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    mp.net is closing?

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    Post  Guest on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:51 am

    KoTeMoRe wrote:
    Ivan the Colorado wrote:
    Book. wrote:Let wait see. if he true nazi

    then no prob...kill him clown

    mp.net is closing? - Page 11 3e84IRH
    Once again Book's brilliance shines through Laughing

    And I disagree, even if this a private domain but there is no breach in forum rules, Dforce has the right to remain an active user on this forum. We are not in a position to judge someone based on prior experience with them elsewhere. I like to think that this forum better than applying the same techniques McCarthy used back in the 50's. My statement to Dforce was genuinely meant as warning to him. How would you like it if you joined a forum only to find that they banned you without giving you any chance? Hell, for all we know the Dforce here could be a completely different person from the Dforce on mp.net/themess.

    But if Dforce goes back to his old ways I am all for kicking him out.

    3rd time the charm maybe?

    Let me be obvious here. A D... who puts the february medal on reverse to show the '20-february-OMGZ-Rasha-did-it-on-purpose-date', who then goes to say what aboot dem Gru (maybe ex) guys who're detained in Ukraine, who I don't doubt will have a crescendo of inuendos (don't trust me, trust his inner self on the mess) up to the moment some of you will ask for his head on a pike, that D is not about to change. That D is just here for the trolling. However. I didn't asked him to be banned, kicked, muted. NOPE. I'm just saying you guys, that he's a dick, will always be a dick, but that's on the Moderation to handle it. NOT US.

    All I can do is vouch for his inane character, his faux outrage and generally hate of Russia. He actually admitted that at MP.net he "disliked" Russia. FFS just bring back the Diver dude from the Northwest, he was actually fun.
    Didn't see his GRU post before... Anyway my personal opinion still holds and the mods are aware of Dforce.
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    Post  flamming_python on Thu Jul 23, 2015 1:29 pm

    Ivan the Colorado wrote:But if Dforce goes back to his old ways I am all for kicking him out.

    KoTeMoRe wrote:3rd time the charm maybe?

    Let me be obvious here. A D... who puts the february medal on reverse to show the '20-february-OMGZ-Rasha-did-it-on-purpose-date', who then goes to say what aboot dem Gru (maybe ex) guys who're detained in Ukraine, who I don't doubt will have a crescendo of inuendos (don't trust me, trust his inner self on the mess) up to the moment some of you will ask for his head on a pike, that D is not about to change. That D is just here for the trolling. However. I didn't asked him to be banned, kicked, muted. NOPE. I'm just saying you guys, that he's a dick, will always be a dick, but that's on the Moderation to handle it. NOT US.

    All I can do is vouch for his inane character, his faux outrage and generally hate of Russia. He actually admitted that at MP.net he "disliked" Russia. FFS just bring back the Diver dude from the Northwest, he was actually fun.

    You newcomers just don't get it, do you?

    No I'm not a mod, but I've been here a lot longer than either of you, so just settle down and listen.

    Whether he 'dislikes' Russia, or 'likes' Russia, whether he is anti-Martian or pro-Martian, or any other political view he exposes; has absolutely no bearing on his membership here.
    People are not banned, or reprimanded for their views and opinions here. There is no 'vote' or 'say' as to whether a member should be banned or not, based on his views on Russia or anything else.

    They are banned and reprimanded for breaking the rules. Which if he does; say by mindless trolling and spamming - then he will be thrown out of here onto his ass. But then, any of us would expect the same treatment too if we start doing something like that.

    So that's that.

    Oh and FYI, I'm pretty sure disrespect of members is against the rules here, so quit attacking the guy; unless of course he starts breaking the rules - in which case take it up with a mod.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe on Thu Jul 23, 2015 2:46 pm

    ...Lol @ Newcomers.

    Anyway, the idea was simple, everyone is liable to a lynching mob, no matter his tenure. My point is this, Opinions are allowed, I'm voicing an opinion, ITC and you as well, you're all upset because ITC just told him to hold his horses, I say he should get bent (Dforce). It's my right to do so, i will endure the consequences of my post, if there are any, but by the same metric, stay in your lane as well.

    Dforce is a dick, there's no other way to put it. You don't agree, prove me wrong. I've done my homework, do yours and everything will be fine. He's the kind of person that put the Ukraine thread at the edge (not only him mind you, pro-Russians as well) but to have you lecture me on what to do and how to do it, it funny. Especially while we both know our respective past in MP.net.

    There's no new start here, it's just the "Continuation War". Now be a friend and read what i wrote, not what you think I wrote.
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    Post  flamming_python on Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:10 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote:Anyway, the idea was simple, everyone is liable to a lynching mob, no matter his tenure.

    Whose idea was that?

    but by the same metric, stay in your lane as well.

    I'm telling you this because someone has to

    My point is this, Opinions are allowed, I'm voicing an opinion, ITC and you as well, you're all upset because ITC just told him to hold his horses, I say he should get bent (Dforce). It's my right to do so, i will endure the consequences of my post, if there are any, but by the same metric, stay in your lane as well.

    Dforce is a dick, there's no other way to put it.

    You don't agree, prove me wrong. I've done my homework, do yours and everything will be fine.

    In that case I advise you to RTFM

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t67-read-rdf-rules-and-regulations
    Vladimir79 wrote:7] Do not disrespect members, do not attack the messenger, attack the message

    The issue has been settled I trust?

    He's the kind of person that put the Ukraine thread at the edge (not only him mind you, pro-Russians as well) but to have you lecture me on what to do and how to do it, it funny. Especially while we both know our respective past in MP.net.

    There's no new start here, it's just the "Continuation War". Now be a friend and read what i wrote, not what you think I wrote.

    No it's not the "Continuation War", this is a different forum, with different mods and rules; and no-one is interested in what X said in forum Y, Z amount of time ago. Keep that stuff in the past, we don't need it here.
    There are no 'lynch mobs' here, keep that stuff to yourself too.
    The only thing that matters for a member new or old, is whether he follows the rules or not.

    Quite frankly I think the snarky comments that some people made in Dforce's introduction thread - are disgraceful, and a breach of the forum's spirit if not its rules outright. But then I'm not a mod.


    Last edited by flamming_python on Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
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    Post  flamming_python on Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:18 pm

    Mike E wrote:Bunch of Muricans' (and by that I do not mean Americans) getting exciting over their own circle-jerking. I expect nothing more. 

    Sad how in many ways this forum is more of the same thing; Bunch of Russia Stronkers!!1 (and by that I do not mean Russians) getting excited over their own circle-jerking.

    I guess a balance is always needed.

    Anyway, there are certain ways this forum is definately better than mp.net, one of them is that here a free exchange of honest opinions are allowed.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe on Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:53 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    KoTeMoRe wrote:Anyway, the idea was simple, everyone is liable to a lynching mob, no matter his tenure.

    Whose idea was that?

    Mine, in every human group some people right or wrong tend to get lynched. Dforce (or me by that metric) is no exception/

    but by the same metric, stay in your lane as well.

    I'm telling you this because someone has to

    I'm glad that you feel compelled to do so, just make sure you're understanding the message. Me and you, we don't matter here. That was the message, either defend
    the rule
    (IE Moderation has a say over 'principles'), either don't, don't give me the it's ok, we're all friends, because we aren't (with Dforce) so stay on you lane.

    My point is this, Opinions are allowed, I'm voicing an opinion, ITC and you as well, you're all upset because ITC just told him to hold his horses, I say he should get bent (Dforce). It's my right to do so, i will endure the consequences of my post, if there are any, but by the same metric, stay in your lane as well.

    Dforce is a dick, there's no other way to put it.

    You don't agree, prove me wrong. I've done my homework, do yours and everything will be fine.

    In that case I advise you to RTFM

    http://www.russiadefence.net/t67-read-rdf-rules-and-regulations
    Vladimir79 wrote:7] Do not disrespect members, do not attack the messenger, attack the message

    The issue has been settled I trust?

    You obviously didn't do your homework. I do not disrespect members, I point out the obvious...if you want to play coy, or worse, dumb I'm not going to have any of that. If Viktor reads the contribution, sees the nickname and has a complete view of character, he'd understand the point.

    He's the kind of person that put the Ukraine thread at the edge (not only him mind you, pro-Russians as well) but to have you lecture me on what to do and how to do it, it funny. Especially while we both know our respective past in MP.net.

    There's no new start here, it's just the "Continuation War". Now be a friend and read what i wrote, not what you think I wrote.

    No it's not the "Continuation War", this is a different forum, with different mods and rules; and no-one is interested in what X said in forum Y, Z amount of time ago. Keep that stuff in the past, we don't need it here.

    It's easy really, there are two variables here:  1.new medium/Forum. 2. Membership input.

    In this case, for Dfarce the input is exactly the same as in MP or TheMess. If you can't see that, i can't help you. So or Dfarce it is just the same old, same old. You don't like it and pretend it's settled, well it ain't so. I know it, Dfarce knows it, you play dumb. Ok...

    There are no 'lynch mobs' here, keep that stuff to yourself too.
    The only thing that matters for a member new or old, is whether he follows the rules or not.

    Rules don't bend, they're rules. Aggravated passive trolling and flame baiting isn't respecting the rules. Oh btw, there will be lynchmobs in here, just wait for the next conflagration.

    [Quite frankly I think the snarky comments that some people made in Dforce's introduction thread - are disgraceful, and a breach of the forum's spirit if not its rules outright. But then I'm not a mod.

    Snarky, lol, maybe they wouldn't have been snarky, if the douchebags first contribution wasn't "Wat Aboot GRU in Yukraine?". And that nice avatar...Nice really. But hey you be Haysoos, we be the other people.

    BTW look at the thread hombre...It is MP.net is closing. It is thus totally appropriate to have this discussion.
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    Post  JohninMK on Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:23 pm

    This is getting silly.

    Any new arrival here should be welcomed regardless of their past, known and experienced or not. It is then down to them as to how they conduct themselves. Hopefully they will fit in with the ethos of this forum. If not there are a range of sanctions from individual ignores to mod's ban.

    I have found, in the short time I have been here, that is is an interesting place to be. That was sometimes not the case at mp. I took the view, and still do, that it is useful in forming a judgement to hear both sides, or different ways of doing things, even if some of it was what not what a few wanted to hear and if that someone was a mod and it disparaged the US then it was 'holiday' time.

    So in a way I support DForce, he has a different view to many here. Treat him with respect until we know different and please everyone don't wind him up with any of your comments. If you do the result could reflect as much on you as him.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe on Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:48 pm

    Again he can say what he wants, that isn't going to change his character or our (those who know who he is and what he stands for) opinion on him. And again that's besides the point, the point is this. Discussing Dforce as an MP.character on the MP.net dedicated thread is PERFECTLY appropriate. PERFECTLY.

    I didn't smeared him on his introduction thread, nor am i gunning for his head. But this thread is about MP.net. And I'm managing MP.net rummage.

    This is something you seem to ignore. You can keep crap out, but you can't keep the smell.
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    Post  JohninMK on Thu Jul 23, 2015 9:29 pm

    KoTeMoRe wrote: You can keep crap out, but you can't keep the smell.
    Can tell you have lived, that's one of the truisms in life.
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    Post  artjomh on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:15 pm

    I don't understand why people are badmouthing MP.net mods.

    Most of them were solid people. Adults. None of them ever acted like a asshole toward me, because I never acted like a asshole toward them.

    I've been registered on MP.net since around 2007-2008. I was never banned or reprimanded a single time (I think I was warned once for hotlinking photos). I never had any problems there because I never acted like an entitled asshole.

    The main rule of being an adult is to act maturely even if everyone else acts like a monkey. Being a dick because others are being dicks is what children do.

    Just my opinion, of course.
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    Post  Werewolf on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:24 pm

    artjomh wrote:I don't understand why people are badmouthing MP.net mods.

    Most of them were solid people. Adults. None of them ever acted like a asshole toward me, because I never acted like a asshole toward them.

    I've been registered on MP.net since around 2007-2008. I was never banned or reprimanded a single time (I think I was warned once for hotlinking photos). I never had any problems there because I never acted like an entitled asshole.

    The main rule of being an adult is to act maturely even if everyone else acts like a monkey. Being a dick because others are being dicks is what children do.

    Just my opinion, of course.

    Trolling?
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    Post  Guest on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:33 pm

    Can we drop the discussion about Dforce? He is now a member here so deal with it. If he goes back to his old ways the mods will deal with him.

    artjomh wrote:I don't understand why people are badmouthing MP.net mods.

    Most of them were solid people. Adults. None of them ever acted like a asshole toward me, because I never acted like a asshole toward them.

    I've been registered on MP.net since around 2007-2008. I was never banned or reprimanded a single time (I think I was warned once for hotlinking photos). I never had any problems there because I never acted like an entitled asshole.

    The main rule of being an adult is to act maturely even if everyone else acts like a monkey. Being a dick because others are being dicks is what children do.

    Just my opinion, of course.
    Agreed, I actually really like the mods at Mp.net. They have a rather demanding job and they have to be objective as possible. Of course, they are not perfect but for all of them being heavily pro-West they are very accommodating to people with different views, unlike many of the members there. A lot of punishments that is given out by the mods there is due to community pressure also. Funny how this forum doesn't have the extreme standoffish attitude back there so people are not going for each other's throats, and all the posters here have a somewhat similar view as well (as of now). Just my $0.02.

    But a good amount of the posters here were banned on MP.net so I can at least see where they are coming from too.
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    Post  artjomh on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:34 pm

    Werewolf wrote:Trolling?

    I'm too old for trolling, every time I try it comes out lame and unfunny.

    So, no, I'm serious.
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    Post  Mike E on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:44 pm

    flamming_python wrote:
    Mike E wrote:Bunch of Muricans' (and by that I do not mean Americans) getting exciting over their own circle-jerking. I expect nothing more. 
    Sad how in many ways this forum is more of the same thing; Bunch of Russia Stronkers!!1 (and by that I do not mean Russians) getting excited over their own circle-jerking.

    I guess a balance is always needed.

    Anyway, there are certain ways this forum is definately better than mp.net, one of them is that here a free exchange of honest opinions are allowed.
    Except that for the most part, the circle-jerking here is actually valid. I spent only a few minutes looking at "The Mess" and could tell you 90% of what is posted is inherently biased. 

    Another one is no rampaging mods, if you ask me.
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    Post  artjomh on Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:51 pm

    Mike E wrote:Except that for the most part, the circle-jerking here is actually valid.

    I personally find some of the the one-sidedness here pretty bland. It feels really vanilla.

    It's not very interesting if there is no-one who will tell you "No, you are wrong because X, Y, Z". And the fun lies in having an intelligent conversation to try and prove the other guy wrong.

    Argumentative Americans made MP.net fun for me personally. Just being surrounded by yes-men is boring as all hell.
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    Post  Mike E on Thu Jul 23, 2015 11:03 pm

    artjomh wrote:
    Mike E wrote:Except that for the most part, the circle-jerking here is actually valid.

    I personally find some of the the one-sidedness here pretty bland. It feels really vanilla.

    It's not very interesting if there is no-one who will tell you "No, you are wrong because X, Y, Z". And the fun lies in having an intelligent conversation to try and prove the other guy wrong.

    Argumentative Americans made MP.net fun for me personally. Just being surrounded by yes-men is boring as all hell.
    I can see where you are coming from... In my honest opinion it is less of "not having an opposition" and more "not being surrounded by a bunch of radicals". 

    People here still correct others, and though the site is obviously geared towards Russia it isn't like we all have the same stance on things.
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    Post  JohninMK on Thu Jul 23, 2015 11:48 pm

    MP.net and themess were and are brilliant sites in so many areas. The Syria and military news threads being the classic examples.

    It was really the Ukraine thread that was the elephant in the room. The number of posts and views just dwarfed anything else on the site and it turned into a nightmare to control with very polarised discussions and deep explorations of the history behind the east of Europe. It became a Mod's nightmare almost having to control it on an hourly basis, Digrar in particular said that he was completely fed up of continuously having to delete posts. At one point hundreds went in an attempt to keep it on topic with many posters banned or suspended.

    But, as said above, it made for a very lively and interesting thread, nothing like it anywhere really, hence the amazing view figures. But when the change came that changed. One suspects the Mods, the same ones, had had enough and decided it wasn't going to happen again so imposed different standards, in particular, no polarisation. The net result seems to be that the US/Kiev side of the argument has stayed there whilst the Russia/Donbas side has come here. Many more of course just vanished. The effect, as artjomh implies, has take the 'sharp' bits of the discussion out, both here and there. Also of course, thankfully there is no serious conflict to report on and discuss.

    I am with Mike E on this and it seems much more civilised here.
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    Post  PapaDragon on Fri Jul 24, 2015 12:14 am


    Guys, relax.


    If Tenacious D wants to go full Reich again that is his thing. We have mods and ignore lists for those situations.

    As long as he (and everyone else) post sources for his stuff and keeps racism in check (yes, Russophobia and Slavophobia in general IS racism) he is more than welcome. I believe people can change, however unlikely it may be.

    As for MP.net mods: f*ck them all !!!

    I got permabanned for posting a joke while westronkian crowd was advocating Final Solution/Lebensraum 2.0 on a daily basis and did not even get infraction for their efforts. angry

    And for the record: it was everyone's beloved Hollis that banned me so there goes his credibility. Razz


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    Post  KoTeMoRe on Fri Jul 24, 2015 12:16 am

    artjomh wrote:I don't understand why people are badmouthing MP.net mods.

    Most of them were solid people. Adults. None of them ever acted like a asshole toward me, because I never acted like a asshole toward them.

    I've been registered on MP.net since around 2007-2008. I was never banned or reprimanded a single time (I think I was warned once for hotlinking photos). I never had any problems there because I never acted like an entitled asshole.

    The main rule of being an adult is to act maturely even if everyone else acts like a monkey. Being a dick because others are being dicks is what children do.

    Just my opinion, of course.

    There's so much truth in these words, but with one caveat.

    1. You almost never got to the political side of the discussion. And even when you crossed the line, the post were sufficiently factual about obscure enough points that NO mod would dare to risk the ridicule confronting you.

    Things were much more complicated with us mere mortals.

    I'll only refer to my own situation regarding the Curtis LeMay debate. I would again refer to my own infraction history (especially both the legalese ones sorrounding the unlawful settlement of the West Bank, the Iranian nuclear row or more simply the Greek crisis issues). Unless you didn't get the memo your so called "solid adults" banned me (and others) on menial self-deserving issues. Just take this easy test, ask Hollis who won VietNam? Ask Hollis what the Phoenix program was. Ask Hollis about the carpet bombing or Agent Orange. Or is that being a dick?

    We could go like this for ages. There were idiotic redlines in MP.net moderation crew, we had Flagg stating that there were superior cultures and civilizations based on how well they could kill people. We got James advocating Total war in Afghanistan. Now we got some Australian bogans pontificating on how they know everything while litterally being behind academic research a couple of decades.

    I have the outmost respect for your Artjom, but in how many thread your own contribution would overlooked, albeit factual and usually terminal, by more than one mod, who would close and eye (or two) when not outright encouraging the idiotic circle jerk about everything Russian/Non Western. FFS Hollis and Co almost went to blows with Dave76 over CAS, albeit Dave was not only factually correct, but logically solid.

    I know that many there just don't care about this or that, but the fact is that the Moderation Crew was totally decrepit and not up to the task for the purpose of Moderation. IE keeping the discussion devoid of bias, authority argument or any other tautological circle jerk.

    I won't go beyond this, but MP.net wasn't equal to all members.

    Edit: BTW you remember desertswo pulling shit out of his chocolate box regarding the Soviet Navy? Did anyone bothered to check those facts? Nope, what moderation can you have when it clearly is not up to task for the job.
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    Post  artjomh on Fri Jul 24, 2015 11:40 am

    You are mad about people disagreeing with you and having a different opinion on the internet?! HA!

    People arguing on the internet is not a problem for me. People telling me I am wrong even if I am right is NOT A PROBLEM.

    Just be an adult and deal with it.
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    Post  KoTeMoRe on Fri Jul 24, 2015 12:33 pm

    artjomh wrote:You are mad about people disagreeing with you and having a different opinion on the internet?! HA!

    People arguing on the internet is not a problem for me. People telling me I am wrong even if I am right is NOT A PROBLEM.

    Just be an adult and deal with it.

    Well what makes me mad, is this. The whole self-censorship part, when you say that, you just bring me back 35 fvcking years ago. Don't sweat it, you know how the comrade director is, it's useless confronting him.

    The carry on, nothing to see attitude.

    You can't be an adult while the others are being childich dicks. It's called being a victim. And accepting it. This is what makes ijits on the MP.net moderation crew dwell on the "Russian Inferiority Complex". Because most of you just tried once. And when they wouldn't understand, you'd just take your coat and move on. That's why whatever you would say on a specific subject, no matter the downright grotesque accuracy you'd achieve would be just disregarded, because you wouldn't go beyond that limit. Say it once, without fuss and move on.

    In that regard RomanS was the epitome of the soft approach. 'become useful and they'll accept you'.

    That's the part that makes me mad. Not the fact MP.net mods were utter shit. That's only part of life and know it only too well.

    Anyway, you're right, we need to be adults for two. And then our offspring would have to be adult for 4 and so on.

    Whatever, thanks for the deep thoughts.
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    Post  GarryB on Fri Jul 24, 2015 2:23 pm

    You newcomers just don't get it, do you?

    No I'm not a mod, but I've been here a lot longer than either of you, so just settle down and listen.

    Whether he 'dislikes' Russia, or 'likes' Russia, whether he is anti-Martian or pro-Martian, or any other political view he exposes; has absolutely no bearing on his membership here.
    People are not banned, or reprimanded for their views and opinions here. There is no 'vote' or 'say' as to whether a member should be banned or not, based on his views on Russia or anything else.

    They are banned and reprimanded for breaking the rules. Which if he does; say by mindless trolling and spamming - then he will be thrown out of here onto his ass. But then, any of us would expect the same treatment too if we start doing something like that.

    So that's that.

    Oh and FYI, I'm pretty sure disrespect of members is against the rules here, so quit attacking the guy; unless of course he starts breaking the rules - in which case take it up with a mod.

    Very well put FP, though I would add that a long term regular poster will get more leeway than a newcomer with attitude.

    There are threads regarding banning members, but there is no vote, there are no lynch mob decisions here.

    Quite frankly I think the snarky comments that some people made in Dforce's introduction thread - are disgraceful, and a breach of the forum's spirit if not its rules outright. But then I'm not a mod.

    I agree, but then if this new member is half as bad as he is being credited as being from a wide range of new and older members, then I think expressing their opinion is healthy too.

    A bad child that follows the rules and does as they are asked is not a bad kid...

    But then if a bad kid hates x why go to a forum about x except to stir up trouble and once they do then the cat is out of the bag... or more precisely, the kid is out of the forum.

    I guess a balance is always needed.

    Yes... but a balance of different opinions, not haters.

    Anyway, there are certain ways this forum is definately better than mp.net, one of them is that here a free exchange of honest opinions are allowed.

    We try... Smile

    (IE Moderation has a say over 'principles'), either don't, don't give me the it's ok, we're all friends, because we aren't (with Dforce) so stay on you lane.

    We all don't have to be friends... but we do have to keep thinks civil... and part of that is respect the rights of others to have differing opinions... that is all everybody has to do here.


    Rules don't bend, they're rules. Aggravated passive trolling and flame baiting isn't respecting the rules. Oh btw, there will be lynchmobs in here, just wait for the next conflagration.

    If anyone breaks the rules by all means send me a PM noting the offending comment... preferably with a link and I will go from there... no lynch mobs.... this is not a democracy, though we do take members opinions seriously.

    This is getting silly.

    Nice post JohninMK, I wont repeat it all here again, but agree with what you said.

    Most of them were solid people. Adults. None of them ever acted like a asshole toward me, because I never acted like a asshole toward them.

    I seem to have gotten on the wrong side of Hollis and it seems he never forgot it. I got repeated infractions... one time for mentioning "IED". Another time I replied to a poster who was calling Putin a Dictator and I mentioned the fact that there were at least 10 political parties also in those elections while in the US there are two... I got banned for that.

    Hollis stated I was only banned for two weeks, but my account never worked again... which didn't really bother me... I only went to the site for the Russian photos thread and the spinoff discussion thread... all the ban did was prevent me from continuing to answer questions asked in those two threads... so it save me some time.

    I personally find some of the the one-sidedness here pretty bland. It feels really vanilla.

    that is funny, because I am just sick of talking to what seem to be a never ending stream of teenage Americans who think even the slightest criticism of the US is a slander that must be avenged... if you don't love it... leave... you are now with the terrorists so don't blub to me if we bomb you...

    Repeating over and over that strategic bombing did fuck all except kill mostly women and children and old people in Germany and that D Day did not defeat the germans in Europe is like Ground hog day.

    It's not very interesting if there is no-one who will tell you "No, you are wrong because X, Y, Z". And the fun lies in having an intelligent conversation to try and prove the other guy wrong.

    The main problem there is that you need a few people who actually have a good knowledge of the topic... which is sadly still rather lacking in the western world. One of the reasons I was pleased to see MP.net close was the influx of members like yourself and many others with huge potential to contribute.

    Argumentative Americans made MP.net fun for me personally. Just being surrounded by yes-men is boring as all hell.

    If you just want me to post "You are wrong" once or twice a day... Twisted Evil just to make you feel better...

    To be honest I find actual arguments boring... it usually comes down to he says she says and a deadlock.

    That's the part that makes me mad. Not the fact MP.net mods were utter shit.

    Actually they did me a favour... over on that site it was a western site on military stuff that included some rather interesting (to me) Russian and Soviet stuff... over there everything was slanted to the western view... a thread about P-3s would never likely mention Il-38s, but a thread on Il-38s would repeatedly mention Orions and how inferior the Mays were.

    Here the stuff I am interested in is not odd or just tolerated... much happier here to be honest.
    artjomh
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    Post  artjomh on Fri Jul 24, 2015 5:49 pm

    GarryB wrote:The main problem there is that you need a few people who actually have a good knowledge of the topic... which is sadly still rather lacking in the western world.

    Well, this is not true at all (the lack, I mean). What about Damian90, Frankerman, many others? But that is beside the point.

    For the intelligent people to come and engage in a vibrant debate, there needs to be an atmosphere of acceptance for the mass of casual silly people.

    If you bully the Western-leaning casuals because they are not following the party line that Russia is indeed the bestest, you are creating an impression that NO dissenting opinion will be tolerated, no matter how well articulated. I don't mean you specifically, but this thread is a good example of people abusing new members for holding a different point of view even before those members broke any rules. All of which leads to intelligent pro-Western people just not bothering with visiting at all.

    I am all for relaxed mods not micromanaging things, but when I see regular non-mod members intervening to tell people to chill out, it seems like an issue to me.
    Werewolf
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    Post  Werewolf on Fri Jul 24, 2015 6:38 pm

    artjomh wrote:
    GarryB wrote:The main problem there is that you need a few people who actually have a good knowledge of the topic... which is sadly still rather lacking in the western world.

    Well, this is not true at all (the lack, I mean). What about Damian90, Frankerman, many others? But that is beside the point.

    For the intelligent people to come and engage in a vibrant debate, there needs to be an atmosphere of acceptance for the mass of casual silly people.

    If you bully the Western-leaning casuals because they are not following the party line that Russia is indeed the bestest, you are creating an impression that NO dissenting opinion will be tolerated, no matter how well articulated. I don't mean you specifically, but this thread is a good example of people abusing new members for holding a different point of view even before those members broke any rules. All of which leads to intelligent pro-Western people just not bothering with visiting at all.

    I am all for relaxed mods not micromanaging things, but when I see regular non-mod members intervening to tell people to chill out, it seems like an issue to me.

    Major bullshit.

    Garry is right you need people with knowledge and understanding to actually have healthy conversations and discussions. It does not matter how many Pro and Contra arguments you make when both sides just ignore and do not adknowledge the points that have been made. We know enough off this childish talk back and forth just like i've been entertained on DFI forum where Damian tried to explain the 101 Design of tanks and their 30° +- frontal protection and safe maneuvering in those angles and they just ignored over 74 pages what Damian meant even tho it was explained in the simpliest way. It does not matter how many pro and contras you have you need people that can thrive their interest with knowledge that comes from others based on what they know and what both sides can base on facts and not mere nonsense they find in their own bums.

    This is among the most friendly forum, no abusement of power by mods or admins, very tolerant and very reluctant mods using their rights to edit or ban people even tho sometimes they may have had to take actions. No onesided banning and censorship like on Mp.nut where non USA-stronkkk or anyone that even dared to mention Tonkin False Flag and all the other Flase flags that by Forum rules were banned to discuss because they do not serve the US stronkkk bullshit that was the basic agenda on mp.net.

    This forum gives all necessities for healthy and free expression of opinions, the only difference is PRO-USA or westerners do not give a jack shit about Russia and they want keep their believes of Russia being rusted junk graveyard with primates all paid by big Tzar Putin Hitlerov and the millions of deaths this evil Dictator made when he invaded with his mongol Army Crimea.
    Cowboy's daughter
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    Post  Cowboy's daughter on Fri Jul 24, 2015 9:26 pm

    Ivan the Colorado wrote:Can we drop the discussion about Dforce? He is now a member here so deal with it. If he goes back to his old ways the mods will deal with him.

    artjomh wrote:I don't understand why people are badmouthing MP.net mods.

    Most of them were solid people. Adults. None of them ever acted like a asshole toward me, because I never acted like a asshole toward them.

    I've been registered on MP.net since around 2007-2008. I was never banned or reprimanded a single time (I think I was warned once for hotlinking photos). I never had any problems there because I never acted like an entitled asshole.

    The main rule of being an adult is to act maturely even if everyone else acts like a monkey. Being a dick because others are being dicks is what children do.

    Just my opinion, of course.
    Agreed, I actually really like the mods at Mp.net. They have a rather demanding job and they have to be objective as possible. Of course, they are not perfect but for all of them being heavily pro-West they are very accommodating to people with different views, unlike many of the members there. A lot of punishments that is given out by the mods there is due to community pressure also. Funny how this forum doesn't have the extreme standoffish attitude back there so people are not going for each other's throats, and all the posters here have a somewhat similar view as well (as of now). Just my $0.02.

    But a good amount of the posters here were banned on MP.net so I can at least see where they are coming from too.

    My opposing opinion: mpnet mods were biased and their bias banned ppl.

    I got some deserved infractions - for posting NSFW, when I didn't intend to, but also got infracted for crap.

    I am not pro-Russia, nor pro-USA, and I am not anti any country. i.e. I'm not anti-Russia, and I'm not anti-the USA. Nor the ppl of the Country, except I am anti what the English did to the Irish, but then some English people assisted the Irish.
    I am pro the facts.
    I think there are Countries who have really done wrong to other ppl. Or persons in those Countries really did wrong to persons. or both. The USA to American Indians. for one.
    I don't like pointing out other countries' faults, or what I might think are their faults, just the USA and Great Britan. Smile
    I'm not so much anti- British people, but am anti what the British Empire did, but they aren't the only Empire that ill treated, and worse, human beings.

    I live in the USA and I would hope it'd be a decent country to live in, and to others in the world, but ...because I live where I do, it's a decent place to live. Because of laws that have been passed, spying, etc. - not so much. & as for as how we treat other countries, well, as I read a guy say today: "Washington is the machine and corporate lobbyist money is the oil. " Sad

    Usually I treat persons the way they treat me. but on mpnet a lot of times, I couldn't post without some jerk trolling me, and the atmosphere was toxic, and imho it's the same on the Mess. and it isn't worth posting there. Or not much. that is just my opinion. & everybody has an opinion....Smile

    Another thing I didn't like over there, was posting info, and a mod just wiping it off the forum.

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