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    Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

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    Viktor

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Viktor on Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:09 pm

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    mack8

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  mack8 on Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:11 pm

    I always found baffling that all these years India never purchased the S-300V or P series. I know there are rumours about them having S-200 and S-300, but as far as i know, this has never been confirmed, correct?
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:25 pm

    India seems to be building a solid air defense force, both ground and air.... The Akash SAM among others, and now possibly the S-400!
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    magnumcromagnon

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  magnumcromagnon on Thu Sep 04, 2014 3:26 am


    I think India should not only buy the systems, but also build the plants and be granted full transfer of technology with lincense production, as a show of mutual trust and respect among strategic partners!
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Thu Sep 04, 2014 3:37 am

    magnumcromagnon wrote:

    I think India should not only buy the systems, but also build the plants and be granted full transfer of technology with lincense production, as a show of mutual trust and respect among strategic partners!

    That would be great as well. Two strategic allies, two countries with strong air defense!

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    India buying new Submarines

    Post  par far on Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:31 pm

    Earlier this year the Indian Navy was planning on buying subs, has anything happened on this subject.


    http://www.defensenews.com/article/20140802/DEFREG03/308020016/Indian-Navy-Wants-Fast-Track-Purchase-Russian-Subs

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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:49 pm

    par far wrote:Earlier this year the Indian Navy was planning on buying subs, has anything happened on this subject.


    http://www.defensenews.com/article/20140802/DEFREG03/308020016/Indian-Navy-Wants-Fast-Track-Purchase-Russian-Subs

    Haven't heard much on the subject, but India is going to buy six French Scorpene class which might delay or even prevent the purchase. To be honest, I think it depends on this Scorpene deal and the performance of their Kilos in the future. - Their older Kilos and Type 209's may be replaced by Amurs. Their oldest 209's date back to 1986, and most of their Kilos date back to the late eighties/early nineties so they should be replaced sooner than later.

    IDB

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  IDB on Fri Oct 24, 2014 11:58 am

    I think this proposal could see some light in the next round of discussions when Putin visits India.
    Also the IN has recently ordered for 3 more Talwar class frigates which makes us believe that IN is not averse to looking at Russia for its sub-par fleet of conventional submarines and needs to prop up numbers as fast as possible.
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Fri Oct 24, 2014 10:38 pm

    IDB wrote:I think this proposal could see some light in the next round of discussions when Putin visits India.
    Also the IN has recently ordered for 3 more Talwar class frigates which makes us believe that IN is not averse to looking at Russia for its sub-par fleet of conventional submarines and needs to prop up numbers as fast as possible.
    True, but I'm concerned that the Scorpene-deal will dry up their funds for any more SSK's (for the short-term). 

    That deal does look good for RU/IN navy co-operation, but doesn't have much relevance to subs....

    IDB

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  IDB on Sat Oct 25, 2014 11:00 pm

    Indian navy which has been in dire need of new submarines has received a huge funding from Government of India . Government of India cleared projects worth 80,000 crores out of which 50,000 crores went to Navy.It also include plans to get 12 dornier surveillance planes .

    Government of India cleared plan to build 6 submarines in India at cost of approximately 50,000 crores. The submarines will be air independent propulsion (AIP) capable that will enable them to stay underwater for longer than a conventional submarine besides having enhanced stealth features.

    The Navy currently has 13 operational submarines and the target set in 1999 was to have 24 by 2030. Its also building 6 scorpene submarines with help of France and first submarine is expected to be in service by year 2016 .



    This is the latest news on this from our own webpage verified by reliable sources
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    RTN

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  RTN on Sun Oct 26, 2014 7:03 am

    IDB wrote:

    This is the latest news on this from our own webpage verified by reliable sources

    Which web page? As per the rules of this forum you must state the URL from which the information was copied.

    IDB

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  IDB on Sun Oct 26, 2014 12:37 pm

    RTN wrote:
    IDB wrote:

    This is the latest news on this from our own webpage verified by reliable sources

    Which web page? As per the rules of this forum you must state the URL from which the information was copied.


    Sir i am a new member not allowed to post links
    Secondly i would post secondary news links of the source when allowed as i wont like to be seen as soliciting or publicizing my own webpage on the RMF

    Alternatively you can look here :- Edited


    Last edited by IDB on Sun Oct 26, 2014 1:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    RTN

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  RTN on Sun Oct 26, 2014 12:46 pm

    IDB wrote:

    Sir i am a new member not allowed to post links
    Secondly i would post secondary news links of the source when allowed as i wont like to be seen as soliciting or publicizing my own webpage on the RMF

    Alternatively you can look here http://indiandefenceboard.com/news/made-india-push-india-build-6-submarines-india/

    I realize you are new. Going forward,just state the web page if you are unable to post a link.

    Also, as per the rules of this forum, please do not provide links of other Forums. Your own webpage as source/reference is perfect.

    IDB

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  IDB on Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:48 pm

    Submarines shortlisted under Project-75I are The Amur 1650 (Russia), Scorpene (France), Type 214 (Germany) and S-80 (Spain). While Mazagon Dockyard Ltd has been advocating building enlarged Scorpene since they have already picked up submarine building skills from the earlier project , but it is unlikely to happen due to steep rise in cost of Project and French in name of inflation have doubled Equipment cost from already contracted ones .

    Two Biggest Contenders fighting for Project-75I are Russia with Amur 1650 submarines and Germany with Class 214 submarine. Both countries have steeped up their back channel push for order and also are firing at all guns on diplomatic front too. Russia seems to be more desperate to bag the order and have been pushing hard for sale , Amur 1650 offered by Russia is dubbed has a modernised version of the Kilo-class submarine which can be equipped with air-independent propulsion (AIP), Amur boats are single-hulled, with minimal displacement allowing for reduced noise signature and improved propulsion quality has also is most effective modern non-nuclear submarine available today. Compared to similar boats in its class .on the downturn China might be first Export customer of Amur 1650 Submarines and Since China will also Built 2 in its Shipyards locally , Technology might be replicated for building newer diesel Submarines for china . India and china earlier too operated Kilo class submarines but now situation has clearly changed and Indian navy might be wary of operating a weapons systems which also will be used by Rival china

    http://idrw.org/?p=45865

    par far

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  par far on Mon Oct 27, 2014 11:00 pm

    http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:00 am

    par far wrote:http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
    That is money for producing the six Scorpene's, not for buying the new 75l. 

    My guess is that India will jump on board the Amur 1650 bandwagon... The Type 214 hasn't lived up to expectations, or so I've heard. Plus, with India buying the Scorpene's, they have a good reason to buy a sub from a non-NATO country. 

    I wonder what they are going to do with their Kilos... Some of them are rather new, and should be kept in service for another decade or so.
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    sepheronx

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  sepheronx on Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:03 am

    Mike E wrote:
    par far wrote:http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
    That is money for producing the six Scorpene's, not for buying the new 75l. 

    My guess is that India will jump on board the Amur 1650 bandwagon... The Type 214 hasn't lived up to expectations, or so I've heard. Plus, with India buying the Scorpene's, they have a good reason to buy a sub from a non-NATO country. 

    I wonder what they are going to do with their Kilos... Some of them are rather new, and should be kept in service for another decade or so.

    I agree with one concept from above poster, is that if China is gonna get them, India may not. But if the Scorpene's contract is anything like Rafale, then heck no.

    A Kilo class sub with AIP is far better IMO, as Kilo class subs have proven themselves quite well, and the improved Kilo's are rated one of the best. Adding in an AIP system would make it far better. Apparently Ruben is working on an AIP system that can be retrofitted to current Kilo class subs. That would be impressive really.
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:24 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    par far wrote:http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
    That is money for producing the six Scorpene's, not for buying the new 75l. 

    My guess is that India will jump on board the Amur 1650 bandwagon... The Type 214 hasn't lived up to expectations, or so I've heard. Plus, with India buying the Scorpene's, they have a good reason to buy a sub from a non-NATO country. 

    I wonder what they are going to do with their Kilos... Some of them are rather new, and should be kept in service for another decade or so.

    I agree with one concept from above poster, is that if China is gonna get them, India may not.  But if the Scorpene's contract is anything like Rafale, then heck no.

    A Kilo class sub with AIP is far better IMO, as Kilo class subs have proven themselves quite well, and the improved Kilo's are rated one of the best.  Adding in an AIP system would make it far better.  Apparently Ruben is working on an AIP system that can be retrofitted to current Kilo class subs.  That would be impressive really.
    That doesn't make much sense though... India and Chian routinely buy similar equipment from Russia, there is no reason why the Amur should be any different.

    Far better? Than the Amur? They are pretty similar... The Amur (and Lada for that matter) are an advanced upgrade over the already great 636. So getting the 636 with AIP would be like getting the Lada, but with no other upgrades that come with it... That being said, the 636 is a great sub (one of the very best SSK's) and the only thing it is missing is AIP. A retrofit or new model with AIP installed would be a great option, and combined with the Amur, India would have an effective, and affordable (by comparison to just the Amur) SSK force. The Amur and Lada have more than just an added AIP system, so you have to keep that in mind....

    par far

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  par far on Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:57 am

    India is looking to buy more Submarnies because they will be replacing, some of their older subs over the next 5-7 years. India will build/get Scorpene's and they will likely get the Amur 1650 or the Kilos. I thought India would go after the Sōryū-class submarines fron japan(those are the most advanced diesel subs(according to various websites). India is worried about chinese subs coming into the indian ocean and close to india and India is going the pacific ocean because they are getting oil and trade from Nigeria and other countries so they need subs to patrol the Indian Ocean and the pacific ocean.
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    sepheronx

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  sepheronx on Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:58 am

    Mike E wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    par far wrote:http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
    That is money for producing the six Scorpene's, not for buying the new 75l. 

    My guess is that India will jump on board the Amur 1650 bandwagon... The Type 214 hasn't lived up to expectations, or so I've heard. Plus, with India buying the Scorpene's, they have a good reason to buy a sub from a non-NATO country. 

    I wonder what they are going to do with their Kilos... Some of them are rather new, and should be kept in service for another decade or so.

    I agree with one concept from above poster, is that if China is gonna get them, India may not.  But if the Scorpene's contract is anything like Rafale, then heck no.

    A Kilo class sub with AIP is far better IMO, as Kilo class subs have proven themselves quite well, and the improved Kilo's are rated one of the best.  Adding in an AIP system would make it far better.  Apparently Ruben is working on an AIP system that can be retrofitted to current Kilo class subs.  That would be impressive really.
    That doesn't make much sense though... India and Chian routinely buy similar equipment from Russia, there is no reason why the Amur should be any different.

    Far better? Than the Amur? They are pretty similar... The Amur (and Lada for that matter) are an advanced upgrade over the already great 636. So getting the 636 with AIP would be like getting the Lada, but with no other upgrades that come with it... That being said, the 636 is a great sub (one of the very best SSK's) and the only thing it is missing is AIP. A retrofit or new model with AIP installed would be a great option, and combined with the Amur, India would have an effective, and affordable (by comparison to just the Amur) SSK force. The Amur and Lada have more than just an added AIP system, so you have to keep that in mind....

    Not even close to similar. Su-30MKI is not like Su-30MK2. Better look into it. I will help you though, first is the Radar.
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:30 am

    sepheronx wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    par far wrote:http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
    That is money for producing the six Scorpene's, not for buying the new 75l. 

    My guess is that India will jump on board the Amur 1650 bandwagon... The Type 214 hasn't lived up to expectations, or so I've heard. Plus, with India buying the Scorpene's, they have a good reason to buy a sub from a non-NATO country. 

    I wonder what they are going to do with their Kilos... Some of them are rather new, and should be kept in service for another decade or so.

    I agree with one concept from above poster, is that if China is gonna get them, India may not.  But if the Scorpene's contract is anything like Rafale, then heck no.

    A Kilo class sub with AIP is far better IMO, as Kilo class subs have proven themselves quite well, and the improved Kilo's are rated one of the best.  Adding in an AIP system would make it far better.  Apparently Ruben is working on an AIP system that can be retrofitted to current Kilo class subs.  That would be impressive really.
    That doesn't make much sense though... India and Chian routinely buy similar equipment from Russia, there is no reason why the Amur should be any different.

    Far better? Than the Amur? They are pretty similar... The Amur (and Lada for that matter) are an advanced upgrade over the already great 636. So getting the 636 with AIP would be like getting the Lada, but with no other upgrades that come with it... That being said, the 636 is a great sub (one of the very best SSK's) and the only thing it is missing is AIP. A retrofit or new model with AIP installed would be a great option, and combined with the Amur, India would have an effective, and affordable (by comparison to just the Amur) SSK force. The Amur and Lada have more than just an added AIP system, so you have to keep that in mind....

    Not even close to similar.  Su-30MKI is not like Su-30MK2.  Better look into it.  I will help you though, first is the Radar.
    They *are* similar, that doesn't mean they are the same... Plus, aircraft isn't the only example. Both countries use Kilos!
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    sepheronx

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  sepheronx on Tue Oct 28, 2014 2:40 am

    Mike E wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    sepheronx wrote:
    Mike E wrote:
    par far wrote:http://www.janes.com/article/45039/indian-mod-signs-off-on-usd13-bn-for-spike-submarine-icv-procurements

    This is saying that India has bought six subs(does not state what kind) and india has also bought Kh-35 missiles.
    That is money for producing the six Scorpene's, not for buying the new 75l. 

    My guess is that India will jump on board the Amur 1650 bandwagon... The Type 214 hasn't lived up to expectations, or so I've heard. Plus, with India buying the Scorpene's, they have a good reason to buy a sub from a non-NATO country. 

    I wonder what they are going to do with their Kilos... Some of them are rather new, and should be kept in service for another decade or so.

    I agree with one concept from above poster, is that if China is gonna get them, India may not.  But if the Scorpene's contract is anything like Rafale, then heck no.

    A Kilo class sub with AIP is far better IMO, as Kilo class subs have proven themselves quite well, and the improved Kilo's are rated one of the best.  Adding in an AIP system would make it far better.  Apparently Ruben is working on an AIP system that can be retrofitted to current Kilo class subs.  That would be impressive really.
    That doesn't make much sense though... India and Chian routinely buy similar equipment from Russia, there is no reason why the Amur should be any different.

    Far better? Than the Amur? They are pretty similar... The Amur (and Lada for that matter) are an advanced upgrade over the already great 636. So getting the 636 with AIP would be like getting the Lada, but with no other upgrades that come with it... That being said, the 636 is a great sub (one of the very best SSK's) and the only thing it is missing is AIP. A retrofit or new model with AIP installed would be a great option, and combined with the Amur, India would have an effective, and affordable (by comparison to just the Amur) SSK force. The Amur and Lada have more than just an added AIP system, so you have to keep that in mind....

    Not even close to similar.  Su-30MKI is not like Su-30MK2.  Better look into it.  I will help you though, first is the Radar.
    They *are* similar, that doesn't mean they are the same... Plus, aircraft isn't the only example. Both countries use Kilos!

    You are correct, they do both use Kilo's. But there may be alternative equipment onboard, making them effectively different. Su-30MKI is quite different than Su-30MK2 and other variants. Effectively, same body build, but different aircraft altogether. Hence besides maybe structual knowledge and its radar crossection (which may be also different depending if they added any RAM coating or radar absorbing paint), can be different or similar. All depends. That is why I love the Su-30 itself over any other aircraft, so many options making it a very modular aircraft.

    mutantsushi

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  mutantsushi on Wed Oct 29, 2014 5:57 am

    Is there a reason DCNS would not bid it's latest design?
    http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/release/3/158342/dcns-offers-new%2C-long_endurance-ssk-design.html
    Amur-1650 has not been produced either, so why stick with Scorpene?
    Navantia S-80 should be clearly upserior to scorpene.
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    Mike E

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    Re: Russia in Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  Mike E on Wed Oct 29, 2014 6:49 am

    mutantsushi wrote:Is there a reason DCNS would not bid it's latest design?
    http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/release/3/158342/dcns-offers-new%2C-long_endurance-ssk-design.html
    Amur-1650 has not been produced either, so why stick with Scorpene?
    Navantia S-80 should be clearly upserior to scorpene.
    That proposal is more of a concept than a production model, at least India knows the Amur will be produced...
    Why do you say that? Neither have been compared against each other, and the Scorpene is a very good sub in its own right.
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    George1

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    Indian Armed Forces Tenders:

    Post  George1 on Sat Jan 03, 2015 10:02 am

    India Requires Russia, S. Korea to Partner With Local Firms in Helo Contest

    NEW DELHI — India's Defence Ministry has decided that South Korea and Russia must partner with Indian firms in order to take part in its helicopter competition, despite offers of complete technology transfer, according to an MoD source.

    South Korea is offering its Surion light utility helicopter (LUH) and Russia its Ka-226 machine. Russian President Vladimir Putin made the offer during his Dec. 11 visit to India.

    "MoD's decision to buy LUH only through competition from domestic vendors is a virtual rejection of any government-to-government helicopter production deal between India and Russia," said defense analyst Nitin Mehta.

    The MoD source, however, said the decision not to enter a joint program with either South Korea or Russia is part of a policy to boost the domestic private sector defense industry, and that the MoD would like to see partnerships for weapons programs with overseas companies.

    After coming to power, the government of Prime Minister Narendra Modi canceled two global tenders for light utility helicopter purchases and approached the domestic companies to participate in the procurement of unspecified numbers of helicopters, either alone or in partnership with an overseas company.

    India needs 440 LUHs to replace its aging Cheetah and Chetak helicopters used for reconnaissance and logistics in the high altitude battlefields in the Himalayas.

    After the summit talks with Putin, Modi said in a statement: "I am pleased that Russia has offered to fully manufacture in India one of its most advanced helicopters. It includes the possibility of exports from India. It can be used for both military and civilian use. We will follow up on this quickly."

    South Korea has also offered India full tech transfer of the Surion helicopter, the MoD source said. A diplomat from the South Korean Embassy in New Delhi confirmed that a proposal was been made to India in December, but gave no details.

    In August, MoD canceled the 2012 tender for the purchase of 56 naval utility helicopters, in which Airbus Helicopters and AgustaWestland were in the race.

    In July, MoD canceled the 2008 global tender for the purchase of 197 light utility helicopters worth $1 billion, in which now Airbus Helicopters' AS550 was in competition with Russia's Ka-226T built by Kamov.

    India's helicopter requirement is expected to grow to 600. In addition, the MoD also plans to procure 90 multirole helicopters worth $2.5 billion through the "Buy and Make (India)" route.

    "Except for state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Limited [HAL], no private-sector defense major has ever produced a military helicopter," Mehta said. "But in the future, tie-ups are expected with overseas defense companies to tap the emerging helicopter market."

    US-based Sikorsky and Tata Group already have an agreement, and in October, Airbus Helicopters also announced a tie-up with the Tata to jointly produce Avro transport aircraft.

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