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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

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    Vann7
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Vann7 on Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:08 pm

    Walther von Oldenburg wrote:Vann.

    In my list of the most rusophobic nations in Europe I put Poland on 2nd place, after Ukraine. But a war between Poland and Russia - even a limited one - is not possible. The best NATO can hope for is Polish troops in Ukraine - Polish Vietnam basically - and so far we don't have solid evidence of any significant Polish forces in Donbass.

    Ukraine is not Rusophobic..  only a minority there is.. The people in the army are forced to be
    there.. if you look at previous elections were Yaknovych won.. he got majority ,in a legal democratic election.. Means Majority of Ukrainians have pro Russian opinion.. What happens today is a 5% minority that never win elections that is Rusophobic now control half of the parliament and the other half is controlled by Thieves and Corrupt politicians like Poroshenko
    that will sell for money Ukraine and do whatever told.

    POland in the other hand is highly RUsophobic , they are historical enemies of Russia.. and have fought many times since Russia was created centuries ago.

    IF you look at the video.. What they are training is Paramilitary Groups.. people that do not represent the Polish Army... this is ideal for Proxy wars.. Poland or NATO cannot go to a war against Russia.. officially.. but paramilitary volunteers groups can.. In the video you only see is polish citizens.. but in real practice they can hire Islamic mercenaries and send them to attack
    a Russian town and retreat to a forest..and Poland provide later refuge to them.. but deny it officially to have anything to do with the mercenaries attacking Russia. Since Russia have mercenaries in Ukraine.. Poland can say.. we too have mercenaries that we dont control the place they go.  It is my believe that Poland and Lithuane are preparing for attacks against Kaliningrad in Russia through proxies.. is not surprise that both nations are the ones more voicy...against Russian invasion and with heaviest propaganda on its people about how to protect when "Russia invades".  THis makes the average society in Poland on the belief that Russia is the one that will attack them... whenever any conflict start.. because they are "Aggressors". And that if any terrorist attack happens in Kaliningrad.. Poland will claims it wwas a "staged attack" by Russia to justify an aggression on Poland or lithuane.

    So the whole script is there for a low level conflict between Poland/Lituane vs Kaliningrad RUssia. Is a way to pressure Russia economy in hopes to give Russia a new chechen war or more like a vietnam war using terrain as cover.. because it will be difficult to fight Russian
    army on open terrain with Russian airforce supremacy .

    For sure Russian Media will play a major role in revealing the reality to counter NATO media ,that will claim Russia is bombing "peaceful civilians" asking for freedom in kaliningrad. but reality will be Russia will be fighting Proxy Mercenaries sent by Poland and LIthuane to Kalingrad.. Is no surprising that Both nations Poland and Lithuane have banned Russian media there.. so only one side of the story is told.. in case any conflict start by proxy against Russia.

    Another potential target is Serbia.. Armenia and Tajikistan.. and Trannistria. to Force Russia
    army to activate and fight back. Because it doesn't look like Russia will interfere officially in Ukraine.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Vann7 on Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:28 pm

    par far wrote:
    Khepesh wrote:Lukashenko has ordered the border with Ukraine strengthened. He says it is not that they fear Ukraine or that belarus has anything that Ukraine wants to attack, but to make sure that the border is secure, particulary from uncontrolled passage of arms over the border. Clearly he expects chaos soon. http://www.belta.by/president/view/lukashenko-belarusi-neobhodimo-usilivat-juzhnye-granitsy-159386-2015/



    All the countries bordering Ukraine are strengthening their borders over the past little while.

    yeah.. Americans aims to see Russia Army to interfere in a country.. to help an ally. Lukashenko
    do well to secure borders.. not only of Ukraine but with baltic states too.. he should. But im confident all this Proxy wars in Europe, attempts against Russia are all doomed to fail.. there is too much opposition in europe to American policies in Ukraine and they see the writing on the wall ,that US is trying to provoke a war against Russia and fight Russia to the last European blood. So leaks from European Intelligence agencies about any attack on Russia will be told ,
    so will be hard for Poland and Lithuane and US to keep in secret any operation of destabilization of Kaliningrad with violence.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Dforce on Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:38 pm

    Ivan the Colorado wrote:
    Looked all over the web, nothing found. Be nice if the OSCE provided numbers and nationality of the observers. Speaking of which, we should get enough people here to email them about that. Really would help with their transparency as they have very little now. Small chance of it succeeding, but things like this have worked before and it could help keep them more accountable and to be fair to the people suffering in the Donbass.

    I guess the state censorship is weaker here in the evil West, because I found what you are looking for:

    http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/177251?download=true

    26 Russians! russia


    Last edited by Dforce on Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:40 pm; edited 1 time in total

    KoTeMoRe
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Tue Aug 18, 2015 10:40 pm

    Khepesh wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    Look at the modernized Su27P's they're barely at 1999 level. Unless most of those were shipped in Israel or elsewhere for a total overhaul, I don't see how they're going to have better aircraft within the constraint of them being former-Soviet/WarPact. And again sources depict a very bleak picture around 2013. About 20 flyable 29's, 18 27's, 15-20 Su-25's. About 15 Su-24's. less than 50 Mil Mi 24's (with about 12 in UN livery).

    All those old and under-maintained, with relatively little value against heavy airspace interdiction assets. This means that "Northern Wind" can pretty much lock and load all of the Donbass without even leaving that certain country.
    I hardly meant they will have better equipment per se, but they will, I am sure, be better prepared for war. If VSN had an airforce I am sure they would use it, anybody would, so I am sure that ukrops will use theirs in some capacity. If a need arises to hit a VSN tank column fast, will ukrops say that they cannot possibly use their ground attack air assets because they might get shot down, as on that basis nobody leaves barracks for war as they might get shot.

    Once again, notice how that very logic, taking off=death or near death kept the UA AF at bay during most of the war. Ukraine can't afford to lose any aircraft. Given that CAS would be regarded as a serious escalation by that certain neighbour, this also means that every flying object that flies around the AO under 10K is going the way of the Mohicans. Needless to explain you why that's problematic for a standing army like the UA armed forces. So basically I stand by my opinion, there's no real threat added by the flying assets of Ukraine. Would it be more painful for any NAF effort to deal with that supplemental theat? Off course. Would it really change the course of war, we've seen that it doesn't, courtesy of a helpful neighbour.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  sektor on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:07 pm

    Video from pravui sektor crying about how they got their ass kicked after they mounted an attack at Novopasna. http://youtu.be/i80ep6rqup8. But wait didnt they said that it was rebels who attacked first.......

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  franco on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:09 pm

    Re the aircraft question, the NAF in June estimated that there were a total of 75 combat capable aircraft AND helicopters in the Ukrainian Air Force at that time.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:11 pm

    Dforce wrote:
    Ivan the Colorado wrote:
    Looked all over the web, nothing found. Be nice if the OSCE provided numbers and nationality of the observers. Speaking of which, we should get enough people here to email them about that. Really would help with their transparency as they have very little now. Small chance of it succeeding, but things like this have worked before and it could help keep them more accountable and to be fair to the people suffering in the Donbass.

    I guess the state censorship is weaker here in the evil West, because I found what you are looking for:

    http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/177251?download=true

    26 Russians! russia

    On over 800 "observers"...

    Chersonesus
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Chersonesus on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:18 pm

    Vann7 wrote:

    --- snip --- 

    So for example..

    the National Endowed for Democracy or (NED) ..here is the website..

    http://www.ned.org

    IF you read their own website.. they claim to operate in more than 90 countries in the world.
    to defend "Democracy" and freedom" . How is that? does the US government really believe
    in "democracy" and "freedom" and a "better future" as they did in Lybia or the organization is a fraud?

    Interestingly they do not operate or very little activity in NATO countries.. they operate fully only in Nations Not aligned with US imperialism.  So there is no NED in Israel for example.. or NED In Turkey or in Poland. or Kuwait.. No NED offices in Repressive states that are loyal to American IMperialism.  

    The American Terrorist NGO organization (NED) ,hides behind a peaceful humanitarian cover ,funded Directly by US congress , can call for a 50,000 protest in Venezuela.. coordinated with the CIA..  and they tell them.. that the protest have to be peaceful.. ( to make sure the agency dont get blamed later for the terror attacks) ,so thousands of peaceful civilians are fooled into a trap.

    That organization is behind the Coup in Ukraine and the COup in Georgia too. the one in Egypt too that put Morsi in power .and helped to organize the violence and civil war in Lybia, organize the initial violence in Syria. And behind the violence in venezuela and Brazil too. and behind the protest in Russia too.. is simply US congress money ,used to provoke violence in nations they perceive as a threat to American IMperialism. they failed a revolution in IRAN.. you can read more about US Congress color revolutions ,and the many tentacles (NED) have ,that is nothing but a CIA Front.. that provide the information for their criminal activities.

    here a French Journalist explain you how NED American terrorist organization operates..

    http://www.voltairenet.org/article160764.html

    Is an American CIA front.. that collect information of potential terrorist recruits for the agency..
    Later another american NGO or the CIA hire criminals to shoot at the peaceful they told to organize and protest. So essentially all this peaceful protesters with good intentions of a better future were mislead and used to stage for other purposes ,to stage a major violent event ,where the government will be blamed and they not told about it..that criminals also will be hired to Shoot at them.. im sure even the most crazy fanatic ,American Fanboy on this forums..,will ever attend a protest if they were told snipers will be firing at them for a "Greater cause" of removing from Power the government in Russia. That they will be used as Involuntary martyrs . So idiots like Navalny ,PussyRiots or Nemetsov (oh wait already killed) who are more useful death than alive ,,risk their lives for being popular ,and opposing  PUTIN.. This is how the lovely Freedom America operates.. IF any opposition activist to RussianGovernment is popular ,but stand not a chance in politics ,they are a likely candidate for being used as martyrs without them being told.
    the criminals could be given Police Uniforms too...to make it more real... that the "Government is killing" them..

    --- snip ---


    NED has been declared as officially 'undesirable' in Russia. Some of Soros' fronts are also on the way out. China will probably pass laws to do the same.

    http://landdestroyer.blogspot.co.uk/2015/08/national-endowment-for-democracy-is-now.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  flamming_python on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:25 pm

    Dforce wrote:
    sektor wrote:
    Dforce wrote:
    Neutrality wrote:Look Dforce, if your sole intention is to piss off Russian posters by your "epic trole mate xDDDD eeksdeee!!" attitude then I suggest you just stay away. You obviously know people support Donbass here so why bother? I remember you clearly from MP.net and your unconditional support of Kiev. I'll never forget you and your friends like Asheren, kalerab, CourageAboveAllValues and the other batshit insane people from that place.

    I honestly do not think I am the topic here, and if you can show me where I have been trolling you are welcome. Besides, I do not think it okay to call other posters "batshit insane".

    Seriously man  you are not welcomed here. Go back to cesspool called themess.

    Somehow I doubt you are in charge of the member admission department on this site, so if you just want to complain more about me you are welcome to do so via the internal message system. Let us discuss Ukraine here and not me, shal we?

    You really ruffling some feathers here eh Dforce?

    Keep it comin'!

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  franco on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:27 pm

    The sixth wave of mobilization of the Ukraine (the last of the planned this year) ended with a sizeable shortfalls:

       The sixth wave of mobilization , according to the decree of President hosted from June 19 to August 17, 2015.
       "The plan of conscription of citizens for military service is made ​​to mobilize more than 60%, including the officer corps - more than 80%, and vehicles - more than 30%," - said Pravdivets.
       "As a result of the mobilization of volunteers intended 8.5% 25.7% temporarily unemployed", - he added.
       Regarding the outcome of the plan by area Speaker of the General Staff noted:
       "The volumes of 80 to 100% reference is made ​​in Vinnytsia, Dnipropetrovsk, Volyn, Khmelnytsky and Zhytomyr regions. Disappointing, to a maximum of 40%, the job is done in Sumy, Transcarpathian, Odessa, Ivano-Frankivsk region."
       Answering the question of journalists, thereby will be compensated 40% shortfall, Pravdivets said:
       "In accordance with the presidential decree of August 17, the call for mobilization is completed. The legal basis for the continuation of his - no. The difference of failure of the plan will be compensated by receiving in the military service under contract."
       According to him, it would be "almost 10% of each wave of mobilization."
       Also, the colonel declined to specify the number of troops, designed within the framework of the 6th wave of mobilization:
       "We do not reveal the data. It's classified information."

       "The number of citizens who did not come after a warning in military commissariat, was 50-55%. The result revealed" draft dodgers "mobilization in the amount of 26.8 thousand people," - he said .
       "Today is open in such cases administrative proceedings 5811, the results of which citizens were brought to administrative responsibility, and opened almost 1.5 thousand criminal proceedings for evasion of mobilization," - said the colonel.
       Also, according to Pravdivtsev, 61% of those who arrived at the medical examination, turned out to be unfit for duty for health reasons.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Khepesh on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:29 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    Once again, notice how that very logic, taking off=death or near death kept the UA AF at bay during most of the war. Ukraine can't afford to lose any aircraft. Given that CAS would be regarded as a serious escalation by that certain neighbour, this also means that every flying object that flies around the AO under 10K is going the way of the Mohicans. Needless to explain you why that's problematic for a standing army like the UA armed forces. So basically I stand by my opinion, there's no real threat added by the flying assets of Ukraine. Would it be more painful for any NAF effort to deal with that supplemental theat? Off course. Would it really change the course of war, we've seen that it doesn't, courtesy of a helpful neighbour.
    When this war starts it will probably be existential to Kiev junta, so for what reason will they not use their air arm, what will they hold it back for, to protect Borispol when the rats run? In Spring last year everybody was saying categorically that use of Grad on a city would be seen as "serious escalation" by the certain neighbor, seems not.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  franco on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:40 pm

    Sergey Bobkov ‏- 2 hours ago

    Commander of Engineer Corps of Nat Grd of #Ukraine, Colonel #Yatsulyak, defected to #Donbass, could no longer execute criminal orders. #ATO


    Any confirmation of this??

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  franco on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:50 pm

    Vostok training exercises and NO that is not a T-72B3.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0oYznENnYg

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  whir on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:56 pm

    Khepesh wrote:When this war starts it will probably be existential to Kiev junta, so for what reason will they not use their air arm, what will they hold it back for, to protect Borispol when the rats run?
    Mainly for the same reason they stopped using it, Kiev's airforce is compromised. Parading some MiGs and SUs around it's a great propaganda asset, and a fast way to fill someone's pockets, and although in theory they could try sporadic bombing runs but after that Pantsir paraded around Lugansk the propaganda backlash in case of multiple downings of big fighters/bombers is not worth it.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Flagship Victory on Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:57 pm

    No concert tonight? Calm before the storm? Shocked

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  PapaDragon on Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:01 am


    Well no sh*t... lol1

    ''Ukraine, Syria Capitals See Biggest Decline in Liveability Over Five Years''

    http://www.sputniknews.com/europe/20150818/1025899646.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Godric on Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:02 am

    franco wrote:Vostok training exercises and NO that is not a T-72B3.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0oYznENnYg

    clearly B1s tracks are the old style as well from the 1980s

    a lot of people are getting confused with the T-72BM and the T-72B3 the biggest difference is in the tracks

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  JohninMK on Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:14 am

    More 'you can't keep glossing over this OSCE' comments and data from Moscow. Then we have Poro summoned to Berlin.

    MOSCOW, August 18. /TASS/. Russia has informed observers of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) that the Ukrainian army is building up weaponry with a caliber of over 100 millimeters along the disengagement line, Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova said on Tuesday.

    "Russian representatives in the Joint Control and Coordination Center informed employees of the OSCE’s Special Monitoring Mission of the buildup of weapons with a caliber of over 100 mm by the Ukrainian Armed Forces along the disengagement line between the sides," the spokeswoman said in a video commentary. "In particular, it was established that six self-propelled artillery systems and three tanks were mounted in Novotroitskoye, 11 Grad [multiple launch rocket] systems arrived in Krasnogorovka, nine self-propelled artillery systems, two Pion artillery guns and four Grad systems were deployed near Tarasovka and Vodyanoye," her comment said.

    "Two Grad systems were deployed in Mirnoye, two D-30 howitzers of the 152-mm caliber were placed in Talakovka, 10 D-30 howitzers were deployed in Starognatovka and Novognatovka. Besides, the personnel of a private military firm has arrived in Starognatovka, and the movement of a Ukrainian convoy of three towed D-30 howitzers of the 122-mm caliber has been registered near Mayorsk," Zakharova said.

    She said "relevant information, including photo and video materials on the mentioned violations, has been handed to the OSCE SMM."




    PARIS, August 18. /TASS/. German Chancellor Angela Merkel, French President Francois Hollande and Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko will hold a meeting in Berlin on Monday to discuss deterioration of the situation in east Ukraine, French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius said Tuesday.

    "I hope the meeting on Monday will make it possible for us to move forward on both points [withdrawal of armaments and ceasefire]. We hope the decision is found in December at the latest," he was quoted by media as saying.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Wed Aug 19, 2015 12:29 am

    http://dnr-news.com/dnr/24270-avakov-napisal-zayavlenie-ob-uvolnenii.html

    Isn't this what Right Sector wanted, or am I confused??



    The upcoming test Prosecutor General of Ukraine could push the Minister of Internal Affairs of Ukraine to the abdication

    On receipt of the application to dismiss Interior Minister Arsen Avakov voluntarily informed the secretariat of the Ukrainian government.

    "Resignation Arsen Borisovich actually received by the government, but the Prime Minister was not even considered. Interior Minister requests to release him at his own request at the end of vacation "


    - Stated in the Cabinet of Ministers of Ukraine.

    Among the possible reasons for dismissal referred to a letter to the General Prosecutor's Office, which refers to the beginning of the verification of compliance with requirements of the law by police officers in the exercise of its powers. In particular, the investigators are going to check the facts of abuse of authority and forgery by the Interior Minister and his subordinates.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  KoTeMoRe on Wed Aug 19, 2015 1:32 am

    Khepesh wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:

    Once again, notice how that very logic, taking off=death or near death kept the UA AF at bay during most of the war. Ukraine can't afford to lose any aircraft. Given that CAS would be regarded as a serious escalation by that certain neighbour, this also means that every flying object that flies around the AO under 10K is going the way of the Mohicans. Needless to explain you why that's problematic for a standing army like the UA armed forces. So basically I stand by my opinion, there's no real threat added by the flying assets of Ukraine. Would it be more painful for any NAF effort to deal with that supplemental theat? Off course. Would it really change the course of war, we've seen that it doesn't, courtesy of a helpful neighbour.
    When this war starts it will probably be existential to Kiev junta, so for what reason will they not use their air arm, what will they hold it back for, to protect Borispol when the rats run? In Spring last year everybody was saying categorically that use of Grad on a city would be seen as "serious escalation" by the certain neighbor, seems not.

    We're speaking about two different things here. The shelling is part of the game now. It's mainly a static show of force, typical "collateral damage" bollocks, with random shelling and dead civilians. That much can't be stopped. It would need a certain commitment that the neighbour doesn't want to see through. However employing CAS or any kind of aircraft for tactical airlift/bombing/recon IS a major escalation in the war program. It's force on force and is premeditate. Therefore opening the usual Pandora box. Cas/AirStrike on NAF? At worst NAF "captures" Tochka's of their own. At best the planes get shot before even delivering their ordinance.

    Godric wrote:
    franco wrote:Vostok training exercises and NO that is not a T-72B3.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0oYznENnYg

    clearly B1s tracks are the old style as well from the 1980s

    a lot of people are getting confused with the T-72BM and the T-72B3 the biggest difference is in the tracks

    Err that's an uber-pimped 64BV + T72B with triple side rows of Era. The Autoloader is a dead giveaway as well. No T-72BM's in this video.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  OminousSpudd on Wed Aug 19, 2015 1:38 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Dforce wrote:
    Ivan the Colorado wrote:
    Looked all over the web, nothing found. Be nice if the OSCE provided numbers and nationality of the observers. Speaking of which, we should get enough people here to email them about that. Really would help with their transparency as they have very little now. Small chance of it succeeding, but things like this have worked before and it could help keep them more accountable and to be fair to the people suffering in the Donbass.

    I guess the state censorship is weaker here in the evil West, because I found what you are looking for:

    http://www.osce.org/ukraine-smm/177251?download=true

    26 Russians! russia

    On over 800 "observers"...

    After a little calculation from Dforce's link, 427/525 members are from Russophobic/NATO member countries. 50 from the US alone, while smaller nations such as Poland get in with 27 members. Makes the 26 Russians look pretty sad really eh?

    Try again Dforce.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Neutrality on Wed Aug 19, 2015 1:48 am

    There are Russian nationalists embedded with Azov and other neo-fascist battalions. Somehow Dforce doesn't mention that little fact. It's only bad when Russians fight at the side of the NAF.

    This guy... not even worth the trouble.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Erk on Wed Aug 19, 2015 2:00 am

    JohninMK wrote:More 'you can't keep glossing over this OSCE' comments and data from Moscow. Then we have Poro summoned to Berlin.

    MOSCOW, August 18. /TASS/. Russia has informed observers of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE) that the Ukrainian army is building up weaponry with a caliber of over 100 millimeters along the disengagement line, Foreign Ministry spokeswoman Maria Zakharova said on Tuesday.

    "Russian representatives in the Joint Control and Coordination Center informed employees of the OSCE’s Special Monitoring Mission of the buildup of weapons with a caliber of over 100 mm by the Ukrainian Armed Forces along the disengagement line between the sides," the spokeswoman said in a video commentary. "In particular, it was established that six self-propelled artillery systems and three tanks were mounted in Novotroitskoye, 11 Grad [multiple launch rocket] systems arrived in Krasnogorovka, nine self-propelled artillery systems, two Pion artillery guns and four Grad systems were deployed near Tarasovka and Vodyanoye," her comment said.

    "Two Grad systems were deployed in Mirnoye, two D-30 howitzers of the 152-mm caliber were placed in Talakovka, 10 D-30 howitzers were deployed in Starognatovka and Novognatovka. Besides, the personnel of a private military firm has arrived in Starognatovka, and the movement of a Ukrainian convoy of three towed D-30 howitzers of the 122-mm caliber has been registered near Mayorsk," Zakharova said.

    She said "relevant information, including photo and video materials on the mentioned violations, has been handed to the OSCE SMM."




    PARIS, August 18. /TASS/. German Chancellor Angela Merkel, French President Francois Hollande and Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko will hold a meeting in Berlin on Monday to discuss deterioration of the situation in east Ukraine, French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius said Tuesday.

    "I hope the meeting on Monday will make it possible for us to move forward on both points [withdrawal of armaments and ceasefire]. We hope the decision is found in December at the latest," he was quoted by media as saying.
    http://tass.ru/en/world/815118

    About time Russia took photos of the violations and waved it in front of the OSCE.
    I can't understand why they didn't do it weeks ago before the OSCE vehicles got burned. (Do we know who did that yet?)

    Dforce
    Junior Sergeant
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    Posts : 101
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    Join date : 2015-07-22

    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  Dforce on Wed Aug 19, 2015 2:44 am

    OminousSpudd wrote:

    After a little calculation from Dforce's link, 427/525 members are from Russophobic/NATO member countries. 50 from the US alone, while smaller nations such as Poland get in with 27 members. Makes the 26 Russians look pretty sad really eh?

    Try again Dforce.

    Try WHAT again? Sending IvanColorado the link he was looking for?

    I am not much for bragging, but I think I did just that...

    kvs
    Colonel
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

    Post  kvs on Wed Aug 19, 2015 3:51 am

    http://www.rferl.org/content/daily-vertical-false-flag-alert/27195022.html

    Western propagandists paving a cover story for the Kiev regime.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #20

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