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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

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    Cowboy's daughter
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    The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:33 pm

    Special update, inside the home of Anastasia Butorina, 16-year-old girl killed by Ukrainian shelling of Gorlovka -



    I couldn't keep from crying when I watched this, and think there's only so much grief the human heart can stand. Sad

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  JohninMK on Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:44 pm

    [quote="Cowboy's daughter"]
    Flagship Victory wrote:


    Maidan begins 6th wave of mobilization to fight insurgents.


    There isn't going to be anyone left to mobilize, unless they're counting on brainwashed kids who are barely old enough.
    Are they re-mobilising those who were released from the front in March?

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:47 pm

    God bless this man for standing up!

    The New York Times “basically rewrites whatever the Kiev authorities say”: Stephen F. Cohen on the U.S./Russia/Ukraine history the media won’t tell you
    There's an alternative story of Russian relations we're not hearing. Historian Stephen Cohen tells it here

    http://www.salon.com/2015/04/16/the_new_york_times_basically_rewrites_whatever_the_kiev_authorities_say_stephen_f_cohen_on_the_u_s_russiaukraine_history_the_media_wont_tell_you/

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Erk on Thu Jun 18, 2015 11:01 pm



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZaWtlgz3U2c

    Prof Stephen Cohen talking to RT about some of the politics behind the Ukraine crisis.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:24 am

    Second part to interview with Stephen F. Cohen

    “Architects of American policy towards Russia and Ukraine are destroying American national security”: Stephen F. Cohen on the truths U.S. media and politicians hide
    Myths of American nationalism busted as our interview with noted scholar concludes
    Patrick L. Smith

    http://www.salon.com/2015/04/23/architects_of_american_policy_towards_russia_and_ukraine_are_destroying_american_national_security_stephen_f_cohen_on_the_truths_u_s_media_and_politicians_hide/

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Flagship Victory on Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:25 am

    US congress blocks aid to Azov. Let's be honest, Azov is the most hardcore, the most effective unit of the Maidan army. Without Azov, Maidan army has only 30% combat capability.

    http://sputniknews.com/us/20150612/1023266493.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  franco on Fri Jun 19, 2015 12:54 am

    After reading the reports coming out of Donbas today, with the increased heavy fighting and casualties, that outright war again is not too far away in the future.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Ivan the Colorado on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:05 am

    JohninMK wrote:
    Ivan the Colorado wrote:
    auslander wrote:
    Cyberspec wrote:
    JohninMK wrote:
    Cyberspec wrote:DNR will attack if Ukraine attacks Transnistria

    In the case of aggravation of the situation in Transnistria DNR army will be ready to support the forces of the Pridnestrovian Moldavian Republic. This was announced to reporters in Donetsk by the Foreign Minister Alexander Kofman. Aggravation of the situation, in his opinion, is inevitable (due to the appointment of Sakashvilli as Odesa governor)

    Nothing like a bit of moral support. Goodness knows how they could provide physical help, even the Russians are going to have a problem.

    By launching an offensive and forcing a 2 front war on Ukr

    D Day was the third front. From summer 1941 Germany was in a two front war, East Front and South Front.
    Technically yes, but nothing really happened on the southern front. Nowadays we have Krim as well, it will become a three front war for Ukraine. Maybe even a forth front will occur if Russian troops based in Belarus will respond. So Russia has Ukraine enclosed in what could potentially be the biggest cauldron yet.
    Leaving Yugoslavia to one side, I don't think that the thousands of Allied/German/Italian soldiers fighting some nasty actions in Italy in early 1944 would have regarded the South Front as a technicality. Not huge numbers like the Eastern front but a lot of high quality German troops were tied up there.

    Russia is highly unlikely to launch any offensive, other than the remote possibly of Donbas. Any fighting in Transnistira would have to be started by Kiev initiating its own second front, against the UN supported Russian peacekeepers. As Russia wants Crimea to become theirs in the eyes of the International community hostile action in any direction is very unlikely and an attack out of Belarus would be WW3.

    Ironically the more noise and actions that the US makes and takes in EE the more likely it is that Russia will act as they will see that they have less and less to lose by acting. But then this is probably all part of the deep US plan.
    That is fair, however the allies did not advance further than the Alps. The Southern Front was to take Italy out of the war and pin Germany, not for advancing into the heart of the Reich. Besides, despite the bloodshed that occurred at the Southern Front and the insurgency in the Balkans, their effect on the war is almost universally considered minimal because of the enormity of the action occuring on the Eastern front and much later on the Western front.

    If there were to be an attack on Russian land (defacto and dejure), citizens, or soldiers, Russia would have to respond, despite what the international community thinks. Of course, I would expect Russia to try and counter any attack by letting the Rebels launch a brutal attack to catch the Ukrainians off-guard just like what probably happened a few weeks ago.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:06 am

    Unique church shelled, burnt to ashes in E. Ukraine

    http://rt.com/news/179068-church-shelling-ukraine-destroyed/#.VYNC0_US3nI.facebook


    I wonder if this is true? I'll see if I can find anything else about it....

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    Nalivaychenko’s people primarily volonteer Battⁿs Aydar, Tornado, Donbass, Kiev, Azov regt, have begun advancing at speed on Kiev

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:10 am

    Flagship Victory wrote:US congress blocks aid to Azov. Let's be honest, Azov is the most hardcore, the most effective unit of the Maidan army. Without Azov, Maidan army has only 30% combat capability.

    http://sputniknews.com/us/20150612/1023266493.html

    Thank God, maybe somebody will come to their senses, or stop being cowards and there will be a policy change in the USA, or with some politicians.


    Okay, google translate:

    Source: Regiment "Azov" battalions "Tornado" and "Aydar" go to Kiev. APU is trying to block the fellow Nalyvaychenko 06.18.2015 7:50 naliv According to our source in Kiev, today's resignation from the post of head of Nalyvaychenko SBU took place suddenly for him because the CIA spy chief in the Ukraine did not believe that Poroshenko dare to go to the end. Apparently, Poroshenko able to prove their overseas supervisors that he is in charge Malchish-bad guy, and Nalyvaychenko with his Nazi battalions no longer needed - got the power of the pro-American junta, and can leave. However, most such Nalyvaychenko change of scenery did not like, so, according to the source, its people on the ground - especially volunteer battalions Aydar, Tornado, Donbass, Kiev regiment "Azov", began hastily advancing in Kiev. Just Nalyvaychenko can rely on the structure of the SBU across the country that simply is filled with last year's appointees from the right sector, Liberty and other pro-Nazi-minded parties and organizations. All these people have absolutely nothing to lose - because yesterday and today they have shown that they are waiting for. After the US Congress has expressed displeasure at the fact of the existence of a large number of armed Ukrainian Nazis ("disgusting Azov Regiment"), Poroshenko and Avakov begun to take branding moves - in particular the arrest of the battalion leadership Tornado (Hero turned sadists, what a discovery), the publication of data on the murder Olesya Elderberry - it also turns out to be killed by the Nazis, and now, the resignation of the chief curator of the Nazis in Ukraine Nalyvaychenko. That night, in the Ukraine may start Nazi coup - or a revolution, as it will. From other sources we know that in Mariupol and the surrounding area there is a battle with heavy weapons - perhaps this regiment Azov makes its way to Kiev. Details we will have a couple of hours. Also reported that the battalion Tornado blocked APU at its base in Lisichansk. This will be a sleepless night, a fact. wrote:

    http://jpgazeta.ru/istochnik-polk-azov-batalonyi-tornado-i-aydar-idut-na-kiev-vsu-pyitaetsya-blokirovat-soratnikov-nalivaychenko/

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:19 am

    Wow, look at this! 2 videos and a photo:

    video: Anti-war march in central Kiev for resignation of Poroshenko and Yatsenyuk 06/17/2015
    video: Anti-war rally near US Embassy, posters USA = WAR, people shouting "Yankee Go Home" 06/17/2015

    photo: Near administration of Poroshenko, "president" is afraid





    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=151_1434579171

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:43 am




    So what are the facts? What is really going on??


    SBU Chief Fired After Flap With Poroshenko


    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/sbu-chief-fired-after-flap-with-poroshenko-391460.html

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jun 19, 2015 1:45 am

    JohninMK wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:
    Flagship Victory wrote:


    Maidan begins 6th wave of mobilization to fight insurgents.


    There isn't going to be anyone left to mobilize, unless they're counting on brainwashed kids who are barely old enough.
    Are they re-mobilising those who were released from the front in March?

    Maybe, I don't know...

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Mr.Comrade on Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:39 am

    Cowboy's daughter wrote:Wow, look at this! 2 videos and a photo:

    video: Anti-war march in central Kiev for resignation of Poroshenko and Yatsenyuk 06/17/2015
    video: Anti-war rally near US Embassy, posters USA = WAR, people shouting "Yankee Go Home" 06/17/2015

    photo: Near administration of Poroshenko, "president" is afraid






    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=151_1434579171

    This video shows just how fearful Ukrainians are protesting against their government. If you pay attention, most of the protestors hide their faces when they get near the camera. I could only imagine how many Ukrainians simpathize with the march, but are too afraid to join in

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Ivan the Colorado on Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:48 am

    Mr.Comrade wrote:
    Cowboy's daughter wrote:Wow, look at this! 2 videos and a photo:

    video: Anti-war march in central Kiev for resignation of Poroshenko and Yatsenyuk 06/17/2015
    video: Anti-war rally near US Embassy, posters USA = WAR, people shouting "Yankee Go Home" 06/17/2015

    photo: Near administration of Poroshenko, "president" is afraid




    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=151_1434579171

    This video shows just how fearful Ukrainians are protesting against their government. If you pay attention, most of the protestors hide their faces when they get near the camera. I could only imagine how many Ukrainians simpathize with the march, but are too afraid to join in
    Excellent point, with opressive and Russia-loving Yanukovich they didn't have to hide their faces, but under Poroshenko's democratic government they do.


    Last edited by Ivan the Colorado on Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:49 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Spalling)

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Vann7 on Fri Jun 19, 2015 7:16 am

    There is a major storm on social networks created by the Russophobic pro NAZI
    media VICE..  after he focused in 1 soldier that supposedly is from Russian Army ,
    that posted a selfie in Ukraine..  The investigation of VICE leads to the house of RUssian
    soldier and In the end he denied to ever leaving Russia.. or being the man in the photo..
    Which totally shokes the whole investigation... All VICE evidence of "Russian invasion" is
    based in 1 photo of 1 soldier that was in Ukraine and posted a selfie in Facebook ..

    If you look at chinese they all look identical.. but yet Simone from Vice believe he is
    the man that was in Ukraine..  and even if that was the man.. does not proof he was
    in active service.. at all.. People never update regularly their current Job in social networks
    if they got unemployed. anyway here is the report..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zssIFN2mso

    Is a nice attempt but a weak report indeed.. while at the same time clever..
    because try to make a storm for 1 picture of 1 soldier that apparently was in Ukraine.
    The funny part of the video was when the video try to portray Russian army/DOnetsk as people
    who drink Vodka and steal money from local citizens.. lol1

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Rodinazombie on Fri Jun 19, 2015 8:43 am

    Is it that clown ostrovski by any chance?

    The guy has no credibility, he has been trying to pin everything on russia right since the start of his oh so wittily titled 'russian roulette'  videos.

    Anyone remember the incident in the first week or so of war last year where some ukies were ambushed outside slavyansk/kramatorsk and he did a report on it, standing at the scene of the ambush stating 'im sure that russian special forces did this'?

    He is pure propaganda, nothing more, nothing less. His videos are excellently shot but ive not bothered watching them since last year due to the propaganda in them.

    Vice are supposedly known for their independency, their ability to get into the nitty gritty places where noone else would dare to go. Dont you think about a violent coup that overthrows its democratically elected leader that then goes off to suppress all opposition using genuine ne-nazis, that imprisons thousands of innocents, kills thousands of civilians and is happy  murdering opposition leaders and journalists would be a decent story?

    It certainly sounds like a good story to me. Any decent journalist would pick up on this rather than try to play the russia bs card 24/7.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  higurashihougi on Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:36 am

    If Maidan facists really want to eradicate all Soviet legacy, they will have aaaaaa looooot of thing to do


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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  whir on Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:49 am

    El Pais via Google Translate wrote:El veto entre UE y Rusia amenaza dos millones de empleos, según un estudio
    The EU and Russia veto threat from two million jobs, according to a study
    LENA 18 JUN 2015 - 21:38 CET

    The European Commission believes, however, that the effect is "reduced" and "manageable"

    The EU embargoes imposed on Russia by the conflict with Ukraine have had little success in goods paralyze politicians and oligarchs of the country. However, the subsequent exchange of penalties between the two powers threatens more than two million jobs and around 100,000 million euros in value added in Europe. That's the conclusion of the Austrian Institute of Economic Research (WIFO), according to a study conducted exclusively for the Alliance of leading newspapers in Europe (LENA).

    The experts assume the most adverse scenario: "The fall in exports last fall that we considered the worst case scenario has come true," says Oliver Fritz, one of three authors of the analysis. He adds that perhaps could lessen the effects if companies can not sell to Russia from exporting more to other countries, something that seems that there are indications in agricultural products.

    On Wednesday, the Permanent Representatives to the EU agreed that European economic sanctions against Russia were to be extended until the end of January 2016. The Foreign Affairs Council should adopt a formal decision on Monday. And this Friday is expected to Russian President Vladimir Putin , who participates in the International Economic Forum in St. Petersburg, may also make reference to the vetoes. According to WIFO calculations, in Germany, the country most affected by the crisis with Russia, are at stake almost half a million jobs and 27,000 million euros in added value. Italy lost more than 200,000 jobs. And in Spain, if the worst adverse scenarios were met, 160,000 jobs could be impacted the Russian ban on imports, as the Eurasian country prevents imports of fresh produce to the country.

    The study's findings differ from those of last confidential report by the European Commission on the penalties to which they have had access correspondents in Brussels COUNTRY and Die Welt. The Commission concludes that the measures will have little impact on the European economy and not will affect the majority of exports, as only has banned the sale of certain military equipment and goods. It states that the effects on the European economy are "relatively small" and "manageable".

    In late May, the Commission was confident that even negative results that had the sanctions could continue to decline. -that The short term ie in 2015 he believed that the adverse consequences of retaliation behave a decline of just 0.25% of EU GDP.

    Carlo Bonini, Jörg Eigendorf, Nicola Lombardozzi, Andreas Maisch, Andre Tauber, Claudi Pérez, Mario Stäuble, Melett Jenner, Eduard Steiner, Pierre-Alexandre and Cristina Delgado Sallier.

    This information is Partnership Initiatives Newspaper Leaders in Europe (LENA). Die Welt part, La Repubblica, Le Figaro, Le Soir, Tages-Anzeiger, Tribune de Geneve and the country. Continue reading.

    El Pais via Google Translate wrote:Cosechas vetadas por el pulso ruso
    Crops vetoed by the Russian pulse
    CRISTINA DELGADO Madrid 18 JUN 2015 - 21:39 CET

    Spain's agriculture is still suffering the blow of Moscow to ban import fresh produce from EU countries

    "Never would I have imagined that a high-flying political conflict between Obama, Merkel and Putin ended up ruining many in this town," laments Vicente Lopez. Has with his brother and a production of fruit in Almunia de Doña Godina, a municipality of 7,800 inhabitants near Zaragoza partner. The veto that the Kremlin imposed in August 2014 on imports of fresh -in response to European products the first EU sanctions adopted against Russia for its role in Ukraine - has been on the ropes many Spanish farmers who have been forced to find alternative buyers for their crops at lower prices before the oversupply of fruit and vegetables .

    "Last year my business had losses. And I have many acquaintances who are broke and about to sell the land, "Lopez explains. His farm has 170 hectares of leaving 3.5 million kilos of fruit per year. Peaches, nectarines, Paraguayan, cherries, apples ... It also has a store where negotiates exports. And, as in the whole area, about 30% of sales are made in Russia. He says that for the harvest this year has found alternative buyers. New markets in Latin America, in addition to Italy, the UK, France or the Spanish market. But the EU is absorbing a lot of fruit that used to buy Russia, for example in Poland, which has sunk the price of many products.

    Brussels estimated that losses to Spain by the veto would be about 338 million euros in the first year . And it is not known whether there will be a long-term effect in the field amid falling prices. Both the Spanish government and the European Union boosted aid to calm the agricultural sector. They subsidized the removal of part of the products affected by the ban (to avoid oversupply) and to find new markets of sale. Minister of Agriculture, Food and Environment, Isabel García Tejerina, recalled that Spain was "the country most benefited" by European aid, receiving 30 million euros for fruit and vegetables.

    The agricultural unions, however, state that the aid did not reach all farmers, because the restrained bureaucracy. "This year found new buyers for the production going to Russia, but sales prices are low. Many production sold a cheaper 50% last year, below the cost of production, "said Andres Gongora, of COAG.

    Pressure from Spain

    Although Spain is not the country hardest hit by the vetoes between Russia and the US, Spanish Foreign Minister Jose Manuel Garcia-Margallo, it is one of the politicians who has meant more to the tightening of economic sanctions. On a visit to Moscow in March, Garcia-Margallo said that the adoption of new restrictive measures would have a "very severe cost to everyone" and said that the European Union has taken to date losses of 21,000 million euros .

    Why Spain tops the pressure to soften the vetoes? "Trade relations are fluid, but not strategic. But Spain has traditionally had a very comprehensive position with Moscow. There have always been sympathy between the pro-establishment of the two countries now is a more complicated situation, because Spain must show its support for the positions of the European Union, even if they are hard, "said Nicolas de Pedro, principal investigator of the think tank CIDOB. This expert notes that European sanctions were extended, perhaps in the medium term some oil companies as Repsol or other infrastructure could also suffer losses. "Even so Spain should support the position taken by the European Union. If there is a real drive, you must prove it "believes.

    Also tourism, the great Spanish economic engine, it being affected by difficult relations with the Eurasian country. Its unstable economy has led to a devaluation of the ruble that has alienated many of the Spanish coast . Between January and April 2015 161 813 Russian tourists visited Spain, almost 30% less than a year earlier. In addition, plans to arrive a day to remove the visa between Russia and the EU, which would have driven travel, they have been left in a drawer. At least, for now. Continue reading.

    El Pais via Google Translate wrote:Los rusos sancionados por la UE no han visto sus bienes afectados
    Russian sanctioned by the EU have not seen their property affected
    LENA 18 JUN 2015 - 21:40 CET

    The properties of most of the 150 included in the European list remain intact

    The European Union has included 150 people on its blacklist of sanctions on Russia over the conflict in Ukraine since March 2014. What is the balance? Almost none of the 150 Russians and Ukrainians among whom are men of the highest trust Putin, from Alexander Bortnikov, head of the secret services, Vyachislav Volodin, deputy head of the presidential administration, appears to have been actually affected, and properties of most of them, if they have any in EU territory, remain hidden and intact.

    The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Cyprus responds in writing that have been frozen less than 120,000 euros in assets. For its part, the Central Bank of Ireland "is not aware" of the garnishee. Also from Finland comes a "no frozen assets." The same can be said for Croatia, Malta, Slovenia, Slovakia and Spain. "We do not consist embargoes in any sector," they respond sources Spanish Ministries of Economy and Foreign Affairs. Beside her, the response of the German Economy Ministry sounds like a success: 124 346 euros have been retained ... and two horses.

    The two horses, Zazou and Drashing Home, officially belonging to Ramzan Kadyrov, the president of the Russian republic of Chechnya. And listed in the Directory Thoroughbred Breeding and Racing. In any case, there is a however, insists the German ministry. The horses only been "frozen in respect of financial resources in accordance with the decree," reports written a spokesman. "Which means that you can no longer use or sell for profit," they add.

    In the Czech Republic was similar success. There also was a single victim of sanctions: Kadyrov and his horses. But the Chechen robust get over it. The golden age of his magnificent horse Zazou is history, and in 2014 raised only Kadyrov 17,000 euros in prize money, while in the previous five years, the horse had won almost 1.2 million euros.

    The other 149 Russians and Ukrainians could contemplate even lighter penalties because, in general, European authorities appear to have taken special pains to find the money, the homes and cars of sanctioned.

    No specific data

    Judging by the meager balance, not surprisingly, on the European side and not want to record the failure. In the Commission or the Council of Europe, there is not one centralized database on the concrete consequences of embargoes. Despite repeated requests to them, no one was able to quantify the total sum of money, property and assets frozen. "The application of sanctions for the Member States", reported a spokeswoman.

    Italy is an exception. On a cool September morning last year, the Italian Finance Guard proceeded against Russian billionaire Arkady Rotenberg so consistent that so far has no equal in Europe, the case of Russia: a luxury hotel in Rome, an apartment Tarquinia, a villa in Villasimius, two floors in the Emerald Coast. Officials of the Guardia di Finanza, the Italian police economic crimes, were all perfectly cooked. Within minutes, they robbed one of the trusted men of Putin's control over properties worth around 30 million euros.

    And while, in general, the consequences for Russian politicians and oligarchs are insignificant, another part of the Directive 269/2014 regulating embargoes, it is taking more dramatic effects, not only for Russia but also for most the 28 EU countries. After the seizure, the EU also established bans on the export of arms to the country, civilian and military use and sale of key sensitive sectors, including energy technologies. In response, Russia banned imports of fresh produce. And these measures have indeed had various economic effects on the EU.

    Carlo Bonini, Jörg Eigendorf, Nicola Lombardozzi, Andreas Maisch, Andre Tauber, Claudi Pérez, Mario Stäuble, Melett Jenner, Eduard Steiner, Pierre-Alexandre and Cristina Delgado Sallier.

    This information is Partnership Initiatives Newspaper Leaders in Europe (LENA). Die Welt part, La Repubblica, Le Figaro, Le Soir, Tages-Anzeiger, Tribune de Geneve and the country. Continue reading.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Werewolf on Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:21 am

    higurashihougi wrote:If Maidan facists really want to eradicate all Soviet legacy, they will have aaaaaa looooot of thing to do


    So the rada proofs itself that Ukrainian names, culture and history was invented, while they depict themselfs as Cossacks, with cossack haircut, traditions and culture which is just another tribe. I say it again for those who do not understand russian language. Ukrainian is a human that lifes At the border, meaning all ukrainians are russians since the existence and appereance of Kievan Rus and even thousands of years before that they were always the same people. Divide et impera that is the point behind Poles believing they are not slavic, why Russians that we call today Ukrainians were made hostile to their own kind and why rest of slavic nations are indoctrinated to be russophobic to distance themselfs from russians and to believe the West holds them in any good association or light.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:46 am

    Werewolf wrote:why Russians that we call today Ukrainians were made hostile to their own kind and why rest of slavic nations are indoctrinated to be russophobic to distance themselfs from russians and to believe the West holds them in any good association or light.

    The problem is that Slavs hate each other. Serbs and Croats hate each other. Russians and Ukrainians hate each other. Russians and Poles hate each other. Etc. This hatred leads to wars and lack of economic integration. It is also easy to exploit from outside, as the West does.

    Slavs will remain backwards compared to the West as long as this hatred exists.

    higurashihougi
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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  higurashihougi on Fri Jun 19, 2015 10:52 am

    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:why Russians that we call today Ukrainians were made hostile to their own kind and why rest of slavic nations are indoctrinated to be russophobic to distance themselfs from russians and to believe the West holds them in any good association or light.

    The problem is that Slavs hate each other. Serbs and Croats hate each other. Russians and Ukrainians hate each other. Russians and Poles hate each other. Etc. This hatred leads to wars and lack of economic integration. It is also easy to exploit from outside, as the West does.

    Slavs will remain backwards compared to the West as long as this hatred exists.

    Russland Slavs and Bohemian Slavs are not backward. Although I understand what you are trying to say.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jun 19, 2015 11:11 am

    higurashihougi wrote:
    Karl Haushofer wrote:
    Werewolf wrote:why Russians that we call today Ukrainians were made hostile to their own kind and why rest of slavic nations are indoctrinated to be russophobic to distance themselfs from russians and to believe the West holds them in any good association or light.

    The problem is that Slavs hate each other. Serbs and Croats hate each other. Russians and Ukrainians hate each other. Russians and Poles hate each other. Etc. This hatred leads to wars and lack of economic integration. It is also easy to exploit from outside, as the West does.

    Slavs will remain backwards compared to the West as long as this hatred exists.

    Russland Slavs and Bohemian Slavs are not backward. Although I understand what you are trying to say.

    They are "backward" in a way that they cannot cooperate and unite but instead fight and let themselves be ruled from outside. They also consider themselves inferior to westerners (there is a huge Polish/Ukrainian/etc. immigration to western countries for a "better life").

    If Russia, Ukraine and Poland could somehow put their old rivalries and hatred aside and cooperate it would be huge. Germans, French and British did the same despite fighting countless wars against each other.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  Karl Haushofer on Fri Jun 19, 2015 11:16 am

    For me the whole "Euromaidan" was a big testimony for this inferiority complex.

    We want to be Europeans/westerners now!

    We want to destroy everything "Russian" among us!

    We must kill those Donbass subhumans because they don't share our dreams!

    And this in a country that is a shithole even compared to Poland and Russia. The fools think that the westerners will accept them as equals and among them. When a westerner sees an Ukrainian he sees a cannon fodder, nothing else.

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    Re: The Situation in the Ukraine. #16

    Post  whir on Fri Jun 19, 2015 11:41 am

    Aljazeera wrote:Foreign students face uncertain future in east Ukraine
    Tamila Varshalomidze | 18 Jun 2015 10:07 GMT

    Those studying medicine in rebel-held Donetsk now risk being left without internationally recognised degrees.

    Donetsk, Ukraine - One of the most prestigious medical schools in the country has seen a mass exodus after pro-Russian rebels seized control of the area, and many foreign students now fear their degrees won't be recognised internationally.

    "We had up to 2,500 foreign students last year, now there are only 85 of them left," says Elena Shutskay, a press officer of the Donetsk State Medical University.

    The university - which will celebrate its 85th anniversary since its launch in November 1930 - used to be "the best" medical school in "the former Ukraine", Shutskay says, attracting students from mainly South Asia, the Middle East, Africa, as well as from former Soviet republics.

    Now it is under the control of the Donetsk People's Republic (DPR) - established by pro-Russian rebels in April 2014. Al Jazeera was told by DPR officials to limit its university visit to one hour and ask only "politically correct questions to avoid an awkward situation".

    Since the rebel takeover, Ukrainian language is no longer used in lectures - only Russian and English - and all ties have been severed with Ukraine's Ministry of Education in Kiev. Continue reading.

    Kratkiy Obzor wrote:Donbass. The mines from minefields ATO. June 2015
    Militia fighters DNR Demining minefields left by Ukrainian military near the settlement "Novogrigorevka.

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