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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

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    Vann7
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Vann7 on Fri Jul 03, 2015 7:39 am


    New Protest at the american embassy in kiev..
    yankee go Home..




    More defections from Kiev.. is becoming more and more frequent.





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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Khepesh on Fri Jul 03, 2015 9:13 am

    Shirokino? never heard of such a place. Oh look, a cat on an aircraft wing, how cute, let's talk about that and never mention this imaginary so called "Shirokino" again

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  whir on Fri Jul 03, 2015 9:20 am

    Kyiv Post wrote:After a year of war against Ukraine, Russia is still the country’s leading trade partner
    June 26, 2015, 5:19 p.m. | Business — by Ilya Timtchenko, Olena Gordiienko

    Despite 16 months of war against Ukraine, Russia remains the country's single largest trading partner, with $3.4 billion exchanging hands in the first quarter of this year.

    Comprising 14 percent of Ukraine’s total foreign trade turnover, the bilateral trade figures signify the extent to which Ukraine’s Soviet-era industries of metals, machinery and locomotives are still tied to Russia’s. It also underscores the Ukrainian economy’s failure to diversify by improving quality standards to tap other markets, in particular, the European Union.

    The share of commerce with Russia, however, has declined by 13 percent since 2013 when it accounted for 27 percent of trade. Business with China and the EU has in turn increased.

    As a trading entity, the 28-member EU remains Ukraine’s largest trading partner with $9.3 billion in bilateral turnover in the first four months of 2015. Ukraine has somewhat benefited from a free trade deal with the EU that went into effect this year through import-free quotas on certain products. China is in third with $2.2 billion worth of business.

    Russia and Ukraine have stopped short of engaging in a full-blown trade war despite open military hostilities between the countries. Moscow though has banned many Ukrainian food products such as dairy and meat.

    "Despite the opened European Union market… Ukrainian producers still did not manage to reorient towards European and other foreign markets, so the Russian market stays as our main partner," Angela Bochi, senior economist at the International Center for Policy Studies, a Ukrainian think tank, said.

    The bulk of Ukrainian products fail to meet international quality and safety standards. Having lower standards, Russia does not mind the cheap prices of Ukrainian goods. This is one of the main reasons why Russia maintains a leading trade role with Ukraine, Bochi said. Continue reading.

    Ruptly TV wrote:Ukraine: Protesters call on US to "get out of Ukraine"

    EuroNews wrote:Saakashvili warns of Odessa region’s importance to Ukraine
    02/07 11:27 CET

    Mikheil Saakashvili was appointed governor of Ukraine’s Odessa* region in February, to fight corruption. The former Georgian president might even be considered for higher office. We talked to him in the major Black Sea port city.

    Sergio Cantone, euronews: “Many people in Ukraine are asking why did Saakashvili become the governor of Odessa when there are so many things to do against corruption in Kyiv?”

    Mikheil Saakashvili, Governor of Ukraine’s Odessa region: “Odessa is strategically amazingly important, both for Ukraine, but unfortunately also for the country that invaded Ukraine: Russia. And the problem here is that Putin’s vision of his project, ‘Novorossiya’, includes Odessa as his linchpin. So, first of all we need to safeguard and make sure that Odessa stands, that it doesn’t fall. Because if this region falls, then I think Ukraine will be in major trouble and the whole region might go, not only Ukraine but all the Black Sea, Caucasus and the others. That’s why we need to safeguard Odessa. And second: the way to safeguard is also to develop it. And so we need to do things here.”

    euronews: “There are two problems here. One is that there are a lot of pro-Russian people in this region, a huge number, and secondly a huge problem with corruption and with crime related to the sea port. What are your projects in order to crack down on these huge problems that sometimes, maybe, are also connected?”

    Saakashvili: “I don’t think that Odessa is by itself pro-Russian. I think what is true here is that they speak Russian, they have Russian cultural heritage. This is true, and this is not a weakness, this is a great strength. Odessa is a major international brand. It’s also a very important thing both for the Ukrainian and Russian cultures, their histories, and I think that’s something we should capitalize on.

    “Now, with regard to corruption, yes it’s a major issue. This very sea port, this customs [post] that is here, which makes one of the biggest ports on the Black Sea and basically the biggest of Ukraine. It is a major centre also for all kind of smuggling, trafficking; our estimate is that annually something between 500 million and one billion euros is being diverted from the state budget, that’s to say stolen by corrupt officials, by customs officers, by law enforcement, and of course it is also related to crime.”

    euronews: “It’s true that there are some oligarch regime people who are being fired. But it’s also true that, for instance, the former head of the SBU, of the Security Service of Ukraine, Valentyn Nalyvaichenko, was fired. Many Ukrainians didn’t understand why, because they think that he was doing quite a good job and they are afraid that he was fired for not clear reasons. Why?”

    Saakashvili: “Look, just before he was fired, Nalyvaichenko told me, ‘I am sending you an SBU group to reinforce you in fighting the corruption in the customs.’ I can tell you, I said, publicly, ‘I don’t want that group to come here’, because more SBU means more corruption; the problem is here, and it was a problem until now, that the main smuggling is not even done by the customs or by professional smugglers, it is done by the Ukrainian Security Service, it’s done by elements of the prosecutor’s office, it was traditionally done by the police. The whole drug trafficking of the city is controlled by the police. The problem is that law enforcement is not the solution. At this stage, law enforcement is a problem in itself.” Continue reading.

    Ren TV via Google Translate wrote:На Украине похищают вчерашних школьников и превращают в пушечное мясо
    In Ukraine, the former schoolchildren abducted and turned into cannon fodder
    9:48, 3 July 2015

    As the correspondent of REN TV, the young people being bullied, cheated, and some even kidnapped.

    In the Donbas is now account for almost 50 thousand Ukrainian military. But in Kiev believe that such amount is not enough. The country declared the sixth wave of mobilization. Those wishing to go to the front a little bit, so in the course are a variety of methods. Someone bullied, but someone did and kidnapped.

    Artem does not appear in the institute no longer spend the night in a hostel, do not go out without sunglasses - suddenly someone finds and "nastuchit"? And there is a reason to hide: from the university, where he studied Artem, the students began to disappear. Someone called the draft board for someone special came men in civilian clothes. Where they are taken - not known. Artem thinks the front. Fear of war is now controls all of his instincts.

    "I did not serve, I was not mentally prepared for this, not physically. Just get it, I'll be there as cannon fodder. I just killed. Send the actual death. Therefore, I think it's better to hide," - he said .

    The sixth wave of mobilization was much stronger than the previous ones. Ruthless commissar now need to scrape together the plan of those who for the past five times successfully avoided conscription. Moreover, "scrape", first of all, on the south-eastern regions of Ukraine. In the course are: deception, surveillance and threats. The young men of military age are literally missing out on the streets and pulled in an unknown direction. Continue reading.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:23 am

    Neutrality wrote:So the NAF pull out and VSU pull in and claim victory? I really fucking hope that this is some kind of a genius not-yet-clear-to-us plan because I don't fucking see how letting allow these shitlords position their artillery closer to other NAF held cities is a great idea. So if the report is true, where is the fucking OSCE with a condemnation already? Why are the other parties of the Normandy Four not talking about this shit? Jesus fucking Christ already, whole Europe is caught up with the Greek crisis, just use this opportunity to strike at these fucking disgrace of human beings AKA the Ukrainian army.
    Save your anger and accept the new rules of the game.

    The Kiev junta is allowed to do anything while the NAF is allowed to do nothing. Adherence of the Minsk agreement is only demanded from the NAF. Kiev is not bind by it.

    Both Russia and the West go by these rules now. Just stop rooting for the NAF because it will save you from the stress. It is stressful to root for a loser.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:30 am

    Erk wrote:
    Neutrality wrote:So the NAF pull out and VSU pull in and claim victory? I really fucking hope that this is some kind of a genius not-yet-clear-to-us plan because I don't fucking see how letting allow these shitlords position their artillery closer to other NAF held cities is a great idea. So if the report is true, where is the fucking OSCE with a condemnation already? Why are the other parties of the Normandy Four not talking about this shit? Jesus fucking Christ already, whole Europe is caught up with the Greek crisis, just use this opportunity to strike at these fucking disgrace of human beings AKA the Ukrainian army.

    I must admit, I don't understand the pull back strategy either. I know the NAF are stalling for time as much as they can to let Kiev drain it's funds on war, but giving up ground to them doesn't seem productive.

    You try to understand this in a wrong way. You still assume that the NAF fights this war to win. No, this is not the case anymore. The NAF is not fighting to win this war. The Kiev junta will win this war.

    The Minsk agreement was made for Russia to save the face while allowing the Kiev junta to win the war. Russia can always point out that the NAF is adhering the Minsk agreement and their enemy is not. So Russia can claim the moral highground while losing the war. We lost, but at least we did not break any agreements.

    Of course Russia could let the NAF beat Kiev if it wanted, but it is not in Russia's interest now. Novorossiya has become a burden for the Kremlin and it must be put down.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  JohninMK on Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:21 am

    KIEV (Sputnik) – Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko on Friday called on the international community to consider introducing another round of anti-Russia sanctions should the conflict in Ukraine’s southeast escalate, his press service said.

    The United States, the European Union and their allies imposed several rounds of sanctions against Russia, citing the Kremlin's alleged involvement in the Ukrainian crisis. Moscow has repeatedly denied the accusations as groundless.

    “We need an efficient and well-coordinated plan in case of breakdown of the Minsk agreements. I’m talking about a new round of [anti-Russia] sanctions,” Poroshenko said at a meeting with a US Congress delegation that is set to participate in the OSCE Parliamentary Assembly meeting in Helsinki on July 5-9.


    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150703/1024153947.html#ixzz3eooWK6z9

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  JohninMK on Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:29 am

    Very interesting move by Rada, clearly full of financially literate persons.

    KYIV, July 3 /Ukrinform/. Ukrainian MPs on the second attempt passed in the first reading bill No 1558-1 on restructuring of liabilities on loans in foreign currency. The bill was supported by 229 MPs. The bill provides for all banks to be obliged within a month to restructure the obligations under the credit agreement at the official NBU rate on the date of the loan agreement at the written request of the citizens of Ukraine who had outstanding obligations under the loan agreements in foreign currency.

    The National Bank of Ukraine has already made the statement, insisting to reject the bill. "The adoption of bill No 1558-1 will destroy financial and banking system as it provides for obliging the banks to convert all consumer loans in foreign currency at the exchange rate at the time of signing the contract (approximately UAH 5.05 / USD 1). It will pose a threat both for stability of the banking system and the well-being of all citizens," the NBU statement reads.

    In turn, Finance Minister of Ukraine Natalie Jaresko posted on her Facebook that “the losses to the Ukrainian banking system from the bill No 1558-1 on restructuring of liabilities on loans in foreign currency will make up UAH 95 billion.”

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  JohninMK on Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:32 am

    Thousands of Russian troops on the ground, now they are taking over the skies.

    KYIV, July 3 /Ukrinform/. Ukrainian military have reported an active use of reconnaissance drones by terrorists who are locating positions of Ukrainian troops near the villages of Novotoshkivka - Triokhizbenka and on the left side near Stanytsia Luhanska - Shchastia.

    Head of Information resistance group Dmytro Tymchuk wrote Friday in his Facebook. "It was established that a special unit of the Russian Armed Forces, transferred from the group of Russian troops in Abkhaz to Luhansk region, has been flying drones over these territories," says Tymchuk. According to him, the Russian unit periodically clarifies and adjusts information on the locations of Ukrainian troops along several sections of the "front line".

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Nikander on Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:56 am

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Erk wrote:
    Neutrality wrote:So the NAF pull out and VSU pull in and claim victory? I really fucking hope that this is some kind of a genius not-yet-clear-to-us plan because I don't fucking see how letting allow these shitlords position their artillery closer to other NAF held cities is a great idea. So if the report is true, where is the fucking OSCE with a condemnation already? Why are the other parties of the Normandy Four not talking about this shit? Jesus fucking Christ already, whole Europe is caught up with the Greek crisis, just use this opportunity to strike at these fucking disgrace of human beings AKA the Ukrainian army.

    I must admit, I don't understand the pull back strategy either. I know the NAF are stalling for time as much as they can to let Kiev drain it's funds on war, but giving up ground to them doesn't seem productive.

    You try to understand this in a wrong way. You still assume that the NAF fights this war to win. No, this is not the case anymore. The NAF is not fighting to win this war. The Kiev junta will win this war.

    The Minsk agreement was made for Russia to save the face while allowing the Kiev junta to win the war. Russia can always point out that the NAF is adhering the Minsk agreement and their enemy is not. So Russia can claim the moral highground while losing the war. We lost, but at least we did not break any agreements.

    Of course Russia could let the NAF beat Kiev if it wanted, but it is not in Russia's interest now. Novorossiya has become a burden for the Kremlin and it must be put down.

    No matter how much you want the Nazis to win it's not gonna happen.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:07 pm

    Nikander wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Erk wrote:
    Neutrality wrote:So the NAF pull out and VSU pull in and claim victory? I really fucking hope that this is some kind of a genius not-yet-clear-to-us plan because I don't fucking see how letting allow these shitlords position their artillery closer to other NAF held cities is a great idea. So if the report is true, where is the fucking OSCE with a condemnation already? Why are the other parties of the Normandy Four not talking about this shit? Jesus fucking Christ already, whole Europe is caught up with the Greek crisis, just use this opportunity to strike at these fucking disgrace of human beings AKA the Ukrainian army.

    I must admit, I don't understand the pull back strategy either. I know the NAF are stalling for time as much as they can to let Kiev drain it's funds on war, but giving up ground to them doesn't seem productive.

    You try to understand this in a wrong way. You still assume that the NAF fights this war to win. No, this is not the case anymore. The NAF is not fighting to win this war. The Kiev junta will win this war.

    The Minsk agreement was made for Russia to save the face while allowing the Kiev junta to win the war. Russia can always point out that the NAF is adhering the Minsk agreement and their enemy is not. So Russia can claim the moral highground while losing the war. We lost, but at least we did not break any agreements.

    Of course Russia could let the NAF beat Kiev if it wanted, but it is not in Russia's interest now. Novorossiya has become a burden for the Kremlin and it must be put down.

    No matter how much you want the Nazis to win it's not gonna happen.
    Does it sound like I want them to win?

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Neutrality on Fri Jul 03, 2015 12:50 pm

    [quote="Karl Haushofer"]
    Neutrality wrote:

    The Kiev junta is allowed to do anything while the NAF is allowed to do nothing. Adherence of the Minsk agreement is only demanded from the NAF. Kiev is not bind by it.

    Both Russia and the West go by these rules now. Just stop rooting for the NAF because it will save you from the stress. It is stressful to root for a loser.

    Oh stop the drama already Rolling Eyes

    The situation around Shirokino is unclear right now so it's best to hold off judgement until someone like Cassad comes with an "official" report on what's going on. Donbass is lost territory and even Poroshenko realizes that. Let's assume a highly unlikely scenario in which Kiev entirely retakes Donbass. Poroshenko will NEVER regain the sympathy of the people there. His "ATO" soldiers will have to watch themselves in 4 directions whereas right now they have to aim in one direction (towards NAF). You think insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan are very dangerous and organized? Watch what happens in Donbass. The entire territory will be a minefield figuratively speaking and it will drain Kiev's resources in a much faster pace. Soldiers will lose their shit and start committing war crimes and even if the OSCE and UN aren't Russia's best buddies, they won't ignore that.

    Poroshenko realizes all of the above (I hope he does) which is why he was trying to give away Donbass to Putin (rumours my ass).


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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Khepesh on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:01 pm

    Edit: Raccoons still live even tho had to move again


    Last edited by Khepesh on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:05 pm

    Neutrality wrote:
    The situation around Shirokino is unclear right now so it's best to hold off judgement until someone like Cassad comes with an "official" report on what's going on.
    The NAF does not claim to hold it anymore and apparently the UAF says that they hold it now. Is there still something unclear?


    Neutrality wrote:
    Donbass is lost territory and even Poroshenko realizes that.
    How is Donbass "lost territory" for Kiev when Kiev holds now about 60% of the territory of Donbass? Who is going to drive Kiev out of Mariupol, Slovyansk and Kramatorsk? Who is going to drive Kiev out of shelling distance of Donetsk and Gorlovka?

    You say that this will happen in the future but I fail to see why Kiev would do so. Nobody is going to force them to abandon their positions. The Kiev junta can stay in their positions and shell the NAF held Donbass indefinitely with their artillery and heavy mortars. And the NAF is likely to lose more ground as happened in Shirokino.

    What will happen is that the Kiev junta will continue their constant artillery bombardment of the NAF-held Donbass and step and step take more territories from the NAF.


    Neutrality wrote:
    Let's assume a highly unlikely scenario in which Kiev entirely retakes Donbass. Poroshenko will NEVER regain the sympathy of the people there. His "ATO" soldiers will have to watch themselves in 4 directions whereas right now they have to aim in one direction (towards NAF). You think insurgents in Iraq and Afghanistan are very dangerous and organized? Watch what happens in Donbass. The entire territory will be a minefield figuratively speaking and it will drain Kiev's resources in a much faster pace. Soldiers will lose their shit and start committing war crimes and even if the OSCE and UN aren't Russia's best buddies, they won't ignore that.  
    This is all wrong. If (and likely when) the military resistance of the NAF is broken down then it is all over. There will be no insurgency against the Kiev junta in Donbass. All the military personnel of the NAF will have to relocate to Russia or be captured and killed by the Kiev junta. Same with the political leadership of DPR and LPR. Those who remain in Donbass will have to remain loyal to the junta authories or be imprisoned or killed.

    So the situation will be similar to what it is currently in Sloviansk (where the armed rebellion first started). Now there is no armed insurgency in Sloviansk. There are no attacks against junta troops there. The Nazi volunteer battalions can terrorize the local population of Sloviansk with impunity and without resistance from the locals. The situation will be similar in Donetsk and Lugansk after they fall.

    And yes, the Kiev junta can commit any war crimes against the defeated Novorossiyans after the war is over without reaction from the Western countries or from OSCE. You clearly underestimate how cynical, cruel and evil the West it. The junta could slaughter the whole civilian population of Donbass without repercussions from the West, and Russia would instead be blamed and sanctioned for it.

    Most people in this board do not realize the true nature of the West. These people still have illusions that the West may have some dignity and morals in it. It does not! Remember this. It does not.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  JohninMK on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:16 pm

    The true nature of the West, do it and blame the other side, Lavrov agrees

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) – Ukrainian authorities are “torpedoing” the Minsk agreements on reconciliation, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said Friday. “There is a paradox in the fact that the more actively Kiev torpedoes the Minsk agreements, and they are torpedoing them actively, the more the Russian Federation is to blame,” Lavrov said during a joint press conference with Luxembourg Foreign Minister Jean Asselborn in Moscow.


    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150703/1024159965.html#ixzz3epGysWlV

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Neutrality on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:24 pm

    Yeah I get it already. Everything is lost, better pack in and go. All because of 1 single decision that you and I don't fully understand.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Flagship Victory on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:25 pm

    0 Maidan soldiers KIA 4 Maidan soldiers WIA yesterday.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Khepesh on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:25 pm

    Ukrops preparing pontoon bridge to cross the Donets and assault LNR, at a location not disclosed, according to statement by LNR deputy cheif of staff Polkovnik Igor Yashchenko. It is not the first time such a report has been issued, but this is the first time it has been mentioned for a long time. There is at least one location were it may be possible to snorkel, but I would not trust OPVT that has not been used for more than twenty years and been rotting. Well, let ukrops try, and then drown..... http://www.novorosinform.org/news/id/31806

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:26 pm

    JohninMK wrote:The true nature of the West, do it and blame the other side, Lavrov agrees

    MOSCOW (Sputnik) – Ukrainian authorities are “torpedoing” the Minsk agreements on reconciliation, Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said Friday. “There is a paradox in the fact that the more actively Kiev torpedoes the Minsk agreements, and they are torpedoing them actively, the more the Russian Federation is to blame,” Lavrov said during a joint press conference with Luxembourg Foreign Minister Jean Asselborn in Moscow.


    Read more: http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150703/1024159965.html#ixzz3epGysWlV
    I agree with Lavrov but the problem is that while Russia recognizes the Western hypocrisy (Kiev breaks the Minsk agreement and Russia gets the blame) Russia is not willing to support the NAF enough to truly punish the Kiev junta.

    No negotiations will end this war. No "cunning plans" will end this war. Only brute military force will end it. Either you smash the Kiev junta or let them take Donbass. There is no middle ground.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:28 pm

    Neutrality wrote:Yeah I get it already. Everything is lost, better pack in and go. All because of 1 single decision that you and I don't fully understand.
    Everything is not lost since the NAF still controls Donetsk and Lugansk, but the situation is getting worse for the NAF and better for the Kiev junta. This is the reality on the ground at the moment.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Flagship Victory on Fri Jul 03, 2015 1:31 pm

    Maidan sends to the US list of Russian generals who command NAF

    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine-abroad/zik-ukraine-sends-to-us-list-of-russian-generals-commanding-rebel-troops-392615.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Monarchist on Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:33 pm

    Anyone really interested in the current situation in Novorussia and without pro-Kremlin propaganda should read this guy:

    http://vk.com/juchkovsky

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Monarchist on Fri Jul 03, 2015 2:42 pm

    Neutrality wrote:Yeah I get it already. Everything is lost, better pack in and go. All because of 1 single decision that you and I don't fully understand.
    Everything he wrote is true. Some of us understand but the majority of you doesn't want to understand. You dont understand the true nature of those that hold the economic and political power in Russia. The so called russian elite is fanatically pro-western.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  flamming_python on Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:00 pm

    **yawn**

    Russia is helping the Ukraine dig its own grave. Nothing more.

    And the Ukrainian government will not survive another winter; there is economic collapse, increasing defection, larger and larger protests, and more volunteers are joining the NAF every day.

    Gimme a break with the doom and gloom stuff.
    If Shirokino was abandoned then there was a tactical or strategic reason for it.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  PapaDragon on Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:02 pm

    Monarchist wrote:

    “What would you be without a Tsar, O Russians?" - St. John of Kronstadt



    Tsar=Emperor

    Emperor=Member of  feudal nobility

    Feudal nobility=medieval oligarchs

    You do realise that the Tzar that you get off so hard on was just the biggest oligarch of it's time?

    And all this time I thought that you hated oligarchs... lol1  It turned out you are their biggest fan!

    Seriously, you give yourself right to tell people who are literally on the other end of the planet what to do and how to live their lives?
    You are a f**king disgrace, go f**k yourself.

    And that individual on your avatar was not biggest fan of monarchy  Razz

    Here, l updated your signature to a current day version:

    “What would you be without Oligarchs, O Russians?" - St. Papa of Dragon


    Monarchist
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    Posts : 196
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    Location : russiadefence.net

    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Monarchist on Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:07 pm

    PapaDragon wrote:
    Monarchist wrote:

    “What would you be without a Tsar, O Russians?" - St. John of Kronstadt



    Tsar=Emperor

    Emperor=Member of  feudal nobility

    Feudal nobility=medieval oligarchs

    You do realise that the Tzar that you get off so hard on was just the biggest oligarch of it's time?

    And all this time I thought that you hated oligarchs... lol1  It turned out you are their biggest fan!

    Seriously, you give yourself right to tell people who are literally on the other end of the planet what to do and how to live their lives?
    You are a f**king disgrace, go f**k yourself.

    And that individual on your avatar was not biggest fan of monarchy  Razz

    Here, l updated your signature to a current day version:

    “What would you be without Oligarchs, O Russians?" - St. Papa of Dragon

    Your frustrated reaction and words tells me I'm right.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Sponsored content Today at 11:33 am


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