    So far the Shahed drone has been good. And there's the CH-4...

    And so the shills come out to play, do you really think Russia would use and operate Iranian or Chinese drones for these ops with the VKS?

    I would recommend looking at the pictures posted with my edit to my previous post. Meanwhile, I will look for my Syrian Su-24 photos showing their optical systems in use. I will also find the Su-34's as well.

    Noone said Russians are using them, many Shahed 129 have been seen over Syria so we can assume Syrians operate them and CH-4 has been spotted in Iraq. When its about Russian drones being used in Syria for now we have spotted Eleron 3, Orlan 10 and Granat 3.

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