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    Venezuela crisis

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    Will usa be successful in installing it's puppet

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    Total Votes: 30
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed May 01, 2019 8:05 am

    Tsavo Lion wrote:
    ..starving population.
    If they really were starving, they would look like N Koreans in the 1990s or Nazi concentration camp inmates. Don't spread the Western propaganda here!

    6 million venezuelas run away in last 4 years ago.

    Did you ever visit South America?

    In Chile and Peru they are sick of venezuela refugess. They walk in hordes in streets of Lima and try to sell you shit.

    Nobody can denie that it is a shithole.

    I think the mainproblem is, we have different standards.

    Dor russians and that mindset, venezuela is acceptable and the low end is Auschwitz.

    For western people the low end is countries like Venezuela. I have such high expectation on livimg standards, that i could never imagine to live in Venezuela.

    Tsavo Lion
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    Post  Tsavo Lion on Wed May 01, 2019 8:34 am

    Aristide wrote:
    6 million venezuelas run away in last 4 years ago.
    Out of Population: 31.98 million (2017)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuela#Demographics
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuela#Shortages

    Mexicans, Cubans, Hondurans, Salvadorans, etc. r also fleeing North for better life- food isn't the only thing that makes life worth living.
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed May 01, 2019 9:05 am

    Tsavo Lion wrote:
    Aristide wrote:
    6 million venezuelas run away in last 4 years ago.
    Out of Population: 31.98 million (2017)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuela#Demographics
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Venezuela#Shortages

    Mexicans, Cubans, Hondurans, Salvadorans, etc. r also fleeing North for better life- food isn't the only thing that makes life worth living.

    True, i have certain standards.

    I shower 2 to 3 times a day, demand best equipment for my training, 5g Internet and wlan in public spaces. I want best highspeed transportation and a wide portfolio of food in highest quality.

    From saturday restaurant with my girl

    Venezuela crisis - Page 32 Op4mq9

    I doubt i would my quality of life in Venezuela.
    Hole
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    Post  Hole on Wed May 01, 2019 10:48 am

    More then 6 Mio. people fled Colombia to Venezuela in the last decades. How many of these "venezuelans" are in fact colombians returning home?
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed May 01, 2019 11:04 am

    Hole wrote:More then 6 Mio. people fled Colombia to Venezuela in the last decades. How many of these "venezuelans" are in fact colombians returning home?

    Dude seriously. All this west and east shit aside, can we agree that no form of socialism or communism ever has worked? That it always has collapsed into at best failed states and at worst condensed into shitholes like Venezuela or
    Combodia?

    Look, Russkies experienced socialism. It ended in deaster. Russia today is capitalist. I would say even more capitalist than France to a degree, since there is less regulation.

    Can we agree on that base and the additional fact, that nobody denies, not even Russia, that Maduro is a complete moron?

    Venezuela under Chavez laid the groundwork to ruin since socialism always fails. Chavez could slow that down, because he was intelligent and had some charisma.

    Maduro has the charisma of a wet carpet and the intelligence of a cow.

    The average Venezuelan has lost 8.5kg in last 4 years. Hunger and poverty is an extreme factor in Venezuela.

    verkhoturye51
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    Post  verkhoturye51 on Wed May 01, 2019 12:07 pm

    Mexicans, Cubans, Hondurans, Salvadorans, etc. r also fleeing North for better life- food isn't the only thing that makes life worth living.

    It's not a secret that Venezuela (and other countries) is in serious crisis, hardly any country could prosper under that harsh sanctions. The difference is that Maduro is willing to fight for better future for his country, and isn't concerned just with his own ass, like some people with "high standards" here.

    Venezuela is a shithole with a low IQ bus driver at the top of it and a starving population.

    Charisma supreme. Reminds me of Trump calling Africa a shithole, after which he was accused of white supremacy racism. If you don't respect others, you lose their respect too, like France lost its colonies.

    can we agree that no form of socialism or communism ever has worked?

    No, we can't. Russians were struggling with food shortages after WWI, 40 years later they put a man in the space first. There is no market economy that can do this - trust me, I'm an economist. Hadn't Stalin industrialised SU in the 1930s, Russians would speak German now.

    If you don't have enough - India had 10 times higher GDP p.c. than China after WWII. How far did its free market policy get it? Chinese planning on the other hand turned the country into world superpower with explosion in GDP growth.
    Aristide
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    Post  Aristide on Wed May 01, 2019 12:16 pm

    verkhoturye51 wrote:
    Mexicans, Cubans, Hondurans, Salvadorans, etc. r also fleeing North for better life- food isn't the only thing that makes life worth living.

    It's not a secret that Venezuela (and other countries) is in serious crisis, hardly any country could prosper under that harsh sanctions. The difference is that Maduro is willing to fight for better future for his country, and isn't concerned just with his own ass, like some people with "high standards" here.

    Venezuela is a shithole with a low IQ bus driver at the top of it and a starving population.

    Charisma supreme. Reminds me of Trump calling Africa a shithole, after which he was accused of white supremacy racism. If you don't respect others, you lose their respect too, like France lost its colonies.

    can we agree that no form of socialism or communism ever has worked?

    No, we can't. Russians were struggling with food shortages after WWI, 40 years later they put a man in the space first. There is no market economy that can do this - trust me, I'm an economist. Hadn't Stalin industrialised SU in the 1930s, Russians would speak German now.

    If you don't have enough - India had 10 times higher GDP p.c. than China after WWII. How far did its free market policy get it? Chinese planning on the other hand turned the country into world superpower with explosion in GDP growth.

    We lost not a single colony. The system changed. In colonial times we paid them money. Now they send us money whioe we stopped investing. We get what we want for free. Madagascar is poorest country in world but pays us 165 million € per year.

    As for rest of your rubbish. China is hyper capitalist. Thats their sucess.

    I have to high living standards to live in communism. Im better than others and thus demand better.
    verkhoturye51
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    Post  verkhoturye51 on Wed May 01, 2019 12:27 pm

    It's long overdue to kick racism where it belongs. In a week you'll see another big Russian rocket rolling down Red square celebrating victory over holocaust supporters. Then maybe admins will stop tolerating neo-nazism. russia
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Wed May 01, 2019 12:33 pm

    We lost not a single colony. The system changed. In colonial times we paid them money. Now they send us money whioe we stopped investing. We get what we want for free. Madagascar is poorest country in world but pays us 165 million € per year.

    As for rest of your rubbish. China is hyper capitalist. Thats their sucess.

    I have to high living standards to live in communism. Im better than others and thus demand better

    If China or US impose sanctions on France you will eat rats. Just like french ate rats when germans occupied it during the siege of Paris 1870.

    France without EU is nothing. Germany at least has a strong economy. French are totally dependant on US and china. And lets not even talk how the country is ruled by the Jewish and the Freemasonry.
    MiamiMachineShop
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    Post  MiamiMachineShop on Wed May 01, 2019 4:29 pm

    Socialism basically helped poor Venezuelans reach Chilean or Argentine standards in only 15 short years. Colombia is behind Venezuela at this point, and must whore out its own people to survive. Brazil there is crime you can only see in Mexico. Gangs run things and poverty is abound. Peru is a lost cause, the peruvians are resorting to faking dollars and growing huge amounts of Cocaine to survive, carrying out the cartels assassination orders like slaves. Argentina basically has been in crisis for over a decade. I do not see a comparison in South America. Ecuador is also a lost cause. Chile is basically the continental hegemon, and they are losing their position. Venezuela is claiming it
    Tsavo Lion
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    Post  Tsavo Lion on Wed May 01, 2019 5:04 pm

    Ecuador is also a lost cause.
    It's using US $ as the national currency. At least, Ecuadorians r not emigrate in mass to Chile (which btw has no strategic depth) like Peruvians do.
    But Brazil is the regional heavyweight, despite her internal problems. They make C-390s & will soon get SSNs & got big oil/gas deposits in their EEZ.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embraer_KC-390
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-brazil-submarine/brazil-take-first-step-in-program-to-join-nuclear-powered-sub-club-idUSKBN1OD2CV


    Last edited by Tsavo Lion on Wed May 01, 2019 6:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
    Rodion_Romanovic
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    Post  Rodion_Romanovic on Wed May 01, 2019 5:36 pm

    Tsavo Lion wrote:
    Ecuador is also a lost cause.
    It used US $ as the national currency. At least, Ecuadorians r not emigrate in mass to Chile (which btw has no strategic depth) like Peruvians do.
    But Brazil is the regional heavyweight, despite her internal problems. They make C-390s & will soon get SSNs & got big oil/gas deposits in their EEZ.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embraer_KC-390
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-brazil-submarine/brazil-take-first-step-in-program-to-join-nuclear-powered-sub-club-idUSKBN1OD2CV
    Brasil just sold their aerospace industry to Boeing...
    verkhoturye51
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    Post  verkhoturye51 on Wed May 01, 2019 6:03 pm

    Socialism basically helped poor Venezuelans reach Chilean or Argentine standards in only 15 short years. Colombia is behind Venezuela at this point, and must whore out its own people to survive. Brazil there is crime you can only see in Mexico. Gangs run things and poverty is abound. Peru is a lost cause, the peruvians are resorting to faking dollars and growing huge amounts of Cocaine to survive, carrying out the cartels assassination orders like slaves. Argentina basically has been in crisis for over a decade. I do not see a comparison in South America. Ecuador is also a lost cause. Chile is basically the continental hegemon, and they are losing their position. Venezuela is claiming it

    Ecuador has been recently a good standing leftist country. Under Correa GDP p.c. increased by half. One has to ask himself, why would Ecuadorians be unhappy with this and elect completely different president like Moreno. Somebody else wasn't happy with him. When he provided asylum to Assange, he created himself an enemy in CIA. So some foreign support was obviously a decisive factor in the campaign.
    verkhoturye51
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    Post  verkhoturye51 on Wed May 01, 2019 9:38 pm

    Lavrov to Pompeo: "any your aggressive moves towards Venezuela will bring serious consequences"

    https://tass.ru/politika/6396084
    magnumcromagnon
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    Post  magnumcromagnon on Wed May 01, 2019 10:27 pm

    avatar
    andalusia

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    Post  andalusia on Wed May 01, 2019 10:48 pm

    We lost not a single colony. The system changed. In colonial times we paid them money. Now they send us money whioe we stopped investing. We get what we want for free. Madagascar is poorest country in world but pays us 165 million € per year.


    If it is true that Madagascar pays France 165 million dollars per year; then that is pretty sad. Why do they pay France this money per year?
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Thu May 02, 2019 8:18 am



    I'm still uncertain how because of US sanctions, how Cuba can't buy Venezuelan oil....
    miketheterrible
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    Post  miketheterrible on Thu May 02, 2019 9:56 am

    GarryB
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    Post  GarryB on Thu May 02, 2019 12:44 pm

    I think it is hilarious that a certain member thinks the solution for Venezuela is democracy over communism... it has been democracy that has been their problem... it was the US of A that suggested they didn't need to grow their own food... they have oil wealth so why bother growing your own food when you can buy it cheaply from your neighbours... they also encourage Saudi Arabia not to grow their own food or diversify their economy because it makes them easier to destabilise when times are tough.

    The lack of diversity in Venezuela is because of democracy, and the transition away from "democracy" is difficult, but is always compounded by low oil prices in a country that relies on oil for money... and doubly so when foreign countries steal their money like the US seizing assets and funds and imposing sanctions and of course the UK blocking their access to their own gold reserves.

    Venezuela is in the process of becoming a more diverse economy and so the US is trying to stop that because if they manage to diversify their country... produce their own food like Russia managed to do in a few short years I might add, then their oil reserves will make them a very rich country and their more balanced economy will make them too independent for the US to boss around... and it scares the US to death that a second country might openly oppose their rule of the region because they will have massive oil wealth behind them and therefore be almost impossible to contain... unlike poor little cuba.

    If you love democracy so much, why are you suggesting the undemocratic act of an illegal American backed coup in Venezuela?

    I saw an RT interview/discussion today with a for and an against in this problem and the guy supporting the US coup said 90 percent of the venezuelan population want Maduro to leave... well correct me if I am wrong but when over 90 percent of a population genuinely want something... like the leave the Ukraine and become part of Russia then it happens... and indeed if you tried to stop it there would be bloodshed... where is the bloodshed?


    BTW, Mike... I watched that video and was a little shocked.... the American plan was to pay off some Venezuelan officers to get large numbers of rifles and to go to a prison and give the prisoners these rifles to act against the people of Venezuela... wow... imagine the shitstorm if it was uncovered that Butina was buying up American rifles and was going to supply them to US prisoners to create chaos in the US before the next election... she would have been executed and Trump would be bombing somewhere...

    But lets keep listening to Aristide... I mean obviously the best future Venezuela could possibly hope for is for Bolton and Pompeo and Abrams and the CIA... they can pick anyone from Venezuelan prison to run the place... Guido has no charisma and the people don't know or care who he is... right now he is worth more to the US dead, because they could invade for a martyr, and they don't give a shit about any venezuelans... any of them.
    Tsavo Lion
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    Post  Tsavo Lion on Thu May 02, 2019 10:26 pm


    Officials Suggest US Poised to Attack Venezuela
    US Officials and Media Falsely Say Guaido Is 'Duly Elected President'
    Tensions Between US and Russia Grow Over Venezuela
    Bolton Claims 25,000 Cuban Troops Are in Venezuela
    US Hopes for Venezuela Change Fizzle for 3rd Time This Year
    The Tragedy of Venezuela Is the Tragedy of the United States of America by Lawrence Wilkerson
    Pompeo Hints at Military Move on Venezuela
    John Bolton Says US Troops 'On the Balls' of Their Feet Over Venezuela
    US Has Done 'Exhaustive Planning' on Venezuela Scenarios: Shanahan
    Acting US Defense Chief Scraps Europe Trip to Focus on Venezuela
    Top General: US Military Focused on Collecting Intelligence in Venezuela
    Russia Says US Claim It Told Venezuela's Maduro Not to Flee Is Part of 'Information War'
    Venezuelan Protests Peter Out as Maduro Hangs On; US and Russia Squabble
    Cubans Protest US Sanctions as Trump Raises Pressure on Venezuela
    https://www.antiwar.com/
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    andalusia

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    Post  andalusia on Fri May 03, 2019 3:39 am

    This is a very good article: https://popularresistance.org/the-making-of-juan-guaido-how-the-us-regime-change-laboratory-created-venezuelas-coup-leader/
    Airman
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    Post  Airman on Fri May 03, 2019 6:19 am

    Venezuela crisis - Page 32 Image
    Tsavo Lion
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    Post  Tsavo Lion on Fri May 03, 2019 7:31 am

    Spain recognized her support of Guaydo was an error

    Following the Ground Forces: Russian Special Forces Arrived in Venezuela
    Isos
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    Post  Isos on Fri May 03, 2019 7:19 pm


    ELINT News
    @ELINTNews
    ·
    4m
    #UPDATE: Reports of Russian personnel arriving by Venezuelan AF plane to Coro, taking position in the Girardot Battalion & in oil refineries of the Paraguaná Peninsula. "They occupy a whole floor in the Cumberland hotel near the Coro airport" sources say
    MiamiMachineShop
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    Post  MiamiMachineShop on Fri May 03, 2019 7:34 pm

    Hope thousands of Russians come to Venezuela. Bring them by the Antonov load

    What do they need to sustain there? The breadbasket of Latin america can feed them and resupply them, what do they need for long persistent presence? Thousands could probably be there without many woes. Ammunition needs to be pre-shipped any cold war era stuff they want to get rid of, just stockpile it. What else , aircraft parts and ordnance? Not sure how to get around that one without ships... Really hope they can figure something out there for long term presence without navy. Russians are creative I know they can do something about it. Collaboration with Cuba is probably necessary. I know the Cubans are getting things in there and maintaining presence without a navy.

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