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    Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

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    eehnie
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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Thu Apr 07, 2016 2:52 pm

    Dorfmeister wrote:
    eehnie wrote:Here most the rest of the basics. You can do the track of every unit of big non-combat aircrafts purchased by the Russian Armed Forces since 1997, except the recent orders of the Il-96, that surely will be included in some time:

    http://russianplanes.net/planelist/Ilushin/Il-96 (not enough updated)

    The list you quoted is perfectly up to date: we can discuss the fact that both 96101 and 96103 haven't been noted as "IL-96-400TZ" (but that's quite logical as works are underway) for the rest even the planes which are being built right now are mentionned in the list.

    About the recents orders, nobody knows exactly which variant will be produced and in which numbers: so there's no point in mentionning them in a list as long as nothing is know about them...

    And I can't agree more with wilhelm: you simply can't replace an An-22 with a "modified" Il-96... The Il-96 would be a great platform (even more with new engines) as a tanker, flying command post or AWACS but simply put it can't be used for oversized loads or heavy loads like an T-14 tank or a T-90MS AND that's logical: it hasn't been designed for such jobs.

    Reports of 2015 talk about 11 orders of Il-96 by the Russian ministery of Defense for different roles. Some used aircrafts modified, others totally new. There are reports of the fist deliveries. Some reports even give the reference of which will be the modified aircrafts (one example is the RA-96104) I see not all it reflected in the link, despite it the link is very good and this why I posted it.

    The Il-96 was not designed to be a tanker, but it is now doing the work (with the first units delivered). What I said about the Il-96 in relation with a replacement of the the An-22 is that I would think twice before to rule out the Il-96. It has the right size, it has done the aerodynamical balance, it has the engines, it has the main structure, which is able to support even higher payload than the An-22, and the Il-106 is too far. With some changes, minor changes in overal terms (without changes in the engines, in the external dimenssions or in the main structure of the aircraft and its nodes), I would check the possibility of having a new version with a different cargo cabin and different distribution of doors more adapted to military loads, with the use if necessary of external ramps.  

    The main question about a replacement like this of the An-22, is not in the features of the aircrafts. It is a lot easier than this. We are not talking about a future replacement, the replacement is being done. We need only to look at what has been done and at what is being done.

    Who replaced the retired units of the An-22? Who is taking loads moved before by these aircrafts. It is as difficult to identify them? No. It is something happening before our eyes. The loads of the retired An-22 are not quiet waiting, are being moved by who replaced the retired units of the An-22. We need only to do the track to see that until now the Il-76 has been key in the replacement of the retired units of the An-22.

    Who will replace the remaining units of the An-22? Who take the loads moved by these aircrafts. It is as difficult to identify them? No. New big aircrafts are being ordered, while some others are being retired. Oredered: Il-96 (modified) and Il-76/78/A-50. Retired: An-22 and Il-76/78/A-50. Nothing else because there are not changes in the fleets of An-124, Il-62 and Il-86/80, and new models of aircraft are too far to come.


    Last edited by eehnie on Sat Apr 09, 2016 12:25 am; edited 2 times in total

    eehnie
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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:41 pm

    Like the people can see in the quotes that you posted, you said false things distorting my words here:

    wilhelm wrote:previous statement of being able to transport 2 Armata tanks via side loading hatches in the Il-96

    eehnie wrote:The Il-96 has a payload of 92000 Kg, which means that is SURELY IS STILL NOT ENOUGH FOR 2 T-14

    and here:

    wilhelm wrote:but you've said there is no reason to even develop the Il-106 to replace the An-22 because  the Il-96 can do the job.

    eehnie wrote:Taking into account the existence of the Il-96, I DOUBT that Russia really needs to design FAST a new aircraft of the same class (named Il-106 in the article) to replace the An-22.

    and you lied here:

    wilhelm wrote:I haven't distorted a single thing.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  wilhelm on Thu Apr 07, 2016 4:12 pm

    Completely ridiculous, as your own quotes show. I didn't write them...you did. And I posted the link so people may read exactly what is in them at their leisure.pwnd

    I now know why I didn't respond, and why a lot of others don't bother either, even after the various patient explanations concerning the different types of aircraft configurations.
    Stupid Ilyushin with their delusions....Eehnie can do it faster with some light and basic modifications to an airliner to take the Armata.
    And supersonic PAK TA? Laughing

    There is no further point or benefit to this kind of discussion, so have a great time Eehnie. clown lol!

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:01 pm

    wilhelm wrote:Completely ridiculous, as your own quotes show. I didn't write them...you did. And I posted the link so people may read exactly what is in them at their leisure.pwnd

    I now know why I didn't respond, and why a lot of others don't bother either, even after the various patient explanations concerning the different types of aircraft configurations.
    Stupid Ilyushin with their delusions....Eehnie can do it faster with some light and basic modifications to an airliner to take the Armata.
    And supersonic PAK TA? Laughing

    There is no further point or benefit to this kind of discussion, so have a great time Eehnie. clown lol!

    Your lies failed here, and nothing else to say... have the same luck in your next bid.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  GarryB on Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:54 pm

    If we can talk about a replacement, the aircraft that has been replacing the An-22 has been the Il-76, the alone of the big aircrafts ordered in the last years until very recently. Now some orders of the Il-96 have been done. Maybe not an exact replacement but both aircrafts, the Il-96 and the Il-76, would be the replacement of the An-22 at least in fact.

    One aircraft leaving service and another entering production is not evidence one is replacing the other.

    the few Il-96s being built are not for cargo transport.

    AFAIK they are for inflight refuelling tankers.

    A role the AN-22 was never designed for or used for.

    In the last 20 years about 45 units of the An-22 have been retired, and in the next 5? the remaining 11 (or 9) units will be retired. In the same period of time the Il-96 and the Il-76 are the alone big aircrafts that have been ordered and delivered.

    You can call it like you want, but the fact is the fact.

    The fact you are ignoring is that the Il-96s being produced are not for cargo transport, and the only Il-76s being delivered are the Il-476 which has a max payload capacity of 60 tons which is 20 tons short of the 80 ton payload of the An-22. This means that when the payload is heavier than 60 tons then either two aircraft will be needed or one An-124 will be used where previously one An-22 would have been used.

    Not ideal because two Il-476s or one An-124 would use rather more fuel than an An-22, but when they are not available they have to use what they have.

    Which aricrafts replaced them since the begin or the retirements in 1997?

    If no-one replaced them, what happended with the loads that they transported before? Are waiting to the true future replacement of the An-22?

    When an 80 ton payload aircraft is not available to transport your payload you either split up the payload and use several smaller aircraft, or you use a much bigger aircraft... either way the transport bill is higher.

    When developing ground hardware including radar vehicles and equipment moved for the ground forces, they are generally designed around available air lift capabilities, so by withdrawing one weigh class of transport then you will always make air lift even more expensive because you will need more smaller aircraft or a larger aircraft... both of which burn more fuel.

    The Il-96 was not designed to be a tanker, but it is now doing the work (with the first units delivered).

    There is no aircraft in operational service designed from the outset to be an inflight refuelling aircraft.

    Early models were adapted from bombers because they were large and could fly for long periods with a large payload (of fuel). Current popular models are based on airliners or large transport types... the Il-78 is an aberration in the sense that it is a heavy transport type not optimised for long range cruising like a long range airliner.

    The Il-96 was never designed as an inflight refuelling tanker, but its attributes like low drag, very long range, and rather large size and relatively high cruise speed make them ideal for inflight refuelling tankers for long range strategic bombers.

    It would also have lots of internal space for sensors and communication equipment making it ideal for JSTARS or VIP transport or large AWACS use.

    The main question about a replacement like this of the An-22, is not in the features of the aircrafts. It is a lot easier than this. We are not talking about a future replacement, the replacement is being done. We need only to look at what has been done and at what is being done.

    the replacement has been done... the An-22s are leaving service and the Il-96 is not yet in service, so we can assume that the Il-76 and An-124 are doing the jobs the An-22 would have done previously... they are the replacements... for now... but in the near future they will likely be suplimented by an aircraft in the 80-100 ton payload class because new land vehicles will require that payload capacity.

    Who will replace the remaining units of the An-22? Who take the loads moved by these aircrafts. It is as difficult to identify them? No. New big aircrafts are being ordered, while some others are being retired. Oredered: Il-96 (modified) and Il-76/78/A-50. Retired: An-22 and Il-76/78/A-50. Nothing else because there are not changes in the fleets of An-124, Il-62 and Il-86/80, and new models of aircraft are too far to come.

    There are no known orders for transport versions of the Il-96... only tankers AFAIK.

    Your lies failed here, and nothing else to say... have the same luck in your next bid.

    Large aircraft have a structure. If you change their purpose... ie from airliner to combat transport with nose and rear ramps then you pretty much have to redesign their basic structure.

    In many senses the An-22 was a failure because its basic design was poor for paradropping supplies... that is why the VDV used Il-76s to transport their hardware despite the An-22 being able to carry rather more... the air flow around the rear of the An-22 was not ideal for paradropping vehicles by parachute... I rather suspect the redesign of the Il-96 would have been plain sailing either... far too expensive and risky when new designs had already been largely completed... they will just need new engines and they should be ready for production in a few years...



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    eehnie
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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:00 pm

    A recent article about supersonic air transport:

    http://www.ruaviation.com/news/2016/2/11/4995/

    ruaviation.com wrote:Russia to Build World’s Biggest and Fastest Air Freighter

    Russian Aviaton » Thursday February 11, 2016 18:58 MSK

    Russia’s aircraft designers are setting their sights on a huge, supersonic cargo plane capable of transporting tanks to the field in a matter of hours. The general concept of this flying giant is expected to be ready before this year is out.

    This heavy transport plane, dubbed the PAK TA (Perspective Airborne Complex of Transport Aviation), will be able to fly at supersonic speeds of up to 2,000 km/h, carry up to 200 tons and have a range of 7,000 km.

    Eighty such planes are to be built by 2024, which will make it possible to ferry 400 heavy tanks or 900 lightly armored vehicles to the battlefield much faster than ever before.

    The project is being handled by Ilyushin Aviation Complex, whose CEO Viktor Livanov said that “it may be implemented by 2030," and that the exact specifications were still subject to negotiations.

    The PAK TA project, thought to have been underway for several years now, is to replace the current fleet of Russian heavy air freighters – Antonov An-22 Antei with a load carrying capacity  of 60 tons, and Antonov An-124 Ruslan, which can lift 120 tons of cargo.

    The only operating aircraft that can carry a comparable amount of weight is the Antonov An-225 Mriya, which was built for the Soviet Buran space shuttle program.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:11 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    If we can talk about a replacement, the aircraft that has been replacing the An-22 has been the Il-76, the alone of the big aircrafts ordered in the last years until very recently. Now some orders of the Il-96 have been done. Maybe not an exact replacement but both aircrafts, the Il-96 and the Il-76, would be the replacement of the An-22 at least in fact.

    One aircraft leaving service and another entering production is not evidence one is replacing the other.

    the few Il-96s being built are not for cargo transport.

    AFAIK they are for inflight refuelling tankers.

    A role the AN-22 was never designed for or used for.

    In the last 20 years about 45 units of the An-22 have been retired, and in the next 5? the remaining 11 (or 9) units will be retired. In the same period of time the Il-96 and the Il-76 are the alone big aircrafts that have been ordered and delivered.

    You can call it like you want, but the fact is the fact.

    The fact you are ignoring is that the Il-96s being produced are not for cargo transport, and the only Il-76s being delivered are the Il-476 which has a max payload capacity of 60 tons which is 20 tons short of the 80 ton payload of the An-22. This means that when the payload is heavier than 60 tons then either two aircraft will be needed or one An-124 will be used where previously one An-22 would have been used.

    Not ideal because two Il-476s or one An-124 would use rather more fuel than an An-22, but when they are not available they have to use what they have.

    Which aricrafts replaced them since the begin or the retirements in 1997?

    If no-one replaced them, what happended with the loads that they transported before? Are waiting to the true future replacement of the An-22?

    When an 80 ton payload aircraft is not available to transport your payload you either split up the payload and use several smaller aircraft, or you use a much bigger aircraft... either way the transport bill is higher.

    When developing ground hardware including radar vehicles and equipment moved for the ground forces, they are generally designed around available air lift capabilities, so by withdrawing one weigh class of transport then you will always make air lift even more expensive because you will need more smaller aircraft or a larger aircraft... both of which burn more fuel.

    The Il-96 was not designed to be a tanker, but it is now doing the work (with the first units delivered).

    There is no aircraft in operational service designed from the outset to be an inflight refuelling aircraft.

    Early models were adapted from bombers because they were large and could fly for long periods with a large payload (of fuel). Current popular models are based on airliners or large transport types... the Il-78 is an aberration in the sense that it is a heavy transport type not optimised for long range cruising like a long range airliner.

    The Il-96 was never designed as an inflight refuelling tanker, but its attributes like low drag, very long range, and rather large size and relatively high cruise speed make them ideal for inflight refuelling tankers for long range strategic bombers.

    It would also have lots of internal space for sensors and communication equipment making it ideal for JSTARS or VIP transport or large AWACS use.

    The main question about a replacement like this of the An-22, is not in the features of the aircrafts. It is a lot easier than this. We are not talking about a future replacement, the replacement is being done. We need only to look at what has been done and at what is being done.

    the replacement has been done... the An-22s are leaving service and the Il-96 is not yet in service, so we can assume that the Il-76 and An-124 are doing the jobs the An-22 would have done previously... they are the replacements... for now... but in the near future they will likely be suplimented by an aircraft in the 80-100 ton payload class because new land vehicles will require that payload capacity.

    Who will replace the remaining units of the An-22? Who take the loads moved by these aircrafts. It is as difficult to identify them? No. New big aircrafts are being ordered, while some others are being retired. Oredered: Il-96 (modified) and Il-76/78/A-50. Retired: An-22 and Il-76/78/A-50. Nothing else because there are not changes in the fleets of An-124, Il-62 and Il-86/80, and new models of aircraft are too far to come.

    There are no known orders for transport versions of the Il-96... only tankers AFAIK.

    Your lies failed here, and nothing else to say... have the same luck in your next bid.

    Large aircraft have a structure. If you change their purpose... ie from airliner to combat transport with nose and rear ramps then you pretty much have to redesign their basic structure.

    In many senses the An-22 was a failure because its basic design was poor for paradropping supplies... that is why the VDV used Il-76s to transport their hardware despite the An-22 being able to carry rather more... the air flow around the rear of the An-22 was not ideal for paradropping vehicles by parachute... I rather suspect the redesign of the Il-96 would have been plain sailing either... far too expensive and risky when new designs had already been largely completed... they will just need new engines and they should be ready for production in a few years...

    Wilhelm lied about my words, nothing related to what you are comenting. Also all this comment is ignoring the most important part of my comments about the replacement of the An-22. It was a reason why I bolded it. Most of the things you are talking about here are explained in the following quote of myself. And your comment is not right in somethings (as example the structure of the doors and/or ramps, and the structure of the internal floors, reinforced or not, is not part of the main structure of the aircraft):

    eehnie wrote:The main question about a replacement like this of the An-22, is not in the features of the aircrafts. It is a lot easier than this. We are not talking about a future replacement, the replacement is being done. We need only to look at what has been done and at what is being done.

    Who replaced the retired units of the An-22? Who is taking loads moved before by these aircrafts. It is as difficult to identify them? No. It is something happening before our eyes. The loads of the retired An-22 are not quiet waiting, are being moved by who replaced the retired units of the An-22. We need only to do the track to see that until now the Il-76 has been key in the replacement of the retired units of the An-22.

    Who will replace the remaining units of the An-22? Who take the loads moved by these aircrafts. It is as difficult to identify them? No. New big aircrafts are being ordered, while some others are being retired. Oredered: Il-96 (modified) and Il-76/78/A-50. Retired: An-22 and Il-76/78/A-50. Nothing else because there are not changes in the fleets of An-124, Il-62 and Il-86/80, and new models of aircraft are too far to come.

    In my next comment I'm including one article about the situation of the An-22. The remaining active aircrafts are doing 1-2 flies by year since at least 2012. You can not replace an aircraft that has been almost replaced, with another aircraft that is not coming in more than 10 years. You can not justify the project of the Il-106 talking about a replacement that is almost done. It damages the prospect of the Il-106. I'm not against the development of the Il-106, because this aircraft can be part of the replacement for non contested areas of the aircrafts that replaced and are replacing the An-22.

    Again, to explain the replacement of the An-22 it is necessary to look at what has been done, and at what will be done in the short term (ordered aircrafts), because the replacement is almost done. I said which have been the new orders, And like I said before, you can call it like you wish, but take into account the facts. The An-22 is almost retired today, and its replacement has been covered with the current fleet, the orders of big aircrafts of the last 20 years and the orders that remain to be delivered in the short term (Il-76 and Il-96).

    Also the orders of Il-96 are not only tankers. There are units for other roles and there are units which role has not been explained in the public reports still.


    Last edited by eehnie on Sun Apr 10, 2016 12:36 am; edited 5 times in total

    eehnie
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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:27 pm

    eehnie wrote:Changing of issue, habitually the year of the end of production is a key parameter to see which models can be replaced first as whole models, because it marks the age of the youngest units of a model. It seems right to quote the list by weight class of models that are in service but out of production, including the year of end of the production in every case:

    -

    Il-86/80 (1997)
    An-22 (1975)

    -

    -

    Tu-134 (1989)
    Il-18/20/22 (1985)
    An-10/12 (1972)

    -

    -

    -

    -

    L-39 (1999)
    Mi-2 (1993)
    An-2 (1993)

    For replacements in the short-mid term I would expect to see units of the models that are out of production since longer time being replaced by models that are in production or reaching the production in the short-mid term and are safe bets. It basically means to compare both lists by weight class of my previous comment.

    What I would expect:

    An-10/12 (1972, 65 active and 55 in the reserve) likely to be replaced by Il-214.
    An-22 (1975, 5 active and 6 in the reserve) likely to be replaced by Il-96 (with some changes of minor effect on the navigation for the version of civil transport) or by Il-76/78/A50.
    Il-18/20/22 (1985, 48 active and 8 in the reserve) likely to be replaced by Il-214 and maybe some unit of the Su-Superjet100.
    Tu-134 (1989, 61 active and 107 in the reserve) likely to be replaced by Il-214 and maybe some unit of the Su-Superjet100.

    It will take some time to replace all them. I expect the An-22 the first to be totally replaced, because there are only a few. I do not expect the mentioned Il-106 to come fast enough for a replacement of the An-22.

    About the replacement of the An-2 I would not rule out a replacement by helicopters. It seems likely to me. As example we can compare the specifications of the An-2 and the Ka-60/62.

    Checking the age of the aircrafts by units again appear the same aircrafts as those with oldest fleets. The oldest average age of the fleet of every model is in the An-2, An-10/12, An-22 and Il-18/20/22 (note that the age of the fleet of these aircrafts is in the same range than the age of the Il-38 and Be-12 aircrafts for combat roles), with the fleet of Tu-134 and other aircrafts being significantly younger.

    In the case of the An-22 there is an aditional problem that is the lack of spare engines and parts of engines. Their production seems to be stoped in the begin of the 90s. The following article is from 2012 but explains it. Today the number of An-22 is lower, 5 active and 6 in the reserve (2 of them in museums).

    http://www.ruaviation.com/news/2012/9/7/1191/

    ruaviation.com wrote:Russian Ministry of Defense decided to extend service life of An-22 Antey aircraft

    Russian Aviaton » Friday September 7, 2012 16:31 MSK
    Russian Minister of Defense, Anatoly Serdukov, has taken a decision to extend service life of one of the oldest aircraft of Russian air forces – An-22 “Antey” until 2020, Izvestiya reports.

    The serial production of An-22 aircraft was being carried out in Tashkent (Tashkent Aviation Production Association) during a period from November 1965 to January 1976. As reported by a representative of Russian air forces, the aircraft needs new engines and landing gear. Training of pilots is also necessary.

    However, propellers for these aircraft are not manufactured anymore, that is why Anteys will be performing flights using old propellers, which may break down at any time. «The major problem of Antey is propeller. Propellers have been manufactured in Stupino before, but the production was ceased in 1990s. The ones mounted on the old aircraft have cracks and fatigue damage », — the representative of Russian air forces familiar with the situation explained.

    As explained by a representative of the Ministry of Defense, the main reason for resuming the operation of outdated An-22 aircraft is workload of An-124 heavy transport aircraft caused by commercial transportation. At present Аn-124 aircraft owned by Russian air forces are fulfilling commercial orders in 224th aircraft division, which apparently will be taking part in transportation of NATO’s cargo through Ulyanovsk. «Of course these orders are profitable for the Ministry of Defense, but the air forces need a heavy transport aircraft for their own needs, but all of An-124s are busy. In 2011–2012 An-124 aircraft have not performed a single flight on behalf of Russian air forces», — the source noted. He added that the air forces also have a lot of Il-76 aircraft, but they are less efficient as compared to Аn-124 and Аn-22 aircraft, — they have lower weight-lift ability and Il-76s are unable to transport oversized cargo.

    At present Russian air forces have 24 Anteys: six are in limited operation (the aircraft perform 1-2 flights per year), the rest 18 ones are grounded.

    The manufacturer of An-22 “Antey” aircraft, Antonov State Enterprise, said that it is negotiating with Russian Ministry of Defense regarding extension of service life of Аn-22 aircraft, which expires in 2013. The “Program for extension of service life of aircraft operated for more than 40 years” was developed in cooperation with the Russian party. It is focused only on An-22s. It is planned to extend the vehicles’ service life to 50 years. The work will be carried out at 308th aircraft overhaul plant (Ivanovo). The program is being considered at the moment, — the representative of Antonov noted.

    I do not expect the An-22 to continue after 2020, and even can be totally retired before. Also it is possible and likely the total replacement of the An-10/12 (by Il-214) and the An-2 (maybe by Ka-60/62 and some Let L-410, with Russian owner and production now) before the end of the decade.

    The An-2 is marking today the lowest technological level of the entire Russian air transport fleet. Surely it is of the interest of Russia to retire the limited number of An-2 still in active service and in the reserve as fast as possible, because the An-2 gives to the entire fleet an image of lower technological level and higher age than it really has.

    The Il-18/20/22 should be the next in line, but its replacement also depends of the speed in the development and production of the Il-214, and surely would be finished the next decade.

    Also I would expect the liquidation of the An-140, An-148 and the L-39, by the end of this decade by more political reasons.


    Last edited by eehnie on Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:18 am; edited 5 times in total

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  George1 on Fri Apr 15, 2016 4:55 pm

    Russia to develop new strategic extra heavy airlift aircraft — deputy minister

    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/defense/870020


    We started testing a modernized military transport aircraft Il-76MDM

    Подробнее на ТАСС:
    https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/3209099&usg=ALkJrhjxxRUm0dmHeHyJjXIrpz8G0Am9rA


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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Mon May 09, 2016 7:44 pm

    Aircraft Industries, the company that produces the Let L-410 filed for bankruptcy. Historically it was a Czech company recently controled by new Russian owners that wanted to traslate the production of this aircraft to Russia. The main reason for this bankruptcy seems to be the lack of orders for new aircrafts and monetary disadvantages caused by the depreciation of the ruble.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1889713.html

    It means very likely the end of the production of this veteran small aircraft (in production since 1970).

    Then to update some previous data:

    These would be the aircrafts and helicopters for non-combat roles that are in production and have been at least a relative success, or are in development and I expect a success (based mostly in the number of orders declared and other details). By weight class:

    An-124

    Il-96

    Il-76/78/A-50
    Il-62 (surely to be out of production fast)

    Tu-204/214
    Tu-154 (surely to be out of production fast)

    Il-214
    Su-Superjet100
    Mi-26

    An-72/74

    An-24/26/30/32

    Mi-38
    Mi-8/...
    Yak-130

    Ka-60/62

    Mi-Ansat
    Ka-226
    Yak-54/152

    Here is where the new orders should come from in the following years. It would be rare that Russia orders aircrafts out of this list until new successful aircrafts and helicopters appear. Between the models with a lack of relative success, today the Russian Armed Forces only has 8 An-148 (of the weight class of the An-72/74), and 9 An-140 (of the weight class of the An-24/26/30/32).

    To see where should be the firsts replacements in the Russian Armed Forces fleet, it is necessary to note that there is a good number of models that are out of production (not included in the previous list), but are still in active service in the Russian Armed Forces. It is likely that these models be replaced before. Following the same scheme by weight class, and including the year of end of production, we have:

    -

    Il-86/80 (1997)
    An-22 (1975)

    -

    -

    Tu-134 (1989)
    Il-18/20/22 (1985)
    An-10/12 (1972)

    -

    -

    -

    Let L-410 (2015)

    L-39 (1999)
    Mi-2 (1993)
    An-2 (1993)

    With some, very few, older aircraft still in the reserve.


    Last edited by eehnie on Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:48 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Post  d_taddei2 on Tue Jul 05, 2016 12:17 am

    i am pretty sure that (but could be wrong) that Russia and Ukraine have parted ways on the sale of anything and everything between the two countries. But i read somewhere that Russia in 2015 received 1x AN-140, and 2x An-148-100E now i know that the AN-148 is produced in Russia at the Voronezh Aircraft Production facility. But i would have thought all rights to build them would have be cancelled by Ukraine. Only thing i can think of is that they have allowed orders already placed to be completed, lets face it Ukraine needs all the money it can get and Russia doesnt want to have to drag Ukraine through a court in order to re-coup money already spent on the aircraft. Maybe someone can shed some light

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  franco on Tue Jul 05, 2016 2:20 am

    d_taddei2 wrote:i am pretty sure that (but could be wrong) that Russia and Ukraine have parted ways on the sale of anything and everything between the two countries. But i read somewhere that Russia in 2015 received 1x AN-140, and 2x An-148-100E now i know that the AN-148 is produced in Russia at the Voronezh Aircraft Production facility. But i would have thought all rights to build them would have be cancelled by Ukraine. Only thing i can think of is that they have allowed orders already placed to be completed, lets face it Ukraine needs all the money it can get and Russia doesnt want to have to drag Ukraine through a court in order to re-coup money already spent on the aircraft. Maybe someone can shed some light

    They were joint projects so Russia can keep producing just without parts from Ukraine. For this reason the An-140-100 contract will not be filled (received 10 of 14). The An-148 will be continued with Russian replacement parts.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  TheArmenian on Tue Jul 05, 2016 9:20 am

    The Ukrainians still supply the engines for the AN-148.
    They also still supply large amounts of engines for the Mi helicopters.

    Politicians talk tough...but business gets done.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  George1 on Tue Jul 05, 2016 12:55 pm

    Since we talk for transport aircrafts of RuAF i put the part for future programs below from Ilyushin annual report 2015

    In accordance with the product policy of JSC "UAC" the main activities of the Company in the coming years will be the implementation of programs to create new models of aircraft, maintaining the necessary level of airworthiness of aircraft fleet in service, fulfillment of contractual obligations to export deliveries.

    The priority programs include the following programs:

    ⦁ development and launch mass production of a new light military transport aircraft Il-112V;

    ⦁ completed GSE and ensuring mass production of a new version of heavy military transport aircraft Il-76MD-90A. Working on this basis of new types of aircraft in the special interest of the Russian Defense Ministry;

    ⦁ implementation of the program of modernization of aircraft Il-76MD and Il-78M of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation;

    ⦁ pre-production and serial modernization of aircraft Il-38 aircraft of the Russian Navy;

    ⦁ participate in the program Il-96-400M;

    ⦁ work to define shape and prepare for the design of a new medium transport aircraft;

    ⦁ work to define shape and prepare for the design of prospective aircraft PAK BTA;

    ⦁ modernization and maintenance of the production of long-range wide-body aircraft IL-96-300 CP (M), and ensure the operation of the Il-96-400T;

    ⦁ adjustment of the design documentation, support modernization, testing and certification work Il-96-400 V VIP aircraft;

    ⦁ start serial production of the aircraft IL-114-300;

    ⦁ work on import substitution program;

    ⦁ maintaining airworthiness of aircraft of military transport aircraft and special state customers of the Russian Federation and the aircraft, modernization of commercial aviation aircraft including foreign customers airplanes.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1999765.html

    So 2 questions:
    1. Ilyushin designs new medium aircraft? is this IL/HAL MTA or a new different project?
    2. Which is PAK-BTA? We knew till now just for PAK-TA



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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  wilhelm on Wed Jul 06, 2016 1:11 pm

    George, like others, I am obviously wary of translations and the fact that words or phrases sometimes lose their very accurate meaning or nuance from one language to another...but my take on it is:

    1. I think it is indeed what was previously called the UAC/HAL MTA that was Ilyushins Il-214. Maybe what they are saying is that now that HAL (apparently) is not involved, Ilyushin will define or refine it according to Ilyushins and the Russian Airforce's criteria as opposed to worrying what another airforce might like to be considered in the design. I think it was announced earlier this year that Russia will go it alone on this project. Not a bad idea, looking at some of the protracted Indian "procurement" processes recently, which seem to be a result of internal issues and different interests in India as opposed to anything else.

    2. I take this PAK TA to be whatever the original Il-106 has morphed into.
    The Il-112, Il-214, and Il-476 (or Il-76MD-90A or whatever) cover the categories of transporters carrying 60 tons and under. So these would replace the An-26/AN-12/ Il-76.
    But to replace cargo lifters capable of carrying over 60 tons/bulkier cargo, a new design is needed to replace the An-22 and eventually the An-124 heavy lifters. The handful of An-22's left are on the way out, and they announced a while ago that Aviastar will not produce An-124's, but would overhaul existing airframes. So at some stage, the AN-124 will also need to start being replaced.

    I think the original Il-106 programme is being used as a start point, but will obviously have to be redesigned to take into consideration the changing circumstances. It was originally envisaged to replace the An-22, and was designed in the 80 ton payload btacket. Recent statements seem to mention 80-100 tons, so I think they will be looking at a design that replaces both the An-22 and eventually the An-124.

    How they achieve this will be interesting.
    The original Il-106 cargo dimensions as released were 34m x 6m x 4.6m (LxWxH).
    The An-124 dimensions are 36m x 6.4m x 4.4m.
    So the two are close, not a million miles from each other.

    It is worth bearing in mind that the Il-106 cargobay dimensions, with the exception of length, are actually larger than the C-5 Galaxy.

    Obviously, the An-124 was a heavier, slightly larger aircraft with more powerful engines. This enabled it to carry heavier loads, or the same loads further.

    So a redesign taking into account that it is also the An-124 that will eventually need to be replaced would be handy. Just a small scaling/beefing up of it's size before the final design is frozen and the fitment of more powerful engines would be probably right. The originals of 18 000kg thrust NK-92 envisaged could be replaced with the announced PD-18R of 20 000kg for example.

    Of course, I could be wrong. They might go the whole hog and design something squarely in the An-124 class or bigger, with the 30 000-35 000kg PD-30, but I suspect not.


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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Thu Jul 07, 2016 11:13 pm

    George1 wrote:Since we talk for transport aircrafts of RuAF i put the part for future programs below from Ilyushin annual report 2015

    In accordance with the product policy of JSC "UAC" the main activities of the Company in the coming years will be the implementation of programs to create new models of aircraft, maintaining the necessary level of airworthiness of aircraft fleet in service, fulfillment of contractual obligations to export deliveries.

    The priority programs include the following programs:

    ⦁ development and launch mass production of a new light military transport aircraft Il-112V;

    ⦁ completed GSE and ensuring mass production of a new version of heavy military transport aircraft Il-76MD-90A. Working on this basis of new types of aircraft in the special interest of the Russian Defense Ministry;

    ⦁ implementation of the program of modernization of aircraft Il-76MD and Il-78M of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation;

    ⦁ pre-production and serial modernization of aircraft Il-38 aircraft of the Russian Navy;

    ⦁ participate in the program Il-96-400M;

    ⦁ work to define shape and prepare for the design of a new medium transport aircraft;

    ⦁ work to define shape and prepare for the design of prospective aircraft PAK BTA;

    ⦁ modernization and maintenance of the production of long-range wide-body aircraft IL-96-300 CP (M), and ensure the operation of the Il-96-400T;

    ⦁ adjustment of the design documentation, support modernization, testing and certification work Il-96-400 V VIP aircraft;

    ⦁ start serial production of the aircraft IL-114-300;

    ⦁ work on import substitution program;

    ⦁ maintaining airworthiness of aircraft of military transport aircraft and special state customers of the Russian Federation and the aircraft, modernization of commercial aviation aircraft including foreign customers airplanes.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1999765.html

    So 2 questions:
    1. Ilyushin designs new medium aircraft? is this IL/HAL MTA or a new different project?
    2. Which is PAK-BTA? We knew till now just for PAK-TA


    I think yes in both cases.

    About the first, medium transport aircraft is just the meaning of MTA. It is necessary to take into account that this report seems to be of 2015, and at the time it was a colaboration with India for this project.

    About the second, not an expert but I think the right traslation would be PAK-VTA, which is a designation that has been used before refered to the PAK-TA. Cyrilic B seems to be V in latin alphabets.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  Project Canada on Wed Aug 24, 2016 4:20 am



    New heavy freighter for VCS is built from innovative materials

    Promising military transport aircraft will be established on the basis of modern technical solutions, including extensive use of composite materials in the airframe, reports "Interfax" referring to the general director of OJSC "IL" Sergei Velmozhkina.

    According Velmozhkina, the company currently is developing a promising aviation complex of military transport aircraft (PAK BTA), with many of the technical solutions for the aircraft will be tested when you create WABT (medium military transport aircraft). In particular, the design will increase the percentage of composite materials.

    "Over these problems are working all over the world, as composites can reduce aircraft weight, improved aerodynamics and flight characteristics. Therefore, look for technical solutions and the use of the new materials " - Velmozhkin said.

    The main problem, according to chief designer of JSC "IL", at the moment is the lack of a suitable powerplant for the new aircraft. Great expectations Velmozhkin put on the new engine PD-23, on which are currently carried out development work.

    When the engine is started in the series, it will create a transport aircraft with a payload of 100 tonnes, which would replace "Ruslan" AN-124 troops.

    Earlier that Russian Defense Ministry plans to order new industry superheavy transport aircraft, said Deputy Defense Minister Yuri Borisov.

    http://tvzvezda.ru/news/opk/content/201608231250-xahn.htm

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  George1 on Fri Sep 23, 2016 9:00 am

    Russia may develop concept aircraft similar to Ukraine’s An-124 in next two years

    At present, Russian operators have difficulties maintaining the airworthiness of An-124-100 Ruslan aircraft

    GELENDZHIK, September 22. /TASS/. Russia may develop concept aircraft which is similar to An-124, super heavy transportation aircraft, in the next two years, Andrei Boginsky, Deputy Industry and Trade minister told reporters on the sideline of the Gidroaviasalon exhibition.

    More:
    http://tass.com/defense/901569


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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  KiloGolf on Fri Sep 23, 2016 10:40 am

    [quote="George1"]
    Russia may develop concept aircraft similar to Ukraine’s An-124 in next two years

    An-124 is far from being "Ukraine's" anything.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  GarryB on Fri Sep 23, 2016 11:03 am

    Yes... a Soviet aircraft for sure.


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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  Project Canada on Fri Sep 23, 2016 11:46 am


    Maybe a new aircraft will score better points on the aviation market, people generally think that newer is better

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  KiloGolf on Fri Sep 23, 2016 12:58 pm

    Russia needs to stop spending their money on Ukrainian jobs programs and wasteful military air transport projects. If they could focus on both the Il-476 and Il-112, in the sense of procuring decent numbers of both (>100) at a reasonable time frame (before 2025), things will be better for them.

    Instead the Russian military transport fleet, on all Arms, is a complete mess.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  GarryB on Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:35 am

    Russia needs to stop spending their money on Ukrainian jobs programs and wasteful military air transport projects.

    They are talking about developing a new family of transport aircraft that will likely replace the An-124, An-22, and An-225 in Russian service.

    That alone will add capability (they don't have an An-225 in service and the An-22s are at the end of their service lives) and allow them to fully update their transport inventory... as well as sell such aircraft on an international market that currently has the C-17 as its main option... which is far too expensive and not politically an option for the vast majority of former Soviet clients.

    There is a huge world wide market of ex Antonov transports including big and small aircraft that need replacing from a reliable supplier.

    This means the big and small range of transports will be catered for in Russian types that can be exported for money and for political favours... I am sure Fiji would love to be given an Il-476 for its transport needs that can be used to earn currency in the region as well as service the Fijian military and even operate with neighbours and allies.


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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  eehnie on Wed Oct 05, 2016 12:59 pm

    I would not rule out a transfer of the An-148/158/178, the An-140, and the L-410 to other governmental agencies, for their decommission as foreign vehicles. It would be a no cost solution. For the L-39 the solution seems to be the scrapping.

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    Re: Russian Transport Aircraft fleet

    Post  George1 on Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:15 am

    The first contract for the modernization of Il-76MD military transport aircraft to the level of IL-76MD-M

    According to the October 26, 2016 Department of Information and Mass Communications of the Russian Federation Ministry of Defence, the Ministry of Defence signed a state contract with the first production of "Aviation Complex named after SV Ilyushin "on the modernization of the Il-76MD military transport aircraft to the modification of the Il-76MD-M.

    In accordance with the terms of the contract three modernized Il-76MD-M will be transferred before the end of 2018 VCS Russian military transport aviation.

    Comment bmpd. Recall that in August 2013 the Ministry of Defense of Russia was awarded a contract with the State JSC "Aviation Complex. SV Ilyushin "(JSC" IL ") on the modernization of the Il-76MD military transport aircraft to the level of IL-76MD-M as a brain, as well as a similar modernization of tanker aircraft IL-78M. Work on the modernization of this contract Il-76MD (registration number RF-76746, serial number 0073479374, serial number 60-04) from the Russian VKS conducted on a technical basis JSC "IL" in Zhukovsky, with the end of 2014. The thus obtained sample of the parent IL-76MD-M made its first flight February 28, 2016.

    The modernized Il-76MD-M keeps old engines D-30KP, which are being finalized in order to prolong their life. Modernization works should bring onboard the aircraft equipment to the level of equipment newly built Il-76MD-90A. The total period of service aircraft shall be extended by 15 years. According to the requirements of the Ministry of Defence, the cost of upgrading the Il-76MD in the version of the Il-76MD-M should make only one third of the cost of the Il-76MD-90A new construction.

    Seryinye modernization work is expected to lead to the aircraft repair plant or technical air bases for military transport aircraft. Earlier it was reported that Russian Defense Ministry plans to upgrade 41 marching military transport aircraft Il-76MD to the level of IL-76MD-M.

    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2218665.html


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