Walther von Oldenburg wrote: Vann7 wrote:
Without Romanov History and their achievements. .there will have never been a country called Russia
The "tsars" were absolute pricks. And I'm glad they get gunned down a pit. But Faberge and all that do say one thing about Russia. "If we want to do things YOUR way, we can do it better than all of you".
and not even this forums will exist discussing Russian military hardware.. instead the only forums about military will be discussing NATO hardware.
Ehm... how exactly? This can mean two things:
1. Without Romanovs there would be no one to seize power in the Grand Duchy of Moscow
2. Romanovs were so great that no one could have replaced them.
If the Grand Duchy oF Moscow had broken into several pieces, then it would've probably come under the control of Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth - and we would have a large Russia-like entity again - except that it would not be called Russia. In 17th century Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth already had Polish minority (40%) and if it annexed even more land, the percentage of Poles would drop to 15-20% - so Polish nobility would have to give heavy concessions to Russians/Ruthenians to keep power there.
We would probably witness the emergence of a mixed-Ruthenian-Polish culture, maybe even a mixed language.
Not really.. had there will be no Romanov.. Russia will be part of ottoman Empire ,or Mongols..
It was Russia who defeated Both. And then you have sweeden who wiped Poland too.. Polands effectively worked as a buffer zone to keep away strong powers busy. You have to remember that Ottoman Empire had not been stopped it will have taken control of all eastern Europe.. and controlled all the black sea. So there will have been NO Slavic unity.. as you claim.. Sweeden
was the dominant power in the north and Ottomans in the south. and both wanted to take control of Those slavic non united lands..
Poland was really weak.. it never had a chance to hold power anywhere against otoman or sweeden or German speaking nations or France. It was Romanov who defeated Napoleon who wiped Polish and everyone in Europe. then later German speaking nations wiped poland again..
simply not happening.. Had ROmanov not existed. .the territories of Russia will be all from mongols or Muslins from Turkey. and probably later conquered by Germany Nazis.. Romanov created the division lines of Russia and Soviets took advantage of that already setup powerful nation called RUssia and build from there. and Lets not forget that Great Britain and France had
good relations with ottomans Empire and made alliance with them before to fight Russia.
So Polish was toast.. it had no chance to ever become an serious Empire..with so much powerful enemies near.. Only Ottomans ,or Mongols ,or perhaps Sweeden could have a chance to conquer Russia adn hold it for centuries,but the Europeans were not really interested in muslin or budist territories..Sweeden had their eyes on Europe ,where the civilization was.. Russia was seen at those times as primitive nation with empty Icy lands. So leaving Ottomans as the most probable power to take control of Russia and in modern times probably China to push them back. in short Russia will not exist or anything remotely close to an European Nation with the technology they have ,had Romanov did not appeared to seek control of slavic tribes.
As they did with partial success.
in other words.. to take control of the Slavic divided tribes..
had to be done from the EAST.. with a Power with their rear flank secured .
Poland had nothing like that.. was surrounded in all sides by potential enemies.
And this was probably the most important feature of Russia ,that made it difficult to conquer..
that it had their far east secured with virtually no competition there. So it will have been
impossible for Poland to take control of Russia ,only arriving up to Moscow ,while at the same time having to cover their rear flank from Prusia ,France and ottoman Empire penetrating their territories. This is why every army that invaded Russia stop at Moscow.. Going beyond there
no army in the world have enough soldiers for that.. Romanov controlling Siberia and Far east.. secured Russia rear flank..allowing to fight any invader and have a mobile army that can retreat when needed. Poland -Lithuanians cannot retreat if invaded.