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    Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

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    Stealthflanker

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  Stealthflanker on Thu Oct 01, 2015 9:25 pm

    Project Canada wrote:Thats right! KSA must Burn! I hope Mecca and Medina will be next

    what an irrational thought.
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    George1

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  George1 on Fri Feb 12, 2016 2:34 pm

    Russian and Saudi foreign ministers discuss situation in Syria

    MOSCOW, February 12. /TASS/. Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov and his Saudi Arabian counterpart Adel Al-Jubeir have discussed the situation in Syria and bilateral cooperation on the sidelines of Munich Security Conference, the Russian Foreign Ministry said on Friday.

    "Lavrov and Al-Jubeir discussed the current condition and prospects of Russian-Saudi relations," the foreign ministry said. "They confirmed mutual plans to develop and improve them, to boost cooperation in different spheres," the ministry added.

    "At the meeting, they also considered in detail pressing regional issues with an emphasis on the situation in Syria," the foreign ministry noted.


    More:
    http://tass.ru/en/politics/856270


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    George1

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  George1 on Wed Feb 17, 2016 1:41 pm

    The world’s two biggest crude producers have agreed not to increase oil output, according to Qatar’s energy minister, quoted by Bloomberg. OPEC members, such as Venezuela and Nigeria, have been calling for an emergency meeting of the cartel to discuss crude prices that have fallen over 70 percent since 2014.



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    crod

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    Why Washington will be watching a Saudi king’s visit to Moscow

    Post  crod on Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:08 am


    Saudi Arabia's King Salman arrived in Moscow on Wednesday for a state visit, and Russian officials have prepared an impressive reception for the 81-year-old royal: The Russian capital will celebrate a highly publicized “Saudi Culture Week” as the king arrives, and the Saudi delegation, which typically travels in a grandiose style, is taking over the entire Moscow Ritz-Carlton.

    The sense of occasion is understandable. This is the first official visit by a Saudi king to Russia in the two nations' histories. And it will be watched closely around the world — perhaps especially in Washington.

    The United States has been Saudi Arabia's most important ally for more than 70 years. In contrast, Riyadh forged relations with Moscow only after the collapse of the Soviet Union. Even then, it took a while for things to warm up: Although Russian President Vladimir Putin visited the Saudi capital in 2007, then-King Abdullah didn't repay the favor.

    Times have changed. Abdullah died in 2015, leaving Salman and his powerful young son, Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, in charge. Amid geopolitical uncertainty, with U.S. global leadership questioned and oil prices depressed, Saudi Arabia and Russia appear to have reconsidered their arm's-length relationship and moved toward something closer.

    “The Saudi-Russian energy relationship is part of a larger nexus of mutual interests,” said Theodore Karasik, a senior adviser with Washington-based Gulf State Analytics, noting that Russia had been working on this relationship “under America's nose” for a decade, while Mohammed has visited Russia twice recently.

    For the two largest oil producers in the world, much of the focus during the trip will be on energy politics. Saudi Arabia and Russia are expected to reach an agreement to cooperate on oil production, probably finalizing a $1 billion fund to invest in energy projects. Saudi Arabia, which is in the process of diversifying its economy, is particularly keen for outside investment.

    But the two oil giants most probably won't stick to business alone. Moscow has become an undeniable political force in the Middle East. “There is little doubt that Saudi Arabia greatly values its relations with Russia and views them as multidimensional in nature,” said Fahad Nazer, a political consultant to the Saudi Embassy in Washington who does not speak on its behalf.

    Of particular interest will be the shifting realities in Syria, where Moscow backs the government and Saudi Arabia and the United States back the opposition. As recently as last year, Russia's backing of President Bashar al-Assad and the influence of Iran and its proxies in Syria was a major bone of contention with Saudi Arabia. But, again, realities have changed.

    “The Saudis are basically conceding that Assad will remain in power, but now hope to gain Russian help in keeping Iranian influence in Syria (and elsewhere) limited,” Mark Katz, a Russia specialist at the Schar School of Policy and Government at George Mason University, wrote in an email. “They will hold out the prospect of Saudi trade and investment as an inducement. It is not clear, though, that Moscow actually can do much to limit Iranian influence in Syria. And if the Saudis think that Moscow can't or won't, the Saudi trade and investment will not materialize.”

    What this means for the United States is unclear. Salman's visit to Russia comes at a time of heightened tensions between Moscow and Washington. Although President Trump has embraced Saudi Arabia, even making the country his first foreign stop as leader of the United States, some analysts have suggested that Riyadh may be looking toward Russia because of uncertainty about Washington's intentions in the Middle East.

    “The Saudis recognize that Russia is back as a major player in the region with their victories in Syria,” said Bruce Riedel, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution and a former senior CIA analyst. He added, “A dialogue with Putin is also a hedge on their bet on Trump, who has disappointed them on Qatar,” which is embroiled in a political dispute with several Arab states, including Saudi Arabia.

    Would Saudi Arabia trade its lengthy relationship with the United States, born all those years ago from a Suez Canal meeting between President Franklin D. Roosevelt and the first Saudi king, for a new one with Putin's Russia? Probably not. But the kingdom has shown itself willing to dramatically reconsider some aspects of its society recently, from loosening the oil industry's stranglehold on the economy to allowing Saudi women to drive, long a sticking point in the country's culture wars.

    Standing closer with Russia may be easier than either of those goals. “Generally speaking, there is wide support in Saudi Arabia for strengthening and broadening political, economic and cultural ties with Russia,” Nazer said.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/10/04/why-washington-will-be-watching-a-saudi-kings-visit-to-moscow/?utm_term=.b26643e39149
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    GarryB

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  GarryB on Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:14 am

    I am sure the Russians will talk with the Saudis, but at the end of the day the spread of Shia muslims like Iran has is much preferable to the spread of Sunni muslims as the Saudis encourage.

    Iran has less money than the Saudis but the Iranians are also rather more benign and easier to live with.

    My thoughts are that as in the past both Iran and Saudi Arabia will talk about spending a lot of money on Russian products (mostly military), but at the end of the day the Iranians will buy a few bits and pieces and locally produce certain things, and Saudi Arabia will change its mind and not buy anything.


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    Big_Gazza

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  Big_Gazza on Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:44 am

    The usual WaPo drivel, written by pro-establishment pressitutes in Murica's most blatantly Russophobic "newspaper".

    crod wrote:Saudi Arabia, which is in the process of diversifying its economy, is particularly keen for outside investment.

    That's a fools errand.  Saudis are notorious for being lazy and shiftless and have a universal allergy to anything that looks like work.  Anything that needs doing is done by a Filipino, Indian, or Bangladeshi.  KSA is going to implode when its oil runs out, it'll be a bloodbath.

    GarryB wrote:Iran has less money than the Saudis but the Iranians are also rather more benign and easier to live with.

    Not at the rate the Saudis are burning through their FOREX reserves...  KSA budget (ie funding the royal family extravagances and bribing the populace to stay compliant) is unsustainable with $50-60 oil, and these shifty goat-fondlers know it...
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    flamming_python

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  flamming_python on Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:02 pm

    Big_Gazza wrote:The usual WaPo drivel, written by pro-establishment pressitutes in Murica's most blatantly Russophobic "newspaper".

    crod wrote:Saudi Arabia, which is in the process of diversifying its economy, is particularly keen for outside investment.

    That's a fools errand.  Saudis are notorious for being lazy and shiftless and have a universal allergy to anything that looks like work.  Anything that needs doing is done by a Filipino, Indian, or Bangladeshi.  KSA is going to implode when its oil runs out, it'll be a bloodbath.

    GarryB wrote:Iran has less money than the Saudis but the Iranians are also rather more benign and easier to live with.

    Not at the rate the Saudis are burning through their FOREX reserves...  KSA budget (ie funding the royal family extravagances and bribing the populace to stay compliant) is unsustainable with $50-60 oil, and these shifty goat-fondlers know it...

    I thought it was a decent article as far as Russia-related ones go. Sticks to the facts and reasonable analysis, without heading off into BS territory.

    Only thing is that they pegged Saudi-Russian relations as only having started in 1991 - when in fact the USSR was the first country in the world to recognize Saudi Arabia back in the 20s; a fact one Saudi I knew brought up immediately with me when he made my acquaintance.

    Anyhow Saudi Arabia as noted above is not even remotely a reliable partner. This visit looks good for the media, for mutual domestic audiences, and in terms of gaining leverage on the US perhaps - but in practice the Saudis are going to make their money and investments contingent on some short-term political demands, as they always do, and Russia has no appetite for trying to reign in Iran in Syria so that's that.

    If the Saudis had any sense they'd pick the Japanese & South Korean strategy instead, of courting Russia over a long period of time and expanding ties and investments with it with a view for the long-term.

    This year's Russian Far East development forum was attended by the Japanese, South Korean and Mongolian heads of government/state; and was in fact pretty much hijacked by the former 2 and their agenda for the North Korean crisis - and Putin had basically no choice but to go along with it and acquiese to the pressure to bad-mouth and sanction North Korea.
    How did they do it? Simple - they already had good relations with Russia that they had cultivated for over a decade; with their mega-corporations being responsible for thousands of jobs in Russia and millions of roubles of tax revenue - and were proposing to invest yet more. While at the same time their demands were reasonable and Russia had little to lose from fulfilling them - North Korea was breaking UN resolutions anyway and Russia had minimal trade with it.

    Saudi Arabia on the other hand offers too little too late and demands too much.
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    starman

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  starman on Fri Oct 06, 2017 12:39 pm

    GarryB wrote:
    but at the end of the day the Iranians will buy  a few bits and pieces and locally produce certain things,

    Will Iran get the SU-30 or 35? Could it build something comparable itself?
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    crod

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  crod on Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:48 pm

    starman wrote:
    GarryB wrote:
    but at the end of the day the Iranians will buy  a few bits and pieces and locally produce certain things,

    Will Iran get the SU-30 or 35? Could it build something comparable itself?

    No. Russia cannot and will not supply these items - the trade embargo rules is very clear.

    Not sure if they will remain in place however if, as suggested yesterday, Trump is about to pull out of the nuclear deal. My gut feeling is that Russia will not supply in any event as there will be too much pressure from israel, US and KSA etc.
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    miketheterrible

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  miketheterrible on Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:55 pm

    which neither of those countries has influence over Russia.

    Washington already pushed for THAAD sales to Saudi Arabia day after they say they want S-400's.  So kiss S-400 deal goodbye.  Saudi Arabia has nothing on Russia.  Only one Russia will talk with so far is Israel.

    Iran is a nation that technically borders Russia through Caspian Sea, so it would be in their interest to make sure that Iran stays somewhat together and not attacked/destroyed by the US.  Which so far, judging by Trumps attitude, may be just that case - either Iran or North Korea will get attacked.  Now, he may not go against NK because of the fact that they probably already have nukes and the counter attack by NK against SK and Japan would be so devastating, that their proclaimed surgical strikes to take out NK missiles first hand, wont actually work, especially if NK decides to hide them.

    As for Japan thing, Japan barely has the ability to twist Russia. It is South Korea, which has pretty good relations with Russia. Russia has not so good relations with Japan because Japan's unwillingness to even counter the US and just goes along with it (sanctions as example). So Japan kind of shot itself in the foot, especially since China/Russian relations are at an all time high, both sides want same exact thing out of NK. But rest assured, Russia and China wont simply allow the US to attack NK, if at least NK doesn't do anything stupid. I doubt they will though cause they know the price they would have to pay. US on the other hand has a history of being stupid.
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    Big_Gazza

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  Big_Gazza on Sat Oct 07, 2017 2:24 am

    flamming_python wrote:
    I thought it was a decent article as far as Russia-related ones go. Sticks to the facts and reasonable analysis, without heading off into BS territory.

    Hmmm... went back and had another look and you're correct. I'd been reading other WaPo articles that day, and I think my bullshit-o-meter was stuck on red part of the dial... Good pickup, ty for the reality check Very Happy
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    starman

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  starman on Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:07 pm

    miketheterrible wrote:
    Iran is a nation that technically borders Russia through Caspian Sea, so it would be in their interest to make sure that Iran stays somewhat together and not attacked/destroyed by the US.  Which so far, judging by Trumps attitude, may be just that case - either Iran or North Korea will get attacked.  Now, he may not go against NK because of the fact that they probably already have nukes and the counter attack by NK against SK and Japan would be so devastating, that their proclaimed surgical strikes to take out NK missiles first hand, wont actually work, especially if NK decides to hide them.

    I don't think the US will attack Iran either. Besides driving Iran fully into the Russian camp it would cause the price of oil to go through the roof.
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    starman

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  starman on Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:12 pm

    crod wrote:
    No. Russia cannot and will not supply these items - the trade embargo rules is very clear.

    Even if Trump doesn't undermine the deal, this may be a blessing in disguise. When the prohibition on arms imports finally expires, Russia might be able to sell the T-50. Smile

    My gut feeling is that Russia will not supply in any event as there will be too much pressure from israel, US and KSA etc.

    Surely Israel and KSA don't have that much influence.
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    KiloGolf

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  KiloGolf on Sat Oct 07, 2017 1:35 pm

    Trump already sold them the THAAD for billions, I don't think the US cares for this visit.


    Last edited by KiloGolf on Sun Oct 08, 2017 7:38 am; edited 1 time in total

    ATLASCUB

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    Re: Russia–Saudi Arabia relations

    Post  ATLASCUB on Sun Oct 08, 2017 1:39 am

    KiloGolf wrote:Trump already sole them the THAAD for billions, I don't the US cares for this visit.

    Approved, not sold. The Saudi's have still to ink the deal and can backtrack completely (although unlikely) or modify it (likely).

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